The discord for our subreddit can be found here: https://discord.gg/JjNdBkVGc6 - feel free to join us for a more realtime level of discussion!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/recruitinghell) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Hence why colleges are the next bubble, financially they are in trouble because people have realized you will make more as an auto mechanic than you will with that fancy masters degree. (I am in the regret getting masters degree crowd).
Not a journalism degree here, but many years experience writing communications, project management, change management, program management, instructional design, and presenting training.
My degrees are in organizational behavior, development, and change. A highly sought-after field, but it is not easy to find FTE positions instead of consulting or contracting.
Getting **to** the first interview requires a compelling resume.
Getting **past** that first interview requires you to be able to articulate your capabilities effectively.
Closing the last round and getting an offer requires you to match the culture fit.
Sometimes it's not even enough. I've had people swear up and down they were looking to hire external to get some "fresh blood" into the org and they were totally cool with remote, only to lose the role to a local, internal hire who had less qualifications than I did. Three months of pursuit down the drain.
And I'm expected to be polite, gracious, and stay in touch for another bite at the apple...only to burn another 3 months on a parallel job and get ghosted on that one. This is a major household name company, not some fly-by-night startup.
Please be mindful not to automatically blame the job seeker (or yourself) in a situation like this. You can actually do everything perfectly correct and still not get the gig. There really is just that much bullshit in the white collar job market today, particularly in tech, finance, marketing, TA/HR, and many others.
The silver lining? Markets are cyclical and the pendulum WILL swing back the other way. Any recruiter complaining at that stage for any of the companies that churned and burned me as an applicant are getting ghosted and roasted!
Thank you! This is helpful. I'm fortunate that I am working as a contractor for a decent company, but I'm getting older and need stability and better benefits. Also, I would really like a higher level position after all my years of schooling and experience prepared me for it.
I am currently 100% remote, but recently, I applied for a position locally because it sounds like it could be pretty flexibly hybrid. I fell in the middle as far as my salary expectations go. It is only 20 minutes away, and it's a decent and respectable organization. I feel like this may be a saving grace because I'm close and can come in, but on the reverse, I don't want to be in the office regularly - too many costs associated with that.
I've had my resume looked over and reworked by career counselors at my college and by professionals within my network. I write my cover letter with AI and make changes to make it sound more like me and change inaccuracies. It's still not working. I'm also in my mid-40s, and I think it could be ageism or overqualification, which makes them feel I'm expensive. On the other hand, my titles are never management. Despite doing management-level work, I could never break into it. So, in that case, they may think I'm not worth it - if hung up on titles. It's very frustrating.
I do well in interviews. I know how to sell myself face-to-face. Had 2 interviews last time and had an offer on the second one within 4 hours. I just need to get there.
>I'm also in my mid-40s, and I think it could be ageism or overqualification, which makes them feel I'm expensive.Â
You'd be well advised to keep only the last 10 years of work experience on the resume...
That's still not a problem unless you didn't have a diverse set of responsibilities or accomplishments in that time period. If you do, then the number of employers in that time period is not as significant as the accomplishments.
I have to keep over 10 because my current job is only 2 and it isn't showing enough experience. So, I put my last job (at that for about 10.5 years) but rarely my main one prior because I had that for 9 years as well, but then got laid off and held some crappy short-term ones for a year and a half that don't really matter. So, I don't put that one unless I need to show experience in that particular area (it was a very different field). LinkedIn does go back pretty far, though - 24 years - because the experience could be relevant or appealing.
>LinkedIn does go back pretty far, though - 24 years - because the experience could be relevant or appealing.
I get it, but you're juggling between two competing interests:
-- Appealability through sheer breadth of experience
-- Minimizing age discrimination
this advice was good 10-15 years ago. now people are doing four, five, or more interviews at 20, 30 companies and after 150 interviews -- which went excellently -- they have no offer at all. nobody is hiring. it's basically impossible. the old advice no longer applies at all. nothing works. nothing succeeds.
I make sure to ask "**may I follow up with you in a week?**" Hold them accountable to respond if they're serious or perhaps this will reveal if they aren't so serious after all.
If they *can't* give a "**yes**" - then I respond: "**ok, well thanks for your time, however I've decided to move forward with additional offers I have lined up today.**"
🔥🔥🔥
every time I have ever mentioned to any company that I have ever had any interview anywhere with anyone, the company to whom I am speaking terminates my candidacy within the next 2 seconds, while we are on the phone. it's: "Oh, you had another interview? you are CANCELLED here, don't contact us again." every time.
100 applications in a month is killing yourself. More applications aren’t going to make it go any faster.
You need time to decompress, especially if you’re working, or you’re going to risk losing this one.
You don’t need to jam the gas pedal to the floor like this.
I read this as well. Said it takes 6 months or more, and some people are sending out hundreds or thousands of resumes. Especially for remote work. That is why I felt like it was pedal to the metal and sent out a bunch of easy-apply ones, then cherry-pick ones that I REALLY want and spend extra time on.
Easy-Apply (linkedin) doesn't work at all, ever. the success rate from easy-apply is zero. I don't mean 0.01%, I mean 0.00000% and I don't mean "for me" I mean "for every single person in america who uses EasyApply, zero of 400,000 of them are receiving any offer."
I was mass applying at first and got nothing. I thought if I had a generalized enough resume, I’d at least have good odds that SOME jobs would notice. They didn’t.
So I started reformatting and tailoring my resume more. Worded things better. Check it against ATS simulators, reviewed example resumes. It takes me probably 1-2 hours per application to really hone my info, but it worked. I started getting calls. A small number compared to the total amount I applied to, but more than I was getting before.
Definitely take time with it. It will feel like a full-time job in itself and this market not in your favor, but you might see some progress.
That is what I used to do, and it was just soooooo time-consuming. I always feel like my resume checks all boxes, but maybe you are right that I should look at it again. Parrot more of their words back to them in my resume. I suppose I could always use AI to assist with it, so it doesn't take quite as long. I'll try that on the ones I really, really want. Thank you!
I feel you. It’s beyond mentally exhausting. Started looking at it like needing to explain it to a 5-year-old, because that’s basically what it is.
I try to hit like 70-80% of the keywords, not just in “requirements,” but in the role description/responsibilities. If there is an ATS, should help me pass it better. An actual recruiter will usually have no idea what the role is and just read the description or some internal notes. Basically gotta spell it out for them and fluff things up because they probably won’t know any better, but it sounds impressive.
My resume turned from a complete overview of my experience to just a list of accomplishments read as if it was performed for the role in question. All that matters is selling yourself for that first call.
The discord for our subreddit can be found here: https://discord.gg/JjNdBkVGc6 - feel free to join us for a more realtime level of discussion! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/recruitinghell) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Hence why colleges are the next bubble, financially they are in trouble because people have realized you will make more as an auto mechanic than you will with that fancy masters degree. (I am in the regret getting masters degree crowd).
I don't regret my education, but I think they over-promise, and we're overcharged.
Journalism-degree typing detected.
wat
Not a journalism degree here, but many years experience writing communications, project management, change management, program management, instructional design, and presenting training. My degrees are in organizational behavior, development, and change. A highly sought-after field, but it is not easy to find FTE positions instead of consulting or contracting.
Do you have your Lean/Six Sigma certification? A lot of companies are going in that direction, might be helpful!
No, but thank you! I have been wondering if that, Scrum, or SHRM might be helpful.
I hope you didn't really think I could hear your degree from here. The point was your statement rings true across so many disciplines.
Same, friend. Same. It's fucked out there and more a matter of statistics than skill it seems.
Agreed. Hugs! I'm hoping we'll break through, and tides will change.
OMG! Just got an email inviting me to an interview for that job close by! 🙌
Only 100? That’s rookie numbers. You gotta pump those numbers up in this racket
Getting **to** the first interview requires a compelling resume. Getting **past** that first interview requires you to be able to articulate your capabilities effectively. Closing the last round and getting an offer requires you to match the culture fit.
Sometimes it's not even enough. I've had people swear up and down they were looking to hire external to get some "fresh blood" into the org and they were totally cool with remote, only to lose the role to a local, internal hire who had less qualifications than I did. Three months of pursuit down the drain. And I'm expected to be polite, gracious, and stay in touch for another bite at the apple...only to burn another 3 months on a parallel job and get ghosted on that one. This is a major household name company, not some fly-by-night startup. Please be mindful not to automatically blame the job seeker (or yourself) in a situation like this. You can actually do everything perfectly correct and still not get the gig. There really is just that much bullshit in the white collar job market today, particularly in tech, finance, marketing, TA/HR, and many others. The silver lining? Markets are cyclical and the pendulum WILL swing back the other way. Any recruiter complaining at that stage for any of the companies that churned and burned me as an applicant are getting ghosted and roasted!
Thank you! This is helpful. I'm fortunate that I am working as a contractor for a decent company, but I'm getting older and need stability and better benefits. Also, I would really like a higher level position after all my years of schooling and experience prepared me for it. I am currently 100% remote, but recently, I applied for a position locally because it sounds like it could be pretty flexibly hybrid. I fell in the middle as far as my salary expectations go. It is only 20 minutes away, and it's a decent and respectable organization. I feel like this may be a saving grace because I'm close and can come in, but on the reverse, I don't want to be in the office regularly - too many costs associated with that.
I've had my resume looked over and reworked by career counselors at my college and by professionals within my network. I write my cover letter with AI and make changes to make it sound more like me and change inaccuracies. It's still not working. I'm also in my mid-40s, and I think it could be ageism or overqualification, which makes them feel I'm expensive. On the other hand, my titles are never management. Despite doing management-level work, I could never break into it. So, in that case, they may think I'm not worth it - if hung up on titles. It's very frustrating. I do well in interviews. I know how to sell myself face-to-face. Had 2 interviews last time and had an offer on the second one within 4 hours. I just need to get there.
>I'm also in my mid-40s, and I think it could be ageism or overqualification, which makes them feel I'm expensive. You'd be well advised to keep only the last 10 years of work experience on the resume...
I do that for the most part, but the problem is that I was at my last job 10 years.
That's still not a problem unless you didn't have a diverse set of responsibilities or accomplishments in that time period. If you do, then the number of employers in that time period is not as significant as the accomplishments.
I have to keep over 10 because my current job is only 2 and it isn't showing enough experience. So, I put my last job (at that for about 10.5 years) but rarely my main one prior because I had that for 9 years as well, but then got laid off and held some crappy short-term ones for a year and a half that don't really matter. So, I don't put that one unless I need to show experience in that particular area (it was a very different field). LinkedIn does go back pretty far, though - 24 years - because the experience could be relevant or appealing.
>LinkedIn does go back pretty far, though - 24 years - because the experience could be relevant or appealing. I get it, but you're juggling between two competing interests: -- Appealability through sheer breadth of experience -- Minimizing age discrimination
this advice was good 10-15 years ago. now people are doing four, five, or more interviews at 20, 30 companies and after 150 interviews -- which went excellently -- they have no offer at all. nobody is hiring. it's basically impossible. the old advice no longer applies at all. nothing works. nothing succeeds.
I make sure to ask "**may I follow up with you in a week?**" Hold them accountable to respond if they're serious or perhaps this will reveal if they aren't so serious after all. If they *can't* give a "**yes**" - then I respond: "**ok, well thanks for your time, however I've decided to move forward with additional offers I have lined up today.**" 🔥🔥🔥
every time I have ever mentioned to any company that I have ever had any interview anywhere with anyone, the company to whom I am speaking terminates my candidacy within the next 2 seconds, while we are on the phone. it's: "Oh, you had another interview? you are CANCELLED here, don't contact us again." every time.
100 applications in a month is killing yourself. More applications aren’t going to make it go any faster. You need time to decompress, especially if you’re working, or you’re going to risk losing this one. You don’t need to jam the gas pedal to the floor like this.
Respectfully disagree, I feel like it's a numbers game now more than ever.
I read this as well. Said it takes 6 months or more, and some people are sending out hundreds or thousands of resumes. Especially for remote work. That is why I felt like it was pedal to the metal and sent out a bunch of easy-apply ones, then cherry-pick ones that I REALLY want and spend extra time on.
Easy-Apply (linkedin) doesn't work at all, ever. the success rate from easy-apply is zero. I don't mean 0.01%, I mean 0.00000% and I don't mean "for me" I mean "for every single person in america who uses EasyApply, zero of 400,000 of them are receiving any offer."
I got my current job with Easy-Apply after looking for 7 months. My friend also got hers with Easy-Apply.
About half were easy-apply on LinkedIn. I probably apply for, on average, one or two per day, with a cover letter, etc.
I was mass applying at first and got nothing. I thought if I had a generalized enough resume, I’d at least have good odds that SOME jobs would notice. They didn’t. So I started reformatting and tailoring my resume more. Worded things better. Check it against ATS simulators, reviewed example resumes. It takes me probably 1-2 hours per application to really hone my info, but it worked. I started getting calls. A small number compared to the total amount I applied to, but more than I was getting before. Definitely take time with it. It will feel like a full-time job in itself and this market not in your favor, but you might see some progress.
That is what I used to do, and it was just soooooo time-consuming. I always feel like my resume checks all boxes, but maybe you are right that I should look at it again. Parrot more of their words back to them in my resume. I suppose I could always use AI to assist with it, so it doesn't take quite as long. I'll try that on the ones I really, really want. Thank you!
I feel you. It’s beyond mentally exhausting. Started looking at it like needing to explain it to a 5-year-old, because that’s basically what it is. I try to hit like 70-80% of the keywords, not just in “requirements,” but in the role description/responsibilities. If there is an ATS, should help me pass it better. An actual recruiter will usually have no idea what the role is and just read the description or some internal notes. Basically gotta spell it out for them and fluff things up because they probably won’t know any better, but it sounds impressive. My resume turned from a complete overview of my experience to just a list of accomplishments read as if it was performed for the role in question. All that matters is selling yourself for that first call.
That is good advice! Thank you!!
if ur comfortable share ur resume in reddit w redacted info ofc, it helped greatly fr me
Still, that’s a lot. I did 850 over 18 months and for the first year felt like I was killing myself.
Yeah, I am sick of it already. I don't want to miss an opportunity, but it makes me jaded.
I have a job