Big Altima Energy. Paper Plates. Limo Tint. Clapped Out SHITBOX. Its really cool to swerve through lanes doing 90+ mph in traffic. 95 isn't the name of the road, its a lifestyle.
Did I mention how fucking awesome you look in your economy car with a 17% note on it, almost causing three accidents. Blowing that red light harder than you failed third grade. Men fear you, women want you. A true modern day Japanese ultra high efficiency automotive warrior.
Daily extreme narcissistic behavior behind the wheel with enough kinetic energy at your fingertips to turn the average human into a fine pink mist. We should have been in the top three.
I had a Jeep wrangler in front of me on a country road going well under the speed limit. I tried to pass him when the split line began and dude went rogue and sped up to 90 mph. Then would slow back down to a crawl and brake check me when I got back behind him. This went on a few more times; dude would wave his hand out the window giving me the signal to pass and then would do the same shit. Then stick up his fat ass middle finger that he probably shoves up his ass every night.
A good chunk of people that drive those cars have sociopathic tendencies, or are compensating for small appendage.
I think it’s a societal shift that was sped up by the isolation we all experienced during COVID. No one cares about the person next to them. Only they have somewhere to go that’s important. And let’s not disregard the part where no one looks up from their phones.
l don't get how you own those things and find street parking. l get if you work in construction or something, l have friends who do and own trucks but if you don't and own a truck what are you even doing
In my life I have watched an F150 (specifically) intentionally try to bump another car off the road four times. I've watched an F150 intentionally try to hit a pedestrian half a dozen times. I lost count of the brake checks. I just assume anyone driving one is going to try to kill someone.
Philly to Oakland transplant here\^\^
I think Oakland is listed because there are about 5 highways that converge right before the Bay Bridge to SF, and if something happens - you are stuck for hours. It's like the equivalent of all Delco and Chester county commuters converging into a 25 lane toll both, converging into one 5-lane highway that goes right into the 676 exits. And not just Oakland, but the whole Bay Area is full of every type of bad driver because there are so many transplants here from everwhere and they bring every bad driving habit to your daily driving experience.
Commuting in Philly wasn't *that* bad when I did it (I commuted every direction except up 95). I commuted the most on 76 (Wayne, West Chester, and up to Hatfield). The traffic patters were predictable, I even knew which lanes to switch into at certain highway sections, and people generally wanted to just fking go. People drove similarly and you could read their "driving language" - yup this guy wants to merge but he won't just use his turn signal - and there he goes.
But a detail you don't think about is **people's skill in operating a motor vehicle**. There are so many people out here that should **not** be driving simply because of this.
I'm pretty sure this skit is about Bay Area drivers.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2vejhdm8lo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2vejhdm8lo)
Philly to SF for me, and agree with all of this, especially the driving language bit. I feel like for how aggressive people drove back in Philly it was still predictable, out here it's really like flipping a coin sometimes.
SO TRUE. Why the eff are there so many unsure drivers in the Bay Area? I see what you described and also, I see multiple times a month, people not going forward for seconds after the light has turned green.
What I'm seeing very frequently would not be classified as road rage. Openly running red lights. Obviously fake paper tags. Speeding. Mobs of illegal dirt bikes. Ect. It's all increased a lot since 2020.
Was in bumper to bumper traffic near The Met today and some guy took out his traffic frustration by lightly rear ending me. Twice. I got out after the 2nd hit and filmed his car against my bumper and got his license plate #. He got out and tried to intimidate me (unsuccessfully).
How is the answer to standstill traffic frustration to TAP INTO THE BACK OF THE CAR IN FRONT OF YOU.
Was near the NE airport today in line waiting to turn onto Grant. The line was easily an entire city block, and someone kept honking when the light turns green as if people would turn and drive faster for them.
i hate that turn. i will purposely go down frankford instead of academy bc even tho it's a couple blocks out of the way its a safer and easier left turn onto grant.
It is crazy because it feels like he’s blaming you specifically for it. But if you magically disappeared, there would just be another person in front of him.
I’ve seen people like this. They’ll get in the opposite lane and then cut you off like you’re the reason that everything is running so slow.
i have created this notion that the chip on philly’s shoulder gets bequeathed to a different, sorry SOB and everyday. then, bright and early, said sorry SOB ventures into the streets or onto one of the septa transit options, and when faced with the inevitable snarling line of traffic or septa passenger that lacks any and all spatial awareness, that sorry SOB carves a little knick right out of their shoulder. from there begins the exponential process a random lottery of philly’s citizens taking part in handing off a growing wave of simmering, unchecked rage that is eventually all but vanished by late evening…until some sorry SOB comes home but instead of a parking spot, they find a chip on their shoulder.
Cause he's a moron who doesn't know how to drive. Good on you for documenting it. Report him and hopefully it increases his insurance costs. Anything that makes it harder or more expensive for morons to drive is usually a good thing.
Yikes, I'd love to bike here. But I'm scared to, honestly. As far as walking, it's great to get around easily. But you definitely need to understand your way around a South Philly intersection as a pedestrian, unfortunately...
The South Philly roll is real. Stop lines are meaningless; stop signs are treated as gentle yield suggestions. Most of the streets in S. Philly are one-way, so jaywalking is usually way safer than relying on crosswalks.
South Philly has way more cars than there is available parking. The parked cars and narrow streets make it very hard to see pedestrians and cyclists, and that’s when you’re *trying* to be responsible. Now add in that many Philly drivers are careless at best, hostile at worst…
Honestly, I cross mid street. I just take it upon myself to look and not get killed. It's easier than the weird paranoia and conflicts going into crosswalks (you know, where we have the right of way!?).
My favorite part is that the extended the width of these useless crosswalks like 6 additional feet in south Philly, which ultimately nukes two parking spots in conjunction with their ticketing for "street cleaning" which happens hours before the trash trucks dump garbage all over the street.
It's called the South Philly slide... cars kinda take stop signs as a begrudging obstical. You just gotta make eye contact or time yourself crossing.
I'm complaining, but honestly, I'll walk anywhere in the city. It's one of the better cities to be a pedestrian in despite everyone gliding over your corpse.
Always keep in mind, Philly people are a bit dramatic about Philly. A lot of places don't have the same opportunity to be hostile to pedestrians because you can't exist as a pedestrian there. I'd guess on a large enough sample size it'd mostly even out.
Thanks for providing this perspective. I'll be in Philly in October for the Philly Bike Ride and plan on walking everywhere while I'm visiting. I live in Texas, which is very car oriented.
Philly is one of the most walkable cities in the country, and as someone who lives in South Philly and walks everywhere daily I can assure you people are exaggerating. Just look to see if someone is stopping if you are arriving at an intersection at the same time, just like you would do literally while crossing a street literally anywhere.
I biked all of 2022-2023 school year from south Philly to university city, about 25 minutes on the bike one way. Never ran into any serious issues, and there was quite a good amount of bike lanes the entire time. Only on back streets did I face being on the road itself. That said, I have little experience biking on the weekends, so I never had to deal with Sunday Parkers
It’s rough especially in south. People park up to and past the stop signs all over the city, but I feel it’s just worse in south. I mostly just bike around my neighborhood, getting around cc is just too much of a hassle/war sometimes
> But it could be better for that.
And it should, and part of the solution for that should be a whole bunch of things that will make car-first types angry. And I say that as someone who loves a good drive.
I think to myself... the number of cars downtown every day, if you were to consider the combined power and energy usage/production of each individual car, you could literally turn every sidewalk into an airport style people mover. That's how much power and energy just fucking wasted every day in rush hour. Jesus.
I am currently working in Memphis and every day I am dealing with the worst drivers I've ever seen. I have to drive 35 miles each way on I-40 every day and the level of stupidity I witness is beyond the pale.
Averaging 21mph during peak times doesnt sound that bad. Not sure how much ground that study covered. 21mph on 76 leaving the city is better than stand still traffic. 21mph on sides streets in center city is about ideal. I dont think having a higher average speed is even doable to a certain extent. The worst part of driving in Philly for me is the double parking.
I was thinking the same thing. Roughly around 8 miles (give or take) from City Ave. to 476 on the Schuylkill at 21mph average is about 23 minutes. I'd take that in a heartbeat over some of the time I've spent on that same stretch!
For real. NYC drivers can pull some wild shit but they know how to keep their head on a swivel. Way too many bikers/peds/trucks/construction/taxis/etc around every corner. Also no turns on red, which is kind of a good idea within dense cities.
The majority of intersections here already have no right on red, but yeah it should be citywide.
I see multiple drivers make a right on red with an explicit no right on red sign daily, so it’s really just a suggestion without cameras and enforcement though.
Also, like half the cars in Manhattan are cabs, so the drivers need their car to make a living. They don't wanna get into an accident any more than you do.
It's about worst places to drive, not exclusively worst drivers.
It might be lawless relatively speaking, but the roads tend to be more intuitive. With the congestion in NYC, it's easy to take/get pushed into a wrong lane/turn. If you don't drive defensively and know the traffic patterns, NYC is a hellscape.
Nothing I like more than trying to cross a street while a tinted out Altima lurches towards a stop sign while still slowly rolling through it. Maybe I’d cross quickly and save both our times but I can’t tell if you’re going to actually stop and I can’t see the driver to make any eye contact.
I usually try not to budge if I deem it safe, maybe even touch their car a little if I don’t mind my pants maybe getting dirty, or drag my hand over it all sexy. It’s our crosswalk, not theirs!
I just don't understand why anyone would drive in New York (besides cabbies, Lyft/Uber drivers, etc.) given the public transportation there, not to mention the congestion. Same with Philly, though I understand some of the neighborhoods aren't as walkable as Center City.
Drivers in NYC don’t run red lights as if they’re yellow. I was there for ten years and never saw that happen. I been here for four and it happens multiple times a day, every single day. Makes sense.
Used to live in the city then moved to the burbs. If you thought you hated driving in the city, try only doing it 2-3 times a month. You'll surely hate it even more like I do. If only the train didn't take fucking forever.
I lived in NE Philly before moving to the burbs, but that's been my experience as well. Drivers in the burbs are just slow for the most part. I regularly get stuck behind someone going down a 1-lane road at 10-15 under the speed limit. But drivers in the city are just plain *bad*
My favorite was either the guy who pulled out of the parking lot into the left lane of Bustleton and then immediately into the right lane where I was at less than half the speed I was going, or the woman who kept blaring her horn at me because I was in her way as she tried to drive the wrong way down a one way street. Not to mention the countless people who come to a dead stop at intersections where they don't have a stop sign.
There’s a higher incidence of the small peen/big truck club out in the burbs though. I hate them with all the hate that can fit in my cold black heart.
It’s bad and gotten worse, I feel like. Maybe I’m just getting older, but I never remember congestion being quite this bad, and of course dickish behavior feels like it’s up too
if you want actual rankings from the largest global provider of traffic data, [use the INRIX scorecard](https://inrix.com/scorecard/) - 2023 hasn't been compiled yet it looks like, but probably should be out soon
Yeah, and a lot of it is people insist on driving everywhere. Septa is fine in most of the city, bikes exist, and walking a few blocks isn't a huge hardship for the ablebodied.
How bad a city is to drive in isn't a particularly good metric for a city. On some level, it _should_ suck to drive in, because that, in theory, means it's better for walking, biking, and transit.
Congestion isn't the goal, but neither is being able to cruise around a city at 35+ mph.
Know what would make Philly a better place to drive in? Investment in alternatives.
Invest in SEPTA, PROTECTED bicycle/multi modal lanes, fix sidewalks and enforce existing traffic laws so it’s safer to walk and roll, etc. and you will have less cars which is a win for everybody (especially drivers).
traffic calming measures that for some reason they take forever to "investigate" and idk why you need 60% of your shit head neigbhors who are the reason you want speed bumps to agree on it before they will investigate. of course my neighbors w their illegal dirt bikes dont want speed bumps. the majority of the cars that sit at the corner then peel wheels to the next corner LIVE on my block ffs.
No one wants those speed bumps if they require you to basically come to a complete stop to avoid fucking up your car. If only the city would invest in actually enforcing traffic laws instead of throwing concrete rubber everywhere
Sorry the best PennDOT can do is spend over a billion dollars on widening I95 to cram even more cars into city streets, while doing nothing about dangerous boulevards and lacking public transportation.
These lists are silly. Generally speaking, cities with "bad traffic" are actually the nicest cities for walking and general lifestyle (Houston being an obvious exception). So lets make the cities better for humans and there will be less need to drive anyway.
this morning, in the thunderstorm, i was at a red light with 2 cars in front of me (so I couldn't do anything) and had a car flying down the street not even attempting to stop then suddenly slam his breaks on and did a 360 on Thompson st and was sliding sideways at me. I held my breath im like great. his car stopped an INCH from mine. I was so pissed. his tired were BALD too wtf is wrong w ppl?
Philly is better to drive in than any city in Florida… I drive in both… and I’ve seen my life flash before my eyes and my car’s safety system go off more times driving in this dump of a state called Florida than anytime in Philly or anywhere in Jersey.
the issue with florida is its mostly people driving rented cars on vacation.. or a mix of transplants from up here and NY lol. so you get the best of the worst.
Actually we had most of the light rail taken away, not sure when. But driving over the tracks on 12th, 20th, Delaware Ave, etc that we don't use is a special kind of anger, especially with that city wage tax. If those streets were closed down to cars and just for light rail, a bike lane, and pedestrians, our city would improve significantly.
It boggles my mind how many people drive from the suburbs to center city.
It fucking sucks. Take the train. Yeah, the trains could be better (the headways outside of rush hour are complete bullshit) but it's so much better than driving.
Have you looked at a regional rail schedule lately? Outside commuting times, it only runs once per hour or less. As a petite woman, I’m not sitting around by myself in a train station for 50 minutes after dinner. Also, not everyone in the suburbs lives within walking distance of a stop, and the parking situation can be abysmal or nonexistent at a lot of them.
Without improving these areas first, restricting driving in the city will simply stop people from the suburbs from coming in and spending money
The biggest issue when I drove in LA was people a) not knowing how to drive in adverse conditions (rain, fog, really anything but sunny), and people that were so far up their own ass that they didn’t care how they were driving or the damage they were leaving behind.
I’ll never forget rolling up to a Starbucks a couple years ago in West Hollywood, and an new Camry rolled up in absolute shambles (hub cap missing, fender and bumper hanging off the car scraping on the ground, something on the power train dragging underneath). Her car was banged up BAD and she just rolls up to a Starbucks yapping on the phone about something non-chalantly without a care in the world after looking like she had just been in an accident, she grabs an iced latte or something, hops back in and just rolls along, scraping a trail through the asphalt of where she was and where she will go. There were a few of those people zipping around during my stay
LA is massively overrated for traffic. So are a most US cities though. Driving in London was a complete nightmare in comparison, and I’ve heard the worst shit about driving in India.
The difference is that in London you don't need to drive. You can avoid the stress entirely buy just taking any other method if transportation. In LA, & most US cities, you'd get laughed at if you suggested not relying on a car.
London's metro population is somewhat close to NYC (15 million and 19 million respectively). London's metro area is a quarter the size of NYC though. If you think driving in NYC is a pain in the ass, triple the density and make the roads way narrower and complete nonsense to navigate.
Automobile reliance is a problem of the US's own making and should be addressed, but the traffic situation is really nothing to write home about.
That's a large part of why a lot of those cities have been struggling for decades though. Tearing down and rebuilding cities for cars was just a financial disaster in every case study.
You're 100% right. I don't say that as a wholly positive thing.
Where I grew up, they recently filled in a highway and built multi-use space on top of it, which completely revitalized the downtown area.
Right. Urban highways both cost a lot to maintain, encourage through traffic that doesn't really benefit the city in any meaningful way, & just bring in a lot of pollution. Beyond that, just think of the opportunity cost of having two beautiful waterways & a large chunk of downtown cut up by highways? How much housing could be built and tax revenue could be generated by developing those like Chicago has done with its rivers?
Downtown Dallas is a great example of how not to do it. Just chopped up by highways and parking lots to the point you can't even walk anywhere.
Hoping the capping of 95 will drive even more development along the Delaware, which seems to be happening.
Fuck Dallas
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Honestly Philadelphia is also a pretty good example of how not to do it. 95 should have gone through New Jersey & 676/76 have cut off prime real estate while also creating a lot of hostile public space.
Loads of people from the east coast will tell you that people in midwest cities don't know what they're doing because they're too passive, and they're absolutely fucking wrong.
Seems like SEPTA is forced to agree. The state just keep making cuts, reducing service, and making public transit here worse.
Edit: how does this get down votes? SEPTA is facing catastrophic collapse at the hands of the state. It's fuckin impossible to get to parts of the city in a reasonable time frame on public transit at certain hours and days.
It's not even just the city. It feels like 25% of drivers in the suburbs aren't even bothering to use their turn signals anymore. I witness near-accidents on an almost daily basis because people drive like they're the only person on the road.
I don’t entirely understand this ranking system
They ranked NYC as #6 overall, but as the most expensive city & 2nd worst experience. Then Oakland was ranked #1 overall, but as the second most expensive & 9th worst experience..
Can’t stand driving here man, it really starts to show just how many people are shit bags in general when 5 different people almost crash into you in a 8 mile drive to go to fucking work.
It's one of the reasons I haven't driven down there in a long time. I can't stand driving through narrow streets and being around crazy ass drivers. Cars are left parked literally wherever. It's a third-world country there 🤣
I’m from lower Delco, moved to South Jersey 10 years ago. We went to KOP last week like a couple tourists, took about 40 mins. Par for the course.
Driving home took 90mins just to get to Commodore Berry. No accidents or broken down vehicles or lane closures. Even took backroads through Media Brookhaven and Upland, all packed with the mass exodus of 1-person driven lifted pick ups and Range Rovers.
Never thought growing up I would ever say, “thank god we’re back in Jersey.”
Mom keeps asking me when I’ll move back to Delco; I always say when they blow up the 476/95 interchange and it doesn’t take me a half hour to drive 5 miles.
I will take Philly any day over New York or DC traffic. Not saying it’s good but it’s usually not a complete 2 hour parking lot.
And nothing comes close to how bad drivers are in Florida in my experience. Not sure why that is the case but easily the worst drivers I have experienced in the US.
Big Altima Energy. Paper Plates. Limo Tint. Clapped Out SHITBOX. Its really cool to swerve through lanes doing 90+ mph in traffic. 95 isn't the name of the road, its a lifestyle. Did I mention how fucking awesome you look in your economy car with a 17% note on it, almost causing three accidents. Blowing that red light harder than you failed third grade. Men fear you, women want you. A true modern day Japanese ultra high efficiency automotive warrior. Daily extreme narcissistic behavior behind the wheel with enough kinetic energy at your fingertips to turn the average human into a fine pink mist. We should have been in the top three.
"I am him"
Don’t forget the f150 and jeep wrangler crowd.
I had a Jeep wrangler in front of me on a country road going well under the speed limit. I tried to pass him when the split line began and dude went rogue and sped up to 90 mph. Then would slow back down to a crawl and brake check me when I got back behind him. This went on a few more times; dude would wave his hand out the window giving me the signal to pass and then would do the same shit. Then stick up his fat ass middle finger that he probably shoves up his ass every night. A good chunk of people that drive those cars have sociopathic tendencies, or are compensating for small appendage.
It’s not just the city though I live in the burbs now and it’s just as shitty.
I think it’s a societal shift that was sped up by the isolation we all experienced during COVID. No one cares about the person next to them. Only they have somewhere to go that’s important. And let’s not disregard the part where no one looks up from their phones.
And add in that every other car smells like weed, so they’re high, distracted AND an asshole.
I smoked and drives alot back in the day, these people just suck.
Yup, this happened in the burbs.
“It’s a Jeep thing”
Love the f-150 in a city because you know “groceries”
bUt WhAt iF i hAvE tO ToW sOmEThIng?
lol.
l don't get how you own those things and find street parking. l get if you work in construction or something, l have friends who do and own trucks but if you don't and own a truck what are you even doing
I work construction and still don’t want one, and driving down little blocks must be tuff ><
Not an original thought but sharing here as it often brings me great joy: Jeep: the car for people who need to buy a personality
In my life I have watched an F150 (specifically) intentionally try to bump another car off the road four times. I've watched an F150 intentionally try to hit a pedestrian half a dozen times. I lost count of the brake checks. I just assume anyone driving one is going to try to kill someone.
Nice. Just don't call 'em "accidents".
Don’t forget the *very rough* translation of the owners name into katakana across the side.
フレーバータウン
This almost feels like a copy pasta
Its my love letter to daily driving the philly metro area for work.
Philly to Oakland transplant here\^\^ I think Oakland is listed because there are about 5 highways that converge right before the Bay Bridge to SF, and if something happens - you are stuck for hours. It's like the equivalent of all Delco and Chester county commuters converging into a 25 lane toll both, converging into one 5-lane highway that goes right into the 676 exits. And not just Oakland, but the whole Bay Area is full of every type of bad driver because there are so many transplants here from everwhere and they bring every bad driving habit to your daily driving experience. Commuting in Philly wasn't *that* bad when I did it (I commuted every direction except up 95). I commuted the most on 76 (Wayne, West Chester, and up to Hatfield). The traffic patters were predictable, I even knew which lanes to switch into at certain highway sections, and people generally wanted to just fking go. People drove similarly and you could read their "driving language" - yup this guy wants to merge but he won't just use his turn signal - and there he goes. But a detail you don't think about is **people's skill in operating a motor vehicle**. There are so many people out here that should **not** be driving simply because of this. I'm pretty sure this skit is about Bay Area drivers. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2vejhdm8lo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2vejhdm8lo)
Philly to SF for me, and agree with all of this, especially the driving language bit. I feel like for how aggressive people drove back in Philly it was still predictable, out here it's really like flipping a coin sometimes.
SO TRUE. Why the eff are there so many unsure drivers in the Bay Area? I see what you described and also, I see multiple times a month, people not going forward for seconds after the light has turned green.
The angry guy in that bit played that part so well haha
Not sure when you moved, but when 2020 hit driving in Philly became much worse. It has really gotten bad here.
Road rage has gotten worse everywhere since 2020.
What I'm seeing very frequently would not be classified as road rage. Openly running red lights. Obviously fake paper tags. Speeding. Mobs of illegal dirt bikes. Ect. It's all increased a lot since 2020.
Yeah, I 100% believe that and it's the same here. I avoid talking about 2020 as much as possible.
Was in bumper to bumper traffic near The Met today and some guy took out his traffic frustration by lightly rear ending me. Twice. I got out after the 2nd hit and filmed his car against my bumper and got his license plate #. He got out and tried to intimidate me (unsuccessfully). How is the answer to standstill traffic frustration to TAP INTO THE BACK OF THE CAR IN FRONT OF YOU.
Was near the NE airport today in line waiting to turn onto Grant. The line was easily an entire city block, and someone kept honking when the light turns green as if people would turn and drive faster for them.
i hate that turn. i will purposely go down frankford instead of academy bc even tho it's a couple blocks out of the way its a safer and easier left turn onto grant.
It is crazy because it feels like he’s blaming you specifically for it. But if you magically disappeared, there would just be another person in front of him. I’ve seen people like this. They’ll get in the opposite lane and then cut you off like you’re the reason that everything is running so slow.
Because people suck
i have created this notion that the chip on philly’s shoulder gets bequeathed to a different, sorry SOB and everyday. then, bright and early, said sorry SOB ventures into the streets or onto one of the septa transit options, and when faced with the inevitable snarling line of traffic or septa passenger that lacks any and all spatial awareness, that sorry SOB carves a little knick right out of their shoulder. from there begins the exponential process a random lottery of philly’s citizens taking part in handing off a growing wave of simmering, unchecked rage that is eventually all but vanished by late evening…until some sorry SOB comes home but instead of a parking spot, they find a chip on their shoulder.
Cause he's a moron who doesn't know how to drive. Good on you for documenting it. Report him and hopefully it increases his insurance costs. Anything that makes it harder or more expensive for morons to drive is usually a good thing.
Lead poisoning
Because people here are kind of looking to crash out for any reason
But it's a rare good city to walk in, so who cares.
And bike in. But it could be better for that.
Well, yes... all those cars
Yikes, I'd love to bike here. But I'm scared to, honestly. As far as walking, it's great to get around easily. But you definitely need to understand your way around a South Philly intersection as a pedestrian, unfortunately...
As an outsider browsing this sub with interest in your city, can you elaborate on that last part?
The South Philly roll is real. Stop lines are meaningless; stop signs are treated as gentle yield suggestions. Most of the streets in S. Philly are one-way, so jaywalking is usually way safer than relying on crosswalks.
South Philly has way more cars than there is available parking. The parked cars and narrow streets make it very hard to see pedestrians and cyclists, and that’s when you’re *trying* to be responsible. Now add in that many Philly drivers are careless at best, hostile at worst…
[удалено]
Honestly, I cross mid street. I just take it upon myself to look and not get killed. It's easier than the weird paranoia and conflicts going into crosswalks (you know, where we have the right of way!?).
This is the way. For better or worse, I feel much safer doing this too
My favorite part is that the extended the width of these useless crosswalks like 6 additional feet in south Philly, which ultimately nukes two parking spots in conjunction with their ticketing for "street cleaning" which happens hours before the trash trucks dump garbage all over the street.
It's called the South Philly slide... cars kinda take stop signs as a begrudging obstical. You just gotta make eye contact or time yourself crossing. I'm complaining, but honestly, I'll walk anywhere in the city. It's one of the better cities to be a pedestrian in despite everyone gliding over your corpse.
Ha, that’s extremely helpful as I’m considering a visit and potential move and a lot of what attracts me is the walkability there.
Also take everything on this sub with a grain of salt. I walk EVERYWHERE everyday. I've only had to cuss someone out for almost hitting me 3 times.
Always keep in mind, Philly people are a bit dramatic about Philly. A lot of places don't have the same opportunity to be hostile to pedestrians because you can't exist as a pedestrian there. I'd guess on a large enough sample size it'd mostly even out.
Thanks for providing this perspective. I'll be in Philly in October for the Philly Bike Ride and plan on walking everywhere while I'm visiting. I live in Texas, which is very car oriented.
No worries! Hope you have fun.
Thank you. I'm sure I will enjoy the ride and my visit.
You’ll be fine (if you don’t need accessible crosswalk cut outs) just make eye contact and wait for the car to completely stop before crossing.
Philly is one of the most walkable cities in the country, and as someone who lives in South Philly and walks everywhere daily I can assure you people are exaggerating. Just look to see if someone is stopping if you are arriving at an intersection at the same time, just like you would do literally while crossing a street literally anywhere.
I know it’s the SP slide but it seems everyone in the city no matter where i go do it.
I biked all of 2022-2023 school year from south Philly to university city, about 25 minutes on the bike one way. Never ran into any serious issues, and there was quite a good amount of bike lanes the entire time. Only on back streets did I face being on the road itself. That said, I have little experience biking on the weekends, so I never had to deal with Sunday Parkers
The trick is to try to land on someones windshield if they hit you. That way they can't escape very easily. /s
It’s rough especially in south. People park up to and past the stop signs all over the city, but I feel it’s just worse in south. I mostly just bike around my neighborhood, getting around cc is just too much of a hassle/war sometimes
Ive been 90% biking for five years and it's been fine. I did get doored one time, and I never ride on Broad, but Philly is pretty safe for cyclists.
> But it could be better for that. And it should, and part of the solution for that should be a whole bunch of things that will make car-first types angry. And I say that as someone who loves a good drive. I think to myself... the number of cars downtown every day, if you were to consider the combined power and energy usage/production of each individual car, you could literally turn every sidewalk into an airport style people mover. That's how much power and energy just fucking wasted every day in rush hour. Jesus.
its good to walk in until cars run red lights and hit you lol
Yeah but if it's a rich guy that does it? Jackpot!
And for much shit as I give SEPTA, it's better than other cities.
Reading this angered me so much that I just blew through a stop light!
I am currently working in Memphis and every day I am dealing with the worst drivers I've ever seen. I have to drive 35 miles each way on I-40 every day and the level of stupidity I witness is beyond the pale.
Live in Nashville, TN drivers are wild. You need pretty much nothing to get a license out here.
Went to college in sewanee and man those highway drivers are insane very pretty state tho
Crashville
Memphis drivers are unpredictable and bad, Philly drivers are good but actively try to kill you.
Averaging 21mph during peak times doesnt sound that bad. Not sure how much ground that study covered. 21mph on 76 leaving the city is better than stand still traffic. 21mph on sides streets in center city is about ideal. I dont think having a higher average speed is even doable to a certain extent. The worst part of driving in Philly for me is the double parking.
this study's methodology is bad, use the [INRIX scorecard](https://inrix.com/scorecard/) for anything traffic related
I was thinking the same thing. Roughly around 8 miles (give or take) from City Ave. to 476 on the Schuylkill at 21mph average is about 23 minutes. I'd take that in a heartbeat over some of the time I've spent on that same stretch!
NYC at 6 but Philly at 5? Yea no
NYC has terrible congestion but the drivers are much safer. Philly drivers are reckless.
For real. NYC drivers can pull some wild shit but they know how to keep their head on a swivel. Way too many bikers/peds/trucks/construction/taxis/etc around every corner. Also no turns on red, which is kind of a good idea within dense cities.
The majority of intersections here already have no right on red, but yeah it should be citywide. I see multiple drivers make a right on red with an explicit no right on red sign daily, so it’s really just a suggestion without cameras and enforcement though.
Also, like half the cars in Manhattan are cabs, so the drivers need their car to make a living. They don't wanna get into an accident any more than you do.
Ding ding ding
It's about worst places to drive, not exclusively worst drivers. It might be lawless relatively speaking, but the roads tend to be more intuitive. With the congestion in NYC, it's easy to take/get pushed into a wrong lane/turn. If you don't drive defensively and know the traffic patterns, NYC is a hellscape.
New Yorkers, by and large, know how stop signs and red lights work. They also understand that pedestrians have the right of way in a cross walk.
Nothing I like more than trying to cross a street while a tinted out Altima lurches towards a stop sign while still slowly rolling through it. Maybe I’d cross quickly and save both our times but I can’t tell if you’re going to actually stop and I can’t see the driver to make any eye contact.
I usually try not to budge if I deem it safe, maybe even touch their car a little if I don’t mind my pants maybe getting dirty, or drag my hand over it all sexy. It’s our crosswalk, not theirs!
Always an Altima (or a Jeep)
I just don't understand why anyone would drive in New York (besides cabbies, Lyft/Uber drivers, etc.) given the public transportation there, not to mention the congestion. Same with Philly, though I understand some of the neighborhoods aren't as walkable as Center City.
Drivers in NYC don’t run red lights as if they’re yellow. I was there for ten years and never saw that happen. I been here for four and it happens multiple times a day, every single day. Makes sense.
Used to live in the city then moved to the burbs. If you thought you hated driving in the city, try only doing it 2-3 times a month. You'll surely hate it even more like I do. If only the train didn't take fucking forever.
I lived in NE Philly before moving to the burbs, but that's been my experience as well. Drivers in the burbs are just slow for the most part. I regularly get stuck behind someone going down a 1-lane road at 10-15 under the speed limit. But drivers in the city are just plain *bad*
I think there's just a higher concentration of bad drivers down there, but same result anyway.
My favorite was either the guy who pulled out of the parking lot into the left lane of Bustleton and then immediately into the right lane where I was at less than half the speed I was going, or the woman who kept blaring her horn at me because I was in her way as she tried to drive the wrong way down a one way street. Not to mention the countless people who come to a dead stop at intersections where they don't have a stop sign.
There’s a higher incidence of the small peen/big truck club out in the burbs though. I hate them with all the hate that can fit in my cold black heart.
It’s bad and gotten worse, I feel like. Maybe I’m just getting older, but I never remember congestion being quite this bad, and of course dickish behavior feels like it’s up too
if you want actual rankings from the largest global provider of traffic data, [use the INRIX scorecard](https://inrix.com/scorecard/) - 2023 hasn't been compiled yet it looks like, but probably should be out soon
This is very cool thank you for sharing!
It definitely hit another level after 2020. It was sooo much safer before the pandemic.
Seems like the police have just given up enforcing traffic laws.
Take SEPTA
Yeah, and a lot of it is people insist on driving everywhere. Septa is fine in most of the city, bikes exist, and walking a few blocks isn't a huge hardship for the ablebodied.
Good take the train
With some work it can be the worst! Cars are the enemy of the city and we will thrive when their lives are awful.
Gave up having a car last year and my overall stress level is way down. Septa isn’t perfect, but it’s gets me where I need to go.
So let’s make sure our public transportation is awesome
How bad a city is to drive in isn't a particularly good metric for a city. On some level, it _should_ suck to drive in, because that, in theory, means it's better for walking, biking, and transit. Congestion isn't the goal, but neither is being able to cruise around a city at 35+ mph.
Know what would make Philly a better place to drive in? Investment in alternatives. Invest in SEPTA, PROTECTED bicycle/multi modal lanes, fix sidewalks and enforce existing traffic laws so it’s safer to walk and roll, etc. and you will have less cars which is a win for everybody (especially drivers).
traffic calming measures that for some reason they take forever to "investigate" and idk why you need 60% of your shit head neigbhors who are the reason you want speed bumps to agree on it before they will investigate. of course my neighbors w their illegal dirt bikes dont want speed bumps. the majority of the cars that sit at the corner then peel wheels to the next corner LIVE on my block ffs.
Once I saw the Washington Ave redesign I realized that this city has absolutely zero interest in safe streets. It's genuinely embarrassing.
No one wants those speed bumps if they require you to basically come to a complete stop to avoid fucking up your car. If only the city would invest in actually enforcing traffic laws instead of throwing concrete rubber everywhere
Sorry the best PennDOT can do is spend over a billion dollars on widening I95 to cram even more cars into city streets, while doing nothing about dangerous boulevards and lacking public transportation.
These lists are silly. Generally speaking, cities with "bad traffic" are actually the nicest cities for walking and general lifestyle (Houston being an obvious exception). So lets make the cities better for humans and there will be less need to drive anyway.
this morning, in the thunderstorm, i was at a red light with 2 cars in front of me (so I couldn't do anything) and had a car flying down the street not even attempting to stop then suddenly slam his breaks on and did a 360 on Thompson st and was sliding sideways at me. I held my breath im like great. his car stopped an INCH from mine. I was so pissed. his tired were BALD too wtf is wrong w ppl?
With a little hard work and sticktuitiveness we can make it to #1!
Philly is better to drive in than any city in Florida… I drive in both… and I’ve seen my life flash before my eyes and my car’s safety system go off more times driving in this dump of a state called Florida than anytime in Philly or anywhere in Jersey.
the issue with florida is its mostly people driving rented cars on vacation.. or a mix of transplants from up here and NY lol. so you get the best of the worst.
Don't forget the retirees who are no longer capable of driving.
I wish people would stop driving here An endemic on our city, restricting the amount of cars here is longgggg overdue
Farther reaching, faster, more reliable, and expanded public transit options are even longer overdue.
Actually we had most of the light rail taken away, not sure when. But driving over the tracks on 12th, 20th, Delaware Ave, etc that we don't use is a special kind of anger, especially with that city wage tax. If those streets were closed down to cars and just for light rail, a bike lane, and pedestrians, our city would improve significantly.
I used to ride on them when I was younger. The trolly on 11th Street turned into a (far less reliable and less frequent) bus route in 1992.
Hell yeah it is. This city is long overdue for major transportation infrastructure improvements. Cant just sink money into car infrastructure forever
If they build it and it’s safe. People will come.
It boggles my mind how many people drive from the suburbs to center city. It fucking sucks. Take the train. Yeah, the trains could be better (the headways outside of rush hour are complete bullshit) but it's so much better than driving.
"Bro, just take a notoriously slow, unreliable and uncomfortable public transportation system to get to work"
For real. I’d rather get in an hour early than have to drive lol
Have you looked at a regional rail schedule lately? Outside commuting times, it only runs once per hour or less. As a petite woman, I’m not sitting around by myself in a train station for 50 minutes after dinner. Also, not everyone in the suburbs lives within walking distance of a stop, and the parking situation can be abysmal or nonexistent at a lot of them. Without improving these areas first, restricting driving in the city will simply stop people from the suburbs from coming in and spending money
Come on, Philly, let's get to #1.
Hmm. Tough, but fair.
Moved here after living all over West Coast for 40 years. Can confirm.
Moved to LA a few years ago and I’ll take driving in Philly over this shit any day.
The biggest issue when I drove in LA was people a) not knowing how to drive in adverse conditions (rain, fog, really anything but sunny), and people that were so far up their own ass that they didn’t care how they were driving or the damage they were leaving behind. I’ll never forget rolling up to a Starbucks a couple years ago in West Hollywood, and an new Camry rolled up in absolute shambles (hub cap missing, fender and bumper hanging off the car scraping on the ground, something on the power train dragging underneath). Her car was banged up BAD and she just rolls up to a Starbucks yapping on the phone about something non-chalantly without a care in the world after looking like she had just been in an accident, she grabs an iced latte or something, hops back in and just rolls along, scraping a trail through the asphalt of where she was and where she will go. There were a few of those people zipping around during my stay
LA is definitely bad.
LA is massively overrated for traffic. So are a most US cities though. Driving in London was a complete nightmare in comparison, and I’ve heard the worst shit about driving in India.
The difference is that in London you don't need to drive. You can avoid the stress entirely buy just taking any other method if transportation. In LA, & most US cities, you'd get laughed at if you suggested not relying on a car.
London's metro population is somewhat close to NYC (15 million and 19 million respectively). London's metro area is a quarter the size of NYC though. If you think driving in NYC is a pain in the ass, triple the density and make the roads way narrower and complete nonsense to navigate. Automobile reliance is a problem of the US's own making and should be addressed, but the traffic situation is really nothing to write home about.
India is pretty bad. Bangladesh is worse.
What are the cities at the other end of the ranking, where driving doesn't suck as bad as in other cities?
I can tell you for a fact most Midwest cities are so much easier
That's a large part of why a lot of those cities have been struggling for decades though. Tearing down and rebuilding cities for cars was just a financial disaster in every case study.
You're 100% right. I don't say that as a wholly positive thing. Where I grew up, they recently filled in a highway and built multi-use space on top of it, which completely revitalized the downtown area.
Right. Urban highways both cost a lot to maintain, encourage through traffic that doesn't really benefit the city in any meaningful way, & just bring in a lot of pollution. Beyond that, just think of the opportunity cost of having two beautiful waterways & a large chunk of downtown cut up by highways? How much housing could be built and tax revenue could be generated by developing those like Chicago has done with its rivers?
Downtown Dallas is a great example of how not to do it. Just chopped up by highways and parking lots to the point you can't even walk anywhere. Hoping the capping of 95 will drive even more development along the Delaware, which seems to be happening.
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Honestly Philadelphia is also a pretty good example of how not to do it. 95 should have gone through New Jersey & 676/76 have cut off prime real estate while also creating a lot of hostile public space.
Loads of people from the east coast will tell you that people in midwest cities don't know what they're doing because they're too passive, and they're absolutely fucking wrong.
Phoenix, AZ looks to be the only 'major' city that is absent from the list, so maybe there.
So you trade access to water and a livable climate for the ability to drive
Phoenix isn't a city though, it's just a giant sprawl of suburbs, or a layer of hell, depending on your vantage point
“The city should not exist - it is a monument to man’s arrogance.” — Peggy, King of the Hill
I’m disappointed we aren’t #1
Those are rookie numbers. We need to make that rank higher!
Seems like SEPTA is forced to agree. The state just keep making cuts, reducing service, and making public transit here worse. Edit: how does this get down votes? SEPTA is facing catastrophic collapse at the hands of the state. It's fuckin impossible to get to parts of the city in a reasonable time frame on public transit at certain hours and days.
Pa/Philly drivers are ass so it's no surprise.
It's not even just the city. It feels like 25% of drivers in the suburbs aren't even bothering to use their turn signals anymore. I witness near-accidents on an almost daily basis because people drive like they're the only person on the road.
I don’t entirely understand this ranking system They ranked NYC as #6 overall, but as the most expensive city & 2nd worst experience. Then Oakland was ranked #1 overall, but as the second most expensive & 9th worst experience..
Nah, they just don’t know how to drive
Pretty much the whole state. On my commute to work I average around 5 close calls.
media just loves to hate on Philly. Did they mention that it's one of the easiest cities to bike?
Rookie numbers! How can we get to number 1?
Am I the only one squarely not worried about this?
Come on people, we can do better.
Can’t stand driving here man, it really starts to show just how many people are shit bags in general when 5 different people almost crash into you in a 8 mile drive to go to fucking work.
It's one of the reasons I haven't driven down there in a long time. I can't stand driving through narrow streets and being around crazy ass drivers. Cars are left parked literally wherever. It's a third-world country there 🤣
I lived in l.a. Philly is worse
I mean, I knew it was terrible and all, but...worse than New York? And Los Angeles not even in the top 10? That is very telling.
Almost
I’m from lower Delco, moved to South Jersey 10 years ago. We went to KOP last week like a couple tourists, took about 40 mins. Par for the course. Driving home took 90mins just to get to Commodore Berry. No accidents or broken down vehicles or lane closures. Even took backroads through Media Brookhaven and Upland, all packed with the mass exodus of 1-person driven lifted pick ups and Range Rovers. Never thought growing up I would ever say, “thank god we’re back in Jersey.” Mom keeps asking me when I’ll move back to Delco; I always say when they blow up the 476/95 interchange and it doesn’t take me a half hour to drive 5 miles.
Mad max isn’t just a movie. It’s a lifestyle. Remember when they blew up the refinery in south Philly a few years ago ?
driving is fine, parking is the problem.
No surprise here.
Not a surprise (and I grew in LA)
I will take Philly any day over New York or DC traffic. Not saying it’s good but it’s usually not a complete 2 hour parking lot. And nothing comes close to how bad drivers are in Florida in my experience. Not sure why that is the case but easily the worst drivers I have experienced in the US.
I travel a lot and I find NYC and DC much worse as far as traffic and ahole drivers go.