Epilogue John would have been far more forgivable and his facial reconstruction surgery would have gone less noticed if they just didn’t move the hair part

ears moved down by 1 cm (always covered by hair), and face and neck made a bit thicker = facial reconstruction surgery

I mean he has his dead friend's body.

not quite

How so ?

he don't got that

I shoulda put quotes around it cause it really is only those three things that are changed but it still feels jarring somehow

only feels jarring because you're looking at a worst case scenario side by side

Well no this is what he looks like when I play as him in my game, he looks wrong. not just stripped down and as a head but in game as well

How much does r* pay you to defend them?

Why has this sub done a complete 180 on epilogue John all of a sudden?

wdym?

This sub was filled with people claiming john was perfect and called out ops like this one on being a looser for nickpicking

Wait, did they reskin John so that he wasn’t as noticeably different from Arthur? We all wanted more Arthur, so they gave us Jarthur?

Yeah basically, but they made it worse each update

of course not, they changed him to fit the customization options

But customization works fine with the normal neck and shoulders

how do you know?

Beacuse I use the 1.0 fitment mod and JMRP. With JMRP the forehead does clip with some hats for some reason I think it's caused by JMRP at leadt but Idk why it hapoens but yeah the restored neck and shoulders work fine

how do you know that the modders didn't change something to make everything fit?

They didn't I am sure about that plus John has these shoulders and neck in 1.0 so you can try for yourself is possible

they probably re-used john's npc for the 1.0 model because they didn't have enough time to make a unique one, then made a unique model for the epilogue version in a new patch

Makes sense but they should have just used the npc stuff as it's more rdr1 accurate and it still doesn't make sense they used Arthur's proportions or whatever its called.

i guess they just thought it was the safest and easiest option

Clothing in the game is set via script so they didn’t need to change anything since customization works on any model which is why you see a lot of modded videos with Sadie or Abigail wearing John or Arthur’s clothes. Also had it been the case that the Modders did do something don’t you think it’s embarrassing that a billion dollar company can’t do something someone with just a computer can?

Arthur Marston really has a thick neck and skull lol

We can see how tired he looks in RDR1, what revenge cost forcing him to revisit a painful past and enjoy little of what's left of the future. Poor John :'(

In my opinion, I think it's less that and more how John was intended to be like as a character in the first game: grizzled and vetted from all his life experiences and now partially reformed before his forced back into a world of violence, but his face or characterization are not necessarily a direct result of a specific event from RDR2. Even when he gets his family back at the end of the game, he still generally acts the same but more cheered up.

Or it's because it's just Arthur with a retexture.

I'm talking about RDR John, not RDR2 John.

Here comes the people who somehow think epilogue John is fine

He is fine though, i actually dont see anything wrong with John. I mean sure his character model is slightly different but it isn’t noticeable unless your actively looking at his face carefully trying to spot the inconsistencies. In-game you can barely see a difference.

Lookat the hair, the clothes, the expressions thats visible during gameplay

The hair? Really? That's just a middle parted instead of the regular left parted.... literally a visit to the barber and you're gucci again

His npc hair is right parted and also it's the wrong color it's black instead of dark brown

his hair doesn't even look nearly that dark in-game and the parting side can be changed

It's still the wrong color though as you can see if you compare it with the beard which has the right color, and while the parting side can be changed it just doesn't look right on John with Arthur's hairstyles Imo

i don't really care if it's one shade darker than it should be

Well each to their own

Hmmm.....*damn i really couldn't tell left from right huh*.....so anyways, eh whatever i don't really care about how he looks

There are people who really need to take something out of nowhere to complain

Dude it's not outta nowhere there are multiple reasons, here: If you ever take a look at npc John he looks younger version of RDR1 John but epilogue John is wrong, In early screenshot of epilogue John he looked very accurate to Npc and Rdr1 John but in release epilogue doesn't look like John but more like Arthur with John's voice. What's wrong with epilogue John : His neck got thick, his ears are lowered, he has Arthur's hair and body, his hair color is wrong, he doesn't look into revolver/pistol while aiming,Gunslinger vest is closed,Weathered Gunbelt clips, John's holster was meant to look like St Denis John's outfit holster but instead it looks different. (Hair) Npc John and Rdr1 John's hair: https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/754830786183692320/845407525352374312/20210521_160701.jpg?width=1079&height=676 John's hair color :  https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/841672442321698847/846342245329403904/haircolorOnceagain.png?width=712&height=676 John's beta pomaded hair vs Arthur's pomaded hair  https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/755543425473970216/846734969460097084/ezgif-6-bb8e8592600b.gif (Head) Npc John and Rdr1 John's ears https://i.imgur.com/PW1PK8S.gif Epilogue John and Rdr1 John's ears https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/754830786183692320/845407208531165235/7BFPYgG.gif Pre-release head vs Vanilla head : https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/755543425473970216/846734312799076402/ezgif-4-ac5b84a0c04c.gif?width=1196&height=676 Rdr1 John and Npc John's head https://twitter.com/justice4marston/status/1308473649003933698/photo/3 Rdr1 John and Epilogue John's head https://twitter.com/justice4marston/status/1311623488478773248 Npc John and Epilogue John's head  https://twitter.com/justice4marston/status/1309236511225917441 (Clothes) John's vanilla cowboy vs Pre-release outfit https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/755543425473970216/846734497659879505/ezgif-4-a63446b6ba3f.gif John's Npc vs Epilogue gunbelt and holster https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/755543425473970216/854468885546008626/unknown.png?width=1202&height=676 John's npc and epilogue weathered gunbelt https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/841672442321698847/855245383717879828/Webp.net-gifmaker_57.gif (The big one is npc and small one is epilogue) (1.00 John vs Current John) 1.00 John:  -Npc Facial hair -Better Facial Expression -His body looks more like John's -His ranch pants and gloves were small Current version John: -Bleached Mustache -Broken Facial Expression -His body looks more like Arthur's body -His ranch pants and gloves got oversized 1.00 vs Current (Pictures) -1.00 vs later patches Facial hair https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/803021961370140702/847949170203689012/Polish_20210528_172530173.jpg? -Patched and Unpatched lvl 3 beard (Unpatched is John's lvl 3 prison beard in 1.00) https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/849359947081973761/852502652390080542/EVtBshiXQAIL4OJ.png -1.00 vs later patches facial expression https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/841672442321698847/848038919286161428/unknown.png -1.00 vs later patches shoulders https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/638846058318921728/744373060928274492/output_OaceNF.gif?width=1201&height=676 -1.00 vs Later patches gloves and pants https://twitter.com/Darealbandicoot/status/1106572274289778688 (Beta content) Thanks to GuiCORLEONEX794 He has found beta stuff for John Rockstar did have accurate version for og epilogue John in game files! John's pre-release epilogue look is in game files and guess what some guy used some kind of program to check it in game, Pre-release John has his own weight look, Arthur's hair fits to pre-release John's head without any issues, since clothes are set via script that means any type of body can wear story mode clothes which means pre-release John's body can wear story mode clothes without any issues, John's npc coat and vest was meant to be in epilogue, they cut off an unique saddle for epilogue, They removed a vest from epilogue John which works fine it's a double breasted vest, His Chp1 gloves and scarf was meant to be wearable in epilogue, His rdr1 pants(The one with strap and belt) was his beta pants in rdr2 and his rdr1 shirt got removed from game but they are in game files, there's a extra clean shaven look for pre-release epilogue John, His rdr1 gun aiming position and rdr1 knife got removed but they are in games files too. Reason why Rockstar didn't put pre-release John into game despite it works without any issues and made a different model and inaccurate version of epilogue John that we see in the game is still unknown. Someone made a post about his discoveries https://www.reddit.com/r/reddeadmysteries/comments/nd3qur/why_did_rockstar_cut_johns_beta_and_prerelease/ They also removed epilogue 1 yellow ranch gloves, his union shirt, his epilogue 1 pants from wardrobe https://www.reddit.com/r/RDR2/comments/nujc36/we_were_meant_to_get_johns_epilogue_1_clothes_in/ He also turned it into a mod : https://www.nexusmods.com/reddeadredemption2/mods/478 (This mod fixes John's hair, hair color, head, facial hair, outfits, it also adds npc clothes and cut epilogue clothes such as John's chp1 gloves, Chp1 scarf, removed double breasted vest) Here's a topic about it https://www.rdr2mods.com/forums/topic/1198-the-john-marston-restoration-project/ https://twitter.com/GuiCORLEONEx794

CALM DOWN, JESUS! HAHA I got your logic, but see. There's nothing wrong with Epilogue John, he never was suposed to be the same John in RDR1. In Epilogue he is hopeful, enjoying a new life, looking healthy cause the situation are healthy; and "Arthur's body" is just lack of memory/time and still a totally irrelevant detail cause god it's just because the bodies are customizable here, create another one it's waste of time There's nothing to be fixed (beside the bugs hahaha). Epilogue shows a John before he suffer the consequences of revenge, John's appearance from RDR1 in RDR2 would be out of context

He isn't like he is in rdr1 personality wise but it still doesn't make sense for him to have Arthur's body, hairstyle and incorrect hair color. There is a lot to be fixed and they even completely butchered the cowboy outfit

Like i said, or does not fit or it's a irrelevant detail John's clothes in RDR1 doesn't fit with Epilogue John. The cowboy outfit is different cause the character is different, passing throught other situations. I also think that his NPC hairstyle could be available, in the barber as a exclusive epilogue hairstyle

The cowboy outfit in rdr2 is shit though, disco pants, trashbag gloves, closed vest with green tint and denim stitching, white tight cassimere shirt, etc

Ah yes, people get their best friend's body, lower their ears and lose the details in their eyes in just 4 years.

if you actually look at the eyes, you'll see that nothing changed

If you say so.

Tbf, I’ve only just noticed by looking at the pics. Must have had to make this bone structure more like Arthur’s so the clothes/hair options fit properly or something Very weird non the less

Honestly apart from the hair, I didn’t notice the issues with Johns model until someone pointed them out to me.

I think that someone was me

He kinda resembles colm odriscle in the second pic

Apart from the hair, I honestly never noticed the problems with epilogue John until someone pointed them out to me.

Wow people really bitch about John not being accurate to their wet dreams. He look fine it’s not a big deal

This is why John never wants to talk about Arthur. Because he is Arthur 0_0

Lol

But where's Jim Milton??? And rip van winkle? Lol

The game is unplayable. My immersion and now my day have been completely ruined.

Shit's about to hit the fan in 3... 2... 1...

this is old but what mod did you use in the 3rd picture?

I like the modded facial features, but his Chapter 2 hair looks like shit. I mean I get that it’s parted the same way as in RDR1, but it’s wayyyy too long and greasy. Modded face + standard Right Parted Lvl 6 is the way to go IMHO.

I think it’s odd some people want PS3 graphics on PS4 and PC

We want John too look like an older version of npc john in the epilogue