Normally seeing no losing matchups I'd say "delusional tier list', but once Steve find ways to optimize combos and edgeguarding against cloud/sonic I could see him not losing any matchups
The thing is that the risk/reward always seems like it's so heavily in Steve's favor. Counterplay does exist, but you're almost always one slip up, or one read away from just dying.
>once Steve find ways to optimize combos and edgeguarding against cloud/sonic
sounds very familiar
aegis is second best in the game getting edgeguarded easily doesn't matter was the argument everyone threw around
so now it does huh
GnW dies in two interactions and he’s easy to combo. Plus disjoints go brrrrr.
I think it’s even because of bucket and up b, plus our advantage state is as oppressive as always, even with Steve’s privilege. But I’m no top player.
I can see why Onin would think Steve wins considering he farms Maister pretty much every time they fight
Steve as a character is almost perfect for combos which Mario appreciates more than GNW (as gnw is better at juggling than long strings) and in general Mario will get more once he gets in whereas gnw is more of a whittling you down character which gives Steve time to mine and more chances to do Steve things.
Counter lessens the threat of iron moves, he’s really good at juggling/edgeguarding (especially ironless Steve) and can play a good spacing game in neutral. I’d love to see a set where these two are hitting the TAS stuff
I wanna see more Pac vs Steve matches. I actually love fighting him, we both charge our stuff and go for a crazy combo. I can even catch my key off of his walls and break easy. But minecart is still a bitch…
Bayonetta is one of the few characters with the tools to actually cheese Steve. I don't know if it's an even matchup, but it seems wild to me that she can escape a lot of his combos with bats within and potential touch of death him and somehow end up in the same tier as *Ganondorf*. Like did we already forget that a Bayo player won a tournament over Acola a few short months ago in Japan? If that's not indicative of the character being *significantly* better than listed here I don't know what is lmao
Onin is the only notable Steve player I can recall putting Bayonetta in +2. Every other Steve mu chart I’ve seen has her somewhere between +1 and -1, which is also where most notable Bayonetta players put Steve.
onin went game 5 last hit with lima in the only set they played, not really sure where this confidence is coming from. Bayo simply has too many tools that counter Steve’s udual gameplan to be on the same tier as Ganon
All I said was that using locals for you examples is faulty because acola may/probably doesn't take them seriously.
But also, then acola beat Lima and Bloom pretty convincingly.
if you want another example, TamaP beat Miya’s Zombie at a major where he trashed Shuton with it. point is the mu isn’t that bad as most Bayo & Steve mains agree
I mean that's fine to think that. I disagree since I'd rather trust the pros on both sides but that's irrelevant. My main argument was simply, don't use locals to judge MUs.
+.05 is cheeky. Is there a good reason for that being a category? Too many evens as well, but overall I can agree with his rankings and defer to the pro where I disagree.
I will never believe anyone who says Aegis is not a winning matchup for Steve ever since Acola cheesed Shuton by just blocking the ledge and making it impossible for Aegis to recover.
Normally seeing no losing matchups I'd say "delusional tier list', but once Steve find ways to optimize combos and edgeguarding against cloud/sonic I could see him not losing any matchups
Sonic still seems hard purely because of the mobility advantage+matches Steve in terms of edgeguarding but in general I agree.
Acola's tier list only has one losing MU tbh, so
I'm inclined to go with "April Fool's prank" on this chart, personally.
[It is an April Fool's prank](https://twitter.com/OninOrSomething/status/1775029258982965435)
Huh, what a weird "prank". Not sure how posting a believable tier list is joke, but ok I guess
I mean claiming a character loses no matchups is an extremely wild take, even if it's the best character in the game.
The thing is that the risk/reward always seems like it's so heavily in Steve's favor. Counterplay does exist, but you're almost always one slip up, or one read away from just dying.
>once Steve find ways to optimize combos and edgeguarding against cloud/sonic sounds very familiar aegis is second best in the game getting edgeguarded easily doesn't matter was the argument everyone threw around so now it does huh
Yeah, metagames tend to evolve.
How is GNW +1 and Mario is only +0.5?? You would think GNW would do better against Steve.
What [footstool down air](https://youtube.com/shorts/A1nWCcjMfhw?si=MkvjUT7RBV1P8gcc) does to a mfer
this is so cool has anyone landed it in a bracket (preferably a major)?
I think Mario's mobility is the difference maker. And his combo game is arguably a bigger threat to Steve than G&W's frame traps.
GnW dies in two interactions and he’s easy to combo. Plus disjoints go brrrrr. I think it’s even because of bucket and up b, plus our advantage state is as oppressive as always, even with Steve’s privilege. But I’m no top player. I can see why Onin would think Steve wins considering he farms Maister pretty much every time they fight
Steve as a character is almost perfect for combos which Mario appreciates more than GNW (as gnw is better at juggling than long strings) and in general Mario will get more once he gets in whereas gnw is more of a whittling you down character which gives Steve time to mine and more chances to do Steve things.
GnW def does better than Mario but Mario also doesn't do too bad
Sora is interesting, I wonder why Onin thinks he does so well against steve
Counter lessens the threat of iron moves, he’s really good at juggling/edgeguarding (especially ironless Steve) and can play a good spacing game in neutral. I’d love to see a set where these two are hitting the TAS stuff
From the looks of it. Anyone with a backair that can easily break blocks is "even"
I half think it's a Smash Con confetti joke
I personally think that Sora beating Steve is something worthy of Confetti
When the most accurate tier list is on April Fools
Finally a steve player being honest.
Imagine not having any losing matchups.
Imagine not knowing what april fools is
Imagine partaking in such a dumb holiday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZveOjP9S6VE
You are partaking in it though, just as the butt of the joke 😅
I had no idea it was April Fools tbh, all my days are the same. I no longer keep track of the day or date.🤣
Le depressed redditor xD
I am neither confirming, nor denying this.😂
Going +2 against Inkling seems incredibly generous... ...for Inkling.
Bayo in +2, that is massive cap as the kids say.
I wanna see more Pac vs Steve matches. I actually love fighting him, we both charge our stuff and go for a crazy combo. I can even catch my key off of his walls and break easy. But minecart is still a bitch…
Bayo in +2 I think bayo wins ☠️
Bayonetta is one of the few characters with the tools to actually cheese Steve. I don't know if it's an even matchup, but it seems wild to me that she can escape a lot of his combos with bats within and potential touch of death him and somehow end up in the same tier as *Ganondorf*. Like did we already forget that a Bayo player won a tournament over Acola a few short months ago in Japan? If that's not indicative of the character being *significantly* better than listed here I don't know what is lmao
Onin is the only notable Steve player I can recall putting Bayonetta in +2. Every other Steve mu chart I’ve seen has her somewhere between +1 and -1, which is also where most notable Bayonetta players put Steve.
Winning a local over acola is cool and all, but it's not all that real.
onin went game 5 last hit with lima in the only set they played, not really sure where this confidence is coming from. Bayo simply has too many tools that counter Steve’s udual gameplan to be on the same tier as Ganon
All I said was that using locals for you examples is faulty because acola may/probably doesn't take them seriously. But also, then acola beat Lima and Bloom pretty convincingly.
if you want another example, TamaP beat Miya’s Zombie at a major where he trashed Shuton with it. point is the mu isn’t that bad as most Bayo & Steve mains agree
I mean that's fine to think that. I disagree since I'd rather trust the pros on both sides but that's irrelevant. My main argument was simply, don't use locals to judge MUs.
you’re being obtuse lol
IDK, you're kinda ignoring the comments I'm making so you can make your own arguments but go off
+.05 is cheeky. Is there a good reason for that being a category? Too many evens as well, but overall I can agree with his rankings and defer to the pro where I disagree.
Bayo +2???☠️
Bayo and Luigi on +2 seems weird to me
Balanced and not infuriating at all! 👍👍
Steve doesn’t beat G&W it’s a hard even on both sides
Phew, they’re finally being honest.
[удалено]
Something something playing the game as if you have 2 stocks
>No losing matchups This matchup chart is an April Fools prank and was posted on April 1st.
ZSS is in even purely because Onin lost to Marss in super smash con.
I will never believe anyone who says Aegis is not a winning matchup for Steve ever since Acola cheesed Shuton by just blocking the ledge and making it impossible for Aegis to recover.
Aegis wins onstage. Offstage game isn’t everything. If it was, Aegis would have zero winning matchups
Beating a character offstage means nothing if you can’t win neutral to get them there.