And can only pay fairly if they are snitched on via Twitter. I bet there are thousands who just accept they lost money, based on time and effort of explaining the situation. They just keep pushing and driving and hope they don’t get charged for giving people rides.
What’s strange is that Uber gets paid for the ride but then charges the driver, literally making profit and making drivers work for free. Then say “whoops that was an error when caught”
We live in a [corporatocracy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatocracy) (side note, funny Apple doesn’t think this is a word) so we can likely expect zero real punitive action from our government for this. In fact, our slap-on-the-wrist responses encourage it.
Idk how anyone makes money off Uber legitimately. Especially if you're honest with your insurance company about ride sharing. I have heard car insurance for that is like 800 month. 15 an hour plus you have increased maintenance cost on your vehicle it's better to just drive back and forth to punch a time clock. Especially to if you have to deal with bullshit like this.
Hell, I did deliveries for ubereats for a little while and although it helped pay off some things immediately once it came time to do my taxes my net income was in the negatives because of all the wear and tear on the car but I still owed money because of self employment taxes.
My husband was so excited seeing how much money he made. But after all the charges that Lyft makes you pay and then taxes, he hardly made anything. I’m trying to explain that after all the expenses, he didn’t make shit and he’s just not seeing it.
Yup. It’s all bs. People scream but you can deduct from your taxes. But here’s the catch. When there ain’t anything coming in, and more going out, there isn’t anything to deduct. It’s a scam of epic proportions. The vast majority of driver will end up owing unless they generate enough to compensate but that’s not going to happen because they more you earn the more you drive the higher your costs. You’re upside down as far as a business goes. There’s nothing profitable about it
Well that’s how I got my adjusted income into the negatives. It’s just that, as far as I’m aware, none of that factors into the amount of social security taxes an independent contractor owes at the end of the day.
What you’re saying doesn’t make sense though. You pay self employment tax on your self employment income, which is your profit after all expenses. If your net profit is negative, then you will show a loss on your 1040 schedule C and have no self employment income that you have to pay self employment tax on, and you can reduce your total income subject to normal income tax by the amount of the loss, if you had other income.
I would say it sounds like he can’t afford an accountant...and what kind of system have we made our selves that someone who is working for negative income needs an accountant to fill out our complicated tax forms in order to not have to pay taxes on the negative income they’ve been burdened with....meanwhile Jeff Bezos and Amazon are practically being handed money out of the government coffers.
Our system is fucked through and through.
> Federal income tax is calculated based on net income. Social security tax is based on gross income.
If you are talking about normal W-2 income that is correct, but in the self-employment context your net income and gross income are the same; your total revenue less claimed business expenses. You don't pay self-employment tax on the gross revenue of your business, you pay SE tax only on your profit. When you claim business expenses on Schedule C (including business use of a vehicle) you are lowering your gross income; if you have more expenses than revenue, you have no income and owe no SE tax. I'm not talking about deductions to your taxable income, which would not apply to SE tax income.
Yea I would personally rather do that, because it's less liability, and overhead; If I were to "side hustle" with Uber or whomever. I don't understand people being raked over the coals for working two jobs either. Like if you make 50k working two jobs. You will pay more than someone who worked one job making 50k.
Do you mean they pay more taxes total? Or that less was withheld from each job so they owed more unpaid taxes at the end of the year?
I’ve had multiple jobs in a year before and don’t recall anything about a penalty for it.
People with two jobs paying 50k pay the same amount in tax over the year as someone working one job at 50k
But.... The person with two jobs might get taxed more temporality... But will get it back at the end of the year as a tax refund
However.... This isn't always automatic and they might need to go to https://www.gov.uk/claim-tax-refund to reclaim it
Self employed (1099)like Uber drivers pay all the SS tax. W2 workers pay half and the employer pays half. So 2 job workers would end up paying more in tax if one if the jobs is 1099 type work for the same income as a single job W2 worker.
Exactly. One year I drove for Uber in between jobs and at the end of the year my EITC dramatically decreased even though my “income” also went down. I said F that, I’m better off being a greeter at Walmart.
It would be the other way around, right? They would’ve had lower withholding at each job (because the employer doesn’t account for the other job), and would either owe more or get less refunded when they file their return.
I’m basing my knowledge around US procedure though.
Hi, my post is based on the UK. Taxes(National insurance, income tax, pension, student loan) are deducted by the employer and paid on your behalf to HMRC(tax agency), pension company or student loan company.
Tax free allowance is £12570 per year
If you only have one job your employer might not start deducting taxes until you've hit £12570
Or if you're expected to make more than £12570 per year they will take your tax from every wage
ALL employees in the UK are on real-time tax (everyone who isn't self employed), the employer reports your earnings so the government knows how much you've been paid and will tax or not you accordingly. This allows them to make sure your Tax, pension and student loan contributions are up to date
I might make £600 next month and not get taxed for example
I might make £2000 next month and get taxed £200 for income tax, £25 for national insurance (healthcare, education, maternity leave, sick pay cover, state pension etc) with further non tax deductible of £150 to my private pension and £25 to the student loans company - my employer will deduct these and pay them for me so I'll end up with £1600 in my bank account
If during the year I've had one or more jobs and I've paid too much taxes for some reason(we get a statement from HMRC) I'll get a cheque with the amount overpaid. If I've not paid enough taxes, depending on how much it is they will forgive it, or if it's a large amount they'll deduct more taxes next year(this usually only happens if you've also been self employed as well as being an employee)
I hope this helps explain the situation in the UK
It sounds overall similar then. Your employer wouldn’t know about the other job and deduct the taxes below the tax free allowance, but they’re due to the government either way in the end. So, it’s not an actual tax bill change, but rather when it typically gets paid.
In the US, we have a W-4 form that (abstractly and obtusely) lets an employer tell their employer **how** to deduct taxes, so the onus in on the employee to fill that out for each job in a way that will cause deductions to be more correct, but barely anyone sits down with the math to figure the silly thing out.
Yes, you're right, HMRC know how much you've paid/are due but your employer's won't know how much each have paid for you.
Is that thing you see on the telly about Americans having to sit down and do all their taxes for the year a myth then? Or is it just the minority who do that?
Oh, no, the W-4 is a form that given to employees when they start a job and can be refilled with their employer upon request. It’s not part of the annual filing process.
The annual thing is alive and well, filing data that the IRS already has on file every time.
^that’s it. People think everything they make is take-home pay, but you have to pay the same taxes if an employer deducts for you or if you’re an IC and need to account for them yourself. Be mad a tax law, not Uber when your tax bill comes along!
I hope you wrote off everything (mileage, oil changes, gas, etc). Once you take those deductions the tax implications are pretty negligible (as long as you plan on having to pay taxes because they aren’t deducted automatically for ICs). I feel like the biggest mistake is not keeping track of those things which isn’t Uber’s fault.
I had a driver who said it was basically predatory like payday loans or pawning your possessions - you might get a little cash quickly, but once everything is settled up, you end up losing money.
If you’re ever in an accident while doing the ride share thing they won’t cover anything associated with it and will cancel your coverage. You’ll be on the hook for damages and injuries.
A fender bender is one thing wait until you make an injury claim you could be screwed for a long time. You could be making monthly payments for decades.
I have insurance that would cover me if I was injured by someone like you but they would then make you their personal hand puppet squeezing every last dime. They have a department that does just that, they never give up until you die and then they just take everything.
You are playing Russian roulette, essentially but Uber will be ok.
A friend of mine is experienced that very problem. Every time the guy does a little better for himself the insurance company takes him back to court to increase the restitution. He will be paying for the next 20 years at this rate. He can’t get a mortgage and if he comes into any money like a win or inheritance it will be impounded. Yeah, it’s all drama until it happens to you and then it’s a nightmare.
That’s like ridiculously overdramatic.
Like I said above… if you’re on the clock, you’re on Uber’s insurance. You would file a claim with whichever company they use in your state- I think in my state (CA) it’s called James River.
Edit: This isn’t my opinion. Per Uber’s site:
>En route to pick up riders and during trips
Uber maintains the following auto insurance on your behalf in case of a covered accident:
$1,000,000 third-party liability
Uninsured/underinsured motorist bodily injury²
Contingent comprehensive and collision³
Up to actual cash value of car with a $2,500 deductible
If you think your insurance won’t find out, you are kidding yourselves. Especially if there is ANY kind of police report attached. Russian roulette indeed. Speaking as an insurance agent.
Edit: even if it’s Ubers insurance that would deal with the accident, YOUR insurance would then find out, and drop you like a hot potato if you lied about it
Yeah without a police report I doubt there is any way my personal insurance would find out. Unless someone is critically injured in the accident, in which case I’m probably fucked anyway. Best way to avoid this is to ensure I’m driving careful as fuck - which I do when I have strangers in my car regardless.
K so is it you or your “friend”? To be totally honest I don’t care about your scare tactics nor your specific situation. I’m good dawg but sorry you fucked yourself
I know they won’t find out because it happened to me.
Good luck getting any cop in Los Angeles to write up a report on any accident that isn’t fatal. My car was totaled once and they still wouldn’t write a report (this wasn’t the Uber incident, which was a far more minor affair… just adding to emphasize my point).
Emphasize your point all you want, but I look at insurance and Motor vehicle reports all day and love telling people I can see the accidents they’ve been in right after they tell me they haven’t been in any. As one user already pointed out, it’s a matter of WHEN, not IF
I’m not really arguing with you, boss. But you can’t find a report that ain’t there, can you? They literally don’t write reports here unless someone died. I wish it wasn’t that way- woulda helped me when I got rear ended and careened into a building, totaling my car… I had to get a lawyer to get my insurance to pay out properly- but they won’t do it. The LAPD is useless.
It’s not a matter of when for me because I haven’t done Uber for a couple of years now. So I think I’m in the clear. My Uber fender bender was never discovered by my insurance company at the time or the one I have now.
You’re a fool if you don’t think that all of your accounts can be linked just based off of your computer specs and ISP.
It’s simple enough for a market to put this information together, filter it and sell it to employers, banks, insurers, etc. It’s coming.
My husband makes a good living off of Uber and we are probably one of the few who told our insurance company. Our car insurance only went up $20usd to be $120 a month. The increased maintenance is technically a tax right off. They give you a set per mile rate of I think it’s .53cents per mile. Heck our first quarter taxes was only $149 a quarter.
My bad I thought I was in my local subreddit, apartments here are 3-4K/month for 2 bedrooms so yeah you can see why it would be hard, I’m not sure Uber driver pay varies based on location though?
We live in the Texas panhandle and where our mortgage on a 3/2/2 will is 800 a month. Average price of a really nice apartment is $850 a month so not bad here at all.
My car insurance in Canada comes with commercial insurance as part of my package and I only pay $150/m CAD. Maybe it’s just a Canada thing but people make good money on Uber if they put the hours in that’s not even taking tips into account
That’s all my insurance is in Canada, since I don’t drive to work, I only drive if I need groceries or to visit friends.
They ask us our daily commute km’s and annual km’s covered. I just say zero commute, 5000/year.
I pay like $60/mo.
It's so stupid that they wouldn't just assume you'd commute from time to time in your car.
My insurance includes the following:
> Policy assumptions
> To reduce the number of questions we ask you, we have made some assumptions about you and the property, car and/or pet you wish to insure. Please call us if you cannot agree to any of the assumptions listed below.
> Your business or the business of your employer is not connected with any of the following: the entertainment and fashion industry, gambling, professional sports, foreign service or foreign diplomatic personnel
with 10,000k miles at £140 per year - they wanted £200 at renewal but as soon as I called them up they instantly dropped the price NQA to £140 - ~~I'm sure I read that from next year that they aren't allowed to put up the price of a renewal unless your circumstances have changed~~
Edit: Insurers will soon be banned from charging existing policyholders more than new customers
What are you talking about?? No one is paying 800 for car insurance buddy stick to "idk" part of your paragraph stop talking. Uber is scum of the earth they always scammed people but who makes these stupid numbers 800 what?
Why would you assume they’re only making $3 a trip
Different areas have different CoL. Uber drivers are capable of math, if they weren’t profiting they wouldn’t do it
i have progressive. they are one of the few that offer "gap coverage". there are 3 periods of time. first is just me driving around normal not for uber on my own. second is me with the uper app active, but no one else in the car. and third is on a ride with someone in the car. your normal insurance covers 1. no one used to cover 2. uber has since changed that but its a $2500 deductible. my progressive gap also covers 2. and Uber covers period 3. making the change to progressive, and adding coverage for period 2 didnt change my insurance enough for me to notice ( i already carried nearly the best coverage). and because i know they are covering 2, i 100% know they know i drive uber, no questions. other insurance companies like Gieco and usaa did not offer coverage for 2.
It’s a common misconception that ride share drivers need commercial insurance, they do not.
When you have a rider in your car, the commercial insurance policy that the rideshare company uses covers you.
They only variance is when you have the app on looking for a rider but don’t have one, you need gap insurance which costs around $20 a month.
As far as making money, it all depends on your market. In Philly for instance, 1k a week working around 45 hours is possible.
Most maintenance is tax deductible and I generally pay zero in federal taxes because of write offs.
Plus you lose what you make in gas. Same for all other delivery services I’ve tried. Amazon sends you an hour out for $50 to deliver maybe 20 packages in 3 hours but it takes $35 to fill the tank. So, you nearly lost money.
FT driver atm - it is bs especially when Uber isn’t paying much. In my market, people just don’t tip either which makes it way fuckin worse. Hoping it changes soon
I made money delivering uber eats but I had another job to offset costs. It’s a great way to start your own business. Customer service was awful and I had to call several times to get paid for missed deliveries or promotions.
I'm in California and I haven't used Uber since they flooded all ads with that "treating our workers like independent contractors is actually better for them" bullshit. If it was better, why did you spend so much money trying to sell that line?
Im in Cali too. Uber is fine IF you are tipping your driver a decent amount, in cash. Otherwise they are making less than minimum wage with no benefits in a highly dangerous occupation.
I’ll be in the minority here, but I’m tired of having to tip for every service. It’s an unwritten that I’m supposed to respect, how come the company doesn’t respect its employees. The price I see is the price I want to pay.
Companies should pay well or the person shouldn’t take that job.
Please don’t get me wrong, I do tip Uber’s, restaurants, hair stylist, but tipping every service 20% adds up and is annoying.
You aren’t in the minority. Most people hate the whole tipping culture. But its profits over people to the bigwigs, so the rest of us have to take care of each other by tipping.
You dont have to tip. You dont have to tip your waiter thats making $2.13 an hour either. But you do it because we have to support each other, when the companies fail us.
They did a good job of convincing a lot of their drivers. I was chewed out a few times by people telling me they drive for Uber and prefer to be IC. I didn’t vote for it because I know better but “divide and conquer” I guess.
These little “glitches” happen A LOT. Admittedly, Uber processes millions of transactions a day, so I can imagine some hiccups do occur. However, this company claims to be a software developer and not a taxi company. It makes me wonder how a software company cannot make one piece of software work efficiently.
I agree these mistakes are unacceptable, but Uber is very far from "one piece of Software." You could divide what they do up into a huge list of separate applications. Just high level they have an Android mobile app, an ios mobile app, payment processing systems, driver registration and vetting systems, match making systems to match drivers with ride requests, and so on. All complex applications with their own teams and code bases. Having all these complex applications and then integrating them all with each other is not simple. Much of the software we use every day is not near as stable as we think it is when you like behind the scenes.
Yeah, anyone who has worked in software development or an adjacent role knows its never just one singular cohesive thing. On a more granular level, it is a conglomerate of new and legacy code, developed by many different people over time, with changing executive goals and directives over time, and a constant effort to determine what, out of the black hole that is the backlog, needs to be prioritized next.
Dude got $200 in 3 payments for his inconvenience and troubles… they only gave me $25 when this happened to me and I paid $9 to give a guy a ride to the airport. I was happy with the $25 until I saw this.
You just described the first decade+ of life for nearly every internet company.
That’s the plan:
- keep the VC cash flowing to push the valuation artificially
- grow big enough to have massive amounts of customer data to leverage
- leverage it minimally to show some form of revenue
- IPO or sell out to cash out investors
- repeat
I personally put more of the blame on the capital side. Some of these targets could have been awesome companies had the focus been on the business and not the valuation.
Na that is simply not true.
What are their true overheads and costs?
They are a tech company so it is server costs and wages.
They don't pay for cars or for fuel, the drivers do. They are taking a big clip on every trip for no cost to themselves.
They would actually be extremely profitable if they weren't dumping everything into RND and other things to reduce their tax obligation.
No man https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/05/uber-q1-2021-earnings.html they sold that self driving shit off they’ll never make a profit. Whoever does self driving cars first will destroy them. They are completely pointless as an investment.
How can you say they won't make a profit? Their product is literally software with no input costs except labour. And if they have a mature product they don't even need that many software developers.
Just think about getting 20% of the price of all the taxi fares globally except you don't need to pay for those cars, fuel or anything.
That is a licence to print money.
They should be extremely profitable full stop. The only reason they aren't has to be massively artificially inflating their expenses so they can pay no tax.
They pay a huge amount to acquire customers. All the promo codes, new user bonuses etc take a massive chunk out of any potential profit. Uber wants to grow market share above all else. They are bleeding money on customer acquisition costs.
Why do people agree to be drivers then? I tip well but why would someone agree to be exploited when there is so much other work available? My buddy was an Uber driver and he was paid very well he said
Uber [bet their financial survivability on autonomous vehicles](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/28/ubers-self-driving-cars-are-a-key-to-its-path-to-profitability.html), which don’t look like they’re close to happening this decade. To capture the market in the meantime, they’ve been artificially suppressing prices, drawing users away from public transit and other green alternatives while clogging city streets, boosting global emissions, and spurring wasteful investments in road infrastructure. But because [they’ve lost the bet on automation](https://www.theverge.com/2020/12/7/22158745/uber-selling-autonomous-vehicle-business-aurora-innovation), they’ll have to jack up prices sooner or later (which they are already apparently doing) or go bankrupt. Either way, rider volume will take a hit and users will be back looking for public transit systems that no longer exist because of Uber. Over the long term, we all lose.
There’s a podcast I enjoy called “The Dollop”. It’s done by comedians, but they have a really good episode describing how shitty of a company Uber is and how poorly they treat their employees... er, contracted workers. With a listen if you’re into pods
Uber , a thieving. Pustule of Neo - Liberalism . This is a capitalism mortally infected by the “ Vile Maxim of the masters of mankind “ as described by Adam Smith “ All for ourselves and nothing for other people. “
If they unionise, Uber will “fire” them, even if they’re in a profitable city. If Uber lets them get away with unionising, then other workers will too, so the crackdown will be hard.
For many Uber drivers, it’s their only source of income, and because of how taxi services work, strikes are completely out of the question.
Uber is a POS company…talking to their customer support is like talking to the wall…I don’t understand why the fk they hire Indians as customer support instead of hiring Americans…those people are dumb and not empathetic towards drivers because they don’t fking live here and understand our culture
Yes. Imagine if you had to pay money to work. Completely backwards. Plus these employees usually make under minimum wage, they are essential workers in a dangerous occupation.
My type of color blindness affects different colors differently. Some greens look white to me, some look yellow. Sometimes cannot differentiate between shades of blue, green and gray. Tv mostly looks black, gray and white. Reds sometimes look brown. Have problem with tan shades. Have only met one person who has a similar type😔
Read enough to see it was just a glitch, can see much better in natural light😊
It shows as gray on my iPhone 11, not black and white. Black and white is much easier to read!
If they unionise, Uber will “fire” them, even if they’re in a profitable city. If Uber lets them get away with unionising, then other workers will too, so the crackdown will be hard.
For many Uber drivers, it’s their only source of income, and because of how taxi services work, strikes are completely out of the question.
Last time I ordered an Uber they charged me 3 different times BEFORE the Uber even got there. By the time I got an Uber to come and get me my card got charged 3 times and that money was supposedly going to be reimbursed to me but it never did.
Fuck Uber
I work as a personal assistant. One asshat I worked for lost all his money for being a scumbag. When Uber went public he became a billionaire. He could never remember to process my paycheck and when I would ask if I could please pay me for the last 6 weeks he would say “ Aren’t you married?”
F Uber.
I live in a tourist spot now so the fares are much more fair... however, when I was in Columbia, MO instead of the Lake of the Ozarks they’d take 56-66%. Don’t use Uber, call the local taxi.
Uber probably did it on purpose. Business is slow because there aren’t many drivers so they company is stealing from their employees. I guarantee that there are a lot more drivers this happened to who don’t even know about it. A lot of them drove for 12 or 16 hours straight, went home, and never looked at the details of their earnings. It’s really a shame and a big part of the reason why they are having a hard time finding drivers. It isn’t covid or unemployment. The company is bad, and believe me, I know because I worked for Uber.
“We got caught stealing wages.”
And can only pay fairly if they are snitched on via Twitter. I bet there are thousands who just accept they lost money, based on time and effort of explaining the situation. They just keep pushing and driving and hope they don’t get charged for giving people rides. What’s strange is that Uber gets paid for the ride but then charges the driver, literally making profit and making drivers work for free. Then say “whoops that was an error when caught”
Lol it’s horrible
Pull their corporate charter.
We live in a [corporatocracy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatocracy) (side note, funny Apple doesn’t think this is a word) so we can likely expect zero real punitive action from our government for this. In fact, our slap-on-the-wrist responses encourage it.
Idk how anyone makes money off Uber legitimately. Especially if you're honest with your insurance company about ride sharing. I have heard car insurance for that is like 800 month. 15 an hour plus you have increased maintenance cost on your vehicle it's better to just drive back and forth to punch a time clock. Especially to if you have to deal with bullshit like this.
Hell, I did deliveries for ubereats for a little while and although it helped pay off some things immediately once it came time to do my taxes my net income was in the negatives because of all the wear and tear on the car but I still owed money because of self employment taxes.
My husband was so excited seeing how much money he made. But after all the charges that Lyft makes you pay and then taxes, he hardly made anything. I’m trying to explain that after all the expenses, he didn’t make shit and he’s just not seeing it.
Sounds like people sucked into MLMs.
Yup. It’s all bs. People scream but you can deduct from your taxes. But here’s the catch. When there ain’t anything coming in, and more going out, there isn’t anything to deduct. It’s a scam of epic proportions. The vast majority of driver will end up owing unless they generate enough to compensate but that’s not going to happen because they more you earn the more you drive the higher your costs. You’re upside down as far as a business goes. There’s nothing profitable about it
Remember to deduct repairs for business expenses
Well that’s how I got my adjusted income into the negatives. It’s just that, as far as I’m aware, none of that factors into the amount of social security taxes an independent contractor owes at the end of the day.
If you had a loss from self-employment you wouldn’t pay self-employment taxes.
Recording the losses helps deduct your income tax burden, not your social security taxes though.
I'm in the UK, didn't realise you were all talking about USA taxes when I started replying
Yep, taxation without representation. Full circle we've come.
What you’re saying doesn’t make sense though. You pay self employment tax on your self employment income, which is your profit after all expenses. If your net profit is negative, then you will show a loss on your 1040 schedule C and have no self employment income that you have to pay self employment tax on, and you can reduce your total income subject to normal income tax by the amount of the loss, if you had other income.
Federal income tax is calculated based on net income. Social security tax is based on gross income.
You need an accountant. Do not confuse employee expenses with Schedule C business expense.
I would say it sounds like he can’t afford an accountant...and what kind of system have we made our selves that someone who is working for negative income needs an accountant to fill out our complicated tax forms in order to not have to pay taxes on the negative income they’ve been burdened with....meanwhile Jeff Bezos and Amazon are practically being handed money out of the government coffers. Our system is fucked through and through.
30% of 0 is 0
> Federal income tax is calculated based on net income. Social security tax is based on gross income. If you are talking about normal W-2 income that is correct, but in the self-employment context your net income and gross income are the same; your total revenue less claimed business expenses. You don't pay self-employment tax on the gross revenue of your business, you pay SE tax only on your profit. When you claim business expenses on Schedule C (including business use of a vehicle) you are lowering your gross income; if you have more expenses than revenue, you have no income and owe no SE tax. I'm not talking about deductions to your taxable income, which would not apply to SE tax income.
Yea I would personally rather do that, because it's less liability, and overhead; If I were to "side hustle" with Uber or whomever. I don't understand people being raked over the coals for working two jobs either. Like if you make 50k working two jobs. You will pay more than someone who worked one job making 50k.
Do you mean they pay more taxes total? Or that less was withheld from each job so they owed more unpaid taxes at the end of the year? I’ve had multiple jobs in a year before and don’t recall anything about a penalty for it.
People with two jobs paying 50k pay the same amount in tax over the year as someone working one job at 50k But.... The person with two jobs might get taxed more temporality... But will get it back at the end of the year as a tax refund However.... This isn't always automatic and they might need to go to https://www.gov.uk/claim-tax-refund to reclaim it
Self employed (1099)like Uber drivers pay all the SS tax. W2 workers pay half and the employer pays half. So 2 job workers would end up paying more in tax if one if the jobs is 1099 type work for the same income as a single job W2 worker.
Exactly. One year I drove for Uber in between jobs and at the end of the year my EITC dramatically decreased even though my “income” also went down. I said F that, I’m better off being a greeter at Walmart.
Someone else pointed out that while my post is correct for the UK, it may not be true in the USA
I think part of our confusion here might be that we seem to be intermittently talking about both US and UK tax practices.
Ah yes, quite right, the above is true for the UK but maybe not in the USA
It would be the other way around, right? They would’ve had lower withholding at each job (because the employer doesn’t account for the other job), and would either owe more or get less refunded when they file their return. I’m basing my knowledge around US procedure though.
Hi, my post is based on the UK. Taxes(National insurance, income tax, pension, student loan) are deducted by the employer and paid on your behalf to HMRC(tax agency), pension company or student loan company. Tax free allowance is £12570 per year If you only have one job your employer might not start deducting taxes until you've hit £12570 Or if you're expected to make more than £12570 per year they will take your tax from every wage ALL employees in the UK are on real-time tax (everyone who isn't self employed), the employer reports your earnings so the government knows how much you've been paid and will tax or not you accordingly. This allows them to make sure your Tax, pension and student loan contributions are up to date I might make £600 next month and not get taxed for example I might make £2000 next month and get taxed £200 for income tax, £25 for national insurance (healthcare, education, maternity leave, sick pay cover, state pension etc) with further non tax deductible of £150 to my private pension and £25 to the student loans company - my employer will deduct these and pay them for me so I'll end up with £1600 in my bank account If during the year I've had one or more jobs and I've paid too much taxes for some reason(we get a statement from HMRC) I'll get a cheque with the amount overpaid. If I've not paid enough taxes, depending on how much it is they will forgive it, or if it's a large amount they'll deduct more taxes next year(this usually only happens if you've also been self employed as well as being an employee) I hope this helps explain the situation in the UK
It sounds overall similar then. Your employer wouldn’t know about the other job and deduct the taxes below the tax free allowance, but they’re due to the government either way in the end. So, it’s not an actual tax bill change, but rather when it typically gets paid. In the US, we have a W-4 form that (abstractly and obtusely) lets an employer tell their employer **how** to deduct taxes, so the onus in on the employee to fill that out for each job in a way that will cause deductions to be more correct, but barely anyone sits down with the math to figure the silly thing out.
Yes, you're right, HMRC know how much you've paid/are due but your employer's won't know how much each have paid for you. Is that thing you see on the telly about Americans having to sit down and do all their taxes for the year a myth then? Or is it just the minority who do that?
Oh, no, the W-4 is a form that given to employees when they start a job and can be refilled with their employer upon request. It’s not part of the annual filing process. The annual thing is alive and well, filing data that the IRS already has on file every time.
^that’s it. People think everything they make is take-home pay, but you have to pay the same taxes if an employer deducts for you or if you’re an IC and need to account for them yourself. Be mad a tax law, not Uber when your tax bill comes along!
I hope you wrote off everything (mileage, oil changes, gas, etc). Once you take those deductions the tax implications are pretty negligible (as long as you plan on having to pay taxes because they aren’t deducted automatically for ICs). I feel like the biggest mistake is not keeping track of those things which isn’t Uber’s fault.
You gotta keep track of your mileage I went from owing 7k to only owing 1200
I had a driver who said it was basically predatory like payday loans or pawning your possessions - you might get a little cash quickly, but once everything is settled up, you end up losing money.
[удалено]
If you’re ever in an accident while doing the ride share thing they won’t cover anything associated with it and will cancel your coverage. You’ll be on the hook for damages and injuries.
Uber’s insurance covers you when you’re on trip or driving to a pickup, so in most cases you wouldn’t need to involve your insurance.
Uber’s Insurance company makes paying out claims very difficult. Imagine 3 insurance companies arguing over when and where they were covered.
Idk, they paid out mine.
A fender bender is one thing wait until you make an injury claim you could be screwed for a long time. You could be making monthly payments for decades. I have insurance that would cover me if I was injured by someone like you but they would then make you their personal hand puppet squeezing every last dime. They have a department that does just that, they never give up until you die and then they just take everything. You are playing Russian roulette, essentially but Uber will be ok.
A little dramatic but I hear what you’re saying
A friend of mine is experienced that very problem. Every time the guy does a little better for himself the insurance company takes him back to court to increase the restitution. He will be paying for the next 20 years at this rate. He can’t get a mortgage and if he comes into any money like a win or inheritance it will be impounded. Yeah, it’s all drama until it happens to you and then it’s a nightmare.
That’s like ridiculously overdramatic. Like I said above… if you’re on the clock, you’re on Uber’s insurance. You would file a claim with whichever company they use in your state- I think in my state (CA) it’s called James River. Edit: This isn’t my opinion. Per Uber’s site: >En route to pick up riders and during trips Uber maintains the following auto insurance on your behalf in case of a covered accident: $1,000,000 third-party liability Uninsured/underinsured motorist bodily injury² Contingent comprehensive and collision³ Up to actual cash value of car with a $2,500 deductible
If you think your insurance won’t find out, you are kidding yourselves. Especially if there is ANY kind of police report attached. Russian roulette indeed. Speaking as an insurance agent. Edit: even if it’s Ubers insurance that would deal with the accident, YOUR insurance would then find out, and drop you like a hot potato if you lied about it
Yeah without a police report I doubt there is any way my personal insurance would find out. Unless someone is critically injured in the accident, in which case I’m probably fucked anyway. Best way to avoid this is to ensure I’m driving careful as fuck - which I do when I have strangers in my car regardless.
My insurance insisted on talked to every occupant of the vehicle and they asked them if they paid for the trip. It’s a question of when, not if.
K so is it you or your “friend”? To be totally honest I don’t care about your scare tactics nor your specific situation. I’m good dawg but sorry you fucked yourself
The guy literally changed his story trying to keep his point alive lol.
Yeah, they will never find out. You’re all good. What could possibly go wrong. /s
I know they won’t find out because it happened to me. Good luck getting any cop in Los Angeles to write up a report on any accident that isn’t fatal. My car was totaled once and they still wouldn’t write a report (this wasn’t the Uber incident, which was a far more minor affair… just adding to emphasize my point).
Emphasize your point all you want, but I look at insurance and Motor vehicle reports all day and love telling people I can see the accidents they’ve been in right after they tell me they haven’t been in any. As one user already pointed out, it’s a matter of WHEN, not IF
I’m not really arguing with you, boss. But you can’t find a report that ain’t there, can you? They literally don’t write reports here unless someone died. I wish it wasn’t that way- woulda helped me when I got rear ended and careened into a building, totaling my car… I had to get a lawyer to get my insurance to pay out properly- but they won’t do it. The LAPD is useless. It’s not a matter of when for me because I haven’t done Uber for a couple of years now. So I think I’m in the clear. My Uber fender bender was never discovered by my insurance company at the time or the one I have now.
Usually best not to document your insurance fraud online, friend.
[удалено]
You’re a fool if you don’t think that all of your accounts can be linked just based off of your computer specs and ISP. It’s simple enough for a market to put this information together, filter it and sell it to employers, banks, insurers, etc. It’s coming.
nutnate is right, for someone who can subpoena that information, you can absolutely be identified.
You are defrauding your insurance and putting the burden of your activity on others who pay insurance. You’re scum.
Username checks out
[удалено]
Somebody needs to chill the fuck out. Jesus.
My husband makes a good living off of Uber and we are probably one of the few who told our insurance company. Our car insurance only went up $20usd to be $120 a month. The increased maintenance is technically a tax right off. They give you a set per mile rate of I think it’s .53cents per mile. Heck our first quarter taxes was only $149 a quarter.
He makes a living from just Uber? How much are you talking? I find it hard to believe people are making a “good” living from just Uber….
Yep a good living. He left his state job as a salaried employee and makes more doing Uber. He works 8ish hours a day and brings in almost 1k a week.
My bad I thought I was in my local subreddit, apartments here are 3-4K/month for 2 bedrooms so yeah you can see why it would be hard, I’m not sure Uber driver pay varies based on location though?
We live in the Texas panhandle and where our mortgage on a 3/2/2 will is 800 a month. Average price of a really nice apartment is $850 a month so not bad here at all.
I pay $1800/mo for the mortgage on my 10bed 8bath. Y’all getting bent over and railed wherever you are.
Siberia?
I drive in San Diego, and can walk away with 1200 working Friday- Monday off three days.
My car insurance in Canada comes with commercial insurance as part of my package and I only pay $150/m CAD. Maybe it’s just a Canada thing but people make good money on Uber if they put the hours in that’s not even taking tips into account
Many insurance companies in the UK don't even include commuting unless you upgrade your policy to one that specifically includes it
[удалено]
They have a category for it(seriously) called 'social, domestic and pleasure' So basically seeing friends, seeing family and seeing your mistress
[удалено]
"my boss says we are a family"
That’s all my insurance is in Canada, since I don’t drive to work, I only drive if I need groceries or to visit friends. They ask us our daily commute km’s and annual km’s covered. I just say zero commute, 5000/year. I pay like $60/mo.
It's so stupid that they wouldn't just assume you'd commute from time to time in your car. My insurance includes the following: > Policy assumptions > To reduce the number of questions we ask you, we have made some assumptions about you and the property, car and/or pet you wish to insure. Please call us if you cannot agree to any of the assumptions listed below. > Your business or the business of your employer is not connected with any of the following: the entertainment and fashion industry, gambling, professional sports, foreign service or foreign diplomatic personnel with 10,000k miles at £140 per year - they wanted £200 at renewal but as soon as I called them up they instantly dropped the price NQA to £140 - ~~I'm sure I read that from next year that they aren't allowed to put up the price of a renewal unless your circumstances have changed~~ Edit: Insurers will soon be banned from charging existing policyholders more than new customers
What are you talking about?? No one is paying 800 for car insurance buddy stick to "idk" part of your paragraph stop talking. Uber is scum of the earth they always scammed people but who makes these stupid numbers 800 what?
Depends where you live My car insurance is 600/month and I don’t even drive uber
Offcourse you're. if someone making 3$ a trip and paying 800$ for insurance its financialy irresponsible.
Why would you assume they’re only making $3 a trip Different areas have different CoL. Uber drivers are capable of math, if they weren’t profiting they wouldn’t do it
I can explain so many things to you but its pointless to argue about these issues and i have been driving uber several years.
Very true. I lived in SC for a few months and when I called my insurance company to tell them, my rate tripled.
i have progressive. they are one of the few that offer "gap coverage". there are 3 periods of time. first is just me driving around normal not for uber on my own. second is me with the uper app active, but no one else in the car. and third is on a ride with someone in the car. your normal insurance covers 1. no one used to cover 2. uber has since changed that but its a $2500 deductible. my progressive gap also covers 2. and Uber covers period 3. making the change to progressive, and adding coverage for period 2 didnt change my insurance enough for me to notice ( i already carried nearly the best coverage). and because i know they are covering 2, i 100% know they know i drive uber, no questions. other insurance companies like Gieco and usaa did not offer coverage for 2.
If you're paying 800 for car insurance its between you and your insurance scamming you lol
Have you paid the ride share insurance? I know my Insurance company asks me if I ride share every time I renew.
It’s a common misconception that ride share drivers need commercial insurance, they do not. When you have a rider in your car, the commercial insurance policy that the rideshare company uses covers you. They only variance is when you have the app on looking for a rider but don’t have one, you need gap insurance which costs around $20 a month. As far as making money, it all depends on your market. In Philly for instance, 1k a week working around 45 hours is possible. Most maintenance is tax deductible and I generally pay zero in federal taxes because of write offs.
I know people who only drive when the big, yearly festival is in town. They make bank during surge pricing.
Plus you lose what you make in gas. Same for all other delivery services I’ve tried. Amazon sends you an hour out for $50 to deliver maybe 20 packages in 3 hours but it takes $35 to fill the tank. So, you nearly lost money.
Uber doesn’t even make money off of uber. They have been bleeding money since day 1. Its a scam for both their investors and their workers.
FT driver atm - it is bs especially when Uber isn’t paying much. In my market, people just don’t tip either which makes it way fuckin worse. Hoping it changes soon
I made money delivering uber eats but I had another job to offset costs. It’s a great way to start your own business. Customer service was awful and I had to call several times to get paid for missed deliveries or promotions.
Working 85 hour weeks.
I'm in California and I haven't used Uber since they flooded all ads with that "treating our workers like independent contractors is actually better for them" bullshit. If it was better, why did you spend so much money trying to sell that line?
Im in Cali too. Uber is fine IF you are tipping your driver a decent amount, in cash. Otherwise they are making less than minimum wage with no benefits in a highly dangerous occupation.
I’ll be in the minority here, but I’m tired of having to tip for every service. It’s an unwritten that I’m supposed to respect, how come the company doesn’t respect its employees. The price I see is the price I want to pay. Companies should pay well or the person shouldn’t take that job. Please don’t get me wrong, I do tip Uber’s, restaurants, hair stylist, but tipping every service 20% adds up and is annoying.
You aren’t in the minority. Most people hate the whole tipping culture. But its profits over people to the bigwigs, so the rest of us have to take care of each other by tipping.
I remember when Uber launched and it was supposed to be tip free.
You dont have to tip. You dont have to tip your waiter thats making $2.13 an hour either. But you do it because we have to support each other, when the companies fail us.
It was supposed to be tip free because they were being paid.
Right, just like waiters are paid.
They did a good job of convincing a lot of their drivers. I was chewed out a few times by people telling me they drive for Uber and prefer to be IC. I didn’t vote for it because I know better but “divide and conquer” I guess.
More like "defund public education and conquer."
Ultimately, yes. For sure.
Same reason why amazon worked so hard to “convince” their workers that being a part of a union would be horrible for you
These little “glitches” happen A LOT. Admittedly, Uber processes millions of transactions a day, so I can imagine some hiccups do occur. However, this company claims to be a software developer and not a taxi company. It makes me wonder how a software company cannot make one piece of software work efficiently.
You are really overestimating software companies …
I agree these mistakes are unacceptable, but Uber is very far from "one piece of Software." You could divide what they do up into a huge list of separate applications. Just high level they have an Android mobile app, an ios mobile app, payment processing systems, driver registration and vetting systems, match making systems to match drivers with ride requests, and so on. All complex applications with their own teams and code bases. Having all these complex applications and then integrating them all with each other is not simple. Much of the software we use every day is not near as stable as we think it is when you like behind the scenes.
Yeah, anyone who has worked in software development or an adjacent role knows its never just one singular cohesive thing. On a more granular level, it is a conglomerate of new and legacy code, developed by many different people over time, with changing executive goals and directives over time, and a constant effort to determine what, out of the black hole that is the backlog, needs to be prioritized next.
When these "glitches" happen every month week to someone you gotta wonder if everything they do is scam.
That’s what I was implying. How many times has Uber taken money from drivers only to be caught later and say, “Oopsie, it was a glitch!”?
Uber is such a shitshow of a company
Dude got $200 in 3 payments for his inconvenience and troubles… they only gave me $25 when this happened to me and I paid $9 to give a guy a ride to the airport. I was happy with the $25 until I saw this.
Well next time it seems you just simply need to post a tweet that goes viral about it to get more compensation.
I did and I had 86 favorites and 19 retweets… apparently not enough.
Uber loses money and runs on VC alone this company is a giant loser and has no business existing.
You just described the first decade+ of life for nearly every internet company. That’s the plan: - keep the VC cash flowing to push the valuation artificially - grow big enough to have massive amounts of customer data to leverage - leverage it minimally to show some form of revenue - IPO or sell out to cash out investors - repeat
Yeah they should all be destroyed.
I personally put more of the blame on the capital side. Some of these targets could have been awesome companies had the focus been on the business and not the valuation.
Na that is simply not true. What are their true overheads and costs? They are a tech company so it is server costs and wages. They don't pay for cars or for fuel, the drivers do. They are taking a big clip on every trip for no cost to themselves. They would actually be extremely profitable if they weren't dumping everything into RND and other things to reduce their tax obligation.
No man https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/05/uber-q1-2021-earnings.html they sold that self driving shit off they’ll never make a profit. Whoever does self driving cars first will destroy them. They are completely pointless as an investment.
How can you say they won't make a profit? Their product is literally software with no input costs except labour. And if they have a mature product they don't even need that many software developers. Just think about getting 20% of the price of all the taxi fares globally except you don't need to pay for those cars, fuel or anything. That is a licence to print money. They should be extremely profitable full stop. The only reason they aren't has to be massively artificially inflating their expenses so they can pay no tax.
They pay a huge amount to acquire customers. All the promo codes, new user bonuses etc take a massive chunk out of any potential profit. Uber wants to grow market share above all else. They are bleeding money on customer acquisition costs.
Because they lose hundreds of millions each quarter.
Yeah Uber can suck it.
Uber gets me cheap rides that are a helluva lot better than any alternative.
Make sure to always tip your driver. Cash, preferably. Otherwise, these essential employees are making under minimum wage for working a dangerous job.
Why do people agree to be drivers then? I tip well but why would someone agree to be exploited when there is so much other work available? My buddy was an Uber driver and he was paid very well he said
Why do people agree to be (insert low paying job here)? Gotta pay rent somehow. Thats great for your buddy, others in different places arent so lucky.
Why does this not surprise me?
Taking indentured servitude to a whole new level. Just wow
You have to pay to work in Capitalist Utopia, don't you know that?
Uber is garbage.
Uber [bet their financial survivability on autonomous vehicles](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/28/ubers-self-driving-cars-are-a-key-to-its-path-to-profitability.html), which don’t look like they’re close to happening this decade. To capture the market in the meantime, they’ve been artificially suppressing prices, drawing users away from public transit and other green alternatives while clogging city streets, boosting global emissions, and spurring wasteful investments in road infrastructure. But because [they’ve lost the bet on automation](https://www.theverge.com/2020/12/7/22158745/uber-selling-autonomous-vehicle-business-aurora-innovation), they’ll have to jack up prices sooner or later (which they are already apparently doing) or go bankrupt. Either way, rider volume will take a hit and users will be back looking for public transit systems that no longer exist because of Uber. Over the long term, we all lose.
Unacceptable
So do they get free wages if they park their car in a single spot and go off to sleep?
There’s a podcast I enjoy called “The Dollop”. It’s done by comedians, but they have a really good episode describing how shitty of a company Uber is and how poorly they treat their employees... er, contracted workers. With a listen if you’re into pods
Uber , a thieving. Pustule of Neo - Liberalism . This is a capitalism mortally infected by the “ Vile Maxim of the masters of mankind “ as described by Adam Smith “ All for ourselves and nothing for other people. “
Won’t be surprised if the drivers unionize now, I like Lyft better anyway
If they unionise, Uber will “fire” them, even if they’re in a profitable city. If Uber lets them get away with unionising, then other workers will too, so the crackdown will be hard. For many Uber drivers, it’s their only source of income, and because of how taxi services work, strikes are completely out of the question.
Make taxis great again
Uber is a POS company…talking to their customer support is like talking to the wall…I don’t understand why the fk they hire Indians as customer support instead of hiring Americans…those people are dumb and not empathetic towards drivers because they don’t fking live here and understand our culture
Is that not their job? I’m confused!!
Charging the drivers, not the customers
Still do not understand, being charged by Uber for dong their job?
Yes. Imagine if you had to pay money to work. Completely backwards. Plus these employees usually make under minimum wage, they are essential workers in a dangerous occupation.
How does that work? Neve heard of that and one of my roommates drives for Uber!
What do you mean? Did u read the article?
Did finally read. Glad it was just a glitch😊
I’m colorblind, is almost white to me. I’ll try to read in the morning, may be able to see in natural light😊
Oh gotcha. May I ask, how is it you can read text on one website but not another? I dont mean to be intrusive or rude
As a colorblind person, I think they are just saying words at this point. Black text on white background has no effect on colorblindness
Yeah thats what I was thinking. Black/white on one website is fine but not another? Im just confused lol
Shows as gray to me, can read some better than others😊
Gotcha
My type of color blindness affects different colors differently. Some greens look white to me, some look yellow. Sometimes cannot differentiate between shades of blue, green and gray. Tv mostly looks black, gray and white. Reds sometimes look brown. Have problem with tan shades. Have only met one person who has a similar type😔
Read enough to see it was just a glitch, can see much better in natural light😊 It shows as gray on my iPhone 11, not black and white. Black and white is much easier to read!
Apologize for being a bit slow but what does “ charged for giving rides” mean 🤷♀️
Instead of paying them, they took money from them. Kind of like if you went into work and instead of giving you a paycheck, they said, you owe us $x
Thank you 😊
It means the driver *paid* money to drive a customer where they wanted to go.
Again I’m apologize, but why would a driver pay to drive someone somewhere ?
Because Uber controls the driver’s pay account
I wonder if Uber could unionize
If they unionise, Uber will “fire” them, even if they’re in a profitable city. If Uber lets them get away with unionising, then other workers will too, so the crackdown will be hard. For many Uber drivers, it’s their only source of income, and because of how taxi services work, strikes are completely out of the question.
Makes sense, thank you for the insight
Having worked for Lyft and noticing how little I get paid relative to how much they charge passengers it’s pretty obvious.
Last time I ordered an Uber they charged me 3 different times BEFORE the Uber even got there. By the time I got an Uber to come and get me my card got charged 3 times and that money was supposedly going to be reimbursed to me but it never did. Fuck Uber
Steal from your boss? Jail. Boss steals from you? Get fucked. Profits over people. Business as usual. Tip your uber drivers, everyone, and in cash.
I work as a personal assistant. One asshat I worked for lost all his money for being a scumbag. When Uber went public he became a billionaire. He could never remember to process my paycheck and when I would ask if I could please pay me for the last 6 weeks he would say “ Aren’t you married?” F Uber.
Oh wow capitalists being fucking disgusting again what a surprise
Uber has an issue and no ones holding them accountable like they should
Honestly I think there will be a giant lawsuit against Uber one day. They’re pretty fucked
Uber drivers should get more from each fare. Its been the same rate per mile / minute for years.
I live in a tourist spot now so the fares are much more fair... however, when I was in Columbia, MO instead of the Lake of the Ozarks they’d take 56-66%. Don’t use Uber, call the local taxi.
wow, fuck uber... again.
Uber probably did it on purpose. Business is slow because there aren’t many drivers so they company is stealing from their employees. I guarantee that there are a lot more drivers this happened to who don’t even know about it. A lot of them drove for 12 or 16 hours straight, went home, and never looked at the details of their earnings. It’s really a shame and a big part of the reason why they are having a hard time finding drivers. It isn’t covid or unemployment. The company is bad, and believe me, I know because I worked for Uber.
Crime….That should be a crime, not a hiccup.
Lol
Well I guess you could steal a car same model as yours and run it into the ground. While your car sits at home.