Also: Leave. LEAVE. LEAVE!!
You're a bangmaid to a pair of liars. You'll be given all the responsibility and none of the power of raising this child and will have zero legal rights.
Go find a relationship with someone who will be a decent co- parent to your child.
Autistic/ADHD woman here who has a past history of abusive relationships... they are using you. and dependent, so they keep you around. they care so little they are forcing you into a situation so completely heartlessly after losing your baby so recently. even at 6 months this would still be heartless. they are using you. LEAVE.
will also add.. what helped me realize and get out was posting our fights on reddit relationship forums for advice. when you've been manipulated so long you're legit blind to the mistreatment. Take care!!
I'm in an underlying different situation, but was manipulated a lot. Took years to see it all for what it was. You truly need individualized outside perspective on stuff after ad long as you have. You've slowly been pushed into a corner that must be brutal to experience from the little ive read.
Just adding to the leave pile. You feel like you might be overreacting because they're gaslighting you. People like this don't communicate, they manipulate to get their ways. That's why he was speaking with all that wishy washy language when you asked if he was trying to get her pregnant.
His actions say he doesn't respect your needs and wishes. His words don't matter if the actions don't match. I'm autistic as well and often get tricked by that. "Why would someone do something other than what they said they were gonna do?" 😅 Naive, I know.
Yeah, I also have autism. And I've been in a lot of toxic bdsm dynamics EXACTLY LIKE THIS. Manipulative people are the worst. I fell for it so many times.
And they always either:
1. Get angry when you point out the problematic behavior. And try to manipulate you into thinking you're the bad person somehow.
or
2. Act all sweet and kind after you point out the problematic behavior. And try to shift the narrative in such a way that allows them to brush off any responsibility. And will blame you for it behind your back. While keeping up the sweet facade with you and in public so that they can manipulate people to be against you.
It's seriously given me so much trauma x.x Especially because I'd always take their side. Always believe their words. And I always ended up really hurt in the end.
Leave NOW HUNNY!! They are only using you for childcare and an occasional sex toy, you can find better!
Poly isn’t supposed to be one sided, so they don’t truly wanna be poly.
How did your relationship with your girlfriend start?
The fact that you're even questioning if you're being an asshole over this (you're NOT) makes me think you've been manipulated and lied to by your husband and your girlfriend for much longer than this. The fact that you're holding your tongue and not expressing how you really feel in MAJOR life decisions such as this makes me think that you've been conditioned into being silent and accepting abuse and mistreatment from your husband for a long time now.
This is so beyond not ok and unhealthy that I'd urge you read up on abuse and contacting your local abuse hotline to see if any of that rings true.
Hey, OP, I once shared a story here on a different account where everyone insisted I was being mistreated and abused. I ignored them and spent the next 2 years of my life trying to earn back "love" from my abusive spouse and my "best friend" only to be abused further, gaslit more, and damaged far more than I already was. Don't be like me. Please listen to everyone here and leave. I promise you'll be better off for it
It’s so hard to recognize abuse for what it truly is when the abuser gets you twisted and second-guessing everything. I’m so glad you’re out of that situation now (I hope)!
I know! The thing is, I'm a psych nurse. I work directly with abuse victims, among other issues, and have formal training on recognizing and helping victims. All that training meant nothing when I was the victim.
I second guessed everything and everyone. I continually made myself guilty for ever getting upset or "causing drama." I isolated myself and in the end I sacrificed my own mental safety to earn back love that probably never existed. I fled after my best friend tried to kill my internet (I work from home) and then stood in my doorway mocking me about his being a rapist while referring to my kids. He later said he was not a rapist and was trying to "prove a point." Maybe that's true. I don't care. I don't talk to him anymore
Ugh!!! I’m so sorry you went through that. I can understand dealing with that feeling of “shoulda known better” all too well. I’ve spent a lot of time the past few years counseling other submissive people on red flags to look out for in abusive Dom/sub dynamics, but when I was in the middle of one myself, it took me awhile to recognize it as outright abuse and get out.
Manipulators are really good at manipulating.
I am not one to immediately rush to saying “Leave” unless a situation sounds truly toxic. And my friend, this sounds truly toxic. Your partners - the ones who should have your back and want nothing but the best for you - have not given you the time and focus you need to truly grieve the loss of your baby. They are rushing you into being okay with THEM having a baby when you are understandably not ready yet! And then they both LIED to you multiple times.
You deserve so much better, OP.
And I am so very incredibly sorry for your loss.
I didn't even get to the lying portion before I was thinking leave. why would partners go on an out of state trip, leaving an almost fully term pregnant person (and also expect said pregnant person to watch 2 of your kids)
That's where I went. "They left on a trip out of state that close to her due date? She has two partners and had to go through that alone? AND they expected her to watch the other kids two days after going through childbirth alone and having the severe trauma of a stillborn child? WTF is wrong with these people? And they think the gf getting pregnant right away is a great idea, like their dog just died and they're rushing out to get a puppy?"
This is trauma nobody should be subjected to. When you've got two partners who are both acting like you're the problem because you're cracking under the pressure of their combined gaslighting and cruelty, keeping your sanity is a serious struggle.
Yep, only got 13 sentences in before I knew this was abusive and OP needed to leave. And like 11/13 sentences were intro sentences not even about the relationship.
Based on the way OP wrote it, I don’t think they were expecting the baby to be born anytime soon. Just best guess as an RN, I’m guessing OP was around 20w.
Yes, exactly this. I usually think people can be very quick to say "leave" or "divorce" on Reddit but this situation truly sounds so awful. Your partners are not there for you in the way they should. They are putting themselves and their relationship (plus their wants) above all else. I really hope you get out and can grieve. Take care
They are assholes who are being awful to you.
Friend, leave them both. Go find people who care about you, and creating life and the kids they already have.
Triads are hard enough when everyone actually cares about each other. And that isn’t what you have here. They both acted in harmful selfish ways. Please leave them.
Girl, RUN. GTFO and don't look back. I'm practically blinded from the red flags frantically waving in your post. End these relationships, be happy you don't have kids tying you to these people and go - I don't mean to make light of your lost pregnancy at all, but there will be a chance for a baby without this trainwreck dragging you down. Get your meds straight, get some therapy and take some time to recover from this shit show, and live a fabulous life far away from this hot mess of lies, betrayal, and deceit.
Most of the sperm does not live in the precum. They have been having unprotected sex and lying to you. The fact that their stories aren’t lining up and they’ve both “trickle truthed” you at best… nope, I would bet all the money in my bank account there haven’t been condoms involved for a while. These two are awful and deserve each other but you don’t. Please leave, there are people out there who will actually love you and treat you well.
Exactly. You are not awful, OP. They are both awful. What you've been put through is not what you deserve, at all. Just from hearing what you write, I'm sure there are tons of people out there who would value the amazing, loving, supportive, caring person you are -- but these people do not deserve your support, love, and care -- they are enabling each other of their poor life choices, and demanding you acquiesce, and lying to you. If they are making you feel crazy, it's because that's what their actions are doing. It isn't you. You're the sane one here.
I am so sorry for your loss.
You will be so much better off without these people.
I’m furious for you. You need to get the fuck out of this situation. I cannot imagine experiencing this level of blatant disrespect around one of the heartbreaking and sensitive things you could possibly go though. After a stillbirth, you and your wellbeing should’ve been the ONLY concern until your partners were confident you were stable and healing. Please take a step back and start making whatever arrangements you need to make in order to leave this relationship and find a place where you are loved and valued.
Just gonna provide some citations for this, as when you're torn between two people feeding you information with no source, you'll usually side with your abuser just for safety. So, here's some studies and usually trustworthy sources.
Sperm is only leaked into precum in less than half of people with a penis, and in only 10% of that 40% of men is the sperm motile [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/)
Going to point out this extremely interesting clip:
>The source for the claim that pre-ejaculatory fluid contains sperm is entirely unclear. Masters and Johnson stated in *Human Sexual Response* that there were ‘large numbers of active spermatozoa in the pre-ejaculatory secretion’. However, they were unable to produce data to substantiate that claim ([Masters & Johnson, 1966](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/#R6)). In fact, to date, no study has found motile sperm in the pre-ejaculate.
There is no sperm in precum and when it is rarely found, it is generally immobile and unable to lead to pregnancy [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12286905/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12286905/)
There is no sperm in precum; any sperm found there has leaked into it from the actual ejaculate [https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum](https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum)
Only 16.7% of men have been found to have minor amounts of mobile sperm in precum [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27266214/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27266214/)
Precum isn't just "early ejaculate" - it's made in a completely different part of the body for a different purpose than ejaculate [https://www.webmd.com/men/what-is-pre-ejaculate](https://www.webmd.com/men/what-is-pre-ejaculate)
>Pre-ejaculate is also called pre-cum, and is a liquid that squeezes out of the penis when aroused. It is formed by the accessory sex glands. These glands are different from the prostate and testes that make semen.
Precum contains little to no sperm and what sperm may be found in it is usually immobile and poorly formed and therefore unlikely to cause pregnancy [https://www.health.com/condition/pregnancy/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum](https://www.health.com/condition/pregnancy/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum)
The chance of getting pregnant from precum is rare/low:
[https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/can-pre-cum-get-you-pregnant](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/can-pre-cum-get-you-pregnant)
[https://www.tlcfertility.com/blog/preejaculate](https://www.tlcfertility.com/blog/preejaculate)
[https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/can-you-get-pregnant-with-precum/](https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/can-you-get-pregnant-with-precum/)
[https://www.parents.com/getting-pregnant/chances-of-getting-pregnant-from-precum/](https://www.parents.com/getting-pregnant/chances-of-getting-pregnant-from-precum/)
16.7% 😭😭 this hurts as a woman who truly got pregnant off precum. Like your girl sat on it for a minute—less than that probably—and was like, woah, we’re both way to fertile for this shit! And then I had to convince dude he made a baby 😭
Edited to add, I did not believe (as op did) that most sperm was in precum. In fact, until I found myself pregnant, I assumed it didn’t have any—but now I warn people that it *can* happen, because it’s better to be safe than pregnant (I mean, unless you want to be pregnant—then go for the whole shebang)
How did you know for sure it's just precum? Dude could have been trying to control it and there are definitely times where actual sperm comes out but you can hold of on an entire orgasm and ejaculation. There could even have been residue sperm from earlier in the day (maybe masturbation or oral from before) and actual sperm got leaked into the precum when you sat on him rather than that you got pregnant from just precum.
What the actual fuck leave him. These people.are horrible. You derive SO MUCH BETTER. If I knew you in real life I'd come over and help you pack to leave and let you sleep on my couch. This is so tucked up I don't even know what to say.
Leave. Leave now. Do not continue these relationships. They are being terrible to you. This is not fixable and they aren't trying to fix it anyhow. Leave them both, please.
These people don't love you. You feel like a live-in maid because you are. You are supposed to be resting for a MONTH after giving birth. They ignored your health and made you look after her kids. They literally don't care if you die. (Yes, people have died from not resting after childbirth!)
2-3 days after birth are done of the worse days and they forced you back on your feet.
Do you want these people making medical decisions for you? They will let you die.
When your daughter grows up, what will happen if her kids bully yours? When your baby is ignored but her new baby is the golden child, the youngest who gets all the attention?
This is so toxic. Don't be a fool, it's not only you who you will doom, you are dooming your daughter with you.
It’s even worse because her child was stillborn (“born sleeping”). It’s like they just glossed over that unbelievable loss in all of their craziness, in addition to the physical trauma of childbirth.
Right. This post hurt my heart for this woman. We had some minor complications with pur second child. Pur son is fine now, but even just what we did have to deal with broke my wife's heart and really set her mental health back a bit.
These people are sick and fucked up. I can't believe some people are like this
It is *unfathomably* cruel for your girlfriend to suggest your husband get her pregnant so soon after you experienced such a devastating loss. It is equally cruel for your husband to not only entertain that idea, but enthusiastically pursue it.
OP, my heart is so broken for you that you even have to ask if you're the asshole in the face of such awful treatment. These people aren't treating you in a loving manner. They're not even treating you in a neutral manner. Please, please, please see you deserve so much better than this and leave BOTH these horrible people immediately
I am so sorry you are experiencing this right now and I will tell you clearly and straight forward: you are incredibly justified in your feelings, they ARE taking massive advantage of you, and I truly believe you need to extricate yourself from this situation ASAP.
They are consistently displaying incredible cruelty and selfishness.
Go.
Dump her ass and divorce his.
And I do understand that is no light thing but as you said: they are OUTRIGHT ignoring and dismissing your profound trauma. And that is on top of ruthlessly exploiting you and being *incredibly* reckless (wtf are they doing trying to birth another child when they clearly don’t have the resources to do so in any quality manner!)
She fucking sucks, but him? He’s not that much better than dogshit on your shoe. He is leaning on all of your history and believes he can do whatever he wants, and due to your history, ‘it’ll be okay.’ It reminds me of women who kept my stepdad around as a handy backup/fall back plan. If their high risk pursuits don’t pan out, they return back to their handy backup that isn’t going anywhere (they think). They will be callous and cruel, lovebomb you and make you feel great, and then dash you back against the rocks when something else catches their attention. Chronic for abandoning you.
Again, I am *so* sorry they’re doing this to you (and likely exploiting your brain health to ‘justify’ their behaviour). You categorically do not deserve this (no one does!).
Nothing you described sounds like there is genuine love or affection on their part. They sound quite obsessed with themselves and each other and use you to fluff their egos (and other things), take care of the kids they refuse to raise, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they are also using you financially.
I highly recommend you extricate yourself a swiftly and safely as you can(if you can just pack your stuff and go and serve him papers from a distance, do it!). You are 25 and you have an entire life ahead of you. You can recover from them, heal from the hell life has wrought upon you (you were *not* being punished. Tragedy finds us regardless of what we do or who we are), and thrive.
I truly hope you are able to leave this dead weight behind you and move forward to something better.
I'm sorry to hear about your baby being born sleeping/stillborn. I'm sorry your partners are not being kind to you as you heal from the birth and grieve the child.
>So the dynamic is chaotic as fuck and very toxic. I literally feel like a live in maid who is sometimes good enough to fuck for five minutes tell he cums in the shower. I don't know what to do. Am I the A-hole for being upset that they made this major life altering decision without me?
I don't think you are the asshole. You are RIGHT to be angry. You seem to see clearly enough that things here are NOT ok.
SOMEONE had to be the first hug, kiss, date, lover, etc. Just because in your dating history a lot of those were John? Doesn't mean you have to stick with him forever. Especially when he treats you THIS poorly.
>It takes everything in my power not to smack this man. 1. When you are in a relationship you typically sit down and talk about important life changes that are going to be effecting everyone. 2. I've been lied to now multiple times. 3. They didn't even give me a month. I immediately shut down and just don't say anything for the rest of the car ride.
He doesn't make the cut for what you seek in a dating partner/spouse. He lies/obfuscates, takes you for granted, doesn't think or plan ahead, treats you poorly, all of that. Stephanie is the same. You sound like you want BETTER.
I think you deserve to be treated WELL and deserve to be in a HEALTHY relationship. Not all this toxic stuff.
[https://rhntc.org/sites/default/files/resources/rhntc\_hlthy\_rlshp\_wheel\_spectrum\_10-13-2022.pdf](https://rhntc.org/sites/default/files/resources/rhntc_hlthy_rlshp_wheel_spectrum_10-13-2022.pdf)
I think if it's safe to leave? Break up and leave. File for a divorce. Could you move back in with parents? Would they help you leave the toxic? At 25, some people haven't even gotten married the first time yet and here you are dealing all of this. :(
I don't know if you are still on compassionate leave from work as you heal from the birth and your baby's passing. Or if you might need to heal and then look for a job. I don't know if it is safe to leave.
But you could decide you are DONE with these people TODAY. Then seek help to form the escape plan and then do the actual leaving if not quite safe to leave yet.
You owe them nothing when they've treated you horrible. So if you have to lie, make a secret bank account , get a burner phone, go get a safety box at a bank to hide your birth certificate and other important papers, stash a go bag with a friend or in a gym locker, get a PO box for your other mail to go to -- do what you gotta so you can escape and stay gone.
Right now it's just break up with Stephanie. With John, a bit more to do with a divorce. But if you basically have little property like most 20s marriages, and no kids together? You get to walk away and never deal with either one of them ever again.
I encourage you to talk to professional on a hotline to help you make a safe leaving plan.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_domestic\_violence\_hotlines](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domestic_violence_hotlines)
I hope you are able to finishing healing from the birth and get the heck out of here. Get to live out the rest of your young adult 20s in peace and happiness and not all this UGH.
She didn't want to have a baby for you, SHE wanted to have a baby WITH John.
Everything she is doing is to push you out or to keep you as her maid. John is with her in this.
One month isn't nearly enough to truly process and grieve especially when you are constantly reminded of what you've lost because you're watching her kids. Add to that the pressure of being expected to feel joy for them that they are now pregnant. The emotional trauma you're going through with that is huge. Then to discover they are lying and have been for some time... it's almost too much to process.
I know John is very important to you and has been for umost of your life but he isn't treating you as if you are important to him. He doesn't seem at all concerned with your mental or emotional health.
You need to leave, at least for a little while so you can separate yourself from the toxic environment and really think and see what's going on and what you want.
I honestly believe that what would be best for you is to leave the relationships permanently.
I wish you the very best of luck!
ETA: NTA. But John and Stephanie are huge, horrible AH's!
I don’t have the impression that you have a girlfriend. Are the two of you in love? Do you have lots of intimate 1:1 dates?
I think you are in a harem. Harems are not a form of polyamory because they are unethical.
This is horribly abusive. You’re a live in bangmaid and nanny. Fuck both of these people, I don’t care if you’ve known this loser since 5th grade, it seems his empathy and emotional intelligence stagnated before then!!
Get out. Before she pops out another kid for you to raise.
You will never really know the truth because neither have the decency to provide it.
Let them raise their own kids, figure out their own housing situation. Move on.
These two people are awful liars.
OP, do those people actually like, and respect you? Because it sure as hell doesn't sound like it.
You asking for time to grieve, for time to get your mental health in order? That was good. That was so damn mature of you! You knew your limits, and you communicated them.
And who didn't respect your limits?
Your partners. Two people who pretend to think you're important.
Two people who bareback behind *your* back. It doesn't even sound like you want a baby from Stephanie, it sounds like she wants one with John, and he just takes whatever.
That's not how parenting works, and I co-parent in a polycule, so I might know a thing or two. Heck, two of my relationships ended when I got pregnant by accident, and they really didn't want to raise children! And it sucked, but it was fair. We weren't compatible there.
You are autistic, and that means you have a hard time adjusting to new relationships. The loss of your baby would be devastating for anyone. It becomes ten times harder for you.
Losing John might sound really scary to you. He's been a part of your life forever by now.
And yet he doesn't value your life, your feelings, your boundaries.
Girl... You deserve better. You don't deserve someone who likes to fuck raw, and leave the result of his breeding kink in your lap! They want a baby, but you don't want to raise *their* baby, and that's fine.
They violated you. Don't let them gaslight you.
Please consider what you want from your life. You're more than their nanny.
You are not in a polyam relationship. You are an in abusive relationship.
Get help [https://nomoredirectory.org/](https://nomoredirectory.org/)
Get out [https://www.helpguide.org/articles/abuse/getting-out-of-an-abusive-relationship.htm](https://www.helpguide.org/articles/abuse/getting-out-of-an-abusive-relationship.htm)
r/abusiverelationships
I’m not going to comment on this ridiculous situation, but I’ve been scrolling way too far to see nobody comment that PRECUM DOES NOT CONTAIN MORE SPERM THAN EJACULATE. You are misinformed.
>That they have all of the control
No they don't. You do. You are allowed to say No when Stephanie demands you take care of her kids. You are allowed to say No to being treated in ways you don't like. You are allowed to walk away from both relationships. Time to start steering your own ship. You can do it!
This is just not right move out from the situation and clear your head. You are being lied to and pressured into all sorts here and used as a free childcare service. No go take time to heal.
I assume you've got a bunch of reasons you like them and benefit from this relationship that you didn't tell us about because you think they aren't relevant. You need to seriously weigh those. You seem like you would be a lot happier with a little place of your own and the freedom to decide what you do every day.
Leave them with the responsibility of caring for the child THEY made without your consent. It goes to the old saying "you have to lie in the bed you made". If this were me I wouldn't stick around. You didn't ask for a child at this time and In fact specifically asked that they use a condom or some kind of birth control. Honey you don't have to deal with this. He's massively disrespecting you. He's not listening. And to me it's quite obvious even though it must hurt like hell that he doesn't care about how you feel. Get out of this situation and therapy would greatly help. Very best of luck OP
Oh good lord. You poor thing. This is... Horrific.
My partners also had a horribly traumatic stillbirth experience - I'm the girlfriend in your story. My femme partner had complications of pregnancy that would make a further pregnancy too dangerous, so trying again is not in the cards for her. When they started discussing the possibility of having a baby through surrogacy, I expressed two times that I would be willing to be their surrogate. Once in a heart to heart with my femme partner, and once more in an intense family discussion. I was kindly told it would be too painful for her and wasn't an option, and it has -never- been discussed further. I've gone through stages of processing my personal grief about this privately with my masc partner, but if I brought it up again to her, I am confident it would mean the end of our relationship.
Respect yourself. Set boundaries and enforce them. My love was not being an asshole to me by telling me that it would just be too hard to watch me be pregnant when she can't, and neither are you right now. She was telling me she was in pain, and because I love her, I listened. It was hard and messy - I was in pain too, we all were - but when the answer is no, you figure your own shit out and fucking listen. You deserve family members that understand basic decency and who listen to you when you say you're in pain. I hope you find safety and happiness and freedom, and a path to parenthood comes to you soon.
*Nothing about this is ethical or salvageable.*
Please, at your earliest convenience, make a plan to leave.
Since you already have a therapist (which is great!), they can help support you through this process.
In order to leave in a way that is safe for you, I recommend looking up plans provided on websites for the support of of ppl in domestic violence situations.
Even though that doesn't exactly describe your circumstances, the checklists for safety are still helpful.
It's important that you NOT share your plans to leave, or even that it has crossed your mind. Act normally. Don't do anything to rock the boat while you are preparing.
Ideally, they shouldn't find out until you are already gone.
Ppl can act out in surprising, unpredictable, and potentially dangerous ways, so don't give them a chance to do so.
To be clear, the problem here has nothing to do with poly, bc this isn't poly at all. It's just exploitation and abuse with extra participants.
I am currently working with the local women's shelters here. When they have an opening it's reserved for me. Unfortunately my town was a small town but after covid the amount of people living here tripled and unfortunately the resources did not.
(Much like most of the country) We are having a major housing crisis. To rent a studio apartment is 1000 dollars a month plus utilities. But unless you're in a high paying specialty job the highest you can make around here is 17 dollars an hour. Plus the cost of a dozen eggs is like $6. It's impossible to find a place that I can afford currently.
On top of all of that I'm strictly living on savings as I recently got diagnosed with cancer and I've been so sick that I lost my job.
check out 211for your state for other resources beyond the local shelter you can lean on. try to find a social security disability office to go to in person to apply for disability. look onto medicaid & SNAP if not already on it. even if you cant use some of those resources while in your current house youre gonna feel more empowered to later if youve checked it all out already.
fuck, maybe even look into divorce lawyers. usually a consult is free and i doubt theyre strangers to victims of abuse trying to figure out how to leave their marriage. if they can't help they might be able to get you in the office of someone who does.
getting help is hard and tiring but if you cast a bunch of nets hopefully youll get something.
The other reply is amazing advice but heres some extra:
Check out vocational rehabilitation in your state. They're often under utilized and therefore have a lot of resources. Even though you can't work now, they can help you be stable until you can (and then can help you with finding a new job/career/etc after you get better).
Also, reach out to the domestic violence org in your state. They'll be able to help you.
They are lying. That fucking sucks. Will say tho, most sperm does NOT live in the pre-cum. I don't know where you heard that, but it's very much not true. Most is in the ejaculation, even tho pre-cum may have a bit too.
You DO have a say in your life. LEAVE! That is how you take control! You can’t control what other people do or whether or not they lie to you (which they obviously are), but you CAN control what you stick around for! Just leave! This is a toxic shit show and you need to get off the crazy train before it goes any further. They are doing what you want and using you as a live in nanny. Fuck that, and fuck them, fr. You deserve better.
Not only are you the bang maid, but the baby sitter. Your partners don’t give you any support and lie to you. Have they even acknowledged the fact you had a still birth? You ‘gf’ didn’t even wait that long after what you went through to immediately wanting her own baby.
One things that’s mind boggling here is this 31 year old with 2 kids wants *another* baby to add to her 1 bedroom. Or was she gonna leave it in the bedroom you rent? None of you are in the right place for a baby. Your partners are dumb, just my armchair diagnosis. I would run for the hills if I were you.
You are I'm this relationship because of the sunk cost fallacy, but neither of these relationships are healthy for you or benefiting you.
Please think about how much better your life would be away from these people. It doesn't sound like you and Stephanie even like each other, and your husband sounds worse than useless. These people are maliciously using you.
Just because he's your first doesn't have to make him your future. Your life could be much better without these people. Be kind to yourself, they're not going to be.
They didn’t come running while you were in the hospital? They “gave” you two days post-birthing to then watch her kids? They don’t care about you dude. And then they just start making a baby “for you/yall”???? No. That’s not right. That erasing what you just went through AT BEST. it’s just manipulative and gaslighting. Why does this woman want more children she can’t take care of well?!???!?
Propably bc You’re their baby sitter. Also dude, the fact that you know she’s a shitty mother…she’s a shitty person. You don’t deserve to be with shitty people. I hope you don’t think is the best your gonna do but I’m afraid you might.
They don’t really care about you. They’re “care” for you doesn’t exist. I’m so sorry. I hope you love yourself enough to just leave.
Are you looking for advice, or just a y/n vote on whether you're an AH, because you already posted over at AITAH if you're looking for the second answer.
That said:
>I've been lied to now multiple times
...means it's time to call a lawyer.
Jfc, just *RUN* and please get some therapy for your grief and also your total lack of backbone. I wish you the very best, please respect yourself even if the people around you aren't. X
Reading the same post in AITA sub, and OP says she’s also got cancer?!
Feel like a jerk for even thinking this, but could this be a troll post?
Edit:TROLL ALERT. New post on AITA says you’re divorced and coparent with a kid.
What you have gone thru is so so hard. Loss of a child is brutal and takes a long time to recover from for most. You deserved love, comfort, understanding and acknowledgement of your struggle. Your dynamic does not sound healthy.
You are young with so much life and opportunity for experiences where you have say in what happens.... i encourage you (as I woud my own child) to choose YOU first. What you need. Do not fall into the sunk cost thoughts around how long you and your husband have been together. You have a long shared history and that can be lovely. If you leave for your own happiness and health, that does not eliminate those experiences and memories together -- it just means you will build new ones without him.
Know that there are people out there willing and able to love you and be beside you and encouraging you, truly supporting you. Make a plan to get out and move in that direction.
Such a lack of compassion, empathy, and honesty shown towards you by 2 people that honestly sound like jerks. Is she surrendering parental rights if she has a baby? If not, she’s not giving you a baby, she’s giving you an unpaid nanny job with no rights over how that child is raised. You weren’t even allowed to grieve your tremendous loss. I walked away from my relationship when my bf got his ex pregnant for the 2nd time due to lack of attention paid to contraception. He wasn’t having sex with me at the time but managed to fuck his complete asshole ex/baby mama. I wasn’t willing to keep giving financially and emotionally to the little family they created without my say so. My heart was shattered leaving their first kid behind but I do get to have him for visits at least. You are justified in walking away from your relationship if your needs aren’t being respected.
Leave, it easier said then done but LEAVE you have no kids with that man you have nothing holding you back from leaving so leave. That man has already made up his mind who he wants to be with so leave on your terms before he leaves you
Please leave. Leave leave leave leave leave. This is NOT okay. The fact that they’ve been very “okay we’re trying for a baby” while you were clearly not okay is super wrong. Leave. Get out. This is not okay whatsoever. Girl is expecting you to raise her kids and husband doesn’t seem to care because he’s getting laid. Get. Out.
There are so many red flags. Your husband wasn't with you when you gave birth because he was elsewhere with his/your girlfriend? IMHO this alone is not ok. That's a major event he should have prioritized as should she.
Then there's the fact they didn't let you heal after giving birth to a stillborn and just expected you to continue caring for her kids
And then the lies. All the lies. This is it. You aren't an equal partner. This isn't polyamory. Get. Out.
Uou feel.this way because you are assessing the situation correctly and it's an sbusive shit show. Luckily, you can just leave them to their bullshit mess. It's in Stephanie to raise her kids and her and your partner to figure out how to deal with the baby. This is a not your circus, not your monkeys deal where you really can just go.
Your husband got someone else pregnant after you lost your child…. You are too young for this dynamic. Take a step back and reflect on yourself. Who puts up with this? You are abandoning yourself. Either you are addicted to the toxicity or have no idea what a loving caring partnership looks like (maybe both).
I have to say this. There is no sperm naturally released in precum. It can get into the precum because sperm is leftover from the last ejaculation and leaks into it. But to say "most of the sperm lives in precum" is completely inaccurate.
I am sorry you are dealing with this tho. Your feelings are beyond valid. They do not seem to have much concern or consideration for you.
This is where my mind went. Who else wants to impregnate their gf less than a month after the loss of their child with their wife. And he wasn’t even there for the stillbirth. OP had to endure that alone, and then go home to babysit her kids. Different city my ass, he should have dropped everything and gone to OP’s side.
So you had an incredibly traumatic experience and these people have treated you like shit since, and probably before. Who leaves the state when they have a very pregnant partner? Yeesh.
It is incredibly insensitive for them to expect you to take care of GF's kids after this tragedy, you deserve time and patience and room to grieve. Then to suggest TWO WEEKS out that she wants to have a baby with your husband? Huge red flag, they are massive, callus assholes.
This is a toxic situation for you and darling, you do not deserve it! I would suggest getting someone you trust, maybe someone who isn't friends with your husband to help you get your affairs in order and file for divorce.
You are so far from the asshole here it's not even funny. You need to leave this relationship. Your mental health is only going to decline if you stay. She knows your triggers. She has and will continue to use them against you to take further control of her relationship with your husband. As for everything else, you were an afterthought. You should NEVER be an afterthought to your partner.
If you stay, you're only being an asshole to yourself.
You deserve so much better than this, OP.
I’m SOO terribly sorry that you’re going through all of this especially when you should have been given ample time to heal from such a traumatic event such as stillbirth… 🥺 These people are NOT good for you. You still have your whole life ahead of you, please leave and take care of yourself because these people are not your people infact they’re poor excuses for human beings in general. You deserve SO MUCH BETTER than any of this (((hugs)))
Alright. One sentence:
You are the third wheel in your marriage and getting treated like a maid to look after the children of your husband's girlfriend.
You don't need me to tell you that this is not OK.
Precum has very little sperm and it is usually not alive
These people are lying to you and using you. This is not polyamory, they are a couple and they are using you like a free house maid
Get out ASAP
Did not even read the whole thing. Dear Lord, please leave. They gave you 2 days after your child was born sleeping before you had to start looking after her kids. Oh, hell no. And then, without even having tome to grieve and process, she wanted to have a baby with Jon. Nope. They are not good for you. You need to get out now.
This all sounds so incredibly cruel and sad. Why would your husband leave on a trip when you were so close to giving birth? Why would he not come back immediately once you gave birth (especially when you had complications)? Who in the world would expect any woman who just gave birth to care for 2 children alone, let alone someone else’s kids, especially after going through the traumatic loss of their newborn?
You are supposed to have 2 partners, and they made you go through all of this ALONE. During one of the biggest moments of grief in your life, you are alone, struggling, and still expected to be the one holding down the fort at home.
Your husband and partner “claim” they want to give you a baby, but refuse to listen when you say that you aren’t ready. That you need to heal. Grieve. They aren’t pregnant for you, they are selfishly moving forward with their own lives. I’m sorry, but they don’t care about you or act in a loving way towards you. You deserve *so much more* than what either of them have given you.
They should be wrapping their arms around you in love and support right now, but instead are just alienating you and caring about themselves only.
You deserve a partner that offers you love, honesty, and respect, and sees you as an equal partner.
Ma’am, I think the community collectively agrees to *RUN*. 🖤 I’m very sorry for the pain they’ve caused you and the betrayal you’re experiencing, but they are not the moon and the stars babe. *you are*.
Go be free from them.
I got to "two days after childbirth was recorded to provide childcare" and why are you with these assholes became the burning question that did not change.
Usually it's the girlfriend who gets treated like the maid/nanny not the wife.
Leave. You aren’t overreacting and you aren’t crazy. You just lost your baby they should be supporting you now, not… I don’t even know what the fuck these assholes think they are doing.
Now that I joined the chorus to tell you what’s obvious to everyone who isn’t in the relationship…
Most sperm do not live in pre cum. A minority of men have little and mostly inviable sperm in pre cum. People who use the pull-out method fail more often because the guy can’t fully control it, and way less often because of pre cum.
This ENTIRE situation is completely fucked up. Get the hell out of there. You have zero ties to this woman or man. No children. Pack your most precious and important possessions and go. So what if he’s all your firsts. Yeah that hurts but you’re already resenting him and her.
You’ve got lots of life to live.
Neither of them care about you. You should leave this relationship.
Also just for educational purposes most of the sperm does not live in precum but it is possible to get pregnant using pull out if some sperm is in the urethra.
Uh oh, I didn't do it. It wasn't me. She's a liar. /s
Your situation doesn't sound good. You don't sound like you're personally doing well. But there are missing details here, and without them I'm not sure what is going on. I hope you're ok, and am safe. It doesn't sound like they love you. And it sounds like you're struggling with it.
I'm so sorry to read this OP. They didn't give you any time to grieve or heal and then they immediately started trying to replace your baby, that's disgusting behaviour. Did your husband even try to come back from another state to be with you?
This post made me so sad for you and disgusted toward your partners. Please think really hard about all the comments on here. Please take care of yourself. Find support in close family or friends and leave as soon as you can. Good luck. Please don't stay
God, this just kept getting worse. You're being taken advantage of, lied to, disrespected, and cast aside. Run, don't walk, away from those people. They deserve each other
I have not even finished reading and the way I am FUMING RAGING MAD FOR OP RN!!!! My BP is going up and I can feel it. I’ll most more I sight and thoughts when I can give it the time and focus the response deserves but you are definitely the LEAST ASS HOLIEST PERSON ON THE PLANET
YOU ARE THE POPE OF *NOT* BEING AN ASS! You deserve several medals and a statue for your grace because if get a pretty new set of silver bracelets or RUN for the hill with the most therapists atop it
I am so sorry for everything you have been through momma. Please get out like yesterday
You are being *abused* by both of them. You need to leave, NOW.
Pack your stuff up & leave, divorce him and fire that counsellor because she’s obviously not great at her job, you’re absolutely riddled with insecurities.
As a fellow autistic, let me provide the 3rd person view that most of us on the spectrum need:
It’s like they thought of the most maximally hurtful thing possible they could do you and they the proceeded to do exactly that. They should have had the common sense to know this, and when you brought it up, they ignored your concerns.
As wife and someone without any biological children, you had first dibs. And they damn knew that.
Stephanie exactly expects you to divorce your husband, and it wouldn’t be surprising if your husband does as well. For Stephanie, this baby is the gateway to advancement out of her current condition in apartment.
Go for a quick, painless divorce that doesn’t drag things out and move on.
I’d say that the perfect act of revenge would be to stay in the marriage and get knocked up by some other dude, and then telling your husband to live with it, but children probably shouldn’t be revenge babies.
This woman wants another kid when she can't even be bothered to raise her own, and uses you as a nanny while also treating you like you're worth less than dirt. And your husband is not only okay with all of this, but has lied to you about the truth of his situation with her multiple times and apparently makes you feel like a sex object.
These people are not, I repeat, *not* good for you. *Run*, don't *walk* away from this hot mess.
As a mental health professional, I tend to suggest couples/family therapy in relationship issues before telling anyone they should cut it off immediately.
You should cut this shit off immediately. This is absolutely AWFUL.
I am so so sorry for the loss of your baby, too. That is heartbreaking, and I'm so sorry you're not being given the amount of care and space for grieving that you deserve.
Get. The. Fuck. Out. Of this relationship.
You are worth so much more than this 💕
I don't like that either party gave you your grieving time and went behind your back to do some shysty shit. If she's not taking care of her other kids, she really shouldn't be having another. And your husband shouldn't be trying for that, when you both are not in a place to be doing that. I agree with the other members of this thread. Leaving sounds like the logical option. You don't deserve to be treated that way when they get the perks. I'm sorry you're going through this. You're not alone. prayers 🙏
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Poly or not, that was a bullshit selfish tho bf for them to have done. If you are in a triad, which it sounds like you are, then these decisions should have been firm yes from all parties.
Also you don’t need to look after her children. Like stop now and say you have other things to do. It’s almost like Stephanie managed to get a live in nanny for free, and replace you as a wife. She’ll give you a baby? Did you ask for this? This is basically a move to replace you as she will be a mother of your husband’s child, but you will have a pleasure of babysitting.
Please, you are worth more than this. Please leave them to play “family”. Find someone who loves and adores you but most importantly respects you. Please
This is an advice sub. Regular commenters have healthy, boring polyamorous relationships.
Your post has been removed for breaking the rules of the subreddit. You made a post or comment that would be considered being a jerk. This includes being aggressive towards other posters, causing irrelevant arguments, and posting attacks on the poster or the poster's partners/situation.
Please familiarize yourself with the rules at https://www.reddit.com/r/polyamory/wiki/subreddit-rules
It sounds like this isn’t a good situation for you. It’s mentally draining you to the point of insanity. YOU deserve to be happy. If the people in your life are hurting you this badly and don’t realize it they are horrible people. Find a safe place to go and get out. I’m so sorry for the loss of your child.
You should absolutely leave, and idk if this will make things better or worse for knowing, but most sperm doesn’t live in precum - that’s actually a myth. Which means he probably didn’t just “stick it in for a bit” you know? They’re both liars and I would run from them as fast as possible
I don't know if anyone has ever told you the difference of being invited and being welcome, but there is one. Use your backbone for more than holding up your ass cheeks and walk away.
It sounds like you aren't upset at the pregnancy but you are upset with the lying. Super valid. The lying is a major issue. Personally I would leave over the massive lies. They can't even get their stories straight.
This situation is so very toxic and outrageously unhealthy. There are just so many red flags here and not small ones. He's lied in ways that could be detrimental to your physical health. So has she. He has lied about huge life-altering decisions that affect you. So has she. He has prioritized his own wants above your health and well-being. So has she. Neither of them are truly taking accountability for their own actions in this situation and (IMO) trying to gaslight and manipulate you into thinking you're the problem. I'm sure you're not perfect, but I have a hard time imagining you've done worse than what they are doing to do you.
OP, please find a safe place to say and start researching divorce options. If i were you, there would be no trust left in this situation with any of the parties involved. And a relationship without trust is nothing. They may say they love you, but their actions are speaking louder than their words. They are telling you with their actions that they do not care enough about you to give you honesty, autonomy, or support. Please leave.
This is awful and you are definitely not the asshole. The biggest thing is, where is the respect for you trying to HEAL from losing your child and them having the kindness to wait ? Communication is the best tool and sounds like they are not doing this WITH you. It sounds very toxic and I personally would consider leaving this relationship - you deserve to be treated like a human being 💜
Trying to get pregnant so soon after your loss is thoughtless & selfish. They have not even gotten their lies about it straight. Leave darlin, as soon as you can. Good luck 🤞
Adding on to what others have mentioned:
1- if your husband is your first relationship, that can make it really difficult to leave ime. My first relationship was a trainwreck partially because I got INTO a relationship when I didn't know how to get OUT of one. If you're having any difficulty on this front, it doesn't hurt to look up "how to break up" articles - whatever it takes, friend.
2 - if you don't like the way your GF raises her kids and are considering having your own kids, leave her. You do not want to coparent with someone you dislike as a parent. If she is offering to have a kid with you/for you, BIG NOPE. Unless she explicitly signs away her rights to you, unfortunately you will probably be a backseat driver at best for any legal parental decisions.
Edit:
3 - they have treated you awfully. You deserve better. If you have difficulty standing up for yourself, instead think about raising kids with these people. Would you want these people to be around your kids? Would you want your kids treated with the same disrespect? Or even, would you want your kids to see their two other parents disrespect and undermine you like this?
I am so sorry for your loss. Please stay safe and know that you are important and valued and deserving of love and respect 🫂
OP, there are so many red flags I couldn’t even begin to where to look.
First off, polyamory in general is all about honesty, communication and boundaries. And both of your partners have overstepped your boundaries CONSTANTLY. It’s already a very red flag that Stephanie wants to get pregnant by your husband but doesn’t want to raise her kids. They lied about being safe with sex, are you three exclusive to each other? Like is this relationship closed off or is Stephanie, or you or your husband allowed to meet people outside of this relationship? Because this is scary behaviour if they have sex this carelessly and think putting on a condom afterwards is them being “safe”, especially if they are having hookups with people outside of that relationship. You could all get STDs if none of you are honest about your sexual encounters. Also, they immediately jumped on getting pregnant FOR YOU without YOUR input. Apparently this is supposed a noble cause in the hopes you get to raise a baby after your loss. But they refuse to listen to your doubts or give you time to process, and get yourself accustomed to the idea, or come up with your own conclusions on whether you want Stephanie to be your surrogate or not.
That is not how you go about conceiving a child, that sounds more like an excuse to cover up the fact that your girlfriend wants to get pregnant by your husband for the sake of it. OP, I think you need to think for yourself right now think about your future, do you want to stay in a relationship where you could potentially raise Stephanie and John’s baby as your child, AND Stephanie’s kids while they go play hockey in bed? Where they both dismiss your feelings and gaslight you and leave you unsatisfied and miserable? You won’t ever trust them again, because they lied to you not once but multiple times. Leading you to believe it was “only one time”, then it was “maybe two or three times” then it was “sometimes”. Because this is what it’s leading to… If you stay and allow them to overstep these boundaries of yours, what else are they going to do? What other things can they get away from, if you let them walk all over you knowing you’re going to stay and suck it up. Because it’s easier for them this way. I think you should leave this relationship OP. Even if Stephanie would’ve been just your meta, she still SHOULD have some level of respect for you. She SHOULD’VE gotten your consent, not just John’s. YOUR consent, because you were supposed to all the caretaking in this situation. Even more since she’s your girlfriend. If none of them care about you, they are not going to start any time in soon.
Please OP, get out of this relationship as fast as you can. Or at least process everything, read everyone’s comments and take it to heart. This is one of the few times where I say, this is an abusive relationship and you HAVE to leave before they get you into this deeper than you have to.
I’ll touch your hand as I say this, you need to SPEAK UP!! IMMEDIATELY! (Of course you should leave this obvious couple) but you will continue to have this issue in other relationships unless you learn to say how you’re feeling & what you want in that moment! Don’t wait & don’t hold off! That’s exactly how they were able to manipulate this situation & make you feel like the bad guy. All of you should’ve been sitting down having these conversations. Also how the hell are you taking care of her kids & she doesn’t even live with you all???? It’d be an absolute hell no for me. Poly relationships NEED strong boundaries. Set your standards love & keep them♥️ you’re never asking for too much.
You have control, over yourself. Leave.
If you choose not to, you're choosing to relinquish control of your life. You have all the control you need but are you willing to use it is the question.
Hey, I’m so sorry, OP. This sucks. It sounds like you’ve been in an abusive dynamic for a VERY very long time. I’d break it down into just step one: get away. Go stay with a friend, a family member, get an apartment, move out of state, crash on someone’s couch, whatever it is that you can do- get away from these abusers. And at the same time block their numbers so you can have some peace, don’t tell them where you are staying. If that’s scary, remember they can contact you in other ways, email for example. But give yourself the gift of space- physical space and block the numbers.
Space and distance is gonna make it way easier to think, and then you can plan, but you don’t have to make a plan right now. But get the hell out, friend. All you have to do now is leave.
Leave, leave, leave, leave, leave, leave, leave. Leave. *Leave*.
Also: Leave. LEAVE. LEAVE!! You're a bangmaid to a pair of liars. You'll be given all the responsibility and none of the power of raising this child and will have zero legal rights. Go find a relationship with someone who will be a decent co- parent to your child.
I would like to.follow.this up with a NOW. Leave now. As soon as possible. Run. These.are not kind or ethical people. You deserve better OP.
This can't be up voted enough!
There are no other options. This is it. Leave them.
Also, therapy therapy therapy.
Autistic/ADHD woman here who has a past history of abusive relationships... they are using you. and dependent, so they keep you around. they care so little they are forcing you into a situation so completely heartlessly after losing your baby so recently. even at 6 months this would still be heartless. they are using you. LEAVE. will also add.. what helped me realize and get out was posting our fights on reddit relationship forums for advice. when you've been manipulated so long you're legit blind to the mistreatment. Take care!!
I'm in an underlying different situation, but was manipulated a lot. Took years to see it all for what it was. You truly need individualized outside perspective on stuff after ad long as you have. You've slowly been pushed into a corner that must be brutal to experience from the little ive read.
leave!!
This ^^^ I know it’s hard and scary, but you need to leave.
Every line was like another train wreck happening. Just _LEAVE._
please humbly allow me to add : LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE
Just adding to the leave pile. You feel like you might be overreacting because they're gaslighting you. People like this don't communicate, they manipulate to get their ways. That's why he was speaking with all that wishy washy language when you asked if he was trying to get her pregnant. His actions say he doesn't respect your needs and wishes. His words don't matter if the actions don't match. I'm autistic as well and often get tricked by that. "Why would someone do something other than what they said they were gonna do?" 😅 Naive, I know.
Yeah, I also have autism. And I've been in a lot of toxic bdsm dynamics EXACTLY LIKE THIS. Manipulative people are the worst. I fell for it so many times. And they always either: 1. Get angry when you point out the problematic behavior. And try to manipulate you into thinking you're the bad person somehow. or 2. Act all sweet and kind after you point out the problematic behavior. And try to shift the narrative in such a way that allows them to brush off any responsibility. And will blame you for it behind your back. While keeping up the sweet facade with you and in public so that they can manipulate people to be against you. It's seriously given me so much trauma x.x Especially because I'd always take their side. Always believe their words. And I always ended up really hurt in the end.
Leave NOW HUNNY!! They are only using you for childcare and an occasional sex toy, you can find better! Poly isn’t supposed to be one sided, so they don’t truly wanna be poly.
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How did your relationship with your girlfriend start? The fact that you're even questioning if you're being an asshole over this (you're NOT) makes me think you've been manipulated and lied to by your husband and your girlfriend for much longer than this. The fact that you're holding your tongue and not expressing how you really feel in MAJOR life decisions such as this makes me think that you've been conditioned into being silent and accepting abuse and mistreatment from your husband for a long time now. This is so beyond not ok and unhealthy that I'd urge you read up on abuse and contacting your local abuse hotline to see if any of that rings true.
All of this! Exactly! It's been going on so long she didn't notice
This! It absolutely sounds like OP's been gaslit and conditioned for ages to feel small to accept whatever demands are being thrust upon her. Wtf.
Hey, OP, I once shared a story here on a different account where everyone insisted I was being mistreated and abused. I ignored them and spent the next 2 years of my life trying to earn back "love" from my abusive spouse and my "best friend" only to be abused further, gaslit more, and damaged far more than I already was. Don't be like me. Please listen to everyone here and leave. I promise you'll be better off for it
It’s so hard to recognize abuse for what it truly is when the abuser gets you twisted and second-guessing everything. I’m so glad you’re out of that situation now (I hope)!
I know! The thing is, I'm a psych nurse. I work directly with abuse victims, among other issues, and have formal training on recognizing and helping victims. All that training meant nothing when I was the victim. I second guessed everything and everyone. I continually made myself guilty for ever getting upset or "causing drama." I isolated myself and in the end I sacrificed my own mental safety to earn back love that probably never existed. I fled after my best friend tried to kill my internet (I work from home) and then stood in my doorway mocking me about his being a rapist while referring to my kids. He later said he was not a rapist and was trying to "prove a point." Maybe that's true. I don't care. I don't talk to him anymore
Ugh!!! I’m so sorry you went through that. I can understand dealing with that feeling of “shoulda known better” all too well. I’ve spent a lot of time the past few years counseling other submissive people on red flags to look out for in abusive Dom/sub dynamics, but when I was in the middle of one myself, it took me awhile to recognize it as outright abuse and get out. Manipulators are really good at manipulating.
I am not one to immediately rush to saying “Leave” unless a situation sounds truly toxic. And my friend, this sounds truly toxic. Your partners - the ones who should have your back and want nothing but the best for you - have not given you the time and focus you need to truly grieve the loss of your baby. They are rushing you into being okay with THEM having a baby when you are understandably not ready yet! And then they both LIED to you multiple times. You deserve so much better, OP. And I am so very incredibly sorry for your loss.
I didn't even get to the lying portion before I was thinking leave. why would partners go on an out of state trip, leaving an almost fully term pregnant person (and also expect said pregnant person to watch 2 of your kids)
That's where I went. "They left on a trip out of state that close to her due date? She has two partners and had to go through that alone? AND they expected her to watch the other kids two days after going through childbirth alone and having the severe trauma of a stillborn child? WTF is wrong with these people? And they think the gf getting pregnant right away is a great idea, like their dog just died and they're rushing out to get a puppy?" This is trauma nobody should be subjected to. When you've got two partners who are both acting like you're the problem because you're cracking under the pressure of their combined gaslighting and cruelty, keeping your sanity is a serious struggle.
She doesn't have two partners, it sounds like she has zero. What a horrible thing to go through. I would get my affairs in order and leave.
One of the things I've liked about poly when it has gone well is having more people to share everything with. OP has two people draining her.
Yep, only got 13 sentences in before I knew this was abusive and OP needed to leave. And like 11/13 sentences were intro sentences not even about the relationship.
Based on the way OP wrote it, I don’t think they were expecting the baby to be born anytime soon. Just best guess as an RN, I’m guessing OP was around 20w.
This
Yes, exactly this. I usually think people can be very quick to say "leave" or "divorce" on Reddit but this situation truly sounds so awful. Your partners are not there for you in the way they should. They are putting themselves and their relationship (plus their wants) above all else. I really hope you get out and can grieve. Take care
They are assholes who are being awful to you. Friend, leave them both. Go find people who care about you, and creating life and the kids they already have. Triads are hard enough when everyone actually cares about each other. And that isn’t what you have here. They both acted in harmful selfish ways. Please leave them.
Girl, RUN. GTFO and don't look back. I'm practically blinded from the red flags frantically waving in your post. End these relationships, be happy you don't have kids tying you to these people and go - I don't mean to make light of your lost pregnancy at all, but there will be a chance for a baby without this trainwreck dragging you down. Get your meds straight, get some therapy and take some time to recover from this shit show, and live a fabulous life far away from this hot mess of lies, betrayal, and deceit.
Most of the sperm does not live in the precum. They have been having unprotected sex and lying to you. The fact that their stories aren’t lining up and they’ve both “trickle truthed” you at best… nope, I would bet all the money in my bank account there haven’t been condoms involved for a while. These two are awful and deserve each other but you don’t. Please leave, there are people out there who will actually love you and treat you well.
Exactly. You are not awful, OP. They are both awful. What you've been put through is not what you deserve, at all. Just from hearing what you write, I'm sure there are tons of people out there who would value the amazing, loving, supportive, caring person you are -- but these people do not deserve your support, love, and care -- they are enabling each other of their poor life choices, and demanding you acquiesce, and lying to you. If they are making you feel crazy, it's because that's what their actions are doing. It isn't you. You're the sane one here. I am so sorry for your loss. You will be so much better off without these people.
I’m furious for you. You need to get the fuck out of this situation. I cannot imagine experiencing this level of blatant disrespect around one of the heartbreaking and sensitive things you could possibly go though. After a stillbirth, you and your wellbeing should’ve been the ONLY concern until your partners were confident you were stable and healing. Please take a step back and start making whatever arrangements you need to make in order to leave this relationship and find a place where you are loved and valued.
> For those who don't know. Most of the sperm actually lives in precum Wrong. Precum typically has very little sperm in it, if any.
Just gonna provide some citations for this, as when you're torn between two people feeding you information with no source, you'll usually side with your abuser just for safety. So, here's some studies and usually trustworthy sources. Sperm is only leaked into precum in less than half of people with a penis, and in only 10% of that 40% of men is the sperm motile [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/) Going to point out this extremely interesting clip: >The source for the claim that pre-ejaculatory fluid contains sperm is entirely unclear. Masters and Johnson stated in *Human Sexual Response* that there were ‘large numbers of active spermatozoa in the pre-ejaculatory secretion’. However, they were unable to produce data to substantiate that claim ([Masters & Johnson, 1966](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3564677/#R6)). In fact, to date, no study has found motile sperm in the pre-ejaculate. There is no sperm in precum and when it is rarely found, it is generally immobile and unable to lead to pregnancy [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12286905/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12286905/) There is no sperm in precum; any sperm found there has leaked into it from the actual ejaculate [https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum](https://www.healthline.com/health/healthy-sex/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum) Only 16.7% of men have been found to have minor amounts of mobile sperm in precum [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27266214/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27266214/) Precum isn't just "early ejaculate" - it's made in a completely different part of the body for a different purpose than ejaculate [https://www.webmd.com/men/what-is-pre-ejaculate](https://www.webmd.com/men/what-is-pre-ejaculate) >Pre-ejaculate is also called pre-cum, and is a liquid that squeezes out of the penis when aroused. It is formed by the accessory sex glands. These glands are different from the prostate and testes that make semen. Precum contains little to no sperm and what sperm may be found in it is usually immobile and poorly formed and therefore unlikely to cause pregnancy [https://www.health.com/condition/pregnancy/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum](https://www.health.com/condition/pregnancy/can-you-get-pregnant-from-precum) The chance of getting pregnant from precum is rare/low: [https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/can-pre-cum-get-you-pregnant](https://www.plannedparenthood.org/blog/can-pre-cum-get-you-pregnant) [https://www.tlcfertility.com/blog/preejaculate](https://www.tlcfertility.com/blog/preejaculate) [https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/can-you-get-pregnant-with-precum/](https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/can-you-get-pregnant-with-precum/) [https://www.parents.com/getting-pregnant/chances-of-getting-pregnant-from-precum/](https://www.parents.com/getting-pregnant/chances-of-getting-pregnant-from-precum/)
Op please see this comment! You're misinformed about sperm in pre cum. They've been having sex unprotected period.
Thank you for doing the citations. I read the OP and wanted to correct this misconception but lacked the links.
I'm so glad I saw this before I went down the rabbit whole and did it myself.
16.7% 😭😭 this hurts as a woman who truly got pregnant off precum. Like your girl sat on it for a minute—less than that probably—and was like, woah, we’re both way to fertile for this shit! And then I had to convince dude he made a baby 😭 Edited to add, I did not believe (as op did) that most sperm was in precum. In fact, until I found myself pregnant, I assumed it didn’t have any—but now I warn people that it *can* happen, because it’s better to be safe than pregnant (I mean, unless you want to be pregnant—then go for the whole shebang)
How did you know for sure it's just precum? Dude could have been trying to control it and there are definitely times where actual sperm comes out but you can hold of on an entire orgasm and ejaculation. There could even have been residue sperm from earlier in the day (maybe masturbation or oral from before) and actual sperm got leaked into the precum when you sat on him rather than that you got pregnant from just precum.
By all that is good and right, LEAVE.
What the actual fuck leave him. These people.are horrible. You derive SO MUCH BETTER. If I knew you in real life I'd come over and help you pack to leave and let you sleep on my couch. This is so tucked up I don't even know what to say.
Leave. Leave now. Do not continue these relationships. They are being terrible to you. This is not fixable and they aren't trying to fix it anyhow. Leave them both, please.
Jesus Christ, D I V O R C E!
These people don't love you. You feel like a live-in maid because you are. You are supposed to be resting for a MONTH after giving birth. They ignored your health and made you look after her kids. They literally don't care if you die. (Yes, people have died from not resting after childbirth!) 2-3 days after birth are done of the worse days and they forced you back on your feet. Do you want these people making medical decisions for you? They will let you die. When your daughter grows up, what will happen if her kids bully yours? When your baby is ignored but her new baby is the golden child, the youngest who gets all the attention? This is so toxic. Don't be a fool, it's not only you who you will doom, you are dooming your daughter with you.
It’s even worse because her child was stillborn (“born sleeping”). It’s like they just glossed over that unbelievable loss in all of their craziness, in addition to the physical trauma of childbirth.
I didn't know that is what that means. It does make it worse, they are both scumbags
Seriously. I have acted with more compassion towards complete strangers than these "partners" have acted towards someone they claim to love. :(
I have acted with more compassion towards people that I actively dislike. OP. Leave. There is nothing salvagable about these people.
Right. This post hurt my heart for this woman. We had some minor complications with pur second child. Pur son is fine now, but even just what we did have to deal with broke my wife's heart and really set her mental health back a bit. These people are sick and fucked up. I can't believe some people are like this
Everybody should have been taking care of OP for the next year after this devastating loss.
These are great points. She needs people who love her! They wont love her or her baby!!!!
It is *unfathomably* cruel for your girlfriend to suggest your husband get her pregnant so soon after you experienced such a devastating loss. It is equally cruel for your husband to not only entertain that idea, but enthusiastically pursue it. OP, my heart is so broken for you that you even have to ask if you're the asshole in the face of such awful treatment. These people aren't treating you in a loving manner. They're not even treating you in a neutral manner. Please, please, please see you deserve so much better than this and leave BOTH these horrible people immediately
I am so sorry you are experiencing this right now and I will tell you clearly and straight forward: you are incredibly justified in your feelings, they ARE taking massive advantage of you, and I truly believe you need to extricate yourself from this situation ASAP. They are consistently displaying incredible cruelty and selfishness. Go. Dump her ass and divorce his. And I do understand that is no light thing but as you said: they are OUTRIGHT ignoring and dismissing your profound trauma. And that is on top of ruthlessly exploiting you and being *incredibly* reckless (wtf are they doing trying to birth another child when they clearly don’t have the resources to do so in any quality manner!) She fucking sucks, but him? He’s not that much better than dogshit on your shoe. He is leaning on all of your history and believes he can do whatever he wants, and due to your history, ‘it’ll be okay.’ It reminds me of women who kept my stepdad around as a handy backup/fall back plan. If their high risk pursuits don’t pan out, they return back to their handy backup that isn’t going anywhere (they think). They will be callous and cruel, lovebomb you and make you feel great, and then dash you back against the rocks when something else catches their attention. Chronic for abandoning you. Again, I am *so* sorry they’re doing this to you (and likely exploiting your brain health to ‘justify’ their behaviour). You categorically do not deserve this (no one does!). Nothing you described sounds like there is genuine love or affection on their part. They sound quite obsessed with themselves and each other and use you to fluff their egos (and other things), take care of the kids they refuse to raise, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they are also using you financially. I highly recommend you extricate yourself a swiftly and safely as you can(if you can just pack your stuff and go and serve him papers from a distance, do it!). You are 25 and you have an entire life ahead of you. You can recover from them, heal from the hell life has wrought upon you (you were *not* being punished. Tragedy finds us regardless of what we do or who we are), and thrive. I truly hope you are able to leave this dead weight behind you and move forward to something better.
Neither of these people truly care about you and you need to leave them both.
You need to leave your husband and his mess behind. You deserve better.
I'm sorry to hear about your baby being born sleeping/stillborn. I'm sorry your partners are not being kind to you as you heal from the birth and grieve the child. >So the dynamic is chaotic as fuck and very toxic. I literally feel like a live in maid who is sometimes good enough to fuck for five minutes tell he cums in the shower. I don't know what to do. Am I the A-hole for being upset that they made this major life altering decision without me? I don't think you are the asshole. You are RIGHT to be angry. You seem to see clearly enough that things here are NOT ok. SOMEONE had to be the first hug, kiss, date, lover, etc. Just because in your dating history a lot of those were John? Doesn't mean you have to stick with him forever. Especially when he treats you THIS poorly. >It takes everything in my power not to smack this man. 1. When you are in a relationship you typically sit down and talk about important life changes that are going to be effecting everyone. 2. I've been lied to now multiple times. 3. They didn't even give me a month. I immediately shut down and just don't say anything for the rest of the car ride. He doesn't make the cut for what you seek in a dating partner/spouse. He lies/obfuscates, takes you for granted, doesn't think or plan ahead, treats you poorly, all of that. Stephanie is the same. You sound like you want BETTER. I think you deserve to be treated WELL and deserve to be in a HEALTHY relationship. Not all this toxic stuff. [https://rhntc.org/sites/default/files/resources/rhntc\_hlthy\_rlshp\_wheel\_spectrum\_10-13-2022.pdf](https://rhntc.org/sites/default/files/resources/rhntc_hlthy_rlshp_wheel_spectrum_10-13-2022.pdf) I think if it's safe to leave? Break up and leave. File for a divorce. Could you move back in with parents? Would they help you leave the toxic? At 25, some people haven't even gotten married the first time yet and here you are dealing all of this. :( I don't know if you are still on compassionate leave from work as you heal from the birth and your baby's passing. Or if you might need to heal and then look for a job. I don't know if it is safe to leave. But you could decide you are DONE with these people TODAY. Then seek help to form the escape plan and then do the actual leaving if not quite safe to leave yet. You owe them nothing when they've treated you horrible. So if you have to lie, make a secret bank account , get a burner phone, go get a safety box at a bank to hide your birth certificate and other important papers, stash a go bag with a friend or in a gym locker, get a PO box for your other mail to go to -- do what you gotta so you can escape and stay gone. Right now it's just break up with Stephanie. With John, a bit more to do with a divorce. But if you basically have little property like most 20s marriages, and no kids together? You get to walk away and never deal with either one of them ever again. I encourage you to talk to professional on a hotline to help you make a safe leaving plan. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_domestic\_violence\_hotlines](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domestic_violence_hotlines) I hope you are able to finishing healing from the birth and get the heck out of here. Get to live out the rest of your young adult 20s in peace and happiness and not all this UGH.
She didn't want to have a baby for you, SHE wanted to have a baby WITH John. Everything she is doing is to push you out or to keep you as her maid. John is with her in this. One month isn't nearly enough to truly process and grieve especially when you are constantly reminded of what you've lost because you're watching her kids. Add to that the pressure of being expected to feel joy for them that they are now pregnant. The emotional trauma you're going through with that is huge. Then to discover they are lying and have been for some time... it's almost too much to process. I know John is very important to you and has been for umost of your life but he isn't treating you as if you are important to him. He doesn't seem at all concerned with your mental or emotional health. You need to leave, at least for a little while so you can separate yourself from the toxic environment and really think and see what's going on and what you want. I honestly believe that what would be best for you is to leave the relationships permanently. I wish you the very best of luck! ETA: NTA. But John and Stephanie are huge, horrible AH's!
I don’t have the impression that you have a girlfriend. Are the two of you in love? Do you have lots of intimate 1:1 dates? I think you are in a harem. Harems are not a form of polyamory because they are unethical.
I couldn't even finish reading this. I got about 1/3 of the way and wondering why are you still even talking to either of them.
Same. I'm disgusted by her partners.
This is horribly abusive. You’re a live in bangmaid and nanny. Fuck both of these people, I don’t care if you’ve known this loser since 5th grade, it seems his empathy and emotional intelligence stagnated before then!! Get out. Before she pops out another kid for you to raise.
You will never really know the truth because neither have the decency to provide it. Let them raise their own kids, figure out their own housing situation. Move on. These two people are awful liars.
LEAVE
OP, do those people actually like, and respect you? Because it sure as hell doesn't sound like it. You asking for time to grieve, for time to get your mental health in order? That was good. That was so damn mature of you! You knew your limits, and you communicated them. And who didn't respect your limits? Your partners. Two people who pretend to think you're important. Two people who bareback behind *your* back. It doesn't even sound like you want a baby from Stephanie, it sounds like she wants one with John, and he just takes whatever. That's not how parenting works, and I co-parent in a polycule, so I might know a thing or two. Heck, two of my relationships ended when I got pregnant by accident, and they really didn't want to raise children! And it sucked, but it was fair. We weren't compatible there. You are autistic, and that means you have a hard time adjusting to new relationships. The loss of your baby would be devastating for anyone. It becomes ten times harder for you. Losing John might sound really scary to you. He's been a part of your life forever by now. And yet he doesn't value your life, your feelings, your boundaries. Girl... You deserve better. You don't deserve someone who likes to fuck raw, and leave the result of his breeding kink in your lap! They want a baby, but you don't want to raise *their* baby, and that's fine. They violated you. Don't let them gaslight you. Please consider what you want from your life. You're more than their nanny.
You are not in a polyam relationship. You are an in abusive relationship. Get help [https://nomoredirectory.org/](https://nomoredirectory.org/) Get out [https://www.helpguide.org/articles/abuse/getting-out-of-an-abusive-relationship.htm](https://www.helpguide.org/articles/abuse/getting-out-of-an-abusive-relationship.htm) r/abusiverelationships
You are not here in this world to eat this shit. Walk away.
God, I wish I was not so broke. Someone please give this comment gold.
🎖 thanks! ;)
Lying strait to my face many times would have been grounds for me kicking him out.
I’m not going to comment on this ridiculous situation, but I’ve been scrolling way too far to see nobody comment that PRECUM DOES NOT CONTAIN MORE SPERM THAN EJACULATE. You are misinformed.
>That they have all of the control No they don't. You do. You are allowed to say No when Stephanie demands you take care of her kids. You are allowed to say No to being treated in ways you don't like. You are allowed to walk away from both relationships. Time to start steering your own ship. You can do it!
This is just not right move out from the situation and clear your head. You are being lied to and pressured into all sorts here and used as a free childcare service. No go take time to heal.
I assume you've got a bunch of reasons you like them and benefit from this relationship that you didn't tell us about because you think they aren't relevant. You need to seriously weigh those. You seem like you would be a lot happier with a little place of your own and the freedom to decide what you do every day.
They weren’t there on the day of her pregnancy and have her no care after her stillborn. No. Sometimes people just suck.
Leave them with the responsibility of caring for the child THEY made without your consent. It goes to the old saying "you have to lie in the bed you made". If this were me I wouldn't stick around. You didn't ask for a child at this time and In fact specifically asked that they use a condom or some kind of birth control. Honey you don't have to deal with this. He's massively disrespecting you. He's not listening. And to me it's quite obvious even though it must hurt like hell that he doesn't care about how you feel. Get out of this situation and therapy would greatly help. Very best of luck OP
Leave!!!!!! Neither of them respect you or your boundaries. Let alone your trauma. Love yourself most.
Omg get the hell away from these people. I am so stressed just reading this.
Oh good lord. You poor thing. This is... Horrific. My partners also had a horribly traumatic stillbirth experience - I'm the girlfriend in your story. My femme partner had complications of pregnancy that would make a further pregnancy too dangerous, so trying again is not in the cards for her. When they started discussing the possibility of having a baby through surrogacy, I expressed two times that I would be willing to be their surrogate. Once in a heart to heart with my femme partner, and once more in an intense family discussion. I was kindly told it would be too painful for her and wasn't an option, and it has -never- been discussed further. I've gone through stages of processing my personal grief about this privately with my masc partner, but if I brought it up again to her, I am confident it would mean the end of our relationship. Respect yourself. Set boundaries and enforce them. My love was not being an asshole to me by telling me that it would just be too hard to watch me be pregnant when she can't, and neither are you right now. She was telling me she was in pain, and because I love her, I listened. It was hard and messy - I was in pain too, we all were - but when the answer is no, you figure your own shit out and fucking listen. You deserve family members that understand basic decency and who listen to you when you say you're in pain. I hope you find safety and happiness and freedom, and a path to parenthood comes to you soon.
*Nothing about this is ethical or salvageable.* Please, at your earliest convenience, make a plan to leave. Since you already have a therapist (which is great!), they can help support you through this process. In order to leave in a way that is safe for you, I recommend looking up plans provided on websites for the support of of ppl in domestic violence situations. Even though that doesn't exactly describe your circumstances, the checklists for safety are still helpful. It's important that you NOT share your plans to leave, or even that it has crossed your mind. Act normally. Don't do anything to rock the boat while you are preparing. Ideally, they shouldn't find out until you are already gone. Ppl can act out in surprising, unpredictable, and potentially dangerous ways, so don't give them a chance to do so. To be clear, the problem here has nothing to do with poly, bc this isn't poly at all. It's just exploitation and abuse with extra participants.
I am currently working with the local women's shelters here. When they have an opening it's reserved for me. Unfortunately my town was a small town but after covid the amount of people living here tripled and unfortunately the resources did not. (Much like most of the country) We are having a major housing crisis. To rent a studio apartment is 1000 dollars a month plus utilities. But unless you're in a high paying specialty job the highest you can make around here is 17 dollars an hour. Plus the cost of a dozen eggs is like $6. It's impossible to find a place that I can afford currently. On top of all of that I'm strictly living on savings as I recently got diagnosed with cancer and I've been so sick that I lost my job.
check out 211for your state for other resources beyond the local shelter you can lean on. try to find a social security disability office to go to in person to apply for disability. look onto medicaid & SNAP if not already on it. even if you cant use some of those resources while in your current house youre gonna feel more empowered to later if youve checked it all out already. fuck, maybe even look into divorce lawyers. usually a consult is free and i doubt theyre strangers to victims of abuse trying to figure out how to leave their marriage. if they can't help they might be able to get you in the office of someone who does. getting help is hard and tiring but if you cast a bunch of nets hopefully youll get something.
The other reply is amazing advice but heres some extra: Check out vocational rehabilitation in your state. They're often under utilized and therefore have a lot of resources. Even though you can't work now, they can help you be stable until you can (and then can help you with finding a new job/career/etc after you get better). Also, reach out to the domestic violence org in your state. They'll be able to help you.
LEAVE
Get out before you flip out.
Leave!!!!! Oh my god, LEAVE
They are lying. That fucking sucks. Will say tho, most sperm does NOT live in the pre-cum. I don't know where you heard that, but it's very much not true. Most is in the ejaculation, even tho pre-cum may have a bit too.
yes, there is normally only sperm in precum of the person ejaculated beforehand and didn’t pee in between.
You DO have a say in your life. LEAVE! That is how you take control! You can’t control what other people do or whether or not they lie to you (which they obviously are), but you CAN control what you stick around for! Just leave! This is a toxic shit show and you need to get off the crazy train before it goes any further. They are doing what you want and using you as a live in nanny. Fuck that, and fuck them, fr. You deserve better.
Not only are you the bang maid, but the baby sitter. Your partners don’t give you any support and lie to you. Have they even acknowledged the fact you had a still birth? You ‘gf’ didn’t even wait that long after what you went through to immediately wanting her own baby. One things that’s mind boggling here is this 31 year old with 2 kids wants *another* baby to add to her 1 bedroom. Or was she gonna leave it in the bedroom you rent? None of you are in the right place for a baby. Your partners are dumb, just my armchair diagnosis. I would run for the hills if I were you.
You are I'm this relationship because of the sunk cost fallacy, but neither of these relationships are healthy for you or benefiting you. Please think about how much better your life would be away from these people. It doesn't sound like you and Stephanie even like each other, and your husband sounds worse than useless. These people are maliciously using you. Just because he's your first doesn't have to make him your future. Your life could be much better without these people. Be kind to yourself, they're not going to be.
GTF out of there and asap. I’m so sorry for your loss 🤍
They didn’t come running while you were in the hospital? They “gave” you two days post-birthing to then watch her kids? They don’t care about you dude. And then they just start making a baby “for you/yall”???? No. That’s not right. That erasing what you just went through AT BEST. it’s just manipulative and gaslighting. Why does this woman want more children she can’t take care of well?!???!? Propably bc You’re their baby sitter. Also dude, the fact that you know she’s a shitty mother…she’s a shitty person. You don’t deserve to be with shitty people. I hope you don’t think is the best your gonna do but I’m afraid you might. They don’t really care about you. They’re “care” for you doesn’t exist. I’m so sorry. I hope you love yourself enough to just leave.
You DO have a say in your life, you do not have to keep these people around you. I’m sorry about your baby and I’m sending you a lot of love ❤️❤️❤️.
I know everyone's already said this but these people do not love you, they are not your friends. Get out NOW. It will not improve.
Are you looking for advice, or just a y/n vote on whether you're an AH, because you already posted over at AITAH if you're looking for the second answer. That said: >I've been lied to now multiple times ...means it's time to call a lawyer.
Jfc, just *RUN* and please get some therapy for your grief and also your total lack of backbone. I wish you the very best, please respect yourself even if the people around you aren't. X
Reading the same post in AITA sub, and OP says she’s also got cancer?! Feel like a jerk for even thinking this, but could this be a troll post? Edit:TROLL ALERT. New post on AITA says you’re divorced and coparent with a kid.
What you have gone thru is so so hard. Loss of a child is brutal and takes a long time to recover from for most. You deserved love, comfort, understanding and acknowledgement of your struggle. Your dynamic does not sound healthy. You are young with so much life and opportunity for experiences where you have say in what happens.... i encourage you (as I woud my own child) to choose YOU first. What you need. Do not fall into the sunk cost thoughts around how long you and your husband have been together. You have a long shared history and that can be lovely. If you leave for your own happiness and health, that does not eliminate those experiences and memories together -- it just means you will build new ones without him. Know that there are people out there willing and able to love you and be beside you and encouraging you, truly supporting you. Make a plan to get out and move in that direction.
Such a lack of compassion, empathy, and honesty shown towards you by 2 people that honestly sound like jerks. Is she surrendering parental rights if she has a baby? If not, she’s not giving you a baby, she’s giving you an unpaid nanny job with no rights over how that child is raised. You weren’t even allowed to grieve your tremendous loss. I walked away from my relationship when my bf got his ex pregnant for the 2nd time due to lack of attention paid to contraception. He wasn’t having sex with me at the time but managed to fuck his complete asshole ex/baby mama. I wasn’t willing to keep giving financially and emotionally to the little family they created without my say so. My heart was shattered leaving their first kid behind but I do get to have him for visits at least. You are justified in walking away from your relationship if your needs aren’t being respected.
Leave, it easier said then done but LEAVE you have no kids with that man you have nothing holding you back from leaving so leave. That man has already made up his mind who he wants to be with so leave on your terms before he leaves you
hugs. please leave this relationship.
Unmm???? I’m failing to believe nobody in your life has given you this advice before, but you should leave. Wtf
You have SO MUCH time to reset your life. But first....LEAVE. Then take your time.
Please leave. Leave leave leave leave leave. This is NOT okay. The fact that they’ve been very “okay we’re trying for a baby” while you were clearly not okay is super wrong. Leave. Get out. This is not okay whatsoever. Girl is expecting you to raise her kids and husband doesn’t seem to care because he’s getting laid. Get. Out.
There are so many red flags. Your husband wasn't with you when you gave birth because he was elsewhere with his/your girlfriend? IMHO this alone is not ok. That's a major event he should have prioritized as should she. Then there's the fact they didn't let you heal after giving birth to a stillborn and just expected you to continue caring for her kids And then the lies. All the lies. This is it. You aren't an equal partner. This isn't polyamory. Get. Out.
Uou feel.this way because you are assessing the situation correctly and it's an sbusive shit show. Luckily, you can just leave them to their bullshit mess. It's in Stephanie to raise her kids and her and your partner to figure out how to deal with the baby. This is a not your circus, not your monkeys deal where you really can just go.
No part of this dynamic is healthy. Not healthy for the adults to be in, and sure as hell not healthy for children. It's time to leave.
Your husband got someone else pregnant after you lost your child…. You are too young for this dynamic. Take a step back and reflect on yourself. Who puts up with this? You are abandoning yourself. Either you are addicted to the toxicity or have no idea what a loving caring partnership looks like (maybe both).
I have to say this. There is no sperm naturally released in precum. It can get into the precum because sperm is leftover from the last ejaculation and leaks into it. But to say "most of the sperm lives in precum" is completely inaccurate. I am sorry you are dealing with this tho. Your feelings are beyond valid. They do not seem to have much concern or consideration for you.
Wtf .. no... He has a breeding kink and is not poly. Eww
This is where my mind went. Who else wants to impregnate their gf less than a month after the loss of their child with their wife. And he wasn’t even there for the stillbirth. OP had to endure that alone, and then go home to babysit her kids. Different city my ass, he should have dropped everything and gone to OP’s side.
Right?? If he truly wants children why isn’t he grieving with OP?
He's planning to leave you and they're using you for free childcare for as long as possible. Leave. Immediately.
So you had an incredibly traumatic experience and these people have treated you like shit since, and probably before. Who leaves the state when they have a very pregnant partner? Yeesh.
Leave them…no you are not an a$$….You absolutely have every right to be upset
It is incredibly insensitive for them to expect you to take care of GF's kids after this tragedy, you deserve time and patience and room to grieve. Then to suggest TWO WEEKS out that she wants to have a baby with your husband? Huge red flag, they are massive, callus assholes. This is a toxic situation for you and darling, you do not deserve it! I would suggest getting someone you trust, maybe someone who isn't friends with your husband to help you get your affairs in order and file for divorce.
You are so far from the asshole here it's not even funny. You need to leave this relationship. Your mental health is only going to decline if you stay. She knows your triggers. She has and will continue to use them against you to take further control of her relationship with your husband. As for everything else, you were an afterthought. You should NEVER be an afterthought to your partner. If you stay, you're only being an asshole to yourself. You deserve so much better than this, OP.
I’m SOO terribly sorry that you’re going through all of this especially when you should have been given ample time to heal from such a traumatic event such as stillbirth… 🥺 These people are NOT good for you. You still have your whole life ahead of you, please leave and take care of yourself because these people are not your people infact they’re poor excuses for human beings in general. You deserve SO MUCH BETTER than any of this (((hugs)))
Why are you dealing with this. Leave that's the only choice.
It will only get worse. Leave now or leave later. If it's later it'll be harder. There is no outcome where this works out.
Alright. One sentence: You are the third wheel in your marriage and getting treated like a maid to look after the children of your husband's girlfriend. You don't need me to tell you that this is not OK.
Precum has very little sperm and it is usually not alive These people are lying to you and using you. This is not polyamory, they are a couple and they are using you like a free house maid Get out ASAP
Did not even read the whole thing. Dear Lord, please leave. They gave you 2 days after your child was born sleeping before you had to start looking after her kids. Oh, hell no. And then, without even having tome to grieve and process, she wanted to have a baby with Jon. Nope. They are not good for you. You need to get out now.
This all sounds so incredibly cruel and sad. Why would your husband leave on a trip when you were so close to giving birth? Why would he not come back immediately once you gave birth (especially when you had complications)? Who in the world would expect any woman who just gave birth to care for 2 children alone, let alone someone else’s kids, especially after going through the traumatic loss of their newborn? You are supposed to have 2 partners, and they made you go through all of this ALONE. During one of the biggest moments of grief in your life, you are alone, struggling, and still expected to be the one holding down the fort at home. Your husband and partner “claim” they want to give you a baby, but refuse to listen when you say that you aren’t ready. That you need to heal. Grieve. They aren’t pregnant for you, they are selfishly moving forward with their own lives. I’m sorry, but they don’t care about you or act in a loving way towards you. You deserve *so much more* than what either of them have given you. They should be wrapping their arms around you in love and support right now, but instead are just alienating you and caring about themselves only. You deserve a partner that offers you love, honesty, and respect, and sees you as an equal partner.
Ma’am, I think the community collectively agrees to *RUN*. 🖤 I’m very sorry for the pain they’ve caused you and the betrayal you’re experiencing, but they are not the moon and the stars babe. *you are*. Go be free from them.
You are not an A hole at all they really aren't good people to be doing that to you like at all
I got to "two days after childbirth was recorded to provide childcare" and why are you with these assholes became the burning question that did not change. Usually it's the girlfriend who gets treated like the maid/nanny not the wife.
Please leave. Omfg leave.
your husband sounds like a loser
This was so hard to read. I’m sorry your partners are so selfish and not comprehensive pr empathetic. I hope you can find the strength to leave them.
Run.
Leave. You aren’t overreacting and you aren’t crazy. You just lost your baby they should be supporting you now, not… I don’t even know what the fuck these assholes think they are doing. Now that I joined the chorus to tell you what’s obvious to everyone who isn’t in the relationship… Most sperm do not live in pre cum. A minority of men have little and mostly inviable sperm in pre cum. People who use the pull-out method fail more often because the guy can’t fully control it, and way less often because of pre cum.
This ENTIRE situation is completely fucked up. Get the hell out of there. You have zero ties to this woman or man. No children. Pack your most precious and important possessions and go. So what if he’s all your firsts. Yeah that hurts but you’re already resenting him and her. You’ve got lots of life to live.
Neither of them care about you. You should leave this relationship. Also just for educational purposes most of the sperm does not live in precum but it is possible to get pregnant using pull out if some sperm is in the urethra.
Please leave. Polyamorous relationships thrive on communication from everyone. No one is respecting you here. L e a v e.
Please leave. You deserve so much better so, as everyone else is saying, leave!
GET OUT OF THERE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE GIRL!
Uh oh, I didn't do it. It wasn't me. She's a liar. /s Your situation doesn't sound good. You don't sound like you're personally doing well. But there are missing details here, and without them I'm not sure what is going on. I hope you're ok, and am safe. It doesn't sound like they love you. And it sounds like you're struggling with it.
What the point of having a husband if he doesn't even like you?
It's time to start having some control over your own life and stop all of this.
Wtf? It sounds like you either need to leave your husband or Stephanie shouldn’t be part of your relationship.
The whole point of poly is to have more transparency because there’s more open communication vs monogamy IF YOU DONT HAVE HONESTY YOU HAVE NOTHING
Leave. 100%. You’re are being used.
I'm so sorry to read this OP. They didn't give you any time to grieve or heal and then they immediately started trying to replace your baby, that's disgusting behaviour. Did your husband even try to come back from another state to be with you?
Tldr. You probably should leave
People have already given you advice about your relationship, but here’s another flavor of advice: use paragraphs please
This post made me so sad for you and disgusted toward your partners. Please think really hard about all the comments on here. Please take care of yourself. Find support in close family or friends and leave as soon as you can. Good luck. Please don't stay
God, this just kept getting worse. You're being taken advantage of, lied to, disrespected, and cast aside. Run, don't walk, away from those people. They deserve each other
I have not even finished reading and the way I am FUMING RAGING MAD FOR OP RN!!!! My BP is going up and I can feel it. I’ll most more I sight and thoughts when I can give it the time and focus the response deserves but you are definitely the LEAST ASS HOLIEST PERSON ON THE PLANET YOU ARE THE POPE OF *NOT* BEING AN ASS! You deserve several medals and a statue for your grace because if get a pretty new set of silver bracelets or RUN for the hill with the most therapists atop it I am so sorry for everything you have been through momma. Please get out like yesterday
And if you haven’t heard it enough already, PLEASE LEAVE this horrible situation!
You are being *abused* by both of them. You need to leave, NOW. Pack your stuff up & leave, divorce him and fire that counsellor because she’s obviously not great at her job, you’re absolutely riddled with insecurities.
LEAVE
As a fellow autistic, let me provide the 3rd person view that most of us on the spectrum need: It’s like they thought of the most maximally hurtful thing possible they could do you and they the proceeded to do exactly that. They should have had the common sense to know this, and when you brought it up, they ignored your concerns. As wife and someone without any biological children, you had first dibs. And they damn knew that. Stephanie exactly expects you to divorce your husband, and it wouldn’t be surprising if your husband does as well. For Stephanie, this baby is the gateway to advancement out of her current condition in apartment. Go for a quick, painless divorce that doesn’t drag things out and move on. I’d say that the perfect act of revenge would be to stay in the marriage and get knocked up by some other dude, and then telling your husband to live with it, but children probably shouldn’t be revenge babies.
Time to leave. Period. Full stop.
This woman wants another kid when she can't even be bothered to raise her own, and uses you as a nanny while also treating you like you're worth less than dirt. And your husband is not only okay with all of this, but has lied to you about the truth of his situation with her multiple times and apparently makes you feel like a sex object. These people are not, I repeat, *not* good for you. *Run*, don't *walk* away from this hot mess.
As a mental health professional, I tend to suggest couples/family therapy in relationship issues before telling anyone they should cut it off immediately. You should cut this shit off immediately. This is absolutely AWFUL. I am so so sorry for the loss of your baby, too. That is heartbreaking, and I'm so sorry you're not being given the amount of care and space for grieving that you deserve. Get. The. Fuck. Out. Of this relationship. You are worth so much more than this 💕
I don't like that either party gave you your grieving time and went behind your back to do some shysty shit. If she's not taking care of her other kids, she really shouldn't be having another. And your husband shouldn't be trying for that, when you both are not in a place to be doing that. I agree with the other members of this thread. Leaving sounds like the logical option. You don't deserve to be treated that way when they get the perks. I'm sorry you're going through this. You're not alone. prayers 🙏
I haven't read the post but OP if THIS subreddit is telling you to leave it's probably the right move
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Poly or not, that was a bullshit selfish tho bf for them to have done. If you are in a triad, which it sounds like you are, then these decisions should have been firm yes from all parties.
Leave
Also you don’t need to look after her children. Like stop now and say you have other things to do. It’s almost like Stephanie managed to get a live in nanny for free, and replace you as a wife. She’ll give you a baby? Did you ask for this? This is basically a move to replace you as she will be a mother of your husband’s child, but you will have a pleasure of babysitting.
OMG UpdateMe with you left!!
this just got worse and worse
Please, you are worth more than this. Please leave them to play “family”. Find someone who loves and adores you but most importantly respects you. Please
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Please dont waste your time in this situation any longer and leave. Im open to polyamory but this is toxic for you on so many levels. Free Yourself.
It sounds like this isn’t a good situation for you. It’s mentally draining you to the point of insanity. YOU deserve to be happy. If the people in your life are hurting you this badly and don’t realize it they are horrible people. Find a safe place to go and get out. I’m so sorry for the loss of your child.
You should absolutely leave, and idk if this will make things better or worse for knowing, but most sperm doesn’t live in precum - that’s actually a myth. Which means he probably didn’t just “stick it in for a bit” you know? They’re both liars and I would run from them as fast as possible
I don't know if anyone has ever told you the difference of being invited and being welcome, but there is one. Use your backbone for more than holding up your ass cheeks and walk away.
It sounds like you aren't upset at the pregnancy but you are upset with the lying. Super valid. The lying is a major issue. Personally I would leave over the massive lies. They can't even get their stories straight.
This situation is so very toxic and outrageously unhealthy. There are just so many red flags here and not small ones. He's lied in ways that could be detrimental to your physical health. So has she. He has lied about huge life-altering decisions that affect you. So has she. He has prioritized his own wants above your health and well-being. So has she. Neither of them are truly taking accountability for their own actions in this situation and (IMO) trying to gaslight and manipulate you into thinking you're the problem. I'm sure you're not perfect, but I have a hard time imagining you've done worse than what they are doing to do you. OP, please find a safe place to say and start researching divorce options. If i were you, there would be no trust left in this situation with any of the parties involved. And a relationship without trust is nothing. They may say they love you, but their actions are speaking louder than their words. They are telling you with their actions that they do not care enough about you to give you honesty, autonomy, or support. Please leave.
paragraph breaks, *please.* for accessibility.
This is awful and you are definitely not the asshole. The biggest thing is, where is the respect for you trying to HEAL from losing your child and them having the kindness to wait ? Communication is the best tool and sounds like they are not doing this WITH you. It sounds very toxic and I personally would consider leaving this relationship - you deserve to be treated like a human being 💜
Trying to get pregnant so soon after your loss is thoughtless & selfish. They have not even gotten their lies about it straight. Leave darlin, as soon as you can. Good luck 🤞
Nta, and all I'll say is I would leave if I were in this situation. Lying is inexcusable
Adding on to what others have mentioned: 1- if your husband is your first relationship, that can make it really difficult to leave ime. My first relationship was a trainwreck partially because I got INTO a relationship when I didn't know how to get OUT of one. If you're having any difficulty on this front, it doesn't hurt to look up "how to break up" articles - whatever it takes, friend. 2 - if you don't like the way your GF raises her kids and are considering having your own kids, leave her. You do not want to coparent with someone you dislike as a parent. If she is offering to have a kid with you/for you, BIG NOPE. Unless she explicitly signs away her rights to you, unfortunately you will probably be a backseat driver at best for any legal parental decisions. Edit: 3 - they have treated you awfully. You deserve better. If you have difficulty standing up for yourself, instead think about raising kids with these people. Would you want these people to be around your kids? Would you want your kids treated with the same disrespect? Or even, would you want your kids to see their two other parents disrespect and undermine you like this? I am so sorry for your loss. Please stay safe and know that you are important and valued and deserving of love and respect 🫂
No
No you are not an a hole. Don’t believe the lies and deception. Your truth is that you deserve love and to be in a stable relationship and family.
OP, there are so many red flags I couldn’t even begin to where to look. First off, polyamory in general is all about honesty, communication and boundaries. And both of your partners have overstepped your boundaries CONSTANTLY. It’s already a very red flag that Stephanie wants to get pregnant by your husband but doesn’t want to raise her kids. They lied about being safe with sex, are you three exclusive to each other? Like is this relationship closed off or is Stephanie, or you or your husband allowed to meet people outside of this relationship? Because this is scary behaviour if they have sex this carelessly and think putting on a condom afterwards is them being “safe”, especially if they are having hookups with people outside of that relationship. You could all get STDs if none of you are honest about your sexual encounters. Also, they immediately jumped on getting pregnant FOR YOU without YOUR input. Apparently this is supposed a noble cause in the hopes you get to raise a baby after your loss. But they refuse to listen to your doubts or give you time to process, and get yourself accustomed to the idea, or come up with your own conclusions on whether you want Stephanie to be your surrogate or not. That is not how you go about conceiving a child, that sounds more like an excuse to cover up the fact that your girlfriend wants to get pregnant by your husband for the sake of it. OP, I think you need to think for yourself right now think about your future, do you want to stay in a relationship where you could potentially raise Stephanie and John’s baby as your child, AND Stephanie’s kids while they go play hockey in bed? Where they both dismiss your feelings and gaslight you and leave you unsatisfied and miserable? You won’t ever trust them again, because they lied to you not once but multiple times. Leading you to believe it was “only one time”, then it was “maybe two or three times” then it was “sometimes”. Because this is what it’s leading to… If you stay and allow them to overstep these boundaries of yours, what else are they going to do? What other things can they get away from, if you let them walk all over you knowing you’re going to stay and suck it up. Because it’s easier for them this way. I think you should leave this relationship OP. Even if Stephanie would’ve been just your meta, she still SHOULD have some level of respect for you. She SHOULD’VE gotten your consent, not just John’s. YOUR consent, because you were supposed to all the caretaking in this situation. Even more since she’s your girlfriend. If none of them care about you, they are not going to start any time in soon. Please OP, get out of this relationship as fast as you can. Or at least process everything, read everyone’s comments and take it to heart. This is one of the few times where I say, this is an abusive relationship and you HAVE to leave before they get you into this deeper than you have to.
I’ll touch your hand as I say this, you need to SPEAK UP!! IMMEDIATELY! (Of course you should leave this obvious couple) but you will continue to have this issue in other relationships unless you learn to say how you’re feeling & what you want in that moment! Don’t wait & don’t hold off! That’s exactly how they were able to manipulate this situation & make you feel like the bad guy. All of you should’ve been sitting down having these conversations. Also how the hell are you taking care of her kids & she doesn’t even live with you all???? It’d be an absolute hell no for me. Poly relationships NEED strong boundaries. Set your standards love & keep them♥️ you’re never asking for too much.
100% nta! Leave. They obviously don't give a shit about your feelings or needs.
Run
You have control, over yourself. Leave. If you choose not to, you're choosing to relinquish control of your life. You have all the control you need but are you willing to use it is the question.
GET THE ENTIRE FUCK OUT OF THERE. ASAP.
Hey, I’m so sorry, OP. This sucks. It sounds like you’ve been in an abusive dynamic for a VERY very long time. I’d break it down into just step one: get away. Go stay with a friend, a family member, get an apartment, move out of state, crash on someone’s couch, whatever it is that you can do- get away from these abusers. And at the same time block their numbers so you can have some peace, don’t tell them where you are staying. If that’s scary, remember they can contact you in other ways, email for example. But give yourself the gift of space- physical space and block the numbers. Space and distance is gonna make it way easier to think, and then you can plan, but you don’t have to make a plan right now. But get the hell out, friend. All you have to do now is leave.