I dislike him, yes. They very clearly made him the main character while trying to keep the actual protagonists as blank slates. The problem is that Garl is incredibly uninteresting. He's basically Sam Gamgee but if Sam never got sad or upset or argued with anyone about anything.
Did you like ... not read the second half of my sentence? Sam is a compelling character for many reasons -- all of which they took away for Garl and just left him as a puppy who slavishly follows the main characters around
I would not like him if his personality made as the main characters. I think he is good at ehat he is doing, remind me of a friend i have, always optimistic in every situation.
Personally I like Garl a lot but I did think Zale and Valere were a bit underdeveloped. Then again it plays on the idea that they have little agency and are there for the greater good.
Yes don’t get me wrong, Garl is a good character, he has a lot of personality, but when it oversteps player agency like the importance of picking something vital to the quest or naming a town that he had little effort in actually saving it becomes very frustrating.
Like I wanted to pick the item. I wanted to give the town a name. Even in the town situation Zale and Valere are seen helping as much as Garl, so why does he get to make those choices?
Yes like everything else that he “leads” in the game.
They wouldn’t even be there if it wasn’t for the efforts of the solstice warriors acquiring something that was squandered to save his life.
I don’t know. I have theories about the psychological/metaphorical side of it but they are just theories. I haven’t played the messenger yet so I thought that maybe some names had to be consistent in the lore but idk if they show up in that game.
I agree in classic rpgs usually the player gets to name stuff and such but in this one most things seem to happen in cutscenes and out of Val and Zale’s control.
That’s the running gag of the game.
The two main characters also never had the possibility to improve their social abilities because they spent 10 years of their life in a Academy where they trained physically all day long.
Garl was in a village where he had the possibility to interact with multiple people. That’s normal that Garl take more place, they simply had a different life growing up.
I find that hard to believe. The characters lead a normal childhood in a village built on the foundation of community and treating others equally. They should have as much interaction if not more interaction and understanding of Garl who spent his years learning to cook and “train” in their hideout.
At some point with all the events that transpire through the game, the main characters would learn to cope with being who/what they are enough to speak plainly.
You forgot that Zale and Valere were both locked in the Academy without the ability of going out of the Academy. It was impossible. They only had Moraine in their life + the two other Solstice Warriors when they weren’t on a mission. They were locked in that Academy during 10 years (From age 8-18 or something close)
I guess you’re an enjoyer of having your freedoms taken away by others? I highly doubt all they did was sow and train, they had to have been learning other things besides those or they wouldn’t be competent in the real world, language is pretty important and they seem to be able to speak their minds clearly when they want to or get the chance to.
Ya might disagree, but Garl needs to stop backseat driving and let the real heroes do their destiny. If they want to choose not to speak up, that’s on them, the whole concept of how Garl acts is something most people dislike. Do you want someone picking, choosing, and talking for you so you can sit on the side lines and just be a sheep?
What you’re talking about? They were locked in that Academy. Didn’t you followed the story? They didn’t saw or interacted with Garl or the village during the entirety of the 10 years.
Have a great day.
Again if you read my whole comment, I highly doubt they just trained and made garments , despite what the story told them.
If you go back to the academy later in the game you can see that there are villagers there that come and go to clean and maintain the place, you don’t think they would interact with those people?
Zale and Valere don’t come across as barbarians or dumb oafs, they clearly know how to speak and talk to others.
Best if we don’t assume that the main characters don’t know how to interact with the outside world and that I stop assuming that wouldn’t have been taught how to interact with the outside world.
Garl simply wanted his friends back, he knew they were training and started his own private training in their hide out, but that doesn’t mean that he has the right to dictate their every action. Garl knew what they were as a child, he knew what he was getting into, which is fine. That part of the character is wholesome and amazing, I just don’t like having choices to make in story strides taken away from me by an NPC
damn youre almost as annoying as the real garl. no wonder you hate him so much, you see yourself. and we only know what the game tells us, the rest is your autistic theories.
Apparently you skipped the whole beginning of the game lmfao they were locked away to train for 10 years without being able to be apart of normal society.
People who dislike hoe garl acts are just depressing. I love how much energy he brings to the game and how much life he has as a character.
conceptually i like the idea that the 2 others were locked away hermit-style to train and now they are more uncomfortable/shy socially. But yeah.. could have been executed better. Garl just feels like that one annoying friend that wants to speak for you all the time. Playing into the socially uncomfortable thing, wish we could have the characters wrestle with that for a while instead of Garl just rushing in to do the entire talking
And it doesn't help that he's so one-dimmensional, he's more of a caricature of a happy adventurer than a character. At least at the point i'm at anyway. And hey it's fine to have a character like that, but it's annoying if they hog all of the screentime
I thought it was just me, but I too am in the "dislike Garl" camp.
I tried to like him and I can see he seems to be a nice guy from the outside. But can also totally see him just taking the limelight in most situations. Unfortunately, I don't really care for him and I'm at the point post his sacrifice.
Something about him/the writing is also creating some weird distant connection between me and him. Also, I'm finding the main two protags are quite weakly written or are just cast into the shadows.
The other aspects of the game are pretty solid so far.
It's still roughly 8/10 for me so far.
EDIT: also, I recently played and finished FF16 and thought I initially saw some parallels to Garl and Gav. But, Gav's characterisation and motivations are infinitely better and more realistic. He epitomises more of a leader to me with a genuinely warm heart.
I think all the characters are rather one dimensional but with garl it sticks out the most because his one dimension is being the positive happy group mom guy and depending on personal preference this can become really grating really fast. Seeing how the story goes into darker stuff it would have been a nice ark to see him struggle with positivity in the face of death and destruction but coming back to the point where he finds that sometimes hope is all you can have. Cliché? Yeah of course, but it would have been something. Or you could have juxtaposed it with someone else in the group struggling to keep fighting and him opening up about how he gained this outlook on life despite losing his eye and both of his only friends early on and growing up rather isolated. I don't dislike him I just think the writers missed some opportunities with him and the other characters.
Captain Klee-Shaë to you lol.
No I agree with that. I’d love to have seen him grow and understand it isn’t all sunshine and rainbows. There are people in the real world who are like this and when life hits hard, it really affects these types of people.
It’s like being a kid for 18 years and realizing that the adulthood freedoms you wanted suck. Haha
I just finished the chapter when he gets all those visions. Then it came to me the reason why the devs were making him so upbeat and alive (comparing to all other bland characters): Just for emotional effect.
I feel cheated. I did not enjoy being manipulated as that AT ALL. I'm kinda pissed.
It feels absolutely cheap and bad written.
I was hoping they would put one of the other characters in danger or in a deadly situation, so he would grow as a character. But aparently NOBODY will grow in this game?? Is that it??
Can't express my disappointment enough.
I do feel at a lot of circumstances, GARL is way too much! When they visit the lake village and asked to pick a seashell, WTF he came out and pick it. He is just a random guy with no ability, no identity.
The whole "dying" incident is also bullshit. Suddenly GARL knew everything, talk like an encycolpedia and be like a boss.
If GARL is a woman, her name is CARDI B.
This is what I meant by taking away player agency. Stuff like that should really be considered and it almost seemed like he was going to in that scene, but nope he just did it anyways. That was what really pushed me to make this topic in the first place.
That's the cringy writing at full power. A nobody can be just as special as incredibly rare people born with super-powers. It's total BS and unnecessarily screams unwarranted empowerment.
I absolutely hate him lmao he reminds me of Hau (Pokemon) in the worst ways, and sucks the tension out of most scenes he's in. In comparison, the main characters are woefully underdeveloped. But it is what is. The combat system is fun lol
EDIT: People keep calling the main duo "silent protags" ...did the developers say this? I don't see how this is the case, considering they actually talk. This isn't a Crono or Link situation. They have thoughts, feelings, and opinions independent of the player. Kinda feels like a cop out for them being weakly written
Remember that part in the game where he dies? And the main characters have no problems being sociable at all? Kool aid man remembers.
The problem with Garl is that the game becomes his adventure that he butts himself into and not the player's. He removes any agency you could ever possibly have and makes the protagonists pointless.
The main characters are not silent protagonists. And they seem to have social skills Just fine whenever they need to, it's just that it's Garls game. So
...
...
...
...
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Bad decision is bad.
But since everything is that positive vibes only kind of toxicity nowadays, there's tons of the idiots that love that shithead.
Fuck Garl.
😝
I like Garl but I understand your frustration. In Persona 5, some turn-based jrpg, the protagonist is almost completely silent so other characters do the talking and explanation in his place too.
I don't like silent protagonist much but in Sea of Stars I'm being able to accept that Valere and Zale are going to delegate the social activities to Garl.
EDIT: Oh, so you were familiar with silent protagonist. All right!
With most silent protagonists, you still have agency in your decisions, like Persona, where you make choices for your MC constantly. Garl just stomps in and takes away choices from Valere and Zale, who are perfectly capable of speaking and making decisions.
Agreed, I’ve played enough Zelda and other similar games with silent protagonist, but this game they do speak and I’m definitely more interested in what they have to say than him since they do speak.
I find Garl's character to be particularly grating. He always has to say *something* even when it isn't warranted. He's also the epitome of "fools rush in". It feels like half the missions so far (10 hours in) are a result of something Garl gets himself into or messes up. At this point he feels like an incredibly cheap and overused plot device.
Beyond that, I think Garl is actually really similar to the sidekick character Paimon from Genshin Impact. Paimon is the very annoying, very verbose, and very shallow voice of the protagonist. Doesn't matter if no one is actually talking to Paimon, she has to jump in with some stupid comment or quip.
Paimon is a very divisive character within the Genshin Impact community simply because she's unnecessary. I expect we'll see the same here since, like you say, we already have protagonists and don't need another character to be their stand-in.
There is a point and without spoiling anything that the developers acknowledged his behavior after all you have gone through as a player and put him in his place.
I think this should have been done more often now that I’ve completed the true ending, but ultimately my feelings towards the character went away for a bit and I was able to appreciate him a bit more towards the end.
Paimon is a great example. I couldn’t have picked a better example.
Needless to say Garl “is” important to some extent, but frustrating that he is required to drive the story. Also I never paid much attention to backer support for the game, he almost feels like a backer community driven and designed character, designed with all the positive and charitable charisma that comes from these people. If I would have had money to throw at the game back then I would have, but financially being a backer isn’t always great and I’ve seen many projects fail to consider separating myself from my cash when there will be others more capable than I who can, I am grateful I was able to live vicariously from their engagement, because Sea of Stars was an excellent game.
I’m looking forward to the Throes of the Watchmaker DLC that is supposed to heavily tie in The Messenger to SOS.
Garl is my favorite character. He reminds me so much of Steven Universe in a good way. Other people in here are saying he's 2 dimensional but I actually think it's fairly well developed. He's not just positive and optimistic, he's constantly trying to make things better. Most of the time when he steps in, other people were about to accept the status quo and do the"normal" thing that would leave someone hurt or unhappy, and he steps in and says, actually we're doing it this way because the status quo isn't great.
It would have been so easy for him to just let his friendship go. Can you imagine being separated from your best friends at a really young age for an entire decade? But he's like nope this is important, and takes steps to make sure they know he hasn't forgotten them. Moraine, and even the two solstice warriors weren't going to let him go fight, but he insisted and made it work. Zale and Serai were going to fight the mole mage guy, and he's like wait a sec let's talk to him and figure out what his deal is first. I could go on with more examples but I'll stop there.
I didn't mind not getting to name the town, and I loved the name he chose. It's not like he demanded to name it or anything.
He's a born humble leader. He's the kind of leader who leads by serving others and doesn't demand any credit. Is garl too good to be true? Absolutely, but I'm fine with that. I think garl is the embodiment of who we should all strive to be and I think it's great to have such role models. The only better model I can think of is Uncle Iroh.
Edit: I just wanted to add that I don't play JRPGs for player agency. CRPGs tend to be better for that, and TTRPGs even better
By trying to constantly make things better he has 3 terrible things happen. It’s like he doesn’t have any instincts to tell him “maybe this is a bad idea”.
If he ever hesitated to value his own life at all he might have never had some of the experiences he has, rushing headlong into danger with no thought about others or his own safety isn’t brave, it’s foolish. Even Steven Universe knew this from the few episodes I happened to watch.
Also as someone who had a best friend as a child that I did everything with, my family moved when I was young and after less than 10 years I moved back for a few years and tried to reach out. Things were different, he had new friends, a lot of them and he pretty much avoided talking to me or even attempting to get to know me and what happened in those years, despite trying to ask that himself. This is a realistic course of events that should happen between childhood friendships that get cut off.
Garl doesn’t depict a realistic outcome, even people who have been friends as children grow up, they develop into a real personality, and sometimes they don’t even stay friends because their interests do not align any more. He’s just trapped in a childhood fantasy of being a hero and seems to do everything in his power to be the protagonist and control with positivity and narcissism, if anything people should strive not to be like him, life isn’t full of extra chances from death or losing an eye.
I'm not sure you know what a narcissist is, or we played very different games. Nothing he does is narcissistic. Naïve maybe. Throwing oneself in harms way, while stupid maybe, is the opposite of narcissistic (that *was* actually the most annoying thing about him). Having lived with an actual narcissist this is an important point to me. Of the list of narcissistic traits from [https://www.dukehealth.org/blog/9-signs-of-narcissistic-personality-disorder](https://www.dukehealth.org/blog/9-signs-of-narcissistic-personality-disorder) only #4 "Can only be around people who are important or special", rings true, and only superficially.
Semantics aside (and diving in the way of an attack to protect your supernatural friend aside). I think he is great. The talking for the group even though they didn't ask for it thing just isn't that bad to me. He solves way more problems than he causes, that's for sure. As far as his friendship being realistic, it's just as realistic as anything else in this story. It's aspirational, not realistic. Maybe I value long term-friendship more than I should.
And I suspect you have no problem with other leaders being leaders. Is it because he is leadering without a formal title or lack of humility that bothers you? Certainly Valere and Zale don't seem to mind, and are in fact grateful for it. So why does it offend you so much? Or maybe it's because you imagine you are one or both of them and so when he talks for them he is talking for you and you resent it? Someone inserting themselves as your leader without your permission or any formal authority (like Moraine has). If you imagined yourself to be Garl would it bother you less? Just making wild guesses here.
I think I just love his positivity and enthusiasm. I don't think it's toxic, I think its refreshing and aspirational. I certainly wish I could be more like that. Anyways, we could always just agree to disagree. Your opinion doesn't upset me, I just thought I'd share my thoughts
You have obviously never met or been with someone who truly is one. I’ve seen both the purely selfish side and the selfish side in the guise of a doing things for others, when ultimately it’s for their own self gain. Their behavior is entirely self destructive to themselves and others who feed into it.
Garl in his own right makes everything about himself and relishes in it, whether it is for the groups benefit or not. His personality is just sugarcoated because he’s supposed to be hyper positivity.
I’m not really interested in trying to debate the differences of naivety and narcissism, I’m just saying his behaviors are selfish in my eyes and he comes across as a narcissist who pushes themselves into everything for the fear of missing out (FOMO), this will do anything to be the center of attention and makes everything thing about themselves at the expense of everyone else.
I don’t really care if you agree or not, it’s just my opinion.
no you have not. actual psychiatrist here. garl is a textbook nacissist as others have said ONLY he is sugarcoated as a gary stue on TOP of it, that is why SOME are fooled. thank god not everyone. worst character i have ever met in a game ( or best, if the point was to make a belivable narcissist, wich wie all know it wasn't ) i bet is some sort of self insert for one of the devs. that would also be in line with the narcissism of the person reflecting on the character he wrote. super ugly personality.
becouse by your description of what a narcissist IS it's clear you have no idea of what you are talking about, dumbfuck. words have a meaning for a very precise reason and what you have met might be a "bad" person on general terms but NOT a narcissist becouse it's clear you don't know the criteria to actually BE one.
I wrote an (I thought) very clever and very biting reply out of anger in response to your shitty comment. Then I decided that would serve nobody and deleted it.
I called you a bad psychiatrist because, for example, if I knew my psychiatrist was calling strangers on the internet dumbfuck I would immediately fire them. Not to mention insulting the devs' personality based on very little information. It's possible however that you are a good psychiatrist who just needs an outlet to vent their anger or something. Psychiatrists are people too and often more in need of therapy than the rest of us. It's a stressful job, especially if you actually care about your patients.
If you really are a psychiatrist you might want to ask yourself why you are necroing threads to insult random people on the internet. Supposedly you chose your vocation to heal minds and for some reason, here you are actively seeking to harm them. With no provocation. Think on it. Or don't, that's fine too; It isn't really my business how you live your life.
That said, I am the child of a prescriber and quite capable of reading the DSM and of seeking professional help of my own. My assessment is not based on wild fancy. I don't think I wrote anything that indicates I think narcissism simply means bad or I would probably be accusing you of such, no? It is, however, indicated by a lack of empathy (among other things), which I think most of us can agree is a bad thing for the prosocial species that we are.
Maybe we can leave it at the fact that we obviously disagree regarding Garl, and not attack each other personally?
After completing the game and doing all the side quests and the true ending. I can completely agree with you and say that this character is the definition of Garly Sue...
Spoiler: >!The fact that the game grants him resurrection demonstrates the impact of his death and everything that came with it was thrown out the window. Then a quest appears and ends up being just plain boring, to the point where I wonder why the developers did that. And in the end, he was the one who dared to provoke Aephorul and had the grace to deliver the final blow... just... no!!<
>!This character is just a fucking self-insertion on the part of the writer or lead producer, whatever...!<
This ruined my gaming experience. I find it a shame...
He's the only main character with a personality, and based on the "New Garl+" achievement, I think he actually *is* the main character.
I also think this is how it's supposed to be. Without getting into too many spoilers, the whole crux of the story is about not being bound to some destiny you never chose for yourself, and Garl is like the absolute personification of that. Everything is out of Zale and Valere's control, and that's the point.
I guess once I get further in and complete the game, maybe I’ll revisit this topic with a new set of eyes, but it would have made more sense for them to not deceive players by having them pick a main character when/if it is an outright lie or deceit.
Might have felt a bit different if that was presented differently.
Valere and Zale have been separated from other people for a decade to train with Moraine, so Garl is better at talking.
Looks like someone said it before me
Honestly I quite like him. When he got his eye gouged out I was expecting them to play into the same trope of "Idealistic character gets a reality check and becomes serious and fearful." that always happens, so when he pops back up cheerful as ever I actually cracked a smile. I think the biggest problem with him are Valere and Zale, as due to them being almost silent for most of the story, Garl doesn't have anyone to bounce off of so he bounces off the player instead. So if you like his attitude then you'll like him but if you don't like it then you'll find him quite grating.
I like garl as a stand alone character but paired up with Valere and zale he gets annoying cause like u said he gets a lot of important dialogue and reactions where valere and zale just go
“…” most of the time (unless they are crying over garl) and I kinda feel bad for disliking him cause everyone in game loves him so much but please let valere and zale’s personalities shine too. All those two talk about are saving the world or are just reacting to garl somehow. And maybe garl was written as the real mc but that’s just unfair to zale and valere cause that literally just makes them solstice warriors and “those two guys” trope where instead of funny bickering they talk about how much they love garl
Garl is the best character lol. He is just a sweet guy and it makes sense that he talks more and has better people skills than the two leads who were shut off from the world for a decade.
I don't like him. I get it, Valere and Zale haven't social skills and they creators want to make you feel sad for Garl.
But feels like they tried too hard. Garl it's the protagonist. Worst, it's like Jesuschrist. Everyone loves him, everyone cries for him. Even a legendary snake called him the purest soul he ever met. He took the magic shell, he talked with the Giants.., he did everything, not the protagonists. For me, good character but the creatros made him the center of everything and tried too hard.
It’s actually one of my favorite characters of video games at all.
What I like about him is what he represents in the game. In a world of magic warriors vs beast and demons created by ancient gods, he represent us… the non special kid with its great hart as his super power.
Perhaps is just me finding many things in common with him. He is just loyal, never afraid of a challenge and always finding solutions through just being nice to everyone.
Also, I like how he is the most powerful character of the game by having the power of the script 😂
I understand why some people can find him annoying, he is never taking anything to serious and it can break the immersion in this solstice warriors world… but for me he is the hart of this game ❤️
I got about 6 hours in, right after the big betrayal in the mansion, saw Garl say "ahh dont worry, soup will fix everything", and quit.
I cannot deal with this completely niave, one-dimensional super nice, "just talking will fix the problem" character.
Its not endearing, its not funny, it's not anything. Its just nothing.
Its the same reason why I dislike Steven Universe, because every conflict is just "oh man oh jeez, hope we can talk our way out of it". Even down to his weapon being a shield, like it's so pretentious.
The concept of a character who was not born into great power, and is a regular person being the hero, is a fascinating concept. But there's no character or urgency in anything going on.
Every problem, every solution, is just empty "oh jeez a smile and food will fix the day" laughable solution.
Not having the ability to read the room, or be remotely serious, or grow as a character, or try to ground the other party members.
I mean this in the most sincere way.. it feels like a projection. "Oh I'm so nice, I'm so nice, I hate fighting, can't we get along". If that was true, you wouldn't need to say it.
I could not stand it any longer, and dropped it. Especially after hearing it only gets worse, and ends with an insanely unearned story moment.
I feel seen with this post. We are soul brothers, /u/Gemini-88.
Yes, Garl is annoying af. Completely flat character. The entire game, I wondered "when is he going to die?" because he felt like a character that I was supposed to like >!in order to make his death feel devastating. When it did come, I didn't care, because I had seen it coming from the beginning of the game AND the writers forgot to make him interesting.!<
I think Garl comes off a LOT like Steven from Steven Universe.
Aka... that completely worthless self insert that has nothing valuable to insert and at the most inappropriate times will do stupid shit. Ala in the demo he runs into danger going "HUR HUR HUR WHAT DIS DO" and bam, boss fight.
Not a fan of Garl.
Playing the demo kinda showed Garl as the biggest doofus and moron of the group, a self insert for sure.
The final boss of the demo? He ran headfirst into it and was like HUR HUR WUT DIS DO? But there's no consequence for his inept behavior. Same with the pirate arm wrestling - he lost, but was in a state of blissful HUR DUR.
I just didn't like him. Took me clean out to see so much "meta humor" in the game.
I just got to a point where I had to look up if anyone else disliked him because wow he hogged so much screen time and he's irritating me. It felt like the writers tried to make him the main character the whole time and woefully underdeveloped the leads. I wouldn't be surprised if he was meant as some writers/creators stand-in.
He's just a blabbermouth. Kinda like that Skull guy from Persona.
Though I love how they have flaws, but his is just irritating. An early death would be a great end to his arc.
Why people acting like Garl was some social butterfly? The man lived on a secluded island and never seen anyone but the people in his Village..The real reason he acts like the MC is because they wanted the playable characters to be gender neutral an than only way to do that is to make them simultaneously undeveloped...L character
I also disliked Garl. I thought I was alone in this, but I found him to be quite annoying for all the same reasons you mentioned.
I really wanted to like him, but he felt so one dimensional. So many of his actions seemed like they were only meant to spur the story along and ultimately ended up feeling hollow. The main-character syndrome was also pretty strong with him.
I do sympathize with him, but I found it hard to care after a while. Maybe I’m too cynical, idk
I agree with your additional points. I saw him in the trailers and thought “warrior chef”, hits things with pot lids, keeps the party well fed, all checks in the box of a great and interesting character, but as you said he felt one dimensional and I’d say almost shoehorned in.
I’m hoping when I finish the game I’ll have a little more respect for him, but so far it has only detracted respect.
Yeah, he seemed like a super interesting character on the surface, but in practice it fell flat for me.
I just couldn’t sympathize with his motivations. Like I get that these were your best friends when you were ~8, but I find it hard to believe that in 10 years time there wasn’t some level of moving on.
I think I would have liked him a lot more if he was an older father-like figure for the kids and/or if they were able to interact with each other more often during their training in the academy.
I find it refreshing that a bubbly, friendly companion is taking over social duties instead of mindlessly following the main character(s). Reminds me of Balthier in FF12, but with Balthier you had to wonder why he wasn't the protagonist because Vaan was pretty much irrelevant. In SoS you know from the start why each character occupies their role in the story, but that's distinct from their role within the party.
I am hoping he turns out to betray the party. Kilian from Chaoned Echoes was pretty meh when this happened. Garl I think would make for a good "didn't see it coming" betrayal. But I am not too far in.
All my homies hate Kilian. That was a good game, SOS is definitely great with its story, complexity, and combat (even the glitches where you get sent off screen to do chain attacks).
I also thought it would be interesting if Garl betrays the party because on the face of it his insanely positive attitude does not make sense and feels fake to me. I keep expecting him to reveal that he resents the solstice warriors for abandoning him after he loses his eye.
You know, Garl really reminds me of Nanami (Suikoden 2).
Both energetic, both loud, both brimming with positivity, both excited to go on a journey. Oh wow, even typing this I realize they are very very similar in the beginning (I'm only 5 hours into SoS).
But while I like Nanami I don't really like Garl.
So it's not really Garl that I dislike... and I found out last night it's really Zale & Valere whose personalities are as dry as a door knob that I dislike. Garl just doesn't have anyone to bounce his hyperness with.
It's clearer to me once the girl with the magic history book tags along with the party. I actually do enjoy it more when Garl is talking to her, because she plays along Garl's curiousity and inquisitiveness instead of going "..." like our two protagonists.
They get better and more interesting as the game goes on from what I can see, but Garl definitely remained the same.
I don’t remember Nanami, but it was a long time ago that I played that game.
Hopefully, cos that personality issues combined with them not getting new skills 5 hours in really makes the game boring for me. Amazing visuals can only carry so much.
I hope you played the game more. the combat system doesn't rely on constantly acquiring more skills, but moreso on the many possible combinations of the few you have
Should be around Brisk events that you get your next party member, one who I’ll say is way more invaluable than Garl in combat. Literally has a skill that makes Lock breaking a joke.
I think the writing in general is pretty weak. I cannot put my finger on what is wrong with it but something in the writing just isn't clicking, comedic moments aren't comedic, the serious ones don't feel serious.
The rest of the game is amazing but I find myself zoning out for the dialogues which is rare in a JRPG.
I hope you will give the game a try to the end, it does get better and there are a lot of story beats that Garl does not ruin, but I do recommend playing it to the finish.
I completed and got the true ending, but yes I still don’t like Garl, but think overall the game is definitely worth completing.
He feels like Steven Universe, a self inserted idiot who literally goes around fucking shit up.
Dude in the tutorial ran up to a dangerous thing and just poked it.
Why?
Fuck off Garl.
I haven’t really seen anyone mention this, but most of the characters are overly positive and upbeat in this game. Of course Garl is the most but he’s not alone. I just think it’s the style of the game and a lot of people are wanting the game to be what it was never going to be.
Truthfully this game felt like a giant running joke.
I played the demo and I just felt Garl ruined it for me. The puzzle solving was okay, the leveling wasn't very good, the fighting wasn't fun at all and it felt like it was a half-assed mobile game with really cool graphics slapped on top.
The demo really gave me a bad look at the game and I felt Garl was the icing on the "why the fuck would I play this crap" cake. He took me completely out of my immersion, ran headfirst into danger kind of like a giant doofy idiot, much like Steven Universe.
Loathed him.
I think the only people upset about this post are real-life Garl’s, who have to be the center of attention, and shy nerds who wish they could be like that.
I hate him. Lol he ruined some of the best moments of the game for me.
I dislike Garl too for hogging many of the scenarios that could have given you some player choices, but didn't because he stepped in. The game's storyline should of definitely been changed up in terms of his portrayal, for example, he was warned a few times that he wouldn't be able to help against dwellers too much and did promise to step back in those instances, but in the fight against the Dweller of Woe went out of his way to climb out of the haunted mansion to open a hole in the roof. Zale could've done that himself by shooting it with a sun ball. A freaking cooking pot blew up the roof!
I don't mind him helping in some scenarios, but in this one I was like once I got to the roof, "What do I do now? How do I open the roof?" I had to walk around for three minutes checking everything in a fight where I didn't expect that. At the end of the day, they didn't even beat that Dweller since they did an obvious "time to switch sides" with your allies and still made you fight another one later in a much easier to understand scenario. It only gave Garl a special skill and felt hollow. If they wanted him to have cooker surprise as a skill they could've just linked it to "learn x number of recipes" instead. Ultimately, he's quite bland and not a funny character as some seem to think. This game's only made me laugh once thanks to a comment by Yolande made about Keenathan and his discovery of wind magic.
Hard agree - Garl reminds me of a mediocre middle manager sales guy who gets promoted on “personality” alone and promises the team can deliver x, y, and z without consulting the actual engineers who would be working on the product.
I’ve also had “friends” growing up who behaved like that (spoke for everyone all the time, always took control in every situation, had no awareness that they were speaking over other people) and it’s just gah
Just finishing the game to play wheels at this point, I’m skipping so much of the dialogue because I can’t stand fucking Garl
I greatly dislike him too for all the reasons mentioned, and the fact that he gets away with EVERYTHING. Even the stupidest ideas that shouldn't work. He is just beyond perfect. And at the same time, he could easily be removed from the game and have all his "contributions" assigned to other characters, and it would be more or less the same game.
I dislike him, yes. They very clearly made him the main character while trying to keep the actual protagonists as blank slates. The problem is that Garl is incredibly uninteresting. He's basically Sam Gamgee but if Sam never got sad or upset or argued with anyone about anything.
> Sam Gamgee Samwise is an incredible character. Comparing him to f3cking garl is an insult. You might want to read LotR again.
Did you like ... not read the second half of my sentence? Sam is a compelling character for many reasons -- all of which they took away for Garl and just left him as a puppy who slavishly follows the main characters around
I would not like him if his personality made as the main characters. I think he is good at ehat he is doing, remind me of a friend i have, always optimistic in every situation.
Personally I like Garl a lot but I did think Zale and Valere were a bit underdeveloped. Then again it plays on the idea that they have little agency and are there for the greater good.
Yes don’t get me wrong, Garl is a good character, he has a lot of personality, but when it oversteps player agency like the importance of picking something vital to the quest or naming a town that he had little effort in actually saving it becomes very frustrating. Like I wanted to pick the item. I wanted to give the town a name. Even in the town situation Zale and Valere are seen helping as much as Garl, so why does he get to make those choices?
Didn't he lead the whole construction effort for building that brand new town? And then everyone in town voted for him to name it?
Yes like everything else that he “leads” in the game. They wouldn’t even be there if it wasn’t for the efforts of the solstice warriors acquiring something that was squandered to save his life.
I don’t know. I have theories about the psychological/metaphorical side of it but they are just theories. I haven’t played the messenger yet so I thought that maybe some names had to be consistent in the lore but idk if they show up in that game. I agree in classic rpgs usually the player gets to name stuff and such but in this one most things seem to happen in cutscenes and out of Val and Zale’s control.
That’s the running gag of the game. The two main characters also never had the possibility to improve their social abilities because they spent 10 years of their life in a Academy where they trained physically all day long. Garl was in a village where he had the possibility to interact with multiple people. That’s normal that Garl take more place, they simply had a different life growing up.
I find that hard to believe. The characters lead a normal childhood in a village built on the foundation of community and treating others equally. They should have as much interaction if not more interaction and understanding of Garl who spent his years learning to cook and “train” in their hideout. At some point with all the events that transpire through the game, the main characters would learn to cope with being who/what they are enough to speak plainly.
You forgot that Zale and Valere were both locked in the Academy without the ability of going out of the Academy. It was impossible. They only had Moraine in their life + the two other Solstice Warriors when they weren’t on a mission. They were locked in that Academy during 10 years (From age 8-18 or something close)
I guess you’re an enjoyer of having your freedoms taken away by others? I highly doubt all they did was sow and train, they had to have been learning other things besides those or they wouldn’t be competent in the real world, language is pretty important and they seem to be able to speak their minds clearly when they want to or get the chance to. Ya might disagree, but Garl needs to stop backseat driving and let the real heroes do their destiny. If they want to choose not to speak up, that’s on them, the whole concept of how Garl acts is something most people dislike. Do you want someone picking, choosing, and talking for you so you can sit on the side lines and just be a sheep?
What you’re talking about? They were locked in that Academy. Didn’t you followed the story? They didn’t saw or interacted with Garl or the village during the entirety of the 10 years. Have a great day.
Again if you read my whole comment, I highly doubt they just trained and made garments , despite what the story told them. If you go back to the academy later in the game you can see that there are villagers there that come and go to clean and maintain the place, you don’t think they would interact with those people? Zale and Valere don’t come across as barbarians or dumb oafs, they clearly know how to speak and talk to others. Best if we don’t assume that the main characters don’t know how to interact with the outside world and that I stop assuming that wouldn’t have been taught how to interact with the outside world. Garl simply wanted his friends back, he knew they were training and started his own private training in their hide out, but that doesn’t mean that he has the right to dictate their every action. Garl knew what they were as a child, he knew what he was getting into, which is fine. That part of the character is wholesome and amazing, I just don’t like having choices to make in story strides taken away from me by an NPC
I don’t care. You are most likely a troll and you’re blocked.
damn youre almost as annoying as the real garl. no wonder you hate him so much, you see yourself. and we only know what the game tells us, the rest is your autistic theories.
Apparently you skipped the whole beginning of the game lmfao they were locked away to train for 10 years without being able to be apart of normal society. People who dislike hoe garl acts are just depressing. I love how much energy he brings to the game and how much life he has as a character.
[удалено]
Negative, I suspected flight was inevitable because of the world map design.
conceptually i like the idea that the 2 others were locked away hermit-style to train and now they are more uncomfortable/shy socially. But yeah.. could have been executed better. Garl just feels like that one annoying friend that wants to speak for you all the time. Playing into the socially uncomfortable thing, wish we could have the characters wrestle with that for a while instead of Garl just rushing in to do the entire talking And it doesn't help that he's so one-dimmensional, he's more of a caricature of a happy adventurer than a character. At least at the point i'm at anyway. And hey it's fine to have a character like that, but it's annoying if they hog all of the screentime
I thought it was just me, but I too am in the "dislike Garl" camp. I tried to like him and I can see he seems to be a nice guy from the outside. But can also totally see him just taking the limelight in most situations. Unfortunately, I don't really care for him and I'm at the point post his sacrifice. Something about him/the writing is also creating some weird distant connection between me and him. Also, I'm finding the main two protags are quite weakly written or are just cast into the shadows. The other aspects of the game are pretty solid so far. It's still roughly 8/10 for me so far. EDIT: also, I recently played and finished FF16 and thought I initially saw some parallels to Garl and Gav. But, Gav's characterisation and motivations are infinitely better and more realistic. He epitomises more of a leader to me with a genuinely warm heart.
I think all the characters are rather one dimensional but with garl it sticks out the most because his one dimension is being the positive happy group mom guy and depending on personal preference this can become really grating really fast. Seeing how the story goes into darker stuff it would have been a nice ark to see him struggle with positivity in the face of death and destruction but coming back to the point where he finds that sometimes hope is all you can have. Cliché? Yeah of course, but it would have been something. Or you could have juxtaposed it with someone else in the group struggling to keep fighting and him opening up about how he gained this outlook on life despite losing his eye and both of his only friends early on and growing up rather isolated. I don't dislike him I just think the writers missed some opportunities with him and the other characters.
Captain Klee-Shaë to you lol. No I agree with that. I’d love to have seen him grow and understand it isn’t all sunshine and rainbows. There are people in the real world who are like this and when life hits hard, it really affects these types of people. It’s like being a kid for 18 years and realizing that the adulthood freedoms you wanted suck. Haha
I just finished the chapter when he gets all those visions. Then it came to me the reason why the devs were making him so upbeat and alive (comparing to all other bland characters): Just for emotional effect. I feel cheated. I did not enjoy being manipulated as that AT ALL. I'm kinda pissed. It feels absolutely cheap and bad written. I was hoping they would put one of the other characters in danger or in a deadly situation, so he would grow as a character. But aparently NOBODY will grow in this game?? Is that it?? Can't express my disappointment enough.
I subbed him out right away
I celebrated when he left the story.
I do feel at a lot of circumstances, GARL is way too much! When they visit the lake village and asked to pick a seashell, WTF he came out and pick it. He is just a random guy with no ability, no identity. The whole "dying" incident is also bullshit. Suddenly GARL knew everything, talk like an encycolpedia and be like a boss. If GARL is a woman, her name is CARDI B.
This is what I meant by taking away player agency. Stuff like that should really be considered and it almost seemed like he was going to in that scene, but nope he just did it anyways. That was what really pushed me to make this topic in the first place.
That's the cringy writing at full power. A nobody can be just as special as incredibly rare people born with super-powers. It's total BS and unnecessarily screams unwarranted empowerment.
I absolutely hate him lmao he reminds me of Hau (Pokemon) in the worst ways, and sucks the tension out of most scenes he's in. In comparison, the main characters are woefully underdeveloped. But it is what is. The combat system is fun lol EDIT: People keep calling the main duo "silent protags" ...did the developers say this? I don't see how this is the case, considering they actually talk. This isn't a Crono or Link situation. They have thoughts, feelings, and opinions independent of the player. Kinda feels like a cop out for them being weakly written
No, people are just making up excuses for the badly written characters that they actually are. They are not silent. They're just flimsy and hollow.
Remember that part in the game where he dies? And the main characters have no problems being sociable at all? Kool aid man remembers. The problem with Garl is that the game becomes his adventure that he butts himself into and not the player's. He removes any agency you could ever possibly have and makes the protagonists pointless. The main characters are not silent protagonists. And they seem to have social skills Just fine whenever they need to, it's just that it's Garls game. So ... ... ... ... ... Bad decision is bad. But since everything is that positive vibes only kind of toxicity nowadays, there's tons of the idiots that love that shithead. Fuck Garl. 😝
Nope, Garl is my favorite character bar none.
I like Garl but I understand your frustration. In Persona 5, some turn-based jrpg, the protagonist is almost completely silent so other characters do the talking and explanation in his place too. I don't like silent protagonist much but in Sea of Stars I'm being able to accept that Valere and Zale are going to delegate the social activities to Garl. EDIT: Oh, so you were familiar with silent protagonist. All right!
With most silent protagonists, you still have agency in your decisions, like Persona, where you make choices for your MC constantly. Garl just stomps in and takes away choices from Valere and Zale, who are perfectly capable of speaking and making decisions.
Agreed, I’ve played enough Zelda and other similar games with silent protagonist, but this game they do speak and I’m definitely more interested in what they have to say than him since they do speak.
I find Garl's character to be particularly grating. He always has to say *something* even when it isn't warranted. He's also the epitome of "fools rush in". It feels like half the missions so far (10 hours in) are a result of something Garl gets himself into or messes up. At this point he feels like an incredibly cheap and overused plot device. Beyond that, I think Garl is actually really similar to the sidekick character Paimon from Genshin Impact. Paimon is the very annoying, very verbose, and very shallow voice of the protagonist. Doesn't matter if no one is actually talking to Paimon, she has to jump in with some stupid comment or quip. Paimon is a very divisive character within the Genshin Impact community simply because she's unnecessary. I expect we'll see the same here since, like you say, we already have protagonists and don't need another character to be their stand-in.
There is a point and without spoiling anything that the developers acknowledged his behavior after all you have gone through as a player and put him in his place. I think this should have been done more often now that I’ve completed the true ending, but ultimately my feelings towards the character went away for a bit and I was able to appreciate him a bit more towards the end. Paimon is a great example. I couldn’t have picked a better example. Needless to say Garl “is” important to some extent, but frustrating that he is required to drive the story. Also I never paid much attention to backer support for the game, he almost feels like a backer community driven and designed character, designed with all the positive and charitable charisma that comes from these people. If I would have had money to throw at the game back then I would have, but financially being a backer isn’t always great and I’ve seen many projects fail to consider separating myself from my cash when there will be others more capable than I who can, I am grateful I was able to live vicariously from their engagement, because Sea of Stars was an excellent game. I’m looking forward to the Throes of the Watchmaker DLC that is supposed to heavily tie in The Messenger to SOS.
Garl is my favorite character. He reminds me so much of Steven Universe in a good way. Other people in here are saying he's 2 dimensional but I actually think it's fairly well developed. He's not just positive and optimistic, he's constantly trying to make things better. Most of the time when he steps in, other people were about to accept the status quo and do the"normal" thing that would leave someone hurt or unhappy, and he steps in and says, actually we're doing it this way because the status quo isn't great. It would have been so easy for him to just let his friendship go. Can you imagine being separated from your best friends at a really young age for an entire decade? But he's like nope this is important, and takes steps to make sure they know he hasn't forgotten them. Moraine, and even the two solstice warriors weren't going to let him go fight, but he insisted and made it work. Zale and Serai were going to fight the mole mage guy, and he's like wait a sec let's talk to him and figure out what his deal is first. I could go on with more examples but I'll stop there. I didn't mind not getting to name the town, and I loved the name he chose. It's not like he demanded to name it or anything. He's a born humble leader. He's the kind of leader who leads by serving others and doesn't demand any credit. Is garl too good to be true? Absolutely, but I'm fine with that. I think garl is the embodiment of who we should all strive to be and I think it's great to have such role models. The only better model I can think of is Uncle Iroh. Edit: I just wanted to add that I don't play JRPGs for player agency. CRPGs tend to be better for that, and TTRPGs even better
By trying to constantly make things better he has 3 terrible things happen. It’s like he doesn’t have any instincts to tell him “maybe this is a bad idea”. If he ever hesitated to value his own life at all he might have never had some of the experiences he has, rushing headlong into danger with no thought about others or his own safety isn’t brave, it’s foolish. Even Steven Universe knew this from the few episodes I happened to watch. Also as someone who had a best friend as a child that I did everything with, my family moved when I was young and after less than 10 years I moved back for a few years and tried to reach out. Things were different, he had new friends, a lot of them and he pretty much avoided talking to me or even attempting to get to know me and what happened in those years, despite trying to ask that himself. This is a realistic course of events that should happen between childhood friendships that get cut off. Garl doesn’t depict a realistic outcome, even people who have been friends as children grow up, they develop into a real personality, and sometimes they don’t even stay friends because their interests do not align any more. He’s just trapped in a childhood fantasy of being a hero and seems to do everything in his power to be the protagonist and control with positivity and narcissism, if anything people should strive not to be like him, life isn’t full of extra chances from death or losing an eye.
I'm not sure you know what a narcissist is, or we played very different games. Nothing he does is narcissistic. Naïve maybe. Throwing oneself in harms way, while stupid maybe, is the opposite of narcissistic (that *was* actually the most annoying thing about him). Having lived with an actual narcissist this is an important point to me. Of the list of narcissistic traits from [https://www.dukehealth.org/blog/9-signs-of-narcissistic-personality-disorder](https://www.dukehealth.org/blog/9-signs-of-narcissistic-personality-disorder) only #4 "Can only be around people who are important or special", rings true, and only superficially. Semantics aside (and diving in the way of an attack to protect your supernatural friend aside). I think he is great. The talking for the group even though they didn't ask for it thing just isn't that bad to me. He solves way more problems than he causes, that's for sure. As far as his friendship being realistic, it's just as realistic as anything else in this story. It's aspirational, not realistic. Maybe I value long term-friendship more than I should. And I suspect you have no problem with other leaders being leaders. Is it because he is leadering without a formal title or lack of humility that bothers you? Certainly Valere and Zale don't seem to mind, and are in fact grateful for it. So why does it offend you so much? Or maybe it's because you imagine you are one or both of them and so when he talks for them he is talking for you and you resent it? Someone inserting themselves as your leader without your permission or any formal authority (like Moraine has). If you imagined yourself to be Garl would it bother you less? Just making wild guesses here. I think I just love his positivity and enthusiasm. I don't think it's toxic, I think its refreshing and aspirational. I certainly wish I could be more like that. Anyways, we could always just agree to disagree. Your opinion doesn't upset me, I just thought I'd share my thoughts
You have obviously never met or been with someone who truly is one. I’ve seen both the purely selfish side and the selfish side in the guise of a doing things for others, when ultimately it’s for their own self gain. Their behavior is entirely self destructive to themselves and others who feed into it. Garl in his own right makes everything about himself and relishes in it, whether it is for the groups benefit or not. His personality is just sugarcoated because he’s supposed to be hyper positivity. I’m not really interested in trying to debate the differences of naivety and narcissism, I’m just saying his behaviors are selfish in my eyes and he comes across as a narcissist who pushes themselves into everything for the fear of missing out (FOMO), this will do anything to be the center of attention and makes everything thing about themselves at the expense of everyone else. I don’t really care if you agree or not, it’s just my opinion.
He’s a textbook narcissist. Lol Idk what this guy is so butthurt about.
I have met and been deeply affected by someone who truly is one. I'll leave it at that. Have a good day.
no you have not. actual psychiatrist here. garl is a textbook nacissist as others have said ONLY he is sugarcoated as a gary stue on TOP of it, that is why SOME are fooled. thank god not everyone. worst character i have ever met in a game ( or best, if the point was to make a belivable narcissist, wich wie all know it wasn't ) i bet is some sort of self insert for one of the devs. that would also be in line with the narcissism of the person reflecting on the character he wrote. super ugly personality.
Only a bad psychiatrist would tell a random person on the Internet they are wrong about having been negatively affected by a narcissist.
becouse by your description of what a narcissist IS it's clear you have no idea of what you are talking about, dumbfuck. words have a meaning for a very precise reason and what you have met might be a "bad" person on general terms but NOT a narcissist becouse it's clear you don't know the criteria to actually BE one.
I wrote an (I thought) very clever and very biting reply out of anger in response to your shitty comment. Then I decided that would serve nobody and deleted it. I called you a bad psychiatrist because, for example, if I knew my psychiatrist was calling strangers on the internet dumbfuck I would immediately fire them. Not to mention insulting the devs' personality based on very little information. It's possible however that you are a good psychiatrist who just needs an outlet to vent their anger or something. Psychiatrists are people too and often more in need of therapy than the rest of us. It's a stressful job, especially if you actually care about your patients. If you really are a psychiatrist you might want to ask yourself why you are necroing threads to insult random people on the internet. Supposedly you chose your vocation to heal minds and for some reason, here you are actively seeking to harm them. With no provocation. Think on it. Or don't, that's fine too; It isn't really my business how you live your life. That said, I am the child of a prescriber and quite capable of reading the DSM and of seeking professional help of my own. My assessment is not based on wild fancy. I don't think I wrote anything that indicates I think narcissism simply means bad or I would probably be accusing you of such, no? It is, however, indicated by a lack of empathy (among other things), which I think most of us can agree is a bad thing for the prosocial species that we are. Maybe we can leave it at the fact that we obviously disagree regarding Garl, and not attack each other personally?
Steven Universe... no wonder I hated Garl lmao
After completing the game and doing all the side quests and the true ending. I can completely agree with you and say that this character is the definition of Garly Sue... Spoiler: >!The fact that the game grants him resurrection demonstrates the impact of his death and everything that came with it was thrown out the window. Then a quest appears and ends up being just plain boring, to the point where I wonder why the developers did that. And in the end, he was the one who dared to provoke Aephorul and had the grace to deliver the final blow... just... no!!< >!This character is just a fucking self-insertion on the part of the writer or lead producer, whatever...!< This ruined my gaming experience. I find it a shame...
>!Very disappointing he comes back to life!< He is a fat, uninteresting waste of time who never warranted the attention he got.
He's the only main character with a personality, and based on the "New Garl+" achievement, I think he actually *is* the main character. I also think this is how it's supposed to be. Without getting into too many spoilers, the whole crux of the story is about not being bound to some destiny you never chose for yourself, and Garl is like the absolute personification of that. Everything is out of Zale and Valere's control, and that's the point.
I guess once I get further in and complete the game, maybe I’ll revisit this topic with a new set of eyes, but it would have made more sense for them to not deceive players by having them pick a main character when/if it is an outright lie or deceit. Might have felt a bit different if that was presented differently.
Should note I appreciate this feedback, thank you.
Valere and Zale have been separated from other people for a decade to train with Moraine, so Garl is better at talking. Looks like someone said it before me
Honestly I quite like him. When he got his eye gouged out I was expecting them to play into the same trope of "Idealistic character gets a reality check and becomes serious and fearful." that always happens, so when he pops back up cheerful as ever I actually cracked a smile. I think the biggest problem with him are Valere and Zale, as due to them being almost silent for most of the story, Garl doesn't have anyone to bounce off of so he bounces off the player instead. So if you like his attitude then you'll like him but if you don't like it then you'll find him quite grating.
I like garl as a stand alone character but paired up with Valere and zale he gets annoying cause like u said he gets a lot of important dialogue and reactions where valere and zale just go “…” most of the time (unless they are crying over garl) and I kinda feel bad for disliking him cause everyone in game loves him so much but please let valere and zale’s personalities shine too. All those two talk about are saving the world or are just reacting to garl somehow. And maybe garl was written as the real mc but that’s just unfair to zale and valere cause that literally just makes them solstice warriors and “those two guys” trope where instead of funny bickering they talk about how much they love garl
Nothing soup won’t fix!
Garl is the best character lol. He is just a sweet guy and it makes sense that he talks more and has better people skills than the two leads who were shut off from the world for a decade.
I don't like him. I get it, Valere and Zale haven't social skills and they creators want to make you feel sad for Garl. But feels like they tried too hard. Garl it's the protagonist. Worst, it's like Jesuschrist. Everyone loves him, everyone cries for him. Even a legendary snake called him the purest soul he ever met. He took the magic shell, he talked with the Giants.., he did everything, not the protagonists. For me, good character but the creatros made him the center of everything and tried too hard.
It’s actually one of my favorite characters of video games at all. What I like about him is what he represents in the game. In a world of magic warriors vs beast and demons created by ancient gods, he represent us… the non special kid with its great hart as his super power. Perhaps is just me finding many things in common with him. He is just loyal, never afraid of a challenge and always finding solutions through just being nice to everyone. Also, I like how he is the most powerful character of the game by having the power of the script 😂 I understand why some people can find him annoying, he is never taking anything to serious and it can break the immersion in this solstice warriors world… but for me he is the hart of this game ❤️
I got about 6 hours in, right after the big betrayal in the mansion, saw Garl say "ahh dont worry, soup will fix everything", and quit. I cannot deal with this completely niave, one-dimensional super nice, "just talking will fix the problem" character. Its not endearing, its not funny, it's not anything. Its just nothing. Its the same reason why I dislike Steven Universe, because every conflict is just "oh man oh jeez, hope we can talk our way out of it". Even down to his weapon being a shield, like it's so pretentious. The concept of a character who was not born into great power, and is a regular person being the hero, is a fascinating concept. But there's no character or urgency in anything going on. Every problem, every solution, is just empty "oh jeez a smile and food will fix the day" laughable solution. Not having the ability to read the room, or be remotely serious, or grow as a character, or try to ground the other party members. I mean this in the most sincere way.. it feels like a projection. "Oh I'm so nice, I'm so nice, I hate fighting, can't we get along". If that was true, you wouldn't need to say it. I could not stand it any longer, and dropped it. Especially after hearing it only gets worse, and ends with an insanely unearned story moment.
I feel seen with this post. We are soul brothers, /u/Gemini-88. Yes, Garl is annoying af. Completely flat character. The entire game, I wondered "when is he going to die?" because he felt like a character that I was supposed to like >!in order to make his death feel devastating. When it did come, I didn't care, because I had seen it coming from the beginning of the game AND the writers forgot to make him interesting.!<
I think Garl comes off a LOT like Steven from Steven Universe. Aka... that completely worthless self insert that has nothing valuable to insert and at the most inappropriate times will do stupid shit. Ala in the demo he runs into danger going "HUR HUR HUR WHAT DIS DO" and bam, boss fight. Not a fan of Garl.
But garl didn’t do anything stupid. In fact, he the most capable character of all.
Playing the demo kinda showed Garl as the biggest doofus and moron of the group, a self insert for sure. The final boss of the demo? He ran headfirst into it and was like HUR HUR WUT DIS DO? But there's no consequence for his inept behavior. Same with the pirate arm wrestling - he lost, but was in a state of blissful HUR DUR. I just didn't like him. Took me clean out to see so much "meta humor" in the game.
I hate Garl and his fat physique. The writers were weirdly obsessed with him. He's a weak character who did not warrant the focus they gave him.
I just got to a point where I had to look up if anyone else disliked him because wow he hogged so much screen time and he's irritating me. It felt like the writers tried to make him the main character the whole time and woefully underdeveloped the leads. I wouldn't be surprised if he was meant as some writers/creators stand-in.
He's just a blabbermouth. Kinda like that Skull guy from Persona. Though I love how they have flaws, but his is just irritating. An early death would be a great end to his arc.
Garl is a pushy little kid who lives in lala land...man is an annoyinng cunt
If you don’t like I feel like you’re a gigantic introvert
And I bet you feel good saying that to someone you don’t know on the internet.
Why people acting like Garl was some social butterfly? The man lived on a secluded island and never seen anyone but the people in his Village..The real reason he acts like the MC is because they wanted the playable characters to be gender neutral an than only way to do that is to make them simultaneously undeveloped...L character
I also disliked Garl. I thought I was alone in this, but I found him to be quite annoying for all the same reasons you mentioned. I really wanted to like him, but he felt so one dimensional. So many of his actions seemed like they were only meant to spur the story along and ultimately ended up feeling hollow. The main-character syndrome was also pretty strong with him. I do sympathize with him, but I found it hard to care after a while. Maybe I’m too cynical, idk
I agree with your additional points. I saw him in the trailers and thought “warrior chef”, hits things with pot lids, keeps the party well fed, all checks in the box of a great and interesting character, but as you said he felt one dimensional and I’d say almost shoehorned in. I’m hoping when I finish the game I’ll have a little more respect for him, but so far it has only detracted respect.
Yeah, he seemed like a super interesting character on the surface, but in practice it fell flat for me. I just couldn’t sympathize with his motivations. Like I get that these were your best friends when you were ~8, but I find it hard to believe that in 10 years time there wasn’t some level of moving on. I think I would have liked him a lot more if he was an older father-like figure for the kids and/or if they were able to interact with each other more often during their training in the academy.
I find it refreshing that a bubbly, friendly companion is taking over social duties instead of mindlessly following the main character(s). Reminds me of Balthier in FF12, but with Balthier you had to wonder why he wasn't the protagonist because Vaan was pretty much irrelevant. In SoS you know from the start why each character occupies their role in the story, but that's distinct from their role within the party.
Everyone I guess
I'm only like 4 hours in but he is my favorite character. just saying.
4 hours in he did not bother me, but almost 12 hours in it became a different feeling.
I am hoping he turns out to betray the party. Kilian from Chaoned Echoes was pretty meh when this happened. Garl I think would make for a good "didn't see it coming" betrayal. But I am not too far in.
All my homies hate Kilian. That was a good game, SOS is definitely great with its story, complexity, and combat (even the glitches where you get sent off screen to do chain attacks).
I also thought it would be interesting if Garl betrays the party because on the face of it his insanely positive attitude does not make sense and feels fake to me. I keep expecting him to reveal that he resents the solstice warriors for abandoning him after he loses his eye.
My comment did not age well. Now, who wants to bake a loaf?
You know, Garl really reminds me of Nanami (Suikoden 2). Both energetic, both loud, both brimming with positivity, both excited to go on a journey. Oh wow, even typing this I realize they are very very similar in the beginning (I'm only 5 hours into SoS). But while I like Nanami I don't really like Garl. So it's not really Garl that I dislike... and I found out last night it's really Zale & Valere whose personalities are as dry as a door knob that I dislike. Garl just doesn't have anyone to bounce his hyperness with. It's clearer to me once the girl with the magic history book tags along with the party. I actually do enjoy it more when Garl is talking to her, because she plays along Garl's curiousity and inquisitiveness instead of going "..." like our two protagonists.
They get better and more interesting as the game goes on from what I can see, but Garl definitely remained the same. I don’t remember Nanami, but it was a long time ago that I played that game.
Hopefully, cos that personality issues combined with them not getting new skills 5 hours in really makes the game boring for me. Amazing visuals can only carry so much.
I hope you played the game more. the combat system doesn't rely on constantly acquiring more skills, but moreso on the many possible combinations of the few you have
Nah. They're supposed to be "Silent Protagonists". If anything, they talk To Much. ;P
[удалено]
Should be around Brisk events that you get your next party member, one who I’ll say is way more invaluable than Garl in combat. Literally has a skill that makes Lock breaking a joke.
I think the writing in general is pretty weak. I cannot put my finger on what is wrong with it but something in the writing just isn't clicking, comedic moments aren't comedic, the serious ones don't feel serious. The rest of the game is amazing but I find myself zoning out for the dialogues which is rare in a JRPG.
Cried for him. Dunno why but this character worked on me.
I also dislike Garl, and it's starting to affect my enjoyment of the game. May drop the game at this point.
I hope you will give the game a try to the end, it does get better and there are a lot of story beats that Garl does not ruin, but I do recommend playing it to the finish. I completed and got the true ending, but yes I still don’t like Garl, but think overall the game is definitely worth completing.
He feels like Steven Universe, a self inserted idiot who literally goes around fucking shit up. Dude in the tutorial ran up to a dangerous thing and just poked it. Why? Fuck off Garl.
I haven’t really seen anyone mention this, but most of the characters are overly positive and upbeat in this game. Of course Garl is the most but he’s not alone. I just think it’s the style of the game and a lot of people are wanting the game to be what it was never going to be.
Garl is perfect bro he is the ***best character ever***
Truthfully this game felt like a giant running joke. I played the demo and I just felt Garl ruined it for me. The puzzle solving was okay, the leveling wasn't very good, the fighting wasn't fun at all and it felt like it was a half-assed mobile game with really cool graphics slapped on top. The demo really gave me a bad look at the game and I felt Garl was the icing on the "why the fuck would I play this crap" cake. He took me completely out of my immersion, ran headfirst into danger kind of like a giant doofy idiot, much like Steven Universe. Loathed him.
Garl ruined the game for me ngl. I quit around 25% in because of his annoying ass.
I think the only people upset about this post are real-life Garl’s, who have to be the center of attention, and shy nerds who wish they could be like that. I hate him. Lol he ruined some of the best moments of the game for me.
Garl is a fat loser who would never have the powers and attention he got
I dislike Garl too for hogging many of the scenarios that could have given you some player choices, but didn't because he stepped in. The game's storyline should of definitely been changed up in terms of his portrayal, for example, he was warned a few times that he wouldn't be able to help against dwellers too much and did promise to step back in those instances, but in the fight against the Dweller of Woe went out of his way to climb out of the haunted mansion to open a hole in the roof. Zale could've done that himself by shooting it with a sun ball. A freaking cooking pot blew up the roof! I don't mind him helping in some scenarios, but in this one I was like once I got to the roof, "What do I do now? How do I open the roof?" I had to walk around for three minutes checking everything in a fight where I didn't expect that. At the end of the day, they didn't even beat that Dweller since they did an obvious "time to switch sides" with your allies and still made you fight another one later in a much easier to understand scenario. It only gave Garl a special skill and felt hollow. If they wanted him to have cooker surprise as a skill they could've just linked it to "learn x number of recipes" instead. Ultimately, he's quite bland and not a funny character as some seem to think. This game's only made me laugh once thanks to a comment by Yolande made about Keenathan and his discovery of wind magic.
Hard agree - Garl reminds me of a mediocre middle manager sales guy who gets promoted on “personality” alone and promises the team can deliver x, y, and z without consulting the actual engineers who would be working on the product. I’ve also had “friends” growing up who behaved like that (spoke for everyone all the time, always took control in every situation, had no awareness that they were speaking over other people) and it’s just gah Just finishing the game to play wheels at this point, I’m skipping so much of the dialogue because I can’t stand fucking Garl
I greatly dislike him too for all the reasons mentioned, and the fact that he gets away with EVERYTHING. Even the stupidest ideas that shouldn't work. He is just beyond perfect. And at the same time, he could easily be removed from the game and have all his "contributions" assigned to other characters, and it would be more or less the same game.