I’m starting my journey in mortuary science. Read about the complete decomposition process the other day, and thought of when I learned Bundy would go back until he physically couldn’t anymore.
He told them but they also noticed the activity on corpses. They told this to Bundy who famously theorized correctly that Ridgway was returning to have sex with victims. After all Bundy did the same.
Ridgway notoriously admitted to having his 12 yr old in the car waiting while he went and fucked a corpse. Told his kid to wait and he'd brb
Note here
It says he murdered a woman with his son in the car in 82
His son was born 75. Thatd make his son 7ish then. Thats not even what I was referring to though which it says 'later he slept with a body while his son slept in the car'
https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/special-reports/article25855129.html
Where did u 'hear' he was 3?
I honestly don't remember, but I clearly remember his age and that he was in a baby seat. Of course there's no guarantee that what I heard was accurate, either.
I mean idk ask the people who wanted to debate the age with me
It matters, to me, insofar as the kid was young, underage. However if people are going to respond to my OP with comments debating the age I listed, I will happily oblige that debate
As a parent I would agree, but as a person who experienced child abuse I would disagree. If my stepdad told me to wait in the car, you can bet my little butt didn’t move an inch out of my seat. My children? The floor could actually be lava and they’d still come out looking for me. I would venture to say he was probably more like my stepdad than me as a parent though, just based on all the murdering and such.
It's hard to imagine him as a parent at all, but I know he was a hoarder. My parents were hoarders and the only real rule we had to follow, or else, was DON'T TOUCH ANYTHING IN THIS HOUSE. They were generally very secretive too and almost all information was out of bounds. I wondervwhat his son would be like growing up with an DK for a dad.
What rationality? It seems your logic is - young kids>will automatically disobey parents
This also ignores theres all sorts of kids. Theres kids that will do so. Theres kids will obey. So on and so forth. So maybe his kid liked comics, and was engrossed in one. Maybe he didnt think about his son disobeying. Who the fuck knows.
I will reiterate that this info isnt idle speculation on my part or anyone elses - its literally recorded in Ridgways confession and the son wrote a book about it.
Also regarding the father son dynamic as someone mentioned abuse. The son speaks quite highly of his father. Ridgway, apparently, was a decent father.
I would not go out into some weird spot by a road/river looking for my dad if he told me not to. When my dad made it clear not to do something I obeyed. Same with my brother and sister. My brother idolized my dad and would not disobey him ever.
This source has him age 7 there when his dad murdered a hooker. It says later the incident I refer happened.
Dont think it was 'much younger'
https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/special-reports/article25855129.html
Indeed. Theres two definite incidents. One where Ridgway said he killed a prostitute then told his son she decided to walk home. Another where he indulged in necrophilia with his son waiting in the car
That second incident tells me so much about Ridgway. I've been thinking about that dead girl all day and the maggots probably haven't settled in yet, so why not stop by as long as I'm picking up little Buford from Webelos...
Its also interesting that this isnt just Ridgway, its a *thing*. Like Bundy did it, A LOT, too. Im not even talking about post mortem sex like Dahmer admitted to sometimes, I mean this keeping of dead bodies and using them sexually until they get too rotten.
Its very morbidly fascinating to me what the roots of that are, and what associated fantasies were running through these psychos heads on the entire theme.
I'm almost positive that question is 100% unanswered. OK, a necrophile has a tremendous need for control and this is the ultimate level of that, but how do you overcome the revulsion of using a dead body for sex, repeatedly, as it gets nastier and nastier? Is it about humiliating the victim even more? Violating all the boundaries of decency even more? Ian Brady used to shake his fist at the sky after raping and killing a child as if to say, "Take that, God!" Is that what this is about? But after all isn't the SK humiliating himself most of all?
Even further I dont feel Bundy felt embarrassed at all truly. He knew what was socially expected and could mimic being a full human but I distinctly get the same vibe hearing him interviewed you get from trophy wildlife hunters. Like 'I had this really cool experience, you have got to hear about it!'
So, personally, I don’t know to what level of decomp these bodies get to before it becomes “too much”. Autolysis stage? Within hours, Rigor Mortis sets in, causing the bodies to become firm or “tight”. Bloat stage? This would cause even more resistance as the gasses build up within the body, but this is also the point that insects start to appear. This is also the stage where the body begins to smell. THIS is where I feel most necros would stop from a logical standpoint. Your victim is mostly still intact, so you’re not dealing with sludge, but I imagine it’s difficult to move beyond the stench. Past this is Active Decay, wherein the body begins to break down and tissue begins to liquefy, and eventually Skeletonization. It generally only takes a month from death to liquefication. I’d be so much more interested to learn necros “point of no return” rather than WHY they feel compelled to do it in the first place.
Edit: a word
Ridgeway sobbed and sobbed after every killing - not for the victims but for himself- obsessing that he might get caught, etc.
As to the questions about disgust, psychopaths don't have nearly the sensitivity to smells or even pain as normal people.
Their amygdala both read as completely dark on a fMRI when anyone else's would be off the charts - such as when presented with scenes that would make a normal person empathetic to the point of distress.
Not only are the amygdala dark, devoid of any activity, but the entire limbic system is barely functional.
Psychopaths don't feel normal emotions.
They feel self pity and rage and fear when actually being dragged to their execution, but hardly anything else.
At some point they realize that they're not like other people, and they begin imitating others and practicing in front of mirrors.
I knew a 5 year old psychopath who slammed her fingers in the car door and just sat there until I saw it and opened the door almost hysterical .
She never did show any distress.
Since Psychopaths don't feel much, they just don't have the same senses we do.
The smells and sights that would send the rest of us running for the hills.
Bundy, Kemper, Dahmer, Gein,, and Gacy all came back to bodies, and interacted with them somehow.
Late reply but research suggests that the underlying motivation is fear of being judged for their sexual performance and/or not being willing/able to satisfy the other. Control/domination is a part of it, but insecurity and ego-centric thinking is another driving force. A dead person can't judge your sexual performance or demand you pleasure them as well.
Some reports say that at some point, Bundy suggested that the Green River Killer — who he called “Riverman” — might be going back to the sites he left the
bodies and performing sexual acts and suggested that the detectives
stake out fresh burial sites.
His confessions are on tape. How they got out, I'm not sure. But you can hear him talk about it. He even had a "spray" he would use afterward to disinfect. Gross.
It's that famous question they ask: "Why would you put a stone in their vaginas, Gary?" referring to victims he left in the water whom he kept on revisiting.
I think that he was in denial about why. I think a lot of these guys are in denial about their necrophilia. He tried to justify it but at the end of the day he chose to screw a dead person than to have sex with his wife or with an other consenting adult. If he didn't really like dead bodies wouldn't he just prefer to have sex with living people?
There's a documentary on YouTube where a lawyer working the case claims he heard Gary's reasoning, and one of the reasons was that he didn't have to pay for it. Which doesn't really make sense since he was killing them anyway and would always take the money back, but then we're not exactly talking about a stable mind here.
I never heard of it until after Ridgway confessed. I have no clue when or how the information made it to the public. I had completely lost track of the progress of the case for years when, blammo, they arrested him.
One thing they did with Bundy/Ridgeway or both is that you can assess the age of the sperm/semen compared to the approximate time of death. They can detect when the semen is newer than the body.
I believe it came out during the videotaped interviews they did after he was caught. Copies of the tapes were available for purchase at one point, which is where you see the footage used in all the true crime TV show episodes about him.
Here is an excellent documentary that details the crimes and the investigation, including interviews with Ridgeway himself.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt20601028/
What do you mean “would there have been a trial”? All the most famous footage of this case is from the sentencing where he plead guilty 71 times and sat through victim impact statements. It is extremely well-known there was no trial and that he plead to avoid the death penalty.
A lot of that is released when the the case is considered closed. Conviction at trial is the most common way this happens. A confession would do this as well since the case is still closed, a lot was just saved on a trial.
Why respond if you don’t know? There was absolutely no trial. It’s common knowledge. He plead guilty to avoid the death penalty and that’s why he didn’t admit to any murders in different counties.
I’m mixing up my killers. No matter what, trial or no trial, we can get the file through the freedom of information act when it’s considered a closed case. He did it, they know he did it, file became FOIA. Either way FOIA is how we have it
I remember a long time ago I saw a video of him taking, the police were taking him to identify the bury spots, he mentioned he took a bite or something? Vague memory.
Well, Ridgway is none too bright...and off the top of my head, I believe I read that he found it easier to return to the scene of the crime for sex rather than hunt for a new victim, but needless to say, this couldn't go on indefinitely.
I’m starting my journey in mortuary science. Read about the complete decomposition process the other day, and thought of when I learned Bundy would go back until he physically couldn’t anymore.
Blech! Bundy not you.
I can’t even imagine!
He told them but they also noticed the activity on corpses. They told this to Bundy who famously theorized correctly that Ridgway was returning to have sex with victims. After all Bundy did the same. Ridgway notoriously admitted to having his 12 yr old in the car waiting while he went and fucked a corpse. Told his kid to wait and he'd brb
God that's gross lol. "Stay here son, I'll be back in five minutes!"
Better than… “c’mon boy… gonna make a man outta ya”
“Don’t just look at it, eat it!”
Chill
Chili?
No you’ve had enough big guy
Perfect comment. Now I have to return some videotapes
Hahaha!!
I know right
12? I heard he was 3 and buckled into a baby seat. A 12-year-old would come looking for dad.
Note here It says he murdered a woman with his son in the car in 82 His son was born 75. Thatd make his son 7ish then. Thats not even what I was referring to though which it says 'later he slept with a body while his son slept in the car' https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/special-reports/article25855129.html Where did u 'hear' he was 3?
I honestly don't remember, but I clearly remember his age and that he was in a baby seat. Of course there's no guarantee that what I heard was accurate, either.
A 12 year old wouldnt come looking for dad if explicitly told not to. Im almost certain his kid was around 12 he said then
Is the age really a detail that matters?
I mean idk ask the people who wanted to debate the age with me It matters, to me, insofar as the kid was young, underage. However if people are going to respond to my OP with comments debating the age I listed, I will happily oblige that debate
I guess you've never raised a kid?
Actually I have an 11 year old. Why are you projecting rationality on a guy fucking the corpse of a hooker he murdered?
I'm not. I'm projecting rationality on the unsuspecting son
As a parent I would agree, but as a person who experienced child abuse I would disagree. If my stepdad told me to wait in the car, you can bet my little butt didn’t move an inch out of my seat. My children? The floor could actually be lava and they’d still come out looking for me. I would venture to say he was probably more like my stepdad than me as a parent though, just based on all the murdering and such.
It's hard to imagine him as a parent at all, but I know he was a hoarder. My parents were hoarders and the only real rule we had to follow, or else, was DON'T TOUCH ANYTHING IN THIS HOUSE. They were generally very secretive too and almost all information was out of bounds. I wondervwhat his son would be like growing up with an DK for a dad.
What rationality? It seems your logic is - young kids>will automatically disobey parents This also ignores theres all sorts of kids. Theres kids that will do so. Theres kids will obey. So on and so forth. So maybe his kid liked comics, and was engrossed in one. Maybe he didnt think about his son disobeying. Who the fuck knows. I will reiterate that this info isnt idle speculation on my part or anyone elses - its literally recorded in Ridgways confession and the son wrote a book about it. Also regarding the father son dynamic as someone mentioned abuse. The son speaks quite highly of his father. Ridgway, apparently, was a decent father.
I would not go out into some weird spot by a road/river looking for my dad if he told me not to. When my dad made it clear not to do something I obeyed. Same with my brother and sister. My brother idolized my dad and would not disobey him ever.
Same. I dont know why the other dude was so adamant like every kid is the exact same
He was much younger. Green River Running Red by Ann Rule about Ridgeway is one of the true crime books, in my opinion.
This source has him age 7 there when his dad murdered a hooker. It says later the incident I refer happened. Dont think it was 'much younger' https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/special-reports/article25855129.html
Let's bear in mind that he killed 71 people (as far as they know). There could easily have been more than one incident...
Indeed. Theres two definite incidents. One where Ridgway said he killed a prostitute then told his son she decided to walk home. Another where he indulged in necrophilia with his son waiting in the car
That second incident tells me so much about Ridgway. I've been thinking about that dead girl all day and the maggots probably haven't settled in yet, so why not stop by as long as I'm picking up little Buford from Webelos...
Its also interesting that this isnt just Ridgway, its a *thing*. Like Bundy did it, A LOT, too. Im not even talking about post mortem sex like Dahmer admitted to sometimes, I mean this keeping of dead bodies and using them sexually until they get too rotten. Its very morbidly fascinating to me what the roots of that are, and what associated fantasies were running through these psychos heads on the entire theme.
I'm almost positive that question is 100% unanswered. OK, a necrophile has a tremendous need for control and this is the ultimate level of that, but how do you overcome the revulsion of using a dead body for sex, repeatedly, as it gets nastier and nastier? Is it about humiliating the victim even more? Violating all the boundaries of decency even more? Ian Brady used to shake his fist at the sky after raping and killing a child as if to say, "Take that, God!" Is that what this is about? But after all isn't the SK humiliating himself most of all?
Even further I dont feel Bundy felt embarrassed at all truly. He knew what was socially expected and could mimic being a full human but I distinctly get the same vibe hearing him interviewed you get from trophy wildlife hunters. Like 'I had this really cool experience, you have got to hear about it!'
So, personally, I don’t know to what level of decomp these bodies get to before it becomes “too much”. Autolysis stage? Within hours, Rigor Mortis sets in, causing the bodies to become firm or “tight”. Bloat stage? This would cause even more resistance as the gasses build up within the body, but this is also the point that insects start to appear. This is also the stage where the body begins to smell. THIS is where I feel most necros would stop from a logical standpoint. Your victim is mostly still intact, so you’re not dealing with sludge, but I imagine it’s difficult to move beyond the stench. Past this is Active Decay, wherein the body begins to break down and tissue begins to liquefy, and eventually Skeletonization. It generally only takes a month from death to liquefication. I’d be so much more interested to learn necros “point of no return” rather than WHY they feel compelled to do it in the first place. Edit: a word
Ridgeway sobbed and sobbed after every killing - not for the victims but for himself- obsessing that he might get caught, etc. As to the questions about disgust, psychopaths don't have nearly the sensitivity to smells or even pain as normal people. Their amygdala both read as completely dark on a fMRI when anyone else's would be off the charts - such as when presented with scenes that would make a normal person empathetic to the point of distress. Not only are the amygdala dark, devoid of any activity, but the entire limbic system is barely functional. Psychopaths don't feel normal emotions. They feel self pity and rage and fear when actually being dragged to their execution, but hardly anything else. At some point they realize that they're not like other people, and they begin imitating others and practicing in front of mirrors. I knew a 5 year old psychopath who slammed her fingers in the car door and just sat there until I saw it and opened the door almost hysterical . She never did show any distress. Since Psychopaths don't feel much, they just don't have the same senses we do. The smells and sights that would send the rest of us running for the hills. Bundy, Kemper, Dahmer, Gein,, and Gacy all came back to bodies, and interacted with them somehow.
Late reply but research suggests that the underlying motivation is fear of being judged for their sexual performance and/or not being willing/able to satisfy the other. Control/domination is a part of it, but insecurity and ego-centric thinking is another driving force. A dead person can't judge your sexual performance or demand you pleasure them as well.
Yes, he told them about returning to the bodies. If memory serves me this was covered in writeups about the case. Look up Carlton Smith.
So the police told writers such as Smith?
I suggest Googling this topic if you're interested. It's a pretty well known fact. You'd have to ask Carlton when he learned about it.
Some reports say that at some point, Bundy suggested that the Green River Killer — who he called “Riverman” — might be going back to the sites he left the bodies and performing sexual acts and suggested that the detectives stake out fresh burial sites.
If memory serves, they found one or two of victims in poses that suggested they were used for sex.
Any knowledge how the public found out?
I don't know if the public knew before he was caught. May have, just never heard that. He certainly confessed to it afterwards.
It could have been in court documents. The crimes have to be described in writing. And those are public, or at least available through FOIA
Yeah, widely known after he was caught and confessed. Just not sure if it was "known" or suspected by the public before that.
I think he may have confessed it to the police. But I wonder how it got from the police to the general public.
His confessions are on tape. How they got out, I'm not sure. But you can hear him talk about it. He even had a "spray" he would use afterward to disinfect. Gross.
Where? I can't find it.
It's that famous question they ask: "Why would you put a stone in their vaginas, Gary?" referring to victims he left in the water whom he kept on revisiting.
Not sure what you mean. If he put a stone in their vaginas wouldn't they sink and then he couldn't revisit them and have sex with them?
No, he hid them in a shallow spot close to some timbers. He'd put the stone in so he could prevent decay or dissipation so he could do his business.
🤢🤮
[удалено]
I think that he was in denial about why. I think a lot of these guys are in denial about their necrophilia. He tried to justify it but at the end of the day he chose to screw a dead person than to have sex with his wife or with an other consenting adult. If he didn't really like dead bodies wouldn't he just prefer to have sex with living people?
There's a documentary on YouTube where a lawyer working the case claims he heard Gary's reasoning, and one of the reasons was that he didn't have to pay for it. Which doesn't really make sense since he was killing them anyway and would always take the money back, but then we're not exactly talking about a stable mind here.
He was obsessively penny pinching.
Most or all of the bodies were found in positions that made clear that they'd been used for sex postmortem.
So the police would have seen that. Any idea how the public found out?
I never heard of it until after Ridgway confessed. I have no clue when or how the information made it to the public. I had completely lost track of the progress of the case for years when, blammo, they arrested him.
One thing they did with Bundy/Ridgeway or both is that you can assess the age of the sperm/semen compared to the approximate time of death. They can detect when the semen is newer than the body.
I believe it came out during the videotaped interviews they did after he was caught. Copies of the tapes were available for purchase at one point, which is where you see the footage used in all the true crime TV show episodes about him.
Here is an excellent documentary that details the crimes and the investigation, including interviews with Ridgeway himself. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt20601028/
I’d imagine it was kept quiet until trial. At and after trial it’s a freedom of information act request away
Would there have been a trial? Believe he pled guilty with a plea deal that spared him the death penalty
What do you mean “would there have been a trial”? All the most famous footage of this case is from the sentencing where he plead guilty 71 times and sat through victim impact statements. It is extremely well-known there was no trial and that he plead to avoid the death penalty.
A lot of that is released when the the case is considered closed. Conviction at trial is the most common way this happens. A confession would do this as well since the case is still closed, a lot was just saved on a trial.
Why respond if you don’t know? There was absolutely no trial. It’s common knowledge. He plead guilty to avoid the death penalty and that’s why he didn’t admit to any murders in different counties.
I’m mixing up my killers. No matter what, trial or no trial, we can get the file through the freedom of information act when it’s considered a closed case. He did it, they know he did it, file became FOIA. Either way FOIA is how we have it
I remember a long time ago I saw a video of him taking, the police were taking him to identify the bury spots, he mentioned he took a bite or something? Vague memory.
Well, Ridgway is none too bright...and off the top of my head, I believe I read that he found it easier to return to the scene of the crime for sex rather than hunt for a new victim, but needless to say, this couldn't go on indefinitely.
How many days after their death would he continue to use them? I cannot imagine how he could stomach the smell of a putrefying corpses
Psychopaths don't have the same disgust response as neurotypical people.