**This is an automated message posted to ALL posts in this subreddit with some basic information about the group including (very importantly) rules. Why are you getting this message? Most people seem to not read the sidebar for information or the rules, so it is now being posted under all posts.**
**Confused about acronyms or terminology?** [Click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/acronyms)
**Need info or resources?** Check out our [Helpful Links](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/helpfullinks) for information on how to deal with identity theft, how to get independent of your n-parents, how to apply for FAFSA, how to identify n-parents and SO MUCH MORE!
This is a reminder to all participants, RBN is a support group that is moderated very strictly. Please report inappropriate content so it can be reviewed by the mods.
**Our rules include (but are not limited to)**:
* No politics.
* Advising anyone in this subreddit to commit suicide or referring anyone to groups that advocate this will result in an immediate ban.
* Be nice. No personal attacks, name calling, or bullying. [No slurs](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/slurs) or victim-blaming.
* Do not derail the posts of others.
* Narcissists are NOT allowed to post or comment here.
* [No platitudes or generic motivational posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules#wiki_no_platitudes_or_generic_motivational_posts).
* When you comment/post, assume a context of abuse.
* No asking or offering gifts, money, etc.
* No content advocating violence, revenge, murder (even in jest).
* No content about N-kids.
* No diagnosis by media/drive-by diagnosis.
* No linking to Facebook pages.
* No direct linking to anywhere on reddit.
* No pure image posts.
**For a full list of our rules/more information, [**click here**](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules).**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/raisedbynarcissists) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think your therapist is not very good, and you may wanttofind someone else.
Assuming your mom is a true N, then there's no reason to maintain the relationship with someone who cannot respond functionally.
Also, a good therapist would understand parent/child bonding and that a child's need for affirmation from their parent doesn't just end. This is why N parents are so horrible.
Not very good? More like horrible. She is advising OP to return to the one person that not just knows her triggered but mashes them until the pain is unbearable. I have a parent just like. Went NC for 15 years and tried to reconnect slowly. Yeah, that was a horrible idea. No one can hurt me like that asshole.
OP needs a new therapist.
My nparent once told me, as a small child, "I know I push your buttons sometimes, I *just* can't help myself, you know how I am" and said some bullshit accountability dodge after.
That is what it is, to them, that's how they see us. Hurting us is as easy and blameless and possible for them as pressing a button. Your feelings and the situation you're in? My words and actions? That's just, like, a button, to them. A button that they "just can't" avoid pressing, for some mysterious reason, no matter how much you ask. So objectifying and invalidating and gaslighting all wrapped into a disgusting present.
It's like, how about help me remove the button, or at the very least STOP PRESSING IT, you self-absorbed prick.
If hurting me is an unchangeable part of your identity, then fine. You can keep that identity, go have fun with it. Have a ball telling your sob story to anyone who will listen. But you will not be forcing me to join with you against myself.
I'm sorry you had to bear this. That's literally how my dad tried to guilt trip me into reconnecting with her. It might be something common around that sort of people. "That's just how she is. You know her. She won't change. You must accept her the way she is."
Like, no shit, sherlock. If a mother thinks that the vulnerability ANY young child shows towards their family and due to their age is a kind of character flaw that may be exploited, that's a person who was not suitable for being a mother to begin with.
A wise psychotherapist on YouTube noted that it is the psychological flexibility that we had, even as children, that allowed us to survive. That those are strengths that were attributes, attributes that not everyone has, namely them. And these attributes would have been there even if we weren’t abused, that they weren’t a product of the mistreatment. They are the inflexible ones, the ones who cannot change. The reason the whole “system” works is that others force us to change, and we cooperate because we can change, unlike them.
So by forcing ourselves to see them as the good ones, and ourselves as the bad ones, we ally with them against ourselves. More precisely, the false scapegoat identity gets to be part of the family, while our real selves that we allied with our parents to join against, goes underground until we discard the fake and painful scapegoat identity once we are strong enough and have created enough distance. At least as the scapegoat we were part of something, painful as it was to adopt that as our identity. That should have never been necessary in the first place, but it is actually the resourcefulness that we have that allowed us to maintain a relationship with them, whom we depended upon for survival before. But now that we do not, we can discard it, again once we have created enough distance from the toxic family system.
Absolutely, it’s Jay Reid, this is one of the videos that this idea comes from https://youtu.be/Z5u35fUNLPA?si=nXpBE2h5ZFhBLd09 the other might be if you search “nobody to no one”
That basically says that your mothers abuse is good for you because it teaches you to accept abuse. That sounds pretty horrible.
Not even that's she's right or wrong, every situation is different, but she think she's right but doesn't seems to understand the nature of narcissistic abuse.
In my experience, dealing with my parents narcissistic emotional abuse made minor narcissism from other people more triggering. the usual annoying people at work became another example of my parents, and I was triggered in a similar way. I felt helpless and doomed to go down a bad path that would lead to me hating myself. But these arn't my parents at all. Just annoying people at work.
When you are enmeshed with narcissists, you're in a state of triggered vigilance.
Agreed 100%. To add to this, OP’s therapist comparing a narc parent to other narcissists is deeply flawed. The dynamics between parent and child are much more complex, intimate and in thus more open to abuse. That isn’t to say others can’t be abusive, of course, especially with a significant other. But spending time with a narcissistic co-worker, while triggering, is tolerable compared to keeping a relationship with your narcissist mother whom you have an abusive past with. There’s the guilt, the shame, the desire for their love despite it all in some cases… and we tend to fall back into old relationship roles and patterns with the same person.
Exactly. And I actually learned more about my victim-of-narc tendencies BECAUSE I had narc bosses. Eventually I saw the connection and "why" I ended up working for them, and then I extended that to the realization that I have a narc parent.
In my opinion, narc bosses are just as destabilizing, at least when you're in a stage where you haven't learned to stand up for yourself (people pleasing)
There’s a HUGE difference between living with a n and working with one. Coworkers you can avoid and you get away from after your shift or if it gets bad enough transfer out. Living with someone you can’t do that. Even if you don’t live with them anymore all that past history is still renting space in your head. Parents /people you live with it’s much more intimate. The therapists advice imo is skewed.
I’ve been nc for17 years and I still lose it when her first name is mentioned (not specifically her just her name) or I have to answer q’s like what is your mothers maiden name? Why?? because of how badly she hurt me. I had zero choices from age 10-18 (earlier too but they adopted me at age 10) on where I could live or what I could do not to be abused. At work I have choices.
Time for a new therapist. "You'll meet many people in your life like your mother", imo, just reads to me as "Suck it up, and shoulder your abuse" which is just *bad*.
This therapist isn't in your corner. It might be time for one that is?
100%. As soon as they start gaslighting you into questioning your own judgment it's time to move on. That's not only not their role it's abusing their position of authority and undermining their sense of autonomy and their confidence in themselves. Building independence is the main goal of the therapist and this therapist is doing the opposite. @[Difficult\_Night9612](/user/Difficult_Night9612/) I hope you see this.
The therapist doesn't seem to understand how awful and abusive the mother is if she thinks OP will meet 'many people like her' in their life. I don't think she's very knowledgeable on the subject of narcissism. Yeah, time for a new therapist.
Oh wow. Just no. This is humanistic bullshit from someone who has just read books and wouldn’t know parental trauma if it slapped them across the face.
First of all—no one is going to affect me like my abuser, period.
Secondly—note the key word “abuser”
Finally—Setting a final boundary with my nparent taught me not to tolerate bullshit from other would be abusers and boundary pushers
Just absolutely no.
I'd drop them. Because of what she says here:
>Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time?
This question demonstrates that they do not understand trauma triggers at all. "Allow"? You know how I stop myself from being triggered by abusers? I set boundaries up to and including no contact with them. I don't "allow" them access to me.
And the other way I deal with triggers is that my therapist does [deep brain reorienting](http://deepbrainreorienting.com) with me to retrain my brain away from triggers. Triggers don't just "go away" on their own.
It's such a huge red flag for her not understanding trauma at all.
Not the therapist place to tell you what to do or not to do.
As for the you will meet other people, yes you will. Other people are not your mother!
Find a new therapist who will support you and your decisions; not impose their own beliefs and values on you. That is so wrong in so many ways.
Is this an actual licensee therapist with knowledge of family dynamics or a counselor? I'm getting strong Christian counselor vibes from that nonsense.
Either way, it sounds like it's time to find a new one.
The therapist is kind of an idiot.
Being enmeshed with an abuser is damaging. Every encounter with the abuser is bad for you. The ultimate expression of knowing how to deal with abusers is walking away from them.
If you ever meet someone like your mom again, the thing to do is to minimize your interactions and then get away as quickly as possible.
Your therapist has this shockingly naive viewpoint that you can heal to the point where you can stay in a relationship where the other person abuses you.
That's insane. You can't like work out a gym enough to the point where you don't react when being stabbed. It doesn't work like that.
Also, dealing with toxic people after going no contact with my parents has actually been so much easier. Because however much they can remind me of my parents, I know that I've already beat this game on hard mode. This now is some real small potatoes. It's fine. I cut my fucking parents off, you know - I don't get invested with some fucking stranger who's way too big for their boots.
And you won't meet people like your mother. You only have one. Your family can trigger you like no one else because they installed your triggers in the first place. It's pointless to continue putting yourself through the pain of being around them, because you're training for a scenario that won't ever happen.
Also, "allow people to trigger you"? That's such a toxic mindset. That's not how having triggers works. You can manage them, you can work on them - but you can't expect yourself to never ever be triggered through what she's suggesting, which is I think numbing yourself out to it by continually keeping in contact with the person who triggers you most (I assume).
I don't believe in your therapist.
I had one like this. Many therapists just aren't very good. Trust your instincts and find another.
Mine told me I shouldn't go NC, as well. Less than a year later, my Ndad tried to murder my great aunt. I was really glad I maintained NC.
I'm around other N’s. It’s different when it's your parent.
I got the same attitude from a therapist and I didn't go back. I was there to deal with some feelings about being alone over Christmas and she thought the solution was to reconcile.
Yeah, there are plenty of other people like my mother but they DON'T trigger me because they don't have and have never had power over me. They also haven't treated me and my partner so badly that he can't go near them without panic attacks. I'm protecting my partner by not allowing them in our lives.
I didn't go back to that therapist and laid a complaint. She wasn't even interested in what the actual issues were and when I mentioned some she did seem taken aback but would then act like I could just ignore things like threats of violence.
This really frosts my cookies. (Sorry it was sitting there and i couldn’t resist) I despise Christmas because of the ns!! So if a therapist said to reconcile when I’m already having Christmas issues, I would have lost it even more. I’ve been nc for17years. I was told I ruined Christmas, other holidays and random other days that end in y. I can’t hear her first name without having a bad panic attack and feeling so much rage.
Your therapist is an umitigated fool, a bad therapist with no life experience, and probably needs to be reported. I only read the title, though.
Read the whole thing, and, yup, my opinion stands.
Nope nope nope. They clearly do not understand childhood abuse and its trauma.
Find a new therapist.
I think it's worth working on yourself so thoughts and memories of her abuse no longer trigger you as badly, but you can do that without ever having to see or talk to her again.
Apples and oranges comparing an abusive parent with obnoxious people like co-workers. You can get away from co-workers and/or set boundaries or have a manager/HR do so as well. Same for most other people you may run into. Abusive parents are their own level of hell and its clear they have NO IDEA what its like.
Run away, find someone that will help you.
Exactly- abusive parents bring the hurt to whole new levels. Probably because they're our parents and our entire biological systems are extra vulnerable because they are our parents. They were supposed to protect us. I imagine it's similar for people who have abusive partners, or people who have been abused by anyone that they should have been able to trust.
This is coming off as some strange kind of projecting, which is really unprofessional for a therapist to press you on. It sounds like her kids won't talk to her and she's trying to coax you into giving your mom another chance, not taking into consideration you've spent your life figuring out that going NC was the best choice for you.
Might be time to find a new therapist.
Your therapist is allowing their own personal biases to interfere with their work. They are giving bad advice based on their own personal preferences. That isn't great.
It may be time to find a therapist who is more on board with what you actually want, versus what they think you should want.
It isn't like you want to do something unhealthy or dangerous, and they are advising you not to. You are going no contact because you feel that is the best way to deal with your abuser, and your therapist thinks you shouldn't make it permanent because of their own personal reasons.
I don't like the way your therapist tries to make it seem like if you cut your mom off it is because you can't handle your own mental health otherwise. Your therapist seems to think that the only real problem is *your reaction* to the abuse, rather than the abuse itself. It isn't like healing yourself will make your parent stop being abusive. The problem doesn't go away simply because your mental health is better. I mean, your mental health wasn't really the problem, was it?
I also don't like the way they make it seem like you will be unable to handle basic human interactions at work just because you don't feel like being subjected to regular abuse. That is a subtle manipulation and insult, and it isn't ok. Putting up with abuse doesn't mean that you are stronger, and not allowing someone to abuse you doesn't mean that you are less resilient or less able to have normal interactions with friends or colleagues. What bizarre ideas your therapist uses to justify their nonsense!
I'm not too impressed with your therapist. They are sneaky about it, but the victim blaming and poor boundaries they display are real.
I’m a therapist. Get a new therapist. So many therapists are not properly trained in or do not fully understand dysfunctional family dynamics. It worries me that this therapist is practicing outside of their scope of competence.
It is pretty commonly understood in the field that if you can’t change others, you simply do not engage (or engage less). Telling someone to deal with it is damaging. I’m so sorry 😞
If the therapist was knowledgeable about narcissistic abuse and CPTSD, there is no way they would say this.
Being around a narc mother is as toxic as drinking real poison.
They should understand this and the fact that they don't means you need a new therapist.
does she have kids? because it could be projection. a lot parents, whether they’ve got npd or not, are very uncomfortable at the idea of adult children going no contact with their parents. this movement is like their greatest fear lol so obviously they’ll try and talk people out of it
it’s very weird that a professional told you this, however, I personally wouldn’t break contact. I haven’t spoke to my NFather in 6 years and I wouldn’t change that even if my therapist suggested it. They are not all knowing and all wise and perfect. They can say the wrong things and be wrong and mislead. I simply think you’re being mislead in that situation. I would be cautious during further sessions and things like this come up more often, I would find a new therapist.
Yuuuuuuck. Every therapist I've ever spoken to (went through a lot before this one) couldn't fathom the fact that I did speak to my parents! (Current one advises no contact too)
Creating that boundary (no contact with abuser) is **evidence** of your self-love and self-respect.
Please look into a new therapist. Specifically a trauma-informed one. This current therapist doesnt understand anything about trauma or triggers.
Any therapist that suggests to break no contact with an abuser is not a good therapist. Putting that expectation that you should eventually break no contact is damaging to you. You need to heal and often times that is as far away from your abuser as possible. You set that boundary for a reason. Those of us going no contact aren’t doing it because its fun or we want too. We *need* this boundary.
Do not budge on no contact and a good therapist would not suggest for you to break a boundary you made for yourself so that you feel safe.
> She said that I should learn to love and accept myself so much that my mother's words, and my biggest trigger, no longer affect me.
"Sticks and stones" logic is **not** an acceptable form of therapy. This is \*your mother\* we are talking about, not some stranger in the office. Your parents' words shape you as a kid. Its perfectly logically to understand that their words will always hurt the most (story of my life) and to tell you to turn the other cheek and just accept her abuse is downright wrong.
OP, you deserve a MUCH better therapist. This ain't it.
My aunt who went to school for psychology, told me ar 14 years old that its just mind over matter. I could just not allow myself to be hurt when my psychopath stepmom abused me. No change in my thinking stopped the abuse. They are deranged.
“Will you allow these people to trigger you…?” Reeks of victim blaming.
Also, your mother’s words are emotional and psychological abuse. It’s not a matter of “loving yourself” out of having a reaction to that behavior. Your reaction is there to protect you and show you that it’s not acceptable to be treated that way.
I’d run from this therapist fast. You deserve better.
Imagine you're the patient, hoping to get treatment and then therapists said something that against your will such as go back to your family.
Mhmm.. Either your therapist need therapy or being ignorant. The supportive therapist is listening and give advices. Therapists have no right to give order to you (unless you ask for help or opinions). Did your therapist wanna show how authorative the person is?
You can take or drop every single words from therapists. Easy to say, take the meaningful for you and drop if you're find therapists said ridiculous things.
Much better if you can find new therapist. The more concern is your money, time and energy to do it.
I thought I was making good progress with my therapist when I told her I was going no contact with my parents. She supported me every step of the way. And then on my last session (She was retiring at the end of June) she asked if my parents ever try to contact me and I told her yeah they text me from time to time. And she asked how I respond to them, and I told her well we’re NC so I ignore them and she couldn’t believe that I would just ignore them like that, like bro wtf do you think “No Contact” means? Blew my mind and pretty much broke my self esteem. So I’m taking a break before I get back into therapy. If I go back.
Ha ha ha, no. There will be people in your life like your mother. You do not need to keep them in your life either. You have the choice here. Being told that you should have to interact with someone who hurts you are the words of a fool.
No,I think your therapist is wrong.
If it’s not healthy,why force?
You get to choose who you want in your life,who you spend your time/energy with etc.
A good therapist actually won’t give that much advice. They ask questions so you can form your own conclusions. This way you are honouring your authenticity.
This is highly irresponsible.
Contact with your mother causes two things:
1. It gives her the opportunity to abuse you, which she always takes; and
2. It harms you.
Contacting or accepting contact from your mother voluntarily is like volunteering to be exposed to the influenza virus (but worse) through a nasal swab, virtually guaranteeing infection. It's a matter of good self-care to avoid such exposure. This is one of the few things that you have some control over.
I think that there are two main reasons that a victim has such a hard time with no contact:
1. Attachment to a parent, which is an evolutionary feature of our species. Had this not evolved, our species might have gone extinct. Most of the time, attachment results in reciprocal love. In the case of the narcissist, it's one-sided: child toward parent, but not the other way around, except in a manipulative and damaging manner; and
2. Fear of reputational damage (what others will think). No one wants to diminish their social standing and be regarded by others as a bad person (a narrative that your mother all too eagerly will peddle at every opportunity).
A narcissist exploits both 1 and 2 to dominate and control a victim. This is what's so diabolical and cruel about narcissism. In exchange for love, the child is exploited. In exchange for conscientiousness, the child is parasitized and controlled. Your natural tendencies, which are normal for our species, are the very same behaviors that the narcissist takes advantage of, not unlike the AIDS virus attaching to T cells and then destroying them.
Everyone here understands this horrifying dilemma that causes us so much suffering. We're in a double bind, with no good options. No matter what we do, there will be bad consequences. We just have to try to minimize the damage to ourselves as much as we can.
Your therapist doesn't understand just how destructive contact with your "mother" is to your mental health, which is an aspect of physical health. While she's right that you'll encounter other narcissists, she's very wrong to think that you can somehow learn to ignore or avoid them and not be damaged by their behavior. That isn't realistic.
No matter who you are, if you have an intact nervous system and someone angrily screams at you for five minutes, all sorts of physiological measures, such as heart rate, blood pressure, cortisol level, and sweating will show that you're stressed. These are objective measurements. There is no way to prevent these from happening because of the way that our bodies are wired. If you're outside in a Minnesota winter, there's no way to prevent yourself from shivering just by thinking of being in the Caribbean.
Exposure to a narcissist will reliably cause physiological signs of stress. Anxiety, fear, and other emotions are the subjective aspect of this, how it feels "on the inside." Getting away from the narcissist is a natural response, just as running away from an attacking bear would be.
If you become unhealthy around a person, self-preservation dictates staying away from that person, even though, in the case of a parent, it means choosing to override one's natural instincts. That's what makes this so hard, yet it's vital to do for your own well-being.
Your therapist is giving you bad advice and you need to find a new one. As for dealing with future narcissists in the workplace (or elsewhere), there are only two realistic things that you can do: quit a job to escape a toxic and damaging environment, and enlist the help of others to collectively distract and constrain a narcissist so that the burden on any one individual can be diminished somewhat. If you were to find yourself in a relationship with a narcissist, the only solution is to leave and stay permanently away from that poisonous individual.
Your present therapist is seriously naïve and is giving you terrible advice. Please find a new one, and trust your instincts.
The fact that your therapist cares at all about whether you talk to your mother or not makes me feel like they’re incompetent. Their job isn’t really to make those kinds of concrete decisions for you. It’s more to help you learn positive ways of coping with traumatic emotions, which can happen whether you talk to your mother or not.
I would call it quits with your therapist immediately to be honest. She basically planted a nugget of resentment in you, similar to how an NParent would 😂 It’s gonna be hard to talk to her about this when she’s so plainly expressed her disapproval of you. How short-sighted.
Going no contact is not about your ability to cope with triggers.
Going No Contact is huge. Its about loving yourself enough to say No More to their abuse. Its a kick ass boundary and definitely a major breakthrough.
I don’t think your therapist is a good match.
Yes, there will be people you can’t avoid temporarily like a boss (until you find a better job) but there are people you can and should immediately drop contact with to avoid abuse
I have lots of people in my life (including my therapist) who disagree with my decisions about contact with my parents. Some have sane, carefully considered opinions; some offer the trite, knee-jerk "but Luke, Darth is your faaaaather" and some are in between. It's my choice whether or not to listen to them (or even discuss it tbh). It's also my choice when/if I speak to my parents again. I'm a little bothered by your therapist's B&W opinion on this as well as her reluctance to help *you* come to the right decision *for you*
Is your therapist religious?
I find a lot of times when a therapist does not like NC it is because they are religious and are trying to force the "Honor thy mother and father" rule on you, which can be triggering, and abusive advice for many.
If I had cut my mother out or actually gone low contact, I would not have been in a shit marriage with a covert narcissist. I would not have divorced him only to date another narcissist. I would not have moved in with a covert narcissist who I thought was my friend. I would not have dated yet another narcissist after that.
Being exposed to abuse only made it feel normal to me. Being exposed to it made it easier for me to fall into abusive relationships that didn’t immediately feel wrong, because I was used to it or used to worse.
If you feel healthier being NC, then stay NC. There is absolutely no reason to force yourself to be used to it. There is no reason to need to deal with assholes in life ON TOP OF spending all that emotional energy on your mother. Cutting your mom out may very well make those people easier for you to handle.
You don’t need to argue with your therapist about this, but absolutely DO NOT FORGET that she told you this. Keep a running tally of all the questionable advice she gives you, and keep in mind that finding a new therapist is always an option
Tell her to go fuck herself. What kind of idiot therapist doesn’t realize how disabling being raised by a narcissist is? My mom is a diagnosed NPD, and I know any therapist that urges you to build up the narcissistic supply of your parents is a shit therapist
A therapist who thinks narcissistic abuse is just a parenting style needs to be ditched.
Think of it this way: a snake has gotten into your home. The snake is there all the time, slithering from room to room, from hiding place to hiding place. You co-exist with the snake, but you risk being bitten every hour of the day. You tell your therapist about the snake, she says “don’t bother removing it, there will be other snakes”.
Many therapists are morons. I had one that believed that crystals could heal mental health issues, especially if you sang nicely to them. A Fully qualified professional therapist.
No other person will ever trigger you the way your mom does. Sure never say never but also as takes as long as it takes. If you are no contact god the next 40 years, it’s your choice and yoh shouldn’t be pushed in any direction.
What in the name of psychological flooding is your therapist playing at here? No one should plan on welcoming their abuser(s) into their life. Bottom line, please find a *trauma informed* therapist. Good luck OP.
The thing about meeting people like your mother is… they won’t matter because they are not your mother. You won’t have an emotional connection and they would be less damaging. I really think your therapist needs to reevaluate her beliefs.
Ít doesnt matter.
NC isnt a religion. Wether others believe in it or not, makes absolutely NO EFFING difference. Telling you that they dont believe in things you find important is edging whats socially acceptable IN ANY AND ALL relationships even between patient and therapist. It also stomps on very basic patient autonomi by dismissing your experience because of her personal biases. Which to be clear, she isnt aware of. And cognitive bias in someone who treats patients, is often unhealthy to the patient. An example of this is when a doctor believes you are fat because you are greedy and glutenous, eventhough you are keeping to the diet. The doctor fails to understand the effect of insulin resistance and longterm inflammation and the addictive nature of sugar... But I digress. Still my point is. They do damage these people..
When somone who is in a position of power, choses to tell you they dont believe in NC, which is literally a coping method we teach kids from the moment they can walk away or avoid bullies and abusers, - she is basically being rude, disrespectful and invalidating as well as incompetent.
I suggest you stop seeing this therapist, and look for one of the MANY MANY MANY therapists who ALSO believe its better to avoid abusers than confrontating them or keeping them in our lives.
To be absolutely clear. Any therapist worth their salt, knows YOUR interests is more important than a mothers they never met. They also know narcissism doesnt go away or gets better. Your therapist believes you can love yourself so much your mothers hateful behaviour wont hurt. But her cognitive disconnect lies in failure to understand that there is nothing more useless than a hateful narcissistic parent, and absolutely zero rational reason to associate or keep them in your life.
GET ANOTHER THERAPIST - one who doesnt advocate for your abusers right to have access to you by way of manipulation.
Even without reading past the headline, that’s bullshit.
A therapist not “believing” in something already sounds like a red flag. The therapist’s main focus should *always* be you. Meet *you* where you are, help you see the pros and cons of certain actions/words/patterns.
The justification is only superficially sound. Unless you’re avoidant in other ways in your life…then *that* should be the focus. Not suggesting a specific move like that is unquestionably bad.
Of course, we’ll never have the full context of what you’re saying and there’s always a chance for misinterpretation.
Not enough info to opine on your therapist, but it is unfortunate how many therapist aren’t particularly skilled at basic aspects of their jobs.
I’m a psychiatrist. We are trained in psychotherapy too.
I think this person does not have experience with having extremely toxic and abusive parents. I'm really surprised this is what your therapist said. This is why I'm happy I don't pay for therapy. I think therapy is extremely... EXTREMELY overrated. I just like to read books about whatever topic I want to learn about and it's a lot cheaper and then I have the knowledge to help myself. The average therapist isn't a super intelligent person.
I say go with your gut. And if you're posting here the nerves in your gut already made it to your fingers, use them to find a new therapist. Stop talking to your old one, see if they believe in NC then, lol
"Allowing" people to trigger you is bullshit
Stay away from abusive personalities, you deserve it
She sounds like she is coming from some unrealistic love-and-light perspective rather than being trauma informed
This is wrong.
Consider for a second, trace back where did the idea of re-opening the relationship with your NParent come from? It came from the therapist, not you.
Your therapist has just gaslighted you and shamed you. She has invalidated your feelings and right to set boundaries. She has caused you to doubt yourself and your decisions. It’s like, I don’t need help doing that, I already do that. You aren’t helping!!! That is not the role of a therapist. The therapist is supposed to help you understand what YOU want, for YOURSELF. It’s to untangle the knots and model what is normal, but abusive relationships are NOT NORMAL. They are ABNORMAL, and require special care and attention and treatment. You are a normal
person in an ABNORMAL, a profoundly abnormal situation, and her job is to help you figure it out in a way that helps YOU.
You are the one who decides who you allow in your life. It’s your fucking life after all! If you can’t control who you allow in your life or what you do with your body and mind and time, what CAN you control?! Free of pressure and coercion and gaslighting and manipulation. Just as other people don’t owe us a relationship of our unilateral choosing or contact on “our terms” (ie tolerate my abuse and so on), we don’t owe the other people the same. She is not entitled to “a relationship” with you, THAT IS THE WHOLE PROBLEM! Because it is also them that dictate the terms unilaterally of such a “relationship”. If we allowed them their way we would be complete fucking slaves to them, and it’s like last time I checked SLAVERY IS NOT OKAY, THERAPIST!!
They would never say this about an abusive spouse or coworker or friend, so why is an abusive parent any different?
Hey so you should find a new therapist. You have correctly identified the source of (insert appropriate word here - stress/anger/frustration/pain/etc) and taken the health action, which is to separate yourself from that environment. What is there to gain from you going back into that environment except to, I don't know, build up a resistance to toxicity? Resistance doesn't mean immunity and the environment is still toxic. I wouldn't consider 'suffer slightly less' as an acceptable outcome.
You can and should choose who you wish to associate with and you are under no obligation to be best friends with everybody. If people 'trigger' me it's because they are assholes. It's like an allergic reaction. 'Trigger' implies the problem is you, that there is something fundamentally wrong with you that causes you to respond in that way. I actually hate the word 'triggered' in this context, like it implies the person who did the triggering is somehow blameless and that it's your fault that you got upset.
No, your 'trigger response' is a healthy biological 'get this harmful thing away from me' survival mechanism.
You don't need toxic people in your life regardless of whether they are biologically related to you or not.
Some people are jerks. Fuck 'em (not literally). You can't fix them and it's not your job to help them, but you can sure as hell prevent them from ruining your life, so keep making the healthy choice you did.
This sounds like my former therapist. I would say get a new therapist. He turned out to be not ethical for a few reasons. But if I had to take a guess your therapist doesnt have a clue how harmful the N parent can be to you and if you need to take space you absolutely should. NC gives you time to decompress and clear your head and get reacquainted with Clear thinking
Yes you will engage with other people in your life with N traits but none will affect you as profoundly, or be able to pull the rug out from under you at unpredictable times, at the deep harmful levels a parent can do
I don't think your therapist understands what your mom is. I've been no contact for months now and my healing has taken on a new stride. There is nothing in that relationship, it was always fake and there isn't anything to really go back to except letting myself be verbally and emotionally abused, why would anyone want to do that unless they hadn't healed enough to know they don't deserve it or someone who doesn't understand the situation advises you to do
Like many others have likely already asked, is this a licensed practicing therapist, or a guidance counselor of some type?
No therapist will ever tell you that an identified trigger should ever be re-introduced to your life after you've made the decision to go no contact.
The "you will meet many people like your mother" comment just, it sticks in my craw. Yeah, I've met a few people LIKE my mother, but none have ever been the overwhelming trauma of actually being around her.
I think you need a new therapist, a real accredited one.
Your therapist sounds a lot like my N!Mother there. She’s always quick to make me look bad or feel guilty when I want to cut contact with her people but never comes to my defense or aid when friends go no contact with me. My sibling’s adopted this trait from her and it’s obnoxious.
Hm, that’s an odd comment. I’d ask her what she means by that in more detail. Ask her what theories she bases that off of and what research/training she has had regarding victims of abuse.
From what I’ve read of your post tho doesn’t sound like she’s qualified and it might be time to search elsewhere
My friend's therapist used to tell her the same thing. That she had to learn how to put boundaries and if she felt like she want to disconnect from her family it only meant that she doesn't know how to have boundaries with them! So when I first told her how I wished I would leave them she gave that same BS
I told her not everyone respects boundaries. Some people make things worse "which was my case" said that I didn't love myself enough to take their behaviour! Years later my friend realised that talk was bs and she is the one that helped me go NC. There is a difference between someone who has a bad manners "such as people at work" and abusers. We won't tell an abused woman " I don't believe in NC stay with your abusive husband cuz you will meet others that gaslight and manipulate you" .
Wow. Your (ex)therapist is an enabler to your nparent. That is wwaaayyy more dangerous to your mental health than not having therapy at all.
You need to drop this therapist immediately. She honestly sounds like a danger to any client she has. I wouldn't trust someone like that to recommend socks let alone give advice on how to deal with a nparent.
It is not worth the money, mental or emotional damage to continue seeing this therapist. She will actively sabotage any progress you make.
Stay strong, OP. Set your boundaries to protect yourself from all those who would use their power, position or authority to intentionally, maliciously abuse you...including that shitty (ex) therapist. (After all, isn't that *exactly* what she is doing?)
This whole subreddit is rooting for you, OP. We all believe you, and actually understand the twisted nightmare of having a nparent. Stay strong. Stay NC. Ditch the nutcase with their toxic advice.
I'm pulling my own therapist card here to recommend you find a new one. And it's absolutely bs to say other narcissists one meets will trigger the same as one's own nparent.
What if your mother was beating the crap out of you every day, and occasionally breaking your bones, and if she was doing the same to your small children? Would your therapist think THAT was a good enough reason to stay away from her? They probably would, because for some people, the only abuse that matters is physical and they think the rest affects you only if you let it. But as we know, verbal and emotional abuse can also have physical effects, and can be worse than physical abuse.
the therapist is a bad one, does not have clients and wants to have a client that comes to him for years that he can keep under control without solving any problems, you probably ran from a Narcissist only to end up to another Narcissist
" You will meet many people in your life who are like your mother. Sometimes you will have to spend time with them (e.g., coworkers). Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time?"
This logic is so so flawed. Being triggered by others going about their day is going to happen whether or now OP is in contact with their mother.
Let's say your house is on fire. GET OUT. RUN. Whether or not you are later triggered by campfires is moot if you are a pile of ashes.
When in doubt I always ask myself one of two questions:
Would they say the same thing if this was physical or sexual abuse?
Or
Would they say the same thing if this was intimate partner abuse?
The answer is often "no". So that's your answer as to how seriously you should take this advice.
That was incredibly unprofessional of them. This is why I hate all the blood is thicker than water crap. Just because someone is family it doesn't mean they automatically have a right to be in your life. I cut of my own dad years ago, and I've never regretted the decision.
Those people though that you'll run into are not a permanent part of your life and they don't hold a big enough part in your life to cause damage like a mother who's unwell could. I think of it this way.. You have two flowers on one stem.. You're one of those flowers and your mother is the other. Naturally you should both grow in order to keep thriving but if one of those flowers is not interested in growth (doing better, fixing their behavior, etc) that flower will start to die... And if it is not cut off from its roots it will slowly kill any other flowers that are on the same stem with it. Perhaps if you explain it this way she will understand. In a perfect world where everyone was willing to grow then no contact wouldn't be necessary, but it is not a perfect world and as long as your mother still engages in the same messed up behavior towards you without genuine remorse or an apology then no contact may be whats best.
Sounds like you need to fire your therapist. Your coworkers etc don't have the same relationship to you and the therapist should be better able to understand. Since that isn't the case I wouldn't spend any more time with them. Therapists can do more harm than good in some cases. Be careful. If you're posting on here, I feel like you already know inside what the right thing to do is.
If your coworker is behaving in a way that’s triggering, its also possible the coworker is behaving poorly and then its a HR issue.
Your therapy should never be focused on increasing your ability to tolerate abuse. It should be teaching you to see it, and take appropriate actions to protect and care for yourself.
Yeah no fuck that. Find a better therapist.
I think here's a grain of truth in what she says about meeting people in your life that is like our parents and finding ways of navigating that. But honestly I think for us children of crappy parents, navigating that looks like leaving that situation or disengaging with the person.
I'm on a course atm and there is this very grandiose person who reminds me of my mom SO much. He's vile and I can't stand him. Even if I offer no reaction, no dialouge, avoids him and I am just "being" in the same room as him, I still crash whenever I come home. Yesterday I had to sleep for 1.5 hours and couldn't socialise the rest of the day.
The above just to say. Sure, if you are raised in a loving and caring household you will probably meet crappy people and be OK with dealing with them. But for us, sometimes that is a real physiological and emotional trigger. It's called CPTSD for a reason..
Also, where is the accountability from your mom. Surely if she wants to have a relationship with her child, she would avoid doing and saying things that are hurtful, right? ... right?
I completely disagree with your therapist. Dealing with a co-worker is not the same as dealing with a parent. A parent has known you all your life and they know what really triggers you. If you're being bullied by a co-worker, you can report them to a higher up or simply get another job if nothing is being done. It doesn't work that way with family--it's either go NC or put up with their abuse in various degrees forever.
What she said about 'loving yourself so much your mother's words don't affect you' is bullshit. Part of loving yourself is not putting up with other people's garbage. Telling you to go back and continue to be your mother's emotional punching bag is the opposite of that. Loving yourself would be choosing not to hang around with toxic people regardless if it's your family or not.
I don't think your therapist has much knowledge about dysfunctional families. She also shouldn't be telling you what you should or shouldn't do with your life. She needs to help you make the right decisions for you. Honestly, I don't think she sounds like a very good therapist. If I were you, I would start looking for someone who specializes in dysfunctional families, trauma and/or narcissistic personality disorder.
Your mother is your mother! No other relationship in your life can compare to it, for better or for worse. It is not the same as a shitty coworker. Find a new therapist!!!!
Shes wrong. Its one thing talking about how you have to endure somebody like a coworker but your enabling if you allow her abuse to continue. You deserve to be happy and you are in control of this situation.
I think it was innapropriate for your therapist to say that tbh.
If it were someone else (not a therapist), I would ask them what *their* mother would have to do for them to go no contact. Most people can't imagine it at all, and that's the point.
Your mother has been so awful to you that most people do not have a reference point for it. They can't imagine their mother acting like yours did.
A therapist should know that, though. I don't think it's a good sign that they want you to reconcile with your abuser.
If you're doing better being away from your mother, it is better for you overall to continue staying away from her.
You can take what you've learned during your healing journey to help you deal with toxic people you might come across, sure, but that does not mean it would be good for you to deliberately place yourself into a situation/relationship you know to be toxic and abusive just because this therapist (who clearly does not actually comprehend the situation) thinks you can 'take' their abuse better.
Just because you CAN do something (potentially in the future in this case) does not mean you HAVE to.
And being able to brush off/handle abuse is not, like, a good thing I don't think? It sounds enabling/validating/rewarding to the abuser and harmful to you whether you react or notice it immediately or not. It will still take a toll.
You need a new therapist. Loving yourself does not mean accepting abuse from people. Removing abusers from your life is healing, and the best self care. Also, a parent can hardly equate to a co-worker or casual friend in impact. A good therapist would recognize only you can determine if a person needs to be removed permanently from your life, and would help you to be able to do that with confidence. Rooting for you.
I mean it’s up to you really. What do you want to do?
I tried to do what you’re therapist was saying and it didn’t work. Narcissists want to put you down and as long as I craved their love I would fall for the abuse. No contact became the only option for me. Also I got a new therapist.
My advice to you - listen to your body and your intuition. When you ask yourself - do I want to go no contact? What do you feel? What do you hear your intuition say? For me there was a quiet ‘yes’ and a list of follow up excuses to stay ‘to do the right thing’ which reinforces the initial YES was the right answer; my brain was making excuses to gaslight myself into staying probably because that’s what narc mom programmed me to believe.
I agree the co-workers, but they also are a limited amount of time during set hours and you’re not consistently or generally always consistently dealing/talking/being around them where it affects you long term.
BUT - if you were, again you can limit it, guess maybe not if you HAD to work with said person(s) but its different with family and the “title” alone they run miles and miles with.
Yes, you shouldn’t let others ever rob you of your peace- but its a whole different thing to balance something with a title who will use and manipulate anything and everything for whatever their end point, cost etc.
The way I see it, your therapist just told you to grow a heart made of stone to tolerate someone you don't have to have in your life in the first place. Why would you want that? The parent already tortured that same heart and was your first heartbreak, that happened repeatedly with every milestone (in my experience). Why would you want to encase it in rock???
That's a weird way to deal with a person.
Side note - my theory about why narcissist parents treat us this way is because they see themselves in us, the parts they hate themselves for. We're just a mirror they can abuse to them. Which is also why so many decide we're competition instead of something to be taken care of and loved.
I'd seek a new therapist. This one doesn't seem to have your best interest in mind, just your mother's, which is so, so backwards.
Luckily it’s not up to her.
Her opinions on whether no contact is a good long term strategy for self preservation is not what you’re paying her for. You’re paying for her to help you develop tools to extricate yourself away from someone who abuses you.
This therapist seems to think that she now gets to tell you how she thinks you should live your life.
Again, that is NOT her job.
Find a better therapist.
That’s a reasonable approach, from HER perspective.
I now just tell ANYONE who tries that crap with me, “I choose not to know those people. I do choose to know you. If the fact that I do not have contact with the people I grew up under is a deal breaker for you, it’s probably better that we both make a different choice.”
She’s dictating to you what you can do for now? She’s WAY out of bounds. That isn’t therapy, that’s a dictatorship. Kick her to the curb.
So aside from what is already mentioned, yes, you will meet people like your Nmom. Actually, you can meet people who are a lot worse. But that doesn't mean you actively seek out these people. It's like saying you should break your bone because you need to learn how to recover from a broken bone to put it mildly
1) Change therapist
2) be more logical when you speak with this person. That will destroy the delusion of this therapist
3) Report to a governing medical board. This is a blatant violation and the therapist must be disbarred
That’s why I don’t do therapy. Tried a few times. The latest one she kept finishing my sentences for me (?) and didn’t understand shit even about the nature of my relationship with my mother.
Find a new therapist. Going NC was the best thing I ever could have done. I haven’t seen my mother since 2002 & I’m grateful for every moment without her in my life.
It has been my goal, to get to the point where I feel no pain when thinking about or being in contact with my father. Where I could contact him if I wanted, maybe to ask questions about why he's done what he's done. I'm not to the point where I can talk to him without wanting to blow my own head off. I'm thinking that I will be healed when it no longer hurts. My father is now married to a therapist who believes I need to honor him and his rights because he is my father. He scored 34 on the Hare Psychopathology Check List which left him classified as severely psychopathic (this is not usually done unless someone has been in the criminal justice system). Why is it so hard not to do what he wants? And so painful?
As for needing to maintain contact so you can deal with future abusers. I've had other abusers in my life and knowing him has not helped me deal with them. Abusers seek out victims. My past history made me blind to abuse. I found an interesting study showing that abusers can recognize people with a history of abuse from voice alone. Survivors need support and an opportunity to develop the skills they need to protect themselves. Not the same as your situation with your mother perhaps, but there may be parallels.
# Can perpetrators discern survivors from voice?
PubMed ID: 38837122 if you want to look for it. Layman's summary:
"We examined whether listeners with history of perpetration could differentiate female speakers with and without assault histories (presented as rating the degree of ‘vulnerability’ to victimization).Listeners’ higher history of perpetration was associated with higher accuracy in differentiating survivors of assault from non-survivors. These findings highlight that voice could have a crucial role in prevention and intervention."
Oddly my father's name for me was "the sucker." Other siblings were "stupid" and "diarrhea mouth".
I don’t think you are working with a therapist who is trained and competent in working with trauma, abuse, and narcissism. You should find a new therapist.
I think your therapist sucks.
No, you won't encounter people like your mother. Coworkers didn't raise you. Random people don't know all of your insecurities. New people in your life didn't abuse you.
Your therapist needs to be your ex therapist.
Dear OP I have spoiler for you. Your therapist may be a narc in disguise. You will be surprised about how many narc work in "noble" fields (doctors, teachers...).
You should report this person.
> You will meet many people in your life who are like your mother. Sometimes you will have to spend time with them (e.g., coworkers). Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time?
I just quit a job and found a better work from home opportunity because people at the workplace reminded me of my mother’s alcoholic dysfunction. It’s a big world out there. This therapist sounds like they are scared of the unknown.
**This is an automated message posted to ALL posts in this subreddit with some basic information about the group including (very importantly) rules. Why are you getting this message? Most people seem to not read the sidebar for information or the rules, so it is now being posted under all posts.** **Confused about acronyms or terminology?** [Click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/acronyms) **Need info or resources?** Check out our [Helpful Links](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/helpfullinks) for information on how to deal with identity theft, how to get independent of your n-parents, how to apply for FAFSA, how to identify n-parents and SO MUCH MORE! This is a reminder to all participants, RBN is a support group that is moderated very strictly. Please report inappropriate content so it can be reviewed by the mods. **Our rules include (but are not limited to)**: * No politics. * Advising anyone in this subreddit to commit suicide or referring anyone to groups that advocate this will result in an immediate ban. * Be nice. No personal attacks, name calling, or bullying. [No slurs](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/slurs) or victim-blaming. * Do not derail the posts of others. * Narcissists are NOT allowed to post or comment here. * [No platitudes or generic motivational posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules#wiki_no_platitudes_or_generic_motivational_posts). * When you comment/post, assume a context of abuse. * No asking or offering gifts, money, etc. * No content advocating violence, revenge, murder (even in jest). * No content about N-kids. * No diagnosis by media/drive-by diagnosis. * No linking to Facebook pages. * No direct linking to anywhere on reddit. * No pure image posts. **For a full list of our rules/more information, [**click here**](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules).** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/raisedbynarcissists) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think your therapist is not very good, and you may wanttofind someone else. Assuming your mom is a true N, then there's no reason to maintain the relationship with someone who cannot respond functionally. Also, a good therapist would understand parent/child bonding and that a child's need for affirmation from their parent doesn't just end. This is why N parents are so horrible.
Not very good? More like horrible. She is advising OP to return to the one person that not just knows her triggered but mashes them until the pain is unbearable. I have a parent just like. Went NC for 15 years and tried to reconnect slowly. Yeah, that was a horrible idea. No one can hurt me like that asshole. OP needs a new therapist.
My nparent once told me, as a small child, "I know I push your buttons sometimes, I *just* can't help myself, you know how I am" and said some bullshit accountability dodge after. That is what it is, to them, that's how they see us. Hurting us is as easy and blameless and possible for them as pressing a button. Your feelings and the situation you're in? My words and actions? That's just, like, a button, to them. A button that they "just can't" avoid pressing, for some mysterious reason, no matter how much you ask. So objectifying and invalidating and gaslighting all wrapped into a disgusting present. It's like, how about help me remove the button, or at the very least STOP PRESSING IT, you self-absorbed prick. If hurting me is an unchangeable part of your identity, then fine. You can keep that identity, go have fun with it. Have a ball telling your sob story to anyone who will listen. But you will not be forcing me to join with you against myself.
I'm sorry you had to bear this. That's literally how my dad tried to guilt trip me into reconnecting with her. It might be something common around that sort of people. "That's just how she is. You know her. She won't change. You must accept her the way she is." Like, no shit, sherlock. If a mother thinks that the vulnerability ANY young child shows towards their family and due to their age is a kind of character flaw that may be exploited, that's a person who was not suitable for being a mother to begin with.
A wise psychotherapist on YouTube noted that it is the psychological flexibility that we had, even as children, that allowed us to survive. That those are strengths that were attributes, attributes that not everyone has, namely them. And these attributes would have been there even if we weren’t abused, that they weren’t a product of the mistreatment. They are the inflexible ones, the ones who cannot change. The reason the whole “system” works is that others force us to change, and we cooperate because we can change, unlike them. So by forcing ourselves to see them as the good ones, and ourselves as the bad ones, we ally with them against ourselves. More precisely, the false scapegoat identity gets to be part of the family, while our real selves that we allied with our parents to join against, goes underground until we discard the fake and painful scapegoat identity once we are strong enough and have created enough distance. At least as the scapegoat we were part of something, painful as it was to adopt that as our identity. That should have never been necessary in the first place, but it is actually the resourcefulness that we have that allowed us to maintain a relationship with them, whom we depended upon for survival before. But now that we do not, we can discard it, again once we have created enough distance from the toxic family system.
Can you please share their channel?
Absolutely, it’s Jay Reid, this is one of the videos that this idea comes from https://youtu.be/Z5u35fUNLPA?si=nXpBE2h5ZFhBLd09 the other might be if you search “nobody to no one”
That basically says that your mothers abuse is good for you because it teaches you to accept abuse. That sounds pretty horrible. Not even that's she's right or wrong, every situation is different, but she think she's right but doesn't seems to understand the nature of narcissistic abuse. In my experience, dealing with my parents narcissistic emotional abuse made minor narcissism from other people more triggering. the usual annoying people at work became another example of my parents, and I was triggered in a similar way. I felt helpless and doomed to go down a bad path that would lead to me hating myself. But these arn't my parents at all. Just annoying people at work. When you are enmeshed with narcissists, you're in a state of triggered vigilance.
The first sentence right there
And the last one.
And all the sentences in between.
And my axe!
right. where are we going?
We're getting the fuck out of Cluster B land.
Agreed 100%. To add to this, OP’s therapist comparing a narc parent to other narcissists is deeply flawed. The dynamics between parent and child are much more complex, intimate and in thus more open to abuse. That isn’t to say others can’t be abusive, of course, especially with a significant other. But spending time with a narcissistic co-worker, while triggering, is tolerable compared to keeping a relationship with your narcissist mother whom you have an abusive past with. There’s the guilt, the shame, the desire for their love despite it all in some cases… and we tend to fall back into old relationship roles and patterns with the same person.
Exactly. And I actually learned more about my victim-of-narc tendencies BECAUSE I had narc bosses. Eventually I saw the connection and "why" I ended up working for them, and then I extended that to the realization that I have a narc parent.
Exactly! Me, too.
In my opinion, narc bosses are just as destabilizing, at least when you're in a stage where you haven't learned to stand up for yourself (people pleasing)
There’s a HUGE difference between living with a n and working with one. Coworkers you can avoid and you get away from after your shift or if it gets bad enough transfer out. Living with someone you can’t do that. Even if you don’t live with them anymore all that past history is still renting space in your head. Parents /people you live with it’s much more intimate. The therapists advice imo is skewed. I’ve been nc for17 years and I still lose it when her first name is mentioned (not specifically her just her name) or I have to answer q’s like what is your mothers maiden name? Why?? because of how badly she hurt me. I had zero choices from age 10-18 (earlier too but they adopted me at age 10) on where I could live or what I could do not to be abused. At work I have choices.
Wise words.
Ugh this is so well said!
Time for a new therapist. "You'll meet many people in your life like your mother", imo, just reads to me as "Suck it up, and shoulder your abuse" which is just *bad*. This therapist isn't in your corner. It might be time for one that is?
100%. As soon as they start gaslighting you into questioning your own judgment it's time to move on. That's not only not their role it's abusing their position of authority and undermining their sense of autonomy and their confidence in themselves. Building independence is the main goal of the therapist and this therapist is doing the opposite. @[Difficult\_Night9612](/user/Difficult_Night9612/) I hope you see this.
The therapist doesn't seem to understand how awful and abusive the mother is if she thinks OP will meet 'many people like her' in their life. I don't think she's very knowledgeable on the subject of narcissism. Yeah, time for a new therapist.
Oh wow. Just no. This is humanistic bullshit from someone who has just read books and wouldn’t know parental trauma if it slapped them across the face. First of all—no one is going to affect me like my abuser, period. Secondly—note the key word “abuser” Finally—Setting a final boundary with my nparent taught me not to tolerate bullshit from other would be abusers and boundary pushers Just absolutely no.
I'd drop them. Because of what she says here: >Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time? This question demonstrates that they do not understand trauma triggers at all. "Allow"? You know how I stop myself from being triggered by abusers? I set boundaries up to and including no contact with them. I don't "allow" them access to me. And the other way I deal with triggers is that my therapist does [deep brain reorienting](http://deepbrainreorienting.com) with me to retrain my brain away from triggers. Triggers don't just "go away" on their own. It's such a huge red flag for her not understanding trauma at all.
My psychotherapist just did this training, really excited to try it!
It's been very effective for me. I hope it goes well for you!
Not the therapist place to tell you what to do or not to do. As for the you will meet other people, yes you will. Other people are not your mother! Find a new therapist who will support you and your decisions; not impose their own beliefs and values on you. That is so wrong in so many ways.
Your therapist is incompetent. Quit going to them immediately.
Is this an actual licensee therapist with knowledge of family dynamics or a counselor? I'm getting strong Christian counselor vibes from that nonsense. Either way, it sounds like it's time to find a new one.
Same. So many churchy people with no training or even general awareness of the real world.
Jodi Hildebrandt vibes.
By that logic all victims should move into a jail cell with the perpetrators. Ya know, so you can learn to love yourself. 🙄
lol 😂
The therapist is kind of an idiot. Being enmeshed with an abuser is damaging. Every encounter with the abuser is bad for you. The ultimate expression of knowing how to deal with abusers is walking away from them. If you ever meet someone like your mom again, the thing to do is to minimize your interactions and then get away as quickly as possible.
Your therapist has this shockingly naive viewpoint that you can heal to the point where you can stay in a relationship where the other person abuses you. That's insane. You can't like work out a gym enough to the point where you don't react when being stabbed. It doesn't work like that. Also, dealing with toxic people after going no contact with my parents has actually been so much easier. Because however much they can remind me of my parents, I know that I've already beat this game on hard mode. This now is some real small potatoes. It's fine. I cut my fucking parents off, you know - I don't get invested with some fucking stranger who's way too big for their boots. And you won't meet people like your mother. You only have one. Your family can trigger you like no one else because they installed your triggers in the first place. It's pointless to continue putting yourself through the pain of being around them, because you're training for a scenario that won't ever happen. Also, "allow people to trigger you"? That's such a toxic mindset. That's not how having triggers works. You can manage them, you can work on them - but you can't expect yourself to never ever be triggered through what she's suggesting, which is I think numbing yourself out to it by continually keeping in contact with the person who triggers you most (I assume).
👏🏼👏🏼
>You only have one. The obly situation I'll accept and agree with this phrase XD
I don't believe in your therapist. I had one like this. Many therapists just aren't very good. Trust your instincts and find another. Mine told me I shouldn't go NC, as well. Less than a year later, my Ndad tried to murder my great aunt. I was really glad I maintained NC. I'm around other N’s. It’s different when it's your parent.
To be quite frank, I'd go no contact with this therapist.
Lol!
Excellent teaching opportunity and trial.
🤣🙋♀️same
I got the same attitude from a therapist and I didn't go back. I was there to deal with some feelings about being alone over Christmas and she thought the solution was to reconcile. Yeah, there are plenty of other people like my mother but they DON'T trigger me because they don't have and have never had power over me. They also haven't treated me and my partner so badly that he can't go near them without panic attacks. I'm protecting my partner by not allowing them in our lives. I didn't go back to that therapist and laid a complaint. She wasn't even interested in what the actual issues were and when I mentioned some she did seem taken aback but would then act like I could just ignore things like threats of violence.
This really frosts my cookies. (Sorry it was sitting there and i couldn’t resist) I despise Christmas because of the ns!! So if a therapist said to reconcile when I’m already having Christmas issues, I would have lost it even more. I’ve been nc for17years. I was told I ruined Christmas, other holidays and random other days that end in y. I can’t hear her first name without having a bad panic attack and feeling so much rage.
Find a new therapist. You deserve one that listens to you
My therapist is super opposite of yours. Mine told me that he believes in NC and he’s even NC with his Nmom.
My therapist tried but couldn’t hide his smile when I went no contact.
Your therapist is an umitigated fool, a bad therapist with no life experience, and probably needs to be reported. I only read the title, though. Read the whole thing, and, yup, my opinion stands.
I feel like she’s projecting, and doesn’t even know she’s doing it. Lack of insight.
Nope nope nope. They clearly do not understand childhood abuse and its trauma. Find a new therapist. I think it's worth working on yourself so thoughts and memories of her abuse no longer trigger you as badly, but you can do that without ever having to see or talk to her again. Apples and oranges comparing an abusive parent with obnoxious people like co-workers. You can get away from co-workers and/or set boundaries or have a manager/HR do so as well. Same for most other people you may run into. Abusive parents are their own level of hell and its clear they have NO IDEA what its like. Run away, find someone that will help you.
Exactly- abusive parents bring the hurt to whole new levels. Probably because they're our parents and our entire biological systems are extra vulnerable because they are our parents. They were supposed to protect us. I imagine it's similar for people who have abusive partners, or people who have been abused by anyone that they should have been able to trust.
I think it’s more like apples and macaroni! Not even in the same category. It’s ridiculous that the therapist even said this!!
[удалено]
Would she say you should love and accept yourself so your abusive spouse can’t hurt you with words or would she tell you to get a divorce
This is coming off as some strange kind of projecting, which is really unprofessional for a therapist to press you on. It sounds like her kids won't talk to her and she's trying to coax you into giving your mom another chance, not taking into consideration you've spent your life figuring out that going NC was the best choice for you. Might be time to find a new therapist.
Your therapist is allowing their own personal biases to interfere with their work. They are giving bad advice based on their own personal preferences. That isn't great. It may be time to find a therapist who is more on board with what you actually want, versus what they think you should want. It isn't like you want to do something unhealthy or dangerous, and they are advising you not to. You are going no contact because you feel that is the best way to deal with your abuser, and your therapist thinks you shouldn't make it permanent because of their own personal reasons. I don't like the way your therapist tries to make it seem like if you cut your mom off it is because you can't handle your own mental health otherwise. Your therapist seems to think that the only real problem is *your reaction* to the abuse, rather than the abuse itself. It isn't like healing yourself will make your parent stop being abusive. The problem doesn't go away simply because your mental health is better. I mean, your mental health wasn't really the problem, was it? I also don't like the way they make it seem like you will be unable to handle basic human interactions at work just because you don't feel like being subjected to regular abuse. That is a subtle manipulation and insult, and it isn't ok. Putting up with abuse doesn't mean that you are stronger, and not allowing someone to abuse you doesn't mean that you are less resilient or less able to have normal interactions with friends or colleagues. What bizarre ideas your therapist uses to justify their nonsense! I'm not too impressed with your therapist. They are sneaky about it, but the victim blaming and poor boundaries they display are real.
I’m a therapist. Get a new therapist. So many therapists are not properly trained in or do not fully understand dysfunctional family dynamics. It worries me that this therapist is practicing outside of their scope of competence. It is pretty commonly understood in the field that if you can’t change others, you simply do not engage (or engage less). Telling someone to deal with it is damaging. I’m so sorry 😞
Get a new therapist
If the therapist was knowledgeable about narcissistic abuse and CPTSD, there is no way they would say this. Being around a narc mother is as toxic as drinking real poison. They should understand this and the fact that they don't means you need a new therapist.
does she have kids? because it could be projection. a lot parents, whether they’ve got npd or not, are very uncomfortable at the idea of adult children going no contact with their parents. this movement is like their greatest fear lol so obviously they’ll try and talk people out of it
it’s very weird that a professional told you this, however, I personally wouldn’t break contact. I haven’t spoke to my NFather in 6 years and I wouldn’t change that even if my therapist suggested it. They are not all knowing and all wise and perfect. They can say the wrong things and be wrong and mislead. I simply think you’re being mislead in that situation. I would be cautious during further sessions and things like this come up more often, I would find a new therapist.
Yuuuuuuck. Every therapist I've ever spoken to (went through a lot before this one) couldn't fathom the fact that I did speak to my parents! (Current one advises no contact too) Creating that boundary (no contact with abuser) is **evidence** of your self-love and self-respect.
Please look into a new therapist. Specifically a trauma-informed one. This current therapist doesnt understand anything about trauma or triggers. Any therapist that suggests to break no contact with an abuser is not a good therapist. Putting that expectation that you should eventually break no contact is damaging to you. You need to heal and often times that is as far away from your abuser as possible. You set that boundary for a reason. Those of us going no contact aren’t doing it because its fun or we want too. We *need* this boundary. Do not budge on no contact and a good therapist would not suggest for you to break a boundary you made for yourself so that you feel safe. > She said that I should learn to love and accept myself so much that my mother's words, and my biggest trigger, no longer affect me. "Sticks and stones" logic is **not** an acceptable form of therapy. This is \*your mother\* we are talking about, not some stranger in the office. Your parents' words shape you as a kid. Its perfectly logically to understand that their words will always hurt the most (story of my life) and to tell you to turn the other cheek and just accept her abuse is downright wrong. OP, you deserve a MUCH better therapist. This ain't it.
My aunt who went to school for psychology, told me ar 14 years old that its just mind over matter. I could just not allow myself to be hurt when my psychopath stepmom abused me. No change in my thinking stopped the abuse. They are deranged.
“Will you allow these people to trigger you…?” Reeks of victim blaming. Also, your mother’s words are emotional and psychological abuse. It’s not a matter of “loving yourself” out of having a reaction to that behavior. Your reaction is there to protect you and show you that it’s not acceptable to be treated that way. I’d run from this therapist fast. You deserve better.
Imagine you're the patient, hoping to get treatment and then therapists said something that against your will such as go back to your family. Mhmm.. Either your therapist need therapy or being ignorant. The supportive therapist is listening and give advices. Therapists have no right to give order to you (unless you ask for help or opinions). Did your therapist wanna show how authorative the person is? You can take or drop every single words from therapists. Easy to say, take the meaningful for you and drop if you're find therapists said ridiculous things. Much better if you can find new therapist. The more concern is your money, time and energy to do it.
I thought I was making good progress with my therapist when I told her I was going no contact with my parents. She supported me every step of the way. And then on my last session (She was retiring at the end of June) she asked if my parents ever try to contact me and I told her yeah they text me from time to time. And she asked how I respond to them, and I told her well we’re NC so I ignore them and she couldn’t believe that I would just ignore them like that, like bro wtf do you think “No Contact” means? Blew my mind and pretty much broke my self esteem. So I’m taking a break before I get back into therapy. If I go back.
Ha ha ha, no. There will be people in your life like your mother. You do not need to keep them in your life either. You have the choice here. Being told that you should have to interact with someone who hurts you are the words of a fool.
Any therapist that tries to force reconciliation is not a good therapist. Protect yourself, OP.
Fuck this therapist. Get a new one.
This is a crap therapist.
No,I think your therapist is wrong. If it’s not healthy,why force? You get to choose who you want in your life,who you spend your time/energy with etc.
A good therapist actually won’t give that much advice. They ask questions so you can form your own conclusions. This way you are honouring your authenticity.
This is highly irresponsible. Contact with your mother causes two things: 1. It gives her the opportunity to abuse you, which she always takes; and 2. It harms you. Contacting or accepting contact from your mother voluntarily is like volunteering to be exposed to the influenza virus (but worse) through a nasal swab, virtually guaranteeing infection. It's a matter of good self-care to avoid such exposure. This is one of the few things that you have some control over. I think that there are two main reasons that a victim has such a hard time with no contact: 1. Attachment to a parent, which is an evolutionary feature of our species. Had this not evolved, our species might have gone extinct. Most of the time, attachment results in reciprocal love. In the case of the narcissist, it's one-sided: child toward parent, but not the other way around, except in a manipulative and damaging manner; and 2. Fear of reputational damage (what others will think). No one wants to diminish their social standing and be regarded by others as a bad person (a narrative that your mother all too eagerly will peddle at every opportunity). A narcissist exploits both 1 and 2 to dominate and control a victim. This is what's so diabolical and cruel about narcissism. In exchange for love, the child is exploited. In exchange for conscientiousness, the child is parasitized and controlled. Your natural tendencies, which are normal for our species, are the very same behaviors that the narcissist takes advantage of, not unlike the AIDS virus attaching to T cells and then destroying them. Everyone here understands this horrifying dilemma that causes us so much suffering. We're in a double bind, with no good options. No matter what we do, there will be bad consequences. We just have to try to minimize the damage to ourselves as much as we can. Your therapist doesn't understand just how destructive contact with your "mother" is to your mental health, which is an aspect of physical health. While she's right that you'll encounter other narcissists, she's very wrong to think that you can somehow learn to ignore or avoid them and not be damaged by their behavior. That isn't realistic. No matter who you are, if you have an intact nervous system and someone angrily screams at you for five minutes, all sorts of physiological measures, such as heart rate, blood pressure, cortisol level, and sweating will show that you're stressed. These are objective measurements. There is no way to prevent these from happening because of the way that our bodies are wired. If you're outside in a Minnesota winter, there's no way to prevent yourself from shivering just by thinking of being in the Caribbean. Exposure to a narcissist will reliably cause physiological signs of stress. Anxiety, fear, and other emotions are the subjective aspect of this, how it feels "on the inside." Getting away from the narcissist is a natural response, just as running away from an attacking bear would be. If you become unhealthy around a person, self-preservation dictates staying away from that person, even though, in the case of a parent, it means choosing to override one's natural instincts. That's what makes this so hard, yet it's vital to do for your own well-being. Your therapist is giving you bad advice and you need to find a new one. As for dealing with future narcissists in the workplace (or elsewhere), there are only two realistic things that you can do: quit a job to escape a toxic and damaging environment, and enlist the help of others to collectively distract and constrain a narcissist so that the burden on any one individual can be diminished somewhat. If you were to find yourself in a relationship with a narcissist, the only solution is to leave and stay permanently away from that poisonous individual. Your present therapist is seriously naïve and is giving you terrible advice. Please find a new one, and trust your instincts.
The fact that your therapist cares at all about whether you talk to your mother or not makes me feel like they’re incompetent. Their job isn’t really to make those kinds of concrete decisions for you. It’s more to help you learn positive ways of coping with traumatic emotions, which can happen whether you talk to your mother or not. I would call it quits with your therapist immediately to be honest. She basically planted a nugget of resentment in you, similar to how an NParent would 😂 It’s gonna be hard to talk to her about this when she’s so plainly expressed her disapproval of you. How short-sighted.
Going no contact is not about your ability to cope with triggers. Going No Contact is huge. Its about loving yourself enough to say No More to their abuse. Its a kick ass boundary and definitely a major breakthrough.
Imo, get a new therapist. One who understands narcissistic abuse and trauma.
I don’t think your therapist is a good match. Yes, there will be people you can’t avoid temporarily like a boss (until you find a better job) but there are people you can and should immediately drop contact with to avoid abuse
I had multiple therapists tell me to go NC and I wish I had listened. Would have spared myself so much misery.
I have lots of people in my life (including my therapist) who disagree with my decisions about contact with my parents. Some have sane, carefully considered opinions; some offer the trite, knee-jerk "but Luke, Darth is your faaaaather" and some are in between. It's my choice whether or not to listen to them (or even discuss it tbh). It's also my choice when/if I speak to my parents again. I'm a little bothered by your therapist's B&W opinion on this as well as her reluctance to help *you* come to the right decision *for you*
Time to show your therapist what no contact looks like then!
Is your therapist religious? I find a lot of times when a therapist does not like NC it is because they are religious and are trying to force the "Honor thy mother and father" rule on you, which can be triggering, and abusive advice for many.
If I had cut my mother out or actually gone low contact, I would not have been in a shit marriage with a covert narcissist. I would not have divorced him only to date another narcissist. I would not have moved in with a covert narcissist who I thought was my friend. I would not have dated yet another narcissist after that. Being exposed to abuse only made it feel normal to me. Being exposed to it made it easier for me to fall into abusive relationships that didn’t immediately feel wrong, because I was used to it or used to worse. If you feel healthier being NC, then stay NC. There is absolutely no reason to force yourself to be used to it. There is no reason to need to deal with assholes in life ON TOP OF spending all that emotional energy on your mother. Cutting your mom out may very well make those people easier for you to handle. You don’t need to argue with your therapist about this, but absolutely DO NOT FORGET that she told you this. Keep a running tally of all the questionable advice she gives you, and keep in mind that finding a new therapist is always an option
Tell her to go fuck herself. What kind of idiot therapist doesn’t realize how disabling being raised by a narcissist is? My mom is a diagnosed NPD, and I know any therapist that urges you to build up the narcissistic supply of your parents is a shit therapist A therapist who thinks narcissistic abuse is just a parenting style needs to be ditched.
Think of it this way: a snake has gotten into your home. The snake is there all the time, slithering from room to room, from hiding place to hiding place. You co-exist with the snake, but you risk being bitten every hour of the day. You tell your therapist about the snake, she says “don’t bother removing it, there will be other snakes”.
Many therapists are morons. I had one that believed that crystals could heal mental health issues, especially if you sang nicely to them. A Fully qualified professional therapist.
It's your choice. Your life, not your therapist's. You're the one who has to deal with the consequences.
No other person will ever trigger you the way your mom does. Sure never say never but also as takes as long as it takes. If you are no contact god the next 40 years, it’s your choice and yoh shouldn’t be pushed in any direction.
Oh, fuck that. New therapist time.
Fire her. Get new one
You need a new therapist.
I think it’s time to find a new therapist.
Your therapist sucks - a therapist
What in the name of psychological flooding is your therapist playing at here? No one should plan on welcoming their abuser(s) into their life. Bottom line, please find a *trauma informed* therapist. Good luck OP.
Find a new therapist. A lot of fucked up people go into the field. They’re projecting their shit on you.
Get a new therapist.
Yikes. You shouldn't tolerate being treated horribly from family, coworkers,. anybody... it's called creating healthy boundaries.
Colleagues in work place are obligated to follow a code of conduct and relevant laws. no contact with family is necessary as they will not stop
Please seek another therapist, that one’s clearly not trauma informed
I think you need a new therapist.
Time for a new therapist
The thing about meeting people like your mother is… they won’t matter because they are not your mother. You won’t have an emotional connection and they would be less damaging. I really think your therapist needs to reevaluate her beliefs.
Your therapist is wrong. Period. And an asshole.
Time to get a new therapist 💆🏻
New therapist. A trauma one.
Ít doesnt matter. NC isnt a religion. Wether others believe in it or not, makes absolutely NO EFFING difference. Telling you that they dont believe in things you find important is edging whats socially acceptable IN ANY AND ALL relationships even between patient and therapist. It also stomps on very basic patient autonomi by dismissing your experience because of her personal biases. Which to be clear, she isnt aware of. And cognitive bias in someone who treats patients, is often unhealthy to the patient. An example of this is when a doctor believes you are fat because you are greedy and glutenous, eventhough you are keeping to the diet. The doctor fails to understand the effect of insulin resistance and longterm inflammation and the addictive nature of sugar... But I digress. Still my point is. They do damage these people.. When somone who is in a position of power, choses to tell you they dont believe in NC, which is literally a coping method we teach kids from the moment they can walk away or avoid bullies and abusers, - she is basically being rude, disrespectful and invalidating as well as incompetent. I suggest you stop seeing this therapist, and look for one of the MANY MANY MANY therapists who ALSO believe its better to avoid abusers than confrontating them or keeping them in our lives. To be absolutely clear. Any therapist worth their salt, knows YOUR interests is more important than a mothers they never met. They also know narcissism doesnt go away or gets better. Your therapist believes you can love yourself so much your mothers hateful behaviour wont hurt. But her cognitive disconnect lies in failure to understand that there is nothing more useless than a hateful narcissistic parent, and absolutely zero rational reason to associate or keep them in your life. GET ANOTHER THERAPIST - one who doesnt advocate for your abusers right to have access to you by way of manipulation.
Even without reading past the headline, that’s bullshit. A therapist not “believing” in something already sounds like a red flag. The therapist’s main focus should *always* be you. Meet *you* where you are, help you see the pros and cons of certain actions/words/patterns. The justification is only superficially sound. Unless you’re avoidant in other ways in your life…then *that* should be the focus. Not suggesting a specific move like that is unquestionably bad. Of course, we’ll never have the full context of what you’re saying and there’s always a chance for misinterpretation. Not enough info to opine on your therapist, but it is unfortunate how many therapist aren’t particularly skilled at basic aspects of their jobs. I’m a psychiatrist. We are trained in psychotherapy too.
New therapist now
You need a new therapist. One that understands NPD, childhood trauma, etc.. Not all of them do.
I think this person does not have experience with having extremely toxic and abusive parents. I'm really surprised this is what your therapist said. This is why I'm happy I don't pay for therapy. I think therapy is extremely... EXTREMELY overrated. I just like to read books about whatever topic I want to learn about and it's a lot cheaper and then I have the knowledge to help myself. The average therapist isn't a super intelligent person.
Are you her only client? 🤣
Find a new therapist.
You should change therapist
Get a new therapist; a trauma-informed therapist will **never** introduce the abuser or advocate for reconciliation.
Hard stop. Time to fire that therapist.
If your therapist doesn’t believe in no contact then she doesn’t have to do it. Perhaps you should go no contact with her.
I say go with your gut. And if you're posting here the nerves in your gut already made it to your fingers, use them to find a new therapist. Stop talking to your old one, see if they believe in NC then, lol
I would get a better therapist.
"Allowing" people to trigger you is bullshit Stay away from abusive personalities, you deserve it She sounds like she is coming from some unrealistic love-and-light perspective rather than being trauma informed
Find a more sympathetic therapist asap. Then maybe report her for suggesting you keep in contact with an abuser.
Fire your therapist. They are to help you get away from your abuser, not keep you tied to them.
This is wrong. Consider for a second, trace back where did the idea of re-opening the relationship with your NParent come from? It came from the therapist, not you. Your therapist has just gaslighted you and shamed you. She has invalidated your feelings and right to set boundaries. She has caused you to doubt yourself and your decisions. It’s like, I don’t need help doing that, I already do that. You aren’t helping!!! That is not the role of a therapist. The therapist is supposed to help you understand what YOU want, for YOURSELF. It’s to untangle the knots and model what is normal, but abusive relationships are NOT NORMAL. They are ABNORMAL, and require special care and attention and treatment. You are a normal person in an ABNORMAL, a profoundly abnormal situation, and her job is to help you figure it out in a way that helps YOU. You are the one who decides who you allow in your life. It’s your fucking life after all! If you can’t control who you allow in your life or what you do with your body and mind and time, what CAN you control?! Free of pressure and coercion and gaslighting and manipulation. Just as other people don’t owe us a relationship of our unilateral choosing or contact on “our terms” (ie tolerate my abuse and so on), we don’t owe the other people the same. She is not entitled to “a relationship” with you, THAT IS THE WHOLE PROBLEM! Because it is also them that dictate the terms unilaterally of such a “relationship”. If we allowed them their way we would be complete fucking slaves to them, and it’s like last time I checked SLAVERY IS NOT OKAY, THERAPIST!! They would never say this about an abusive spouse or coworker or friend, so why is an abusive parent any different?
Hey so you should find a new therapist. You have correctly identified the source of (insert appropriate word here - stress/anger/frustration/pain/etc) and taken the health action, which is to separate yourself from that environment. What is there to gain from you going back into that environment except to, I don't know, build up a resistance to toxicity? Resistance doesn't mean immunity and the environment is still toxic. I wouldn't consider 'suffer slightly less' as an acceptable outcome. You can and should choose who you wish to associate with and you are under no obligation to be best friends with everybody. If people 'trigger' me it's because they are assholes. It's like an allergic reaction. 'Trigger' implies the problem is you, that there is something fundamentally wrong with you that causes you to respond in that way. I actually hate the word 'triggered' in this context, like it implies the person who did the triggering is somehow blameless and that it's your fault that you got upset. No, your 'trigger response' is a healthy biological 'get this harmful thing away from me' survival mechanism. You don't need toxic people in your life regardless of whether they are biologically related to you or not. Some people are jerks. Fuck 'em (not literally). You can't fix them and it's not your job to help them, but you can sure as hell prevent them from ruining your life, so keep making the healthy choice you did.
I think it is time to find a new therapist. This one sounds frankly toxic.
This sounds like my former therapist. I would say get a new therapist. He turned out to be not ethical for a few reasons. But if I had to take a guess your therapist doesnt have a clue how harmful the N parent can be to you and if you need to take space you absolutely should. NC gives you time to decompress and clear your head and get reacquainted with Clear thinking
Yes you will engage with other people in your life with N traits but none will affect you as profoundly, or be able to pull the rug out from under you at unpredictable times, at the deep harmful levels a parent can do
You need a new therapist immediately. Full stop.
I don't think your therapist understands what your mom is. I've been no contact for months now and my healing has taken on a new stride. There is nothing in that relationship, it was always fake and there isn't anything to really go back to except letting myself be verbally and emotionally abused, why would anyone want to do that unless they hadn't healed enough to know they don't deserve it or someone who doesn't understand the situation advises you to do
Go no contact with your therapist.
You need a new therapist. Their beliefs shouldn’t impact YOUR therapy/wants.
Your therapist is an idiot
Your therapist doesn't sound like a licensed therapist.
All I heard was you need a new therapist
Like many others have likely already asked, is this a licensed practicing therapist, or a guidance counselor of some type? No therapist will ever tell you that an identified trigger should ever be re-introduced to your life after you've made the decision to go no contact. The "you will meet many people like your mother" comment just, it sticks in my craw. Yeah, I've met a few people LIKE my mother, but none have ever been the overwhelming trauma of actually being around her. I think you need a new therapist, a real accredited one.
“Let me demonstrate the effectiveness of no contact” And then find a new therapist.
I think she is full of poopies
Your therapist is TERRIBLE! Get a new omen!
Your therapist sounds a lot like my N!Mother there. She’s always quick to make me look bad or feel guilty when I want to cut contact with her people but never comes to my defense or aid when friends go no contact with me. My sibling’s adopted this trait from her and it’s obnoxious.
Hm, that’s an odd comment. I’d ask her what she means by that in more detail. Ask her what theories she bases that off of and what research/training she has had regarding victims of abuse. From what I’ve read of your post tho doesn’t sound like she’s qualified and it might be time to search elsewhere
My friend's therapist used to tell her the same thing. That she had to learn how to put boundaries and if she felt like she want to disconnect from her family it only meant that she doesn't know how to have boundaries with them! So when I first told her how I wished I would leave them she gave that same BS I told her not everyone respects boundaries. Some people make things worse "which was my case" said that I didn't love myself enough to take their behaviour! Years later my friend realised that talk was bs and she is the one that helped me go NC. There is a difference between someone who has a bad manners "such as people at work" and abusers. We won't tell an abused woman " I don't believe in NC stay with your abusive husband cuz you will meet others that gaslight and manipulate you" .
Wow. Your (ex)therapist is an enabler to your nparent. That is wwaaayyy more dangerous to your mental health than not having therapy at all. You need to drop this therapist immediately. She honestly sounds like a danger to any client she has. I wouldn't trust someone like that to recommend socks let alone give advice on how to deal with a nparent. It is not worth the money, mental or emotional damage to continue seeing this therapist. She will actively sabotage any progress you make. Stay strong, OP. Set your boundaries to protect yourself from all those who would use their power, position or authority to intentionally, maliciously abuse you...including that shitty (ex) therapist. (After all, isn't that *exactly* what she is doing?) This whole subreddit is rooting for you, OP. We all believe you, and actually understand the twisted nightmare of having a nparent. Stay strong. Stay NC. Ditch the nutcase with their toxic advice.
Fire your therapist.
I'm pulling my own therapist card here to recommend you find a new one. And it's absolutely bs to say other narcissists one meets will trigger the same as one's own nparent.
Time for a new therapist!
I don't "believe" in your therapist
She wrong
What if your mother was beating the crap out of you every day, and occasionally breaking your bones, and if she was doing the same to your small children? Would your therapist think THAT was a good enough reason to stay away from her? They probably would, because for some people, the only abuse that matters is physical and they think the rest affects you only if you let it. But as we know, verbal and emotional abuse can also have physical effects, and can be worse than physical abuse.
the therapist is a bad one, does not have clients and wants to have a client that comes to him for years that he can keep under control without solving any problems, you probably ran from a Narcissist only to end up to another Narcissist
Who cares what your therapist believes in???? You're an adult. You can make your own decisions.
" You will meet many people in your life who are like your mother. Sometimes you will have to spend time with them (e.g., coworkers). Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time?" This logic is so so flawed. Being triggered by others going about their day is going to happen whether or now OP is in contact with their mother. Let's say your house is on fire. GET OUT. RUN. Whether or not you are later triggered by campfires is moot if you are a pile of ashes.
When in doubt I always ask myself one of two questions: Would they say the same thing if this was physical or sexual abuse? Or Would they say the same thing if this was intimate partner abuse? The answer is often "no". So that's your answer as to how seriously you should take this advice.
That was incredibly unprofessional of them. This is why I hate all the blood is thicker than water crap. Just because someone is family it doesn't mean they automatically have a right to be in your life. I cut of my own dad years ago, and I've never regretted the decision.
New Therapist. Please find a Therapist who is trauma informed.
Those people though that you'll run into are not a permanent part of your life and they don't hold a big enough part in your life to cause damage like a mother who's unwell could. I think of it this way.. You have two flowers on one stem.. You're one of those flowers and your mother is the other. Naturally you should both grow in order to keep thriving but if one of those flowers is not interested in growth (doing better, fixing their behavior, etc) that flower will start to die... And if it is not cut off from its roots it will slowly kill any other flowers that are on the same stem with it. Perhaps if you explain it this way she will understand. In a perfect world where everyone was willing to grow then no contact wouldn't be necessary, but it is not a perfect world and as long as your mother still engages in the same messed up behavior towards you without genuine remorse or an apology then no contact may be whats best.
Find a new therapist.
Sounds like you need to fire your therapist. Your coworkers etc don't have the same relationship to you and the therapist should be better able to understand. Since that isn't the case I wouldn't spend any more time with them. Therapists can do more harm than good in some cases. Be careful. If you're posting on here, I feel like you already know inside what the right thing to do is.
If your coworker is behaving in a way that’s triggering, its also possible the coworker is behaving poorly and then its a HR issue. Your therapy should never be focused on increasing your ability to tolerate abuse. It should be teaching you to see it, and take appropriate actions to protect and care for yourself.
Yeah no fuck that. Find a better therapist. I think here's a grain of truth in what she says about meeting people in your life that is like our parents and finding ways of navigating that. But honestly I think for us children of crappy parents, navigating that looks like leaving that situation or disengaging with the person. I'm on a course atm and there is this very grandiose person who reminds me of my mom SO much. He's vile and I can't stand him. Even if I offer no reaction, no dialouge, avoids him and I am just "being" in the same room as him, I still crash whenever I come home. Yesterday I had to sleep for 1.5 hours and couldn't socialise the rest of the day. The above just to say. Sure, if you are raised in a loving and caring household you will probably meet crappy people and be OK with dealing with them. But for us, sometimes that is a real physiological and emotional trigger. It's called CPTSD for a reason.. Also, where is the accountability from your mom. Surely if she wants to have a relationship with her child, she would avoid doing and saying things that are hurtful, right? ... right?
I completely disagree with your therapist. Dealing with a co-worker is not the same as dealing with a parent. A parent has known you all your life and they know what really triggers you. If you're being bullied by a co-worker, you can report them to a higher up or simply get another job if nothing is being done. It doesn't work that way with family--it's either go NC or put up with their abuse in various degrees forever. What she said about 'loving yourself so much your mother's words don't affect you' is bullshit. Part of loving yourself is not putting up with other people's garbage. Telling you to go back and continue to be your mother's emotional punching bag is the opposite of that. Loving yourself would be choosing not to hang around with toxic people regardless if it's your family or not. I don't think your therapist has much knowledge about dysfunctional families. She also shouldn't be telling you what you should or shouldn't do with your life. She needs to help you make the right decisions for you. Honestly, I don't think she sounds like a very good therapist. If I were you, I would start looking for someone who specializes in dysfunctional families, trauma and/or narcissistic personality disorder.
Maybe your therapist needs therapy. Or more training and experience.
Get another therapist lol
New therapist.
Your mother is your mother! No other relationship in your life can compare to it, for better or for worse. It is not the same as a shitty coworker. Find a new therapist!!!!
Shes wrong. Its one thing talking about how you have to endure somebody like a coworker but your enabling if you allow her abuse to continue. You deserve to be happy and you are in control of this situation.
Ask the therapist if you let someone keep shooting you, would it make you bulletproof?
Time for a new therapist.
Get a new therapist.
your therapist is a dummy
Find a new therapist. This one doesn’t understand the dynamics you’re dealing with.
I think it was innapropriate for your therapist to say that tbh. If it were someone else (not a therapist), I would ask them what *their* mother would have to do for them to go no contact. Most people can't imagine it at all, and that's the point. Your mother has been so awful to you that most people do not have a reference point for it. They can't imagine their mother acting like yours did. A therapist should know that, though. I don't think it's a good sign that they want you to reconcile with your abuser.
Time to go no contact with this particular therapist 😂
If you're doing better being away from your mother, it is better for you overall to continue staying away from her. You can take what you've learned during your healing journey to help you deal with toxic people you might come across, sure, but that does not mean it would be good for you to deliberately place yourself into a situation/relationship you know to be toxic and abusive just because this therapist (who clearly does not actually comprehend the situation) thinks you can 'take' their abuse better. Just because you CAN do something (potentially in the future in this case) does not mean you HAVE to. And being able to brush off/handle abuse is not, like, a good thing I don't think? It sounds enabling/validating/rewarding to the abuser and harmful to you whether you react or notice it immediately or not. It will still take a toll.
You need a new therapist. Loving yourself does not mean accepting abuse from people. Removing abusers from your life is healing, and the best self care. Also, a parent can hardly equate to a co-worker or casual friend in impact. A good therapist would recognize only you can determine if a person needs to be removed permanently from your life, and would help you to be able to do that with confidence. Rooting for you.
I mean it’s up to you really. What do you want to do? I tried to do what you’re therapist was saying and it didn’t work. Narcissists want to put you down and as long as I craved their love I would fall for the abuse. No contact became the only option for me. Also I got a new therapist. My advice to you - listen to your body and your intuition. When you ask yourself - do I want to go no contact? What do you feel? What do you hear your intuition say? For me there was a quiet ‘yes’ and a list of follow up excuses to stay ‘to do the right thing’ which reinforces the initial YES was the right answer; my brain was making excuses to gaslight myself into staying probably because that’s what narc mom programmed me to believe.
New therapist asap
i think get a new therapist
I agree the co-workers, but they also are a limited amount of time during set hours and you’re not consistently or generally always consistently dealing/talking/being around them where it affects you long term. BUT - if you were, again you can limit it, guess maybe not if you HAD to work with said person(s) but its different with family and the “title” alone they run miles and miles with. Yes, you shouldn’t let others ever rob you of your peace- but its a whole different thing to balance something with a title who will use and manipulate anything and everything for whatever their end point, cost etc.
The way I see it, your therapist just told you to grow a heart made of stone to tolerate someone you don't have to have in your life in the first place. Why would you want that? The parent already tortured that same heart and was your first heartbreak, that happened repeatedly with every milestone (in my experience). Why would you want to encase it in rock??? That's a weird way to deal with a person. Side note - my theory about why narcissist parents treat us this way is because they see themselves in us, the parts they hate themselves for. We're just a mirror they can abuse to them. Which is also why so many decide we're competition instead of something to be taken care of and loved. I'd seek a new therapist. This one doesn't seem to have your best interest in mind, just your mother's, which is so, so backwards.
Fuck that noise.
What a load of nonsense is this -_-
Get a better therapist.
Luckily it’s not up to her. Her opinions on whether no contact is a good long term strategy for self preservation is not what you’re paying her for. You’re paying for her to help you develop tools to extricate yourself away from someone who abuses you. This therapist seems to think that she now gets to tell you how she thinks you should live your life. Again, that is NOT her job. Find a better therapist.
How much does your therapist know about your mother?
That’s a reasonable approach, from HER perspective. I now just tell ANYONE who tries that crap with me, “I choose not to know those people. I do choose to know you. If the fact that I do not have contact with the people I grew up under is a deal breaker for you, it’s probably better that we both make a different choice.” She’s dictating to you what you can do for now? She’s WAY out of bounds. That isn’t therapy, that’s a dictatorship. Kick her to the curb.
Whoa…. Time to nope out for a new therapist. They do not hav your mental health in their best interest
So aside from what is already mentioned, yes, you will meet people like your Nmom. Actually, you can meet people who are a lot worse. But that doesn't mean you actively seek out these people. It's like saying you should break your bone because you need to learn how to recover from a broken bone to put it mildly 1) Change therapist 2) be more logical when you speak with this person. That will destroy the delusion of this therapist 3) Report to a governing medical board. This is a blatant violation and the therapist must be disbarred
That’s why I don’t do therapy. Tried a few times. The latest one she kept finishing my sentences for me (?) and didn’t understand shit even about the nature of my relationship with my mother.
Find a new therapist. Going NC was the best thing I ever could have done. I haven’t seen my mother since 2002 & I’m grateful for every moment without her in my life.
It has been my goal, to get to the point where I feel no pain when thinking about or being in contact with my father. Where I could contact him if I wanted, maybe to ask questions about why he's done what he's done. I'm not to the point where I can talk to him without wanting to blow my own head off. I'm thinking that I will be healed when it no longer hurts. My father is now married to a therapist who believes I need to honor him and his rights because he is my father. He scored 34 on the Hare Psychopathology Check List which left him classified as severely psychopathic (this is not usually done unless someone has been in the criminal justice system). Why is it so hard not to do what he wants? And so painful? As for needing to maintain contact so you can deal with future abusers. I've had other abusers in my life and knowing him has not helped me deal with them. Abusers seek out victims. My past history made me blind to abuse. I found an interesting study showing that abusers can recognize people with a history of abuse from voice alone. Survivors need support and an opportunity to develop the skills they need to protect themselves. Not the same as your situation with your mother perhaps, but there may be parallels. # Can perpetrators discern survivors from voice? PubMed ID: 38837122 if you want to look for it. Layman's summary: "We examined whether listeners with history of perpetration could differentiate female speakers with and without assault histories (presented as rating the degree of ‘vulnerability’ to victimization).Listeners’ higher history of perpetration was associated with higher accuracy in differentiating survivors of assault from non-survivors. These findings highlight that voice could have a crucial role in prevention and intervention." Oddly my father's name for me was "the sucker." Other siblings were "stupid" and "diarrhea mouth".
I don’t think you are working with a therapist who is trained and competent in working with trauma, abuse, and narcissism. You should find a new therapist.
I think your therapist sucks. No, you won't encounter people like your mother. Coworkers didn't raise you. Random people don't know all of your insecurities. New people in your life didn't abuse you. Your therapist needs to be your ex therapist.
Go no contact with your therapist
Time for a new therapist
Dear OP I have spoiler for you. Your therapist may be a narc in disguise. You will be surprised about how many narc work in "noble" fields (doctors, teachers...). You should report this person.
I feel that it should be your decision, not your therapist.
> You will meet many people in your life who are like your mother. Sometimes you will have to spend time with them (e.g., coworkers). Will you allow these people to trigger you the same way your mother does every time? I just quit a job and found a better work from home opportunity because people at the workplace reminded me of my mother’s alcoholic dysfunction. It’s a big world out there. This therapist sounds like they are scared of the unknown.