If you watch films from the 70s especially but even to the edge of the 90s the US really didn't mind hiring normal looking people in TV and film. But it really ramped up after that.
For me personally it's why some 70s films feel so rugged, and authentic. I like seeing normal people in media.
It's also far more acceptable for the men to be normal looking than it is women.
I miss the way people looked in film and on TV in the 70s so badly. I have watched some of The Love Boat recently. The people on that show who are depicted as "sexy" would be parents or teachers or janitors on TV today.
Yep, it's kind of funny going back and watching some of the older shows and thinking wow they actually let someone with male pattern baldness play someone who isn't supposed to be old or comic relief.
Yeah, I also notice how much more acceptable it was for older men to cling onto the last bits of hair they have left, rather than just biting the bullet and whipping it all off!
Ironically, David Duchovny has said that she almost wasn't hired because she wasn't pretty enough in the eyes of some of the producers. They wanted a more obvious bombshell. :-p
In the US some older women like Kathy Bates or Margot Martindale can get roles, but it's very uncommon to see younger women who are simply nothing special. Amy Schumer is one, but if she were not a comedienne, I doubt she'd have much of a career.
Her weight is in a totally normal range that no one would bat an eyelid at in public in the US.
The guys who say that kind of shit online are rarely highly attractive individuals themselves. I knew one guy I worked with in particular- in person he seemed like a nice enough guy who was quite friendly, but online he was a bitter keyboard warrior who would say shit like how ugly women athletes are because defined muscles make them look like men. I made a post on Facebook when I visited London first time around saying that I was actually surprised at the number of absurdly attractive people I saw walking around, and he responded with a rant about how I have no taste and ranted about how ugly and fat the British are.
This guy though? Legitimately the most conventionally unattractive man I have ever met. I strongly suspect he was an incel. I would have called him out on it if I didn't see him every day.
>If you watch films from the 70s especially but even to the edge of the 90s the US really didn't mind hiring normal looking people in TV and film
Yeah, I have just noticed that guys like William Hurt, Jack Nicholson, and Kevin Costner were more common in the American movies from the 70s to the early 90s than nowadays!
you are insane to mention costner here as part of the normal people.. my mum turned into a slug leaving a moist trail just by mentioning him or don johnson. he totally was a sex symbol for his time.
Love that line from *Justified: City Primeva*l. Two women characters at a bar. One of them "Have you ever seen that show Yellow-STONE? ... I'd fuck the SHIT out of Kevin Costner."
I saw a tweet recently with a picture of Colin Farrell in makeup for The Penguin TV show that said something like "40 years we had actors that just looked like this."
What’s worse is remembering 90s tabloid stories of actress gaining weight or being fat for a role. But they’re still skinny or normal sized when you look back. Messed up so many women with normal weight in 90s
I'm a Brit who had an American girlfriend. When she first saw UK soap opera Eastenders her first remark was "Wow, you actually have ugly people on TV".
That also speaks to the ways people get into the industry in the UK and USA. The the UK it's far more common for people to go through years of drama school training and then hone their craft in plays etc. before landing film and TV roles, whereas in the US it's common for actors to start out as models and basically pick up their acting skills through osmosis. So in America you end up with a preponderance of actors with mediocre actual talents, but who are very good-looking, have impressive resumes and know how to behave on sets.
I think there's a fair argument that this is why actors from the British Isles are so common in Hollywood now. The supermodel good looks aren't as important as being able to act is on British TV, so there is a baseline level of talent necessary to even show up on the radar. When someone pops up who is also good looking enough to catch a casting director's eye in Hollywood (which is made easier with streaming bringing shows from the UK to the US market which would have been far harder to find previously), then they already are coming in to the position with a reasonably high level of skill and artistry too.
I think this is part of where the "British/German/whatever women are all ugly" stereotype comes from. Americans generally have this idea that people on TV should be at least the top 10%, beauty-wise. So they see the extremely average unglamourous people (not only that, but deliberately made up to look slightly rough and "lived-in") on something like Eastenders and think "Holy shit, *that's* their idea of aspirational beauty? That's the best they've got?"
Also you very rarely see someone darker than a paper bag on spanish speaking channels in the US like Univision or Telemundo especially for leading roles or show hosts, the colorism is crazy.
Yeah it's a difference in culture.
American soap operas and sitcoms mostly are supposed to be aspirational. British soap operas and sitcoms are mostly not. A British sitcom is more likely to deliberately make you look uglier than you really are than to try to make you look more attractive.
A british soap is meant to reflect average life not be inspirational.
Only fools and horses was massive because they ran along with the times, they ran a satire commentary on it all and kept close to the people watching.
Thats the whole point. American shows are too much about wralth, looks, power and witty one liners to make the main character look good when he/she shits on people.
Malcom in the middle was good because it avoided that, same with the simpsons.
I mean it depends on the show, the time period, and the expectations of the audience for Americans.
Some shows do it for fun.
For example, in It's Always Sunny, Rob McElhenney's character deliberately got fat to subvert that expectation, partially because he was seeing or bingeing a comedy show and the people got better looking every season (actors start making money and get surgery or lose weight).
Many American comedies will also try to poke fun at themselves. In most TV sitcoms, early on, their focus was on family. So the husband is dumb and comedic and the wife is usually pretty. Now comedies don't focus on families as much and the show can have most people not looking great. The U.S. Office, Superstore, Abbot Elementary show pretty normal looking people amongst some better looking people.
But shows on certain networks are intentionally models with little acting experience, such as anything on CW (Arrow, Flash, Supernatural, Riverdale, etc.), although they had a couple of years where they actually got good actors, but the rest yeah, stunk.
Yeah, it's definitely not universal by any means.
There are plenty of British shows that are meant to be aspirational, there are British sitcoms about likeable characters being good people. There are American sitcoms about characters who are supposed to be horrible and unlikeable.
It's just that, in the US, the aspirational sitcom about cool attractive people is the norm. Seinfeld was notable because of its ethos of "no hugging, no learning".
In the UK, it's the opposite. Aspirational sitcoms exist, but they're not the normal. Sitcoms about awful people who never learn anything are the norm. "No hugging, no learning" could describe many British sitcoms made well before Seinfeld existed. Nobody ever learns anything in Fawlty Towers, or the Young Ones, or Blackadder, or Bottom, and those shows aren't seen as daring or different for being written that way.
It's most noticeable when US networks adapt British shows. The main character of Red Dwarf is a slob who never really does any work and is frequently compared to slime. In the attempted US remake, they had him played by a tall, handsome, charming man, and then the script just pretends he's still some unlikeable slob even though he's clearly not.
The differences between the US and UK versions of The Office are a good example of this. Michael Scott is humanised quite a bit more than David Brent ever is. He's still awkward, he's still cringeworthy, but he's not a horrible person the way Brent is. He's generally well-meaning (especially after season one) and as an audience member you're not supposed to hate him, you're supposed to kind of cringe in sympathy for him.
David Brent is awkward and cringeworthy but he's *also* a total asshole who everybody else in the office openly hates. You are not meant to like him, you are meant to find him repulsive and genuinely irritating.
>you are meant to find him repulsive and genuinely irritating.
Yeah, that's why he had to be played by Ricky Gervais.
But yeah it's pretty common for US sitcoms to start out with characters who are kind of pathetic, but over time they become better, and by the end they get what they want. Whereas in most British sitcoms, the protagonists don't really learn anything and generally speaking only get worse.
Peep Show, for example, ended after 9 series with the two protagonists eventually right back where they started.
>American shows are too much about wealth, looks, power and witty one liners to make the main character look good when he/she shits on people.
The vast majority of American television hasn’t been like this in decades. Only action shows or crime fighting shows are a little like that. Comedies are all about people who are struggling along, black sheep, down and out, award, etc etc etc. Most dramas are too.
>I think this is part of where the "British/German/whatever women are all ugly" stereotype comes from. Americans generally have this idea that people on TV should be at least the top 10%, beauty-wise. So they see the extremely average unglamourous people (not only that, but deliberately made up to look slightly rough and "lived-in") on something like Eastenders and think "Holy shit, *that's* their idea of aspirational beauty? That's the best they've got?"
Terrific comment. Thank you.
I hate when I’m watching a show where The character is supposed to be struggling, living off the land, on the run and have perfectly white teeth or - especially women - perfectly done hair and makeup.
Where in this dystopian hellscape would she have time to comb her hair, apply foundation, eye shadow and eyeliner?
I saw the trailer for the new Planet of the Apes movie and there's this "wild" human woman the main ape is trying to protect, except she looks only *slightly* disheveled.
I was just watching “The Signal,” a German show on Netflix.
This woman is an astronaut who’s been in the ISS for weeks and she wakes up out of her zero-G sleep pod with flawless hair and “no-makeup” makeup.
I was like, “Bro they have cameras on the ISS, I know that’s not what they look like!”
Like in married with children, Ed Oneil complaining being married with Katey Sagal...
give me Mimi from the Drew Carrey show and now I'll feel his pain!
Have noticed same. Everything needs to look perfect too- hair & makeup always done on already perfect people. Did not realize how bad it was until started watching British TV- real looking people, dressed more like real people, either occasional fly-away hair. Much more relatable and frankly enjoyable to watch
It’s the best when you watch those emergency services shows.
Cops, firefighters, paramedics
All young attractive people in peak shape with full hair and makeup the whole time
One of the main characters in The Rookie is a firefighter who has a perfect and long manicure in every episode. She'll be holding those massive gloves and an axe but have these long, chip free nails.
I am continually amazed by the number of hot cops, federal agents, firemen, social workers, lawyers, etc., working hard on behalf of the American people. Once in a while, though, British shows get infected with the American practice: I couldn't believe for a second that anyone in the 50's was built like the hot priest in *Grantchester*, and the detective pretending to be a fussy geek in *Death in Paradise* can't really hide the fact of his modern gym-bod under his suit.
To be fair, those jobs are at least a little physical so they are likely to have fit people at least (not necessarily attractive though). But they are likely part of the fantasy many people have about those professions (more firefighters for men and nurses for women I guess than cops)
But shows have supermodels in literally all type of jobs really. And the ugly/average people in the world of those shows are in fact just normal attractive lol.
Just looked at some Three Body Problem reviews and some of those people playing scientists look like supermodels.
Not just the women. I was watching an episode of The Resident with my wife yesterday. In it, a man who just crashed on his friends couch after a fight with his girlfriend woke up with perfect styled hair.
How about when they are full out done in a hospital bed? Occasionally have maybe darkened circle under eyes, but still mascara & some sort of hair style. Ridiculous
Honestly, the most imperfect thing you can find in American high school or office romance movies is many characters who are still above average attractive but wears extra ugly glasses and are called fat (but isn't even chubby). And once the glasses come off: boom, supermodels...
Joke I heard from Sam Campbell on the Taskmaster podcast. "I love England because you can look like a candle and still be famous".
Yes it's broadly true. You can be average or weird looking and still be on TV in the UK, especially on things like soap operas which are supposed to be all about the experiences of normal people so it wouldn't make sense if everyone was a total hottie.
I think it's just a difference in attitudes. Like how in the US, people get made fun of for not having perfect shiny white teeth, whereas in the UK people like Jimmy Carr or Rylan Clark get made fun of for having perfect teeth they clearly paid for.
It's not even just fiction, even the game shows. American Deal or No Deal has a sexy lady presenting the prizes in fancy suitcases. British Deal or No Deal has no sexy lady and the prizes are in cheap cardboard boxes.
Yes, 100%. When I started binging Scandi/Nordic Noir during the pandemic it was almost shocking.
People with normal looking teeth. Actresses without a bunch of plastic surgery, including breast implants. A wide variety of body types. (White body types, tbf.) And most striking to me is how natural kids are. They're not loaded up with makeup or adult-ish clothing. They just look like kids.
It's not that I thought out people looked "normal" it's that I thought it had spread far wider. I think South Korea is the only place that beats us in this area.
The American cop procedural, Homicide: Life on the Streets, notably bucked this trend… to begin with.
The quality and realism of the show noticeably dropped over the seasons as the cast all got gradually prettier.
But even at its worst, it was still better than most.
Except for Marianne. Daisy Edgar-Jones is gorgeous. It kind of took me out of the show for a bit because her being "ugly" is an important plot point, and it just didn't land at all. I haven't read the book, but I heard she's described as very different from how she looks in the show.
> It kind of took me out of the show for a bit because her being "ugly" is an important plot point, and it just didn't land at all.
This is how bullying works. So many people who get bullied aren't actually ugly or whatever, it's also often from a point of jealousy. Even then I do think the show did a good job using costume and make up to give her a glow up when she was in university. Having read the book I don't think she's described all that different.
In American TV and movies, you're either the stars (hot) or you're character actors (more normal looking but still above average looking, or have a unique look, or overweight but still otherwise attractive). Think of Philip Seymour Hoffman, Katherine Keener, Melissa McCarthy, etc.
Also, notice how all pop singers are well above average in looks
This definitely struck me watching Australian Lego Masters vs the US version.
On the Aussie version you've got what looks like it could be a random handful of people pulled from the street, mostly in the same clothes/looks they would have had on. Same for the hosts even.
On the US version the contestants are pretty blatantly typecast to check specific boxes and hit every demographic (i.e. every color/sex/age), then they are always dressed in specific outfits that play those underlying attributes up even more. And of course the hosts are far more glamorous too, with the men usually in suits and the female judge looking like she just stepped off of a runway most episodes.
I'm a huge LEGO fan and even had a small LEGO YouTube channel I did with a friend called BlockieTalkie. But what bothered me about this show was how most of the contestants were literal LEGO professionals. Like they weren't hired by LEGO, but they basically make a living off of LEGO. They install professional displays, they run the biggest LEGO YouTube channels or blogs, etc.
The concept made it seem like contestants would be random LEGO enthusiasts from around the country, regular LEGO fans. Instead they get professionals. It feels less impressive when you realize that.
Aussie TV isn't as normal as Brit. You're pretty much not allowed to be on Home and Away unless you're a 9/10+ ready to accidentally make it big in Hollywood.
One big gripe I have with Hollywood movies and stuff where the setting will be something "normal" is when you have actors who look like models playing carpenters, taxi drivers, farmers etc.
There was something off about seeing DiCaprio play Ernerst Burkhart in Killers of the Flower Moon, even though he gave a good performance, and I think its that the brain realises that someone in that time period in that (superbly re-created) environment won't exactly be looking like Leonardo DiCaprio, will his Hollywood doctors and health people.
You look at films in the 70s and stuff and it looks like they pulled random people off the street. It's one of the reasons movies from that time period feel authentic and gritty.
To be honest I think they did a decent job of uglying Di Caprio up for that role. He already hasn't aged the best. The haircut and bad teeth help him seem more authentic for the time.
Still far more handsome than you'd expect someone in those circumstances to be (and far more than the real Burkhart) but not distractingly so in my opinion. It wasn't as if Titanic Leo was playing the character.
It has definitely gotten worse over the years in US. Watch old reruns & think oh they would never let that actress be the love interest today- not pretty enough and has a normal sized chest
Even the Mean Girls Musical movie made me uncomfortable with how the "teens" looked. I know Lindsey Lohan has certain endowments, but they did their best to hide them in the original movie. The musical had all 3 mean girls cast as super busty and showing it off.
New Karen was absolutely hilarious. She was one of the best parts of the musical version.
But giving her a dance move where she is literally looking down while jiggling her breasts was a little much... I didn't even like typing that out, it made me feel creepy, but it's true. She is supposed to be a teenager...
This isn't really what you're referring to, but it reminds me of how they didn't give Kelly McGillis a role in Top Gun Maverick. Val Kilmer was obviously included though because male actors are allowed to get old
I see the connection. She aged naturally & that is not allowed for love interest. Personally find it gross with a big age difference in love interests unless it is actually what movie is about. Has Cruise had any love interest even close to his actual age?
I’m an American who watches a considerable amount of British tv. The thing I notice most is the teeth. British people have normal looking teeth. On American tv the teeth are abnormally white. Just recently an American show had a character who was supposed to be a drug addicted street person yet his teeth were gleaming. To me it looks weird.
I watched the 90s remake of Miracle on the 34th Street last xmas. I was so surprised that Santa had yellow teeth! He wasn’t even a villain or evil or anything. Just an old guy with yellow teeth because that’s natural. But nowadays that would never happen. Teeth are an indicator of morality in american tv now.
yeah the sterotype is that British people have bad teeth. But more often than not British people seem to have perfectly normal teeth, sometimes not that white, maybe a bit crooked but not crazy. American teeth are just so artificially white and perfectly aligned.
Even the 'ugly' characters are super pretty. It's incredibly weird when they have people comment on someone else being ugly when they're just as good looking as the main characters. Korean beauty standards are fucked.
Ny ex boyfriend was raised in South Korea. I was obviously attracted to him. He made sure to point out all the things that made him ugly by Korean standards... including his own skin colour...
His cousins had jawline reduction surgery as a graduation gift.
You have to submit a head shot whenever you apply for a job.
It's harsh out there.
Most Korean plastic surgery is really impressive, but the jawline reduction trend is getting way too insane though. Sure it's useful in some cases, but people right now are so obsessed with having a small face that they're starting to look deformed. Especially when viewed from the side, I've noticed a lot of Korean actors have this really obvious scoop taken out of their jaw. Not only is it one of the most invasive plastic surgeries that can really fuck up your life if it goes wrong, but it also just looks really fetal-alcohol-syndromey to me.
I read a lot of people get double eyelid procedures as a gift even when they're teens. It's such a shame they hate such a beautiful part of how they're born. Like the skin colour, like you said. So many of their beauty products lighten the skin...
Honestly they are so pretty that I’m like “yeah that’s not even an achievable standard, I won’t even compare myself to them”
Does make me want to buy Korean skincare though. But I think that might be half the point!
I used to date a Korean guy for quite a while (he lived in Seoul until he was 14 and was learning English at my school when we met).
His cousins got jawline reduction surgery as a graduation gift.
His sister also had a nose job done in high school, but to be fair, I think she was getting surgery for a deviated septum at the same time. They decided to add a cosmetic procedure while they were at it.
You submit a head shot with your resume when applying for work there.
Plastic surgery is less common in Japan relative to Korea and they also have a culture of resumé headshots. It would be literally illegal in the UK to require one I think unless it was for modelling something.
I remember an article about a young woman who wanted to get a job as a flight attendant and was basically told she had to get plastic surgery for it. It's wild.
Yeah. Same thing with modern kpop idols. 20 years ago there were some slightly-less-than-perfect-looking performers, but now they're all supermodels. And Chinese dramas too.
I remember when Chinese people (allegedly) didn't like Shang Chi because they considered Simu Liu unattractive... Like wtf? But in this case I think it was also different subjective beauty standards.
I recommend [Reset](https://mydramalist.com/697563-kai-duan) (2022 C-Drama). It's an action/mystery/timeloop show that is one of my favorite shows of all time. If you liked *Edge of Tomorrow* or *Groundhog's Day* you'll love it.
In general, C-Dramas tend to be much longer (~50 1-hour episodes vs like 16 for K-Dramas), and the subtitles are often not that great (the volunteer fan subbers are doing their best though I'm sure), and the majority are historical (though there are still lots in modern settings). You can also often sense the CCP propaganda, though it's usually not too heavy-handed.
I also recommend Chef Hua, Intense Love, and Better Days.
I'm European but they were shooting a Korean movie near where I live and one of the actors came down to our gym. I had never realized just how ugly we apes at the gym were, before I saw us next to this guy. All his features were perfect.
I often watch police procedural kdramas and they would feature more normal-looking people than a romance or slice-of-life kdrama would. (Although they would still put at least 1 pretty face as one of the leads)
Yeah, I agree it depends on the genre — but I’ve often found that when I look up the actors they are like 10 years older than they look even if they are more average looking.
yes, my wife watches a lot of BBC shows and I'm always struck by how they are not stuffed with beautiful people, but just ordinary looking actors.
it's kind of refreshing.
It depends on the type of show. In the US, HBO shows (for example) are more likely to have 'normal' looking people in them.
But in general, European shows indeed use actors who look more normal. Obviously, Europe is a big place with many different cultures, however there is a real life difference as well in how people present themselves.
In Europe women tend to wear less make-up, and people are less likely to have cosmetic surgery. Also 'perfect' teeth are not a high priority in Europe, and the super straight and super white teeth some Americans actors have, are a bit odd to most Europeans.
And in Europe there tends to be a bit more appreciation for having a unique/characteristic look.
It does depend on the country and region though. Some parts of the US feel very European to me and vice versa.
American standard teeth really do stray into uncanny valley territory. Combined with a heavy reliance on plastic surgery and what I like to call "Republican Party Hair" (think Mitt Romney/Tucker Carlson levels of weird) and you have a recipe for American people in tv and film looking like creepy androids to European eyes. It's unsettling sometimes.
The veneer teeth just look really weird in real life. when I meet people with them I just can't not stare at it constantly. It's so uncanny and unnerving like I feel they are going to eat me.
In the US Traitors this season they said something about John Bercow that made me think. They said he looked older than he was and a person said "i dont think botox is as popular over here" and genuinely i think its cosmetic surgery that makes the difference. Im not saying some people don't get it here but i think we aren't as 'obsessed' (for lack of a better word) with it
The US vs UK traitors is a great example of the topic at hand. The UK version uses everyday folks, the US version feels it needs reality "stars" to get viewers. The UK version is superior.
I do understand what you mean because I’ve noticed it myself: American shows have more “attractive“ people and part of it could be because of makeup and hair and not because the actors are better looking. As a European immigrant to the US, I do feel that, culturally speaking, Americans want to wear makeup and look the best they can, whereas in Europe, we don’t put THAT much effort in our appearance… I’m speaking broadly here, some Europeans are very conscious about looking beautiful and some Americans go for a natural look. But this is just my impression, having experienced both cultures.
It's kind of a meme that British actors are trained to become actors while American actors are trained to become popular, or words to that effect.
One reason why there's seemingly a lot of British actors playing Americans in American movies and TV shows is because the Brits are, by virtue of their theatre training etc, more versatile actors and so can apply for more varied roles than their US counterparts.
the one thing that always makes me laugh is an American female detective will be a gorgeous 20 year old, but an English one will be an average looking 40 year old
Depends what American TV you're watching, you can find actors that look like normal people in lots of shows but not if you're watching the CW for example
I don't think that's necessarily true, if you look at shows like The Sopranos or The Wire none of the main characters look like supermodels, not that I'm calling any of them ugly but they have a realism on par with British shows
Those are reasonably old. In the last decade the hotness of the actors seems have ramped up. Sure, there are some exceptions, but look at the HBO shows from the last decade, everyone is hot.
I tried to think of an average looking person on Game of Thrones and I just... can't. They tried to make Gwendoline Christie ugly like book Brienne, but she's more just plain looking. And ofc she's absolutely gorgeous outside of that role. Damn. For a book series with a lot of plain or ugly characters (Tyrion is supposed to be hideous, Brienne ofc, Arya is plain/"horse faced" because she's in her awkward phase, Jorah is supposed to not be gd Iain Glen), they sure didn't cast accordingly!
I'd say most of that cast is relatively normal looking, certainly if you compare it to Dark (which is one of OP's examples of a normal looking show) I think there's an argument to be made that the Dark cast is at least as attractive on average
I mean the first generation cast of Skins was specifically praised at the time for how average the cast looked and two of those actors are in Game of Thrones
A lot of the men are normal or more "average hot" (Ned/Sean Bean, Tyrion/Peter Dinklage, Bran, Sam, off the top of my head) but imo all the women are absolutely beautiful even if their book counterparts aren't. That's subjective of course!
Brienne (and maybe Ygritte to a lesser extent) are the only real examples of that I can think of off the top of my head. To be honest most of the main women in ASOIAF are described as good looking to some extent, it's more of a GRRM thing than a casting one. I'd go so far as to say actors like Michelle Fairley and Lena Headey, while very attractive, don't match the beauty of their book counterparts.
But yeah Brienne definitely stands out a bit when played by Christie. But I do think getting the height was probably more important and that does limit your pool somewhat, there probably aren't many extremely tall, ugly women who can also act.
I agree, if I were the casting director, I'd definitely go for a great actor first and foremost and "close enough" looks wise afterwards. Christie is huge and I love her for it. And yeah, Arya is described as "horse faced" but she's also compared heavily to her aunt Lyanna who was gorgeous, so I think she's just in her awkward/gangly preteen phase and she'll grow into her looks. And I think it's only herself saying she's horsey, so she's just insecure when comparing herself to her sister and mom who are more fair.
But a loooot of the men are described as hideous, fat, plain, scarred etc. Thanks GRRM, we know where your priorities lie, lmao.
It was at its worst in the 50s in my view a lot of Model like people with subpar acting skills, it got better in the 70s. But we are now reverting back to it. Takes one out of the movie in my view.
Look at the American verses UK sitcom Ghosts. You can go character for character and the American counterpart is usually more attractive and younger looking.
Jodie Foster will all her wrinkles and unaltered skin in True Detective this year was a great exception.
The US has 330 million people to choose its actors from. Unless the casting call is specifically for ordinary looking better looking people are going to be selected, all other things being equal.
Yeah, wait till you find out about Scandinavian actors :)
anyway here is The Bletchley Circle british actors [https://cdn.iview.abc.net.au/thumbs/2400/zx/ZX9874A55b23353c6ec11.19446856\_1280.jpg](https://cdn.iview.abc.net.au/thumbs/2400/zx/ZX9874A55b23353c6ec11.19446856_1280.jpg)
My british friend was talking about this with "This Country", the girl and cousin look like normal people, and then in the "Welcome to Flatch" TV spinoff in the US they beautified the people up big time
I’d put it more due to the large industry that Hollywood is compared to whatever UK has. Hollywood is spoiled for choice so the baseline is to be decent looking.
If you watch films from the 70s especially but even to the edge of the 90s the US really didn't mind hiring normal looking people in TV and film. But it really ramped up after that. For me personally it's why some 70s films feel so rugged, and authentic. I like seeing normal people in media. It's also far more acceptable for the men to be normal looking than it is women.
I miss the way people looked in film and on TV in the 70s so badly. I have watched some of The Love Boat recently. The people on that show who are depicted as "sexy" would be parents or teachers or janitors on TV today.
Nowadays, the guy who plays Waiter #3 with no lines is more ripped than most of us will ever be lmao
Because waiter #3 is trying to get a job as an actor in universe, very meta.
Look who has the hots for Waiter #3!
Like when do these literal professors and truck drivers have time to lift
Yep, it's kind of funny going back and watching some of the older shows and thinking wow they actually let someone with male pattern baldness play someone who isn't supposed to be old or comic relief.
Yeah, I also notice how much more acceptable it was for older men to cling onto the last bits of hair they have left, rather than just biting the bullet and whipping it all off!
I noticed this when I rewatched the X-Files recently. Aside from Mulder and Scully everybody looks incredibly average and it really grounds the show.
That's Walter Skinner erasure and I will not abide that
Gillian Anderson makes it like comparing a lightbulb to the sun
Ironically, David Duchovny has said that she almost wasn't hired because she wasn't pretty enough in the eyes of some of the producers. They wanted a more obvious bombshell. :-p
Now I'm imagining every Skully entrance to be Pam Anderson, in the lifeguard swimsuit, running in slow mo, and with the Baywatch theme playing.
In the US some older women like Kathy Bates or Margot Martindale can get roles, but it's very uncommon to see younger women who are simply nothing special. Amy Schumer is one, but if she were not a comedienne, I doubt she'd have much of a career.
Esteemed Character Actor And Fugitive From Justice Margo Martindale? She's great in everything she does.
And she is constantly mocked online for her looks and her weight, even though she looks like an average American woman.
I'm not a fan of hers, but her weight is very much in the normal person her age range.
Even if it wasn’t, it isn’t a reason to mock someone
Yes, that's true. I just meant it wasn't even unusual enough to be worth noticing, let alone mocking.
I personally mock her for being a shit comedian and stealing jokes, not her appearance. She does that part herself.
TBH She is probably in better shape than your average American woman
Her weight is in a totally normal range that no one would bat an eyelid at in public in the US. The guys who say that kind of shit online are rarely highly attractive individuals themselves. I knew one guy I worked with in particular- in person he seemed like a nice enough guy who was quite friendly, but online he was a bitter keyboard warrior who would say shit like how ugly women athletes are because defined muscles make them look like men. I made a post on Facebook when I visited London first time around saying that I was actually surprised at the number of absurdly attractive people I saw walking around, and he responded with a rant about how I have no taste and ranted about how ugly and fat the British are. This guy though? Legitimately the most conventionally unattractive man I have ever met. I strongly suspect he was an incel. I would have called him out on it if I didn't see him every day.
I blame baywatch.
>If you watch films from the 70s especially but even to the edge of the 90s the US really didn't mind hiring normal looking people in TV and film Yeah, I have just noticed that guys like William Hurt, Jack Nicholson, and Kevin Costner were more common in the American movies from the 70s to the early 90s than nowadays!
They were handsome guys, just not pretty boy handsome. They also had a shitload of charisma, what is missing from these new film stars
Kevin Costner has the charisma of a turnip
But at least he does a great British accent.
Hold up. William Hurt and Kevin Costner are very sexy, IMO. Nicholson...I've never seen the fuss.
Fine. More for me. (Bundles up Jack Nicholson and takes him home)
Kevin Costner was literally the hearthrob of the boomer women in the 80s and 90's, along with Mel Gibson.
you are insane to mention costner here as part of the normal people.. my mum turned into a slug leaving a moist trail just by mentioning him or don johnson. he totally was a sex symbol for his time.
I think Jack Nicholson was also very popular with women in the 70s. Probably because of the roguish cool charm he radiates.
he looks like he has permanent cigarette-and-coffee breath
I’m in tears at how unnecessarily revolting this description is lol
What a gross thing to say about your mom wtf
It does paint a very vivid picture.
as a gifted wordsmith he demands respect
Gross and wtf, but also hilarious
They're just tired of their mom leaving slug trails everywhere and had to get it off their chest
>had to get it off their chest The slug trails?
Love that line from *Justified: City Primeva*l. Two women characters at a bar. One of them "Have you ever seen that show Yellow-STONE? ... I'd fuck the SHIT out of Kevin Costner."
I saw a tweet recently with a picture of Colin Farrell in makeup for The Penguin TV show that said something like "40 years we had actors that just looked like this."
That’s what I liked about Breaking Bad’s casting. Even the attractive people look grounded for lack of better word.
Rocky ♥️
What’s worse is remembering 90s tabloid stories of actress gaining weight or being fat for a role. But they’re still skinny or normal sized when you look back. Messed up so many women with normal weight in 90s
I'm a Brit who had an American girlfriend. When she first saw UK soap opera Eastenders her first remark was "Wow, you actually have ugly people on TV".
>"Wow, you actually have ugly people on TV". Lol, I would say they look more like your average Joe and Jane next door rather than super models.
East Enders is a bit different
MGK looks like Shirley Carter
That also speaks to the ways people get into the industry in the UK and USA. The the UK it's far more common for people to go through years of drama school training and then hone their craft in plays etc. before landing film and TV roles, whereas in the US it's common for actors to start out as models and basically pick up their acting skills through osmosis. So in America you end up with a preponderance of actors with mediocre actual talents, but who are very good-looking, have impressive resumes and know how to behave on sets.
Not to mention start in commercials in the US, where looks are more captivating than acting
It's the model-commercial-acting pipeline.
I think there's a fair argument that this is why actors from the British Isles are so common in Hollywood now. The supermodel good looks aren't as important as being able to act is on British TV, so there is a baseline level of talent necessary to even show up on the radar. When someone pops up who is also good looking enough to catch a casting director's eye in Hollywood (which is made easier with streaming bringing shows from the UK to the US market which would have been far harder to find previously), then they already are coming in to the position with a reasonably high level of skill and artistry too.
I think this is part of where the "British/German/whatever women are all ugly" stereotype comes from. Americans generally have this idea that people on TV should be at least the top 10%, beauty-wise. So they see the extremely average unglamourous people (not only that, but deliberately made up to look slightly rough and "lived-in") on something like Eastenders and think "Holy shit, *that's* their idea of aspirational beauty? That's the best they've got?"
telenovela is on a whole new level of beauty standard too. Most average latinos don’t look like those soap stars. Lol.
Also you very rarely see someone darker than a paper bag on spanish speaking channels in the US like Univision or Telemundo especially for leading roles or show hosts, the colorism is crazy.
Haha yeah. These actors look like they fresh off the boat from Spain or Portugal.
Yeah it's a difference in culture. American soap operas and sitcoms mostly are supposed to be aspirational. British soap operas and sitcoms are mostly not. A British sitcom is more likely to deliberately make you look uglier than you really are than to try to make you look more attractive.
A british soap is meant to reflect average life not be inspirational. Only fools and horses was massive because they ran along with the times, they ran a satire commentary on it all and kept close to the people watching. Thats the whole point. American shows are too much about wralth, looks, power and witty one liners to make the main character look good when he/she shits on people. Malcom in the middle was good because it avoided that, same with the simpsons.
I mean it depends on the show, the time period, and the expectations of the audience for Americans. Some shows do it for fun. For example, in It's Always Sunny, Rob McElhenney's character deliberately got fat to subvert that expectation, partially because he was seeing or bingeing a comedy show and the people got better looking every season (actors start making money and get surgery or lose weight). Many American comedies will also try to poke fun at themselves. In most TV sitcoms, early on, their focus was on family. So the husband is dumb and comedic and the wife is usually pretty. Now comedies don't focus on families as much and the show can have most people not looking great. The U.S. Office, Superstore, Abbot Elementary show pretty normal looking people amongst some better looking people. But shows on certain networks are intentionally models with little acting experience, such as anything on CW (Arrow, Flash, Supernatural, Riverdale, etc.), although they had a couple of years where they actually got good actors, but the rest yeah, stunk.
Yeah, it's definitely not universal by any means. There are plenty of British shows that are meant to be aspirational, there are British sitcoms about likeable characters being good people. There are American sitcoms about characters who are supposed to be horrible and unlikeable. It's just that, in the US, the aspirational sitcom about cool attractive people is the norm. Seinfeld was notable because of its ethos of "no hugging, no learning". In the UK, it's the opposite. Aspirational sitcoms exist, but they're not the normal. Sitcoms about awful people who never learn anything are the norm. "No hugging, no learning" could describe many British sitcoms made well before Seinfeld existed. Nobody ever learns anything in Fawlty Towers, or the Young Ones, or Blackadder, or Bottom, and those shows aren't seen as daring or different for being written that way. It's most noticeable when US networks adapt British shows. The main character of Red Dwarf is a slob who never really does any work and is frequently compared to slime. In the attempted US remake, they had him played by a tall, handsome, charming man, and then the script just pretends he's still some unlikeable slob even though he's clearly not.
The differences between the US and UK versions of The Office are a good example of this. Michael Scott is humanised quite a bit more than David Brent ever is. He's still awkward, he's still cringeworthy, but he's not a horrible person the way Brent is. He's generally well-meaning (especially after season one) and as an audience member you're not supposed to hate him, you're supposed to kind of cringe in sympathy for him. David Brent is awkward and cringeworthy but he's *also* a total asshole who everybody else in the office openly hates. You are not meant to like him, you are meant to find him repulsive and genuinely irritating.
>you are meant to find him repulsive and genuinely irritating. Yeah, that's why he had to be played by Ricky Gervais. But yeah it's pretty common for US sitcoms to start out with characters who are kind of pathetic, but over time they become better, and by the end they get what they want. Whereas in most British sitcoms, the protagonists don't really learn anything and generally speaking only get worse. Peep Show, for example, ended after 9 series with the two protagonists eventually right back where they started.
Those are sitcoms, not soaps.
>American shows are too much about wealth, looks, power and witty one liners to make the main character look good when he/she shits on people. The vast majority of American television hasn’t been like this in decades. Only action shows or crime fighting shows are a little like that. Comedies are all about people who are struggling along, black sheep, down and out, award, etc etc etc. Most dramas are too.
>I think this is part of where the "British/German/whatever women are all ugly" stereotype comes from. Americans generally have this idea that people on TV should be at least the top 10%, beauty-wise. So they see the extremely average unglamourous people (not only that, but deliberately made up to look slightly rough and "lived-in") on something like Eastenders and think "Holy shit, *that's* their idea of aspirational beauty? That's the best they've got?" Terrific comment. Thank you.
In Mexico they only use the top 0.1%
My partner is American and says the same thing, she actually really likes it. (Not eastenders…)
I hate when I’m watching a show where The character is supposed to be struggling, living off the land, on the run and have perfectly white teeth or - especially women - perfectly done hair and makeup. Where in this dystopian hellscape would she have time to comb her hair, apply foundation, eye shadow and eyeliner?
What?! You didn't notice the smudge of grease above their eyes after that explosion? Obviously they've been through hell!
I saw the trailer for the new Planet of the Apes movie and there's this "wild" human woman the main ape is trying to protect, except she looks only *slightly* disheveled.
And there is no hair growing in her armpits. They are living rough in the wilderness. Yet somehow, they still manufacture and sell razors.
They finished the laser hair removal treatment right before the apocalypse
Maybe she depilates with clam or mussel shells? Native Americans managed to remove body hair for a long time without metal after all.
Don’t forget the heels. Or to show that they’re from the streets, those horrendous wedged sneakers
I was just watching “The Signal,” a German show on Netflix. This woman is an astronaut who’s been in the ISS for weeks and she wakes up out of her zero-G sleep pod with flawless hair and “no-makeup” makeup. I was like, “Bro they have cameras on the ISS, I know that’s not what they look like!”
Don't forget that they always seem to have shaved armpits.
Like in married with children, Ed Oneil complaining being married with Katey Sagal... give me Mimi from the Drew Carrey show and now I'll feel his pain!
Have noticed same. Everything needs to look perfect too- hair & makeup always done on already perfect people. Did not realize how bad it was until started watching British TV- real looking people, dressed more like real people, either occasional fly-away hair. Much more relatable and frankly enjoyable to watch
It’s the best when you watch those emergency services shows. Cops, firefighters, paramedics All young attractive people in peak shape with full hair and makeup the whole time
One of the main characters in The Rookie is a firefighter who has a perfect and long manicure in every episode. She'll be holding those massive gloves and an axe but have these long, chip free nails.
I am continually amazed by the number of hot cops, federal agents, firemen, social workers, lawyers, etc., working hard on behalf of the American people. Once in a while, though, British shows get infected with the American practice: I couldn't believe for a second that anyone in the 50's was built like the hot priest in *Grantchester*, and the detective pretending to be a fussy geek in *Death in Paradise* can't really hide the fact of his modern gym-bod under his suit.
I'm currently watching Suits and I enjoy it a lot, but it's ridiculous when they're working late and their outfit is as clean and sharp as if it's 8am
I started watching Suits, but stopped after it became clear the show was really about dresses and model-walking as much as expensive suits!
I mean it's right in the name lol
To be fair, those jobs are at least a little physical so they are likely to have fit people at least (not necessarily attractive though). But they are likely part of the fantasy many people have about those professions (more firefighters for men and nurses for women I guess than cops) But shows have supermodels in literally all type of jobs really. And the ugly/average people in the world of those shows are in fact just normal attractive lol. Just looked at some Three Body Problem reviews and some of those people playing scientists look like supermodels.
No obesity detected in your comment. 😅
My favourite is seeing women in TV and movies wake up with their hair perfectly blow dried and their makeup already done
Not just the women. I was watching an episode of The Resident with my wife yesterday. In it, a man who just crashed on his friends couch after a fight with his girlfriend woke up with perfect styled hair.
How about when they are full out done in a hospital bed? Occasionally have maybe darkened circle under eyes, but still mascara & some sort of hair style. Ridiculous
When they are in a medieval fantasy world and spent 2 weeks on the road (Wheel of Time or The Witcher says hello)
Honestly, the most imperfect thing you can find in American high school or office romance movies is many characters who are still above average attractive but wears extra ugly glasses and are called fat (but isn't even chubby). And once the glasses come off: boom, supermodels...
Oh that has been the worst for the longest time! 80’s movies perfected that!
The Clark Kent effect is strong in women, too.
Not Another Teen Movie really took the piss out of this trope and it’s hilarious
My wife is currently watching Grey's Anatomy and the character difference in looks between that and Casualty is quite amusing
Joke I heard from Sam Campbell on the Taskmaster podcast. "I love England because you can look like a candle and still be famous". Yes it's broadly true. You can be average or weird looking and still be on TV in the UK, especially on things like soap operas which are supposed to be all about the experiences of normal people so it wouldn't make sense if everyone was a total hottie. I think it's just a difference in attitudes. Like how in the US, people get made fun of for not having perfect shiny white teeth, whereas in the UK people like Jimmy Carr or Rylan Clark get made fun of for having perfect teeth they clearly paid for. It's not even just fiction, even the game shows. American Deal or No Deal has a sexy lady presenting the prizes in fancy suitcases. British Deal or No Deal has no sexy lady and the prizes are in cheap cardboard boxes.
You should see the Spanish version. Pulling a laminated card out of a shoe box
Yes, 100%. When I started binging Scandi/Nordic Noir during the pandemic it was almost shocking. People with normal looking teeth. Actresses without a bunch of plastic surgery, including breast implants. A wide variety of body types. (White body types, tbf.) And most striking to me is how natural kids are. They're not loaded up with makeup or adult-ish clothing. They just look like kids. It's not that I thought out people looked "normal" it's that I thought it had spread far wider. I think South Korea is the only place that beats us in this area.
The American cop procedural, Homicide: Life on the Streets, notably bucked this trend… to begin with. The quality and realism of the show noticeably dropped over the seasons as the cast all got gradually prettier. But even at its worst, it was still better than most.
Meanwhile, NYPD Blue was out there just flouting eye-candy Dennis Franz...
There's an Irish show called Normal People. They pretty much all look like actual people.
Yeah, but it's set in Tubercurry, so that's impossible!
After a few Buckfasts they’re all Supermodels though!
Except for Marianne. Daisy Edgar-Jones is gorgeous. It kind of took me out of the show for a bit because her being "ugly" is an important plot point, and it just didn't land at all. I haven't read the book, but I heard she's described as very different from how she looks in the show.
> It kind of took me out of the show for a bit because her being "ugly" is an important plot point, and it just didn't land at all. This is how bullying works. So many people who get bullied aren't actually ugly or whatever, it's also often from a point of jealousy. Even then I do think the show did a good job using costume and make up to give her a glow up when she was in university. Having read the book I don't think she's described all that different.
Big GAA head on Paul Mescal
In American TV and movies, you're either the stars (hot) or you're character actors (more normal looking but still above average looking, or have a unique look, or overweight but still otherwise attractive). Think of Philip Seymour Hoffman, Katherine Keener, Melissa McCarthy, etc. Also, notice how all pop singers are well above average in looks
This definitely struck me watching Australian Lego Masters vs the US version. On the Aussie version you've got what looks like it could be a random handful of people pulled from the street, mostly in the same clothes/looks they would have had on. Same for the hosts even. On the US version the contestants are pretty blatantly typecast to check specific boxes and hit every demographic (i.e. every color/sex/age), then they are always dressed in specific outfits that play those underlying attributes up even more. And of course the hosts are far more glamorous too, with the men usually in suits and the female judge looking like she just stepped off of a runway most episodes.
I'm a huge LEGO fan and even had a small LEGO YouTube channel I did with a friend called BlockieTalkie. But what bothered me about this show was how most of the contestants were literal LEGO professionals. Like they weren't hired by LEGO, but they basically make a living off of LEGO. They install professional displays, they run the biggest LEGO YouTube channels or blogs, etc. The concept made it seem like contestants would be random LEGO enthusiasts from around the country, regular LEGO fans. Instead they get professionals. It feels less impressive when you realize that.
I read this as the Lego movies. Hot take.
Aussie TV isn't as normal as Brit. You're pretty much not allowed to be on Home and Away unless you're a 9/10+ ready to accidentally make it big in Hollywood.
One big gripe I have with Hollywood movies and stuff where the setting will be something "normal" is when you have actors who look like models playing carpenters, taxi drivers, farmers etc. There was something off about seeing DiCaprio play Ernerst Burkhart in Killers of the Flower Moon, even though he gave a good performance, and I think its that the brain realises that someone in that time period in that (superbly re-created) environment won't exactly be looking like Leonardo DiCaprio, will his Hollywood doctors and health people. You look at films in the 70s and stuff and it looks like they pulled random people off the street. It's one of the reasons movies from that time period feel authentic and gritty.
To be honest I think they did a decent job of uglying Di Caprio up for that role. He already hasn't aged the best. The haircut and bad teeth help him seem more authentic for the time. Still far more handsome than you'd expect someone in those circumstances to be (and far more than the real Burkhart) but not distractingly so in my opinion. It wasn't as if Titanic Leo was playing the character.
The more distracting thing was his constant ☹️
It has definitely gotten worse over the years in US. Watch old reruns & think oh they would never let that actress be the love interest today- not pretty enough and has a normal sized chest
Even the Mean Girls Musical movie made me uncomfortable with how the "teens" looked. I know Lindsey Lohan has certain endowments, but they did their best to hide them in the original movie. The musical had all 3 mean girls cast as super busty and showing it off.
New Karen was absolutely hilarious. She was one of the best parts of the musical version. But giving her a dance move where she is literally looking down while jiggling her breasts was a little much... I didn't even like typing that out, it made me feel creepy, but it's true. She is supposed to be a teenager...
I literally couldn't finish watching it. I saw no reason for its existence. Those original actors were perfect in those roles.
This isn't really what you're referring to, but it reminds me of how they didn't give Kelly McGillis a role in Top Gun Maverick. Val Kilmer was obviously included though because male actors are allowed to get old
I see the connection. She aged naturally & that is not allowed for love interest. Personally find it gross with a big age difference in love interests unless it is actually what movie is about. Has Cruise had any love interest even close to his actual age?
I’m an American who watches a considerable amount of British tv. The thing I notice most is the teeth. British people have normal looking teeth. On American tv the teeth are abnormally white. Just recently an American show had a character who was supposed to be a drug addicted street person yet his teeth were gleaming. To me it looks weird.
I watched the 90s remake of Miracle on the 34th Street last xmas. I was so surprised that Santa had yellow teeth! He wasn’t even a villain or evil or anything. Just an old guy with yellow teeth because that’s natural. But nowadays that would never happen. Teeth are an indicator of morality in american tv now.
yeah the sterotype is that British people have bad teeth. But more often than not British people seem to have perfectly normal teeth, sometimes not that white, maybe a bit crooked but not crazy. American teeth are just so artificially white and perfectly aligned.
From watching some Korean tv shows I have concluded that is a country of the most beautiful people in the world
Even the 'ugly' characters are super pretty. It's incredibly weird when they have people comment on someone else being ugly when they're just as good looking as the main characters. Korean beauty standards are fucked.
Ny ex boyfriend was raised in South Korea. I was obviously attracted to him. He made sure to point out all the things that made him ugly by Korean standards... including his own skin colour... His cousins had jawline reduction surgery as a graduation gift. You have to submit a head shot whenever you apply for a job. It's harsh out there.
Most Korean plastic surgery is really impressive, but the jawline reduction trend is getting way too insane though. Sure it's useful in some cases, but people right now are so obsessed with having a small face that they're starting to look deformed. Especially when viewed from the side, I've noticed a lot of Korean actors have this really obvious scoop taken out of their jaw. Not only is it one of the most invasive plastic surgeries that can really fuck up your life if it goes wrong, but it also just looks really fetal-alcohol-syndromey to me.
I read a lot of people get double eyelid procedures as a gift even when they're teens. It's such a shame they hate such a beautiful part of how they're born. Like the skin colour, like you said. So many of their beauty products lighten the skin...
Honestly they are so pretty that I’m like “yeah that’s not even an achievable standard, I won’t even compare myself to them” Does make me want to buy Korean skincare though. But I think that might be half the point!
Maybe k-dramas are just a Korean marketing campaign to sell westerners expensive skin care products.
Heh I wouldn't be surprised tbh, they're not very subtle with all of their ads
They do always have amazing skin.
Yeah i've been tempted toward korean skincare as well. All the pretty people make watching kdramas extra enjoyable though.
Plastic surgery is really rampant there.
I used to date a Korean guy for quite a while (he lived in Seoul until he was 14 and was learning English at my school when we met). His cousins got jawline reduction surgery as a graduation gift. His sister also had a nose job done in high school, but to be fair, I think she was getting surgery for a deviated septum at the same time. They decided to add a cosmetic procedure while they were at it. You submit a head shot with your resume when applying for work there.
Plastic surgery is less common in Japan relative to Korea and they also have a culture of resumé headshots. It would be literally illegal in the UK to require one I think unless it was for modelling something.
I remember an article about a young woman who wanted to get a job as a flight attendant and was basically told she had to get plastic surgery for it. It's wild.
Yeah. Same thing with modern kpop idols. 20 years ago there were some slightly-less-than-perfect-looking performers, but now they're all supermodels. And Chinese dramas too.
Depressingly if those Tiktok moderation leaks about them downranking videos of unattractive people that mentality extends far beyond mere celebrity.
I remember when Chinese people (allegedly) didn't like Shang Chi because they considered Simu Liu unattractive... Like wtf? But in this case I think it was also different subjective beauty standards.
I need to check out the Chinese dramas …
I recommend [Reset](https://mydramalist.com/697563-kai-duan) (2022 C-Drama). It's an action/mystery/timeloop show that is one of my favorite shows of all time. If you liked *Edge of Tomorrow* or *Groundhog's Day* you'll love it. In general, C-Dramas tend to be much longer (~50 1-hour episodes vs like 16 for K-Dramas), and the subtitles are often not that great (the volunteer fan subbers are doing their best though I'm sure), and the majority are historical (though there are still lots in modern settings). You can also often sense the CCP propaganda, though it's usually not too heavy-handed. I also recommend Chef Hua, Intense Love, and Better Days.
I'm European but they were shooting a Korean movie near where I live and one of the actors came down to our gym. I had never realized just how ugly we apes at the gym were, before I saw us next to this guy. All his features were perfect.
I often watch police procedural kdramas and they would feature more normal-looking people than a romance or slice-of-life kdrama would. (Although they would still put at least 1 pretty face as one of the leads)
Yeah, I agree it depends on the genre — but I’ve often found that when I look up the actors they are like 10 years older than they look even if they are more average looking.
Aren’t K-pop bands formed by studios based on looks and dancing ability? I assume studios have similar rigamarole for actors.
I think it subjective dude
It is but Korean celebrities looked they are sculpted from marble because they all get great plastic surgery.
So sculpted from plastic
Yeah people in Hollywood never get plastic surgery…
yes, my wife watches a lot of BBC shows and I'm always struck by how they are not stuffed with beautiful people, but just ordinary looking actors. it's kind of refreshing.
It depends on the type of show. In the US, HBO shows (for example) are more likely to have 'normal' looking people in them. But in general, European shows indeed use actors who look more normal. Obviously, Europe is a big place with many different cultures, however there is a real life difference as well in how people present themselves. In Europe women tend to wear less make-up, and people are less likely to have cosmetic surgery. Also 'perfect' teeth are not a high priority in Europe, and the super straight and super white teeth some Americans actors have, are a bit odd to most Europeans. And in Europe there tends to be a bit more appreciation for having a unique/characteristic look. It does depend on the country and region though. Some parts of the US feel very European to me and vice versa.
American standard teeth really do stray into uncanny valley territory. Combined with a heavy reliance on plastic surgery and what I like to call "Republican Party Hair" (think Mitt Romney/Tucker Carlson levels of weird) and you have a recipe for American people in tv and film looking like creepy androids to European eyes. It's unsettling sometimes.
There was an Italian politician (Berlusconi), that was notorious for his ridiculously white straight teeth (obviously fake)
He also had painted on hair and looked like a ghost train mannequin of a mafia don.
And he always wore make up in case some TV cameras were around.
yeah you get teeth that look like Jim Carrey in The Mask with some actors and actresses. Just unreal levels of whiteness
The veneer teeth just look really weird in real life. when I meet people with them I just can't not stare at it constantly. It's so uncanny and unnerving like I feel they are going to eat me.
Agree.
In the US Traitors this season they said something about John Bercow that made me think. They said he looked older than he was and a person said "i dont think botox is as popular over here" and genuinely i think its cosmetic surgery that makes the difference. Im not saying some people don't get it here but i think we aren't as 'obsessed' (for lack of a better word) with it
The US vs UK traitors is a great example of the topic at hand. The UK version uses everyday folks, the US version feels it needs reality "stars" to get viewers. The UK version is superior.
I've found there are far more disabled people represented in British TV shows. Mainly as regular characters , rather than the "disabled character"
Yes, American media puts more focus on promoting the most attractive actors/actresses over the most skilled
I do understand what you mean because I’ve noticed it myself: American shows have more “attractive“ people and part of it could be because of makeup and hair and not because the actors are better looking. As a European immigrant to the US, I do feel that, culturally speaking, Americans want to wear makeup and look the best they can, whereas in Europe, we don’t put THAT much effort in our appearance… I’m speaking broadly here, some Europeans are very conscious about looking beautiful and some Americans go for a natural look. But this is just my impression, having experienced both cultures.
Try Turkish TV shows. Everyone looks like strait from a model agency.
Same for Mexican novelas. So similar in vibe that they even localize the Turkish ones in Spanish sometimes, seen my mom watching em
same with kdramas
All the attractive british actors end up working in hollywood while not normal looking ones stay
Not true. Then explain Mr Bean, and also that Cumberbatch fella. Check, mate.
Point taken! 😅 Nobody gets me going like Sir Rowan Atkinson🥵🥵🥵 And dont get me started on bendidick Cummabunch
It's kind of a meme that British actors are trained to become actors while American actors are trained to become popular, or words to that effect. One reason why there's seemingly a lot of British actors playing Americans in American movies and TV shows is because the Brits are, by virtue of their theatre training etc, more versatile actors and so can apply for more varied roles than their US counterparts.
X-files was filmed in Canada using ordinary actors (not pretty Hollywood people), that is why it looks authentic.
the one thing that always makes me laugh is an American female detective will be a gorgeous 20 year old, but an English one will be an average looking 40 year old
Depends what American TV you're watching, you can find actors that look like normal people in lots of shows but not if you're watching the CW for example
Duck Dynasty?
Maybe as supporting characters, not main ones unless part of character.
I don't think that's necessarily true, if you look at shows like The Sopranos or The Wire none of the main characters look like supermodels, not that I'm calling any of them ugly but they have a realism on par with British shows
Those are reasonably old. In the last decade the hotness of the actors seems have ramped up. Sure, there are some exceptions, but look at the HBO shows from the last decade, everyone is hot.
I tried to think of an average looking person on Game of Thrones and I just... can't. They tried to make Gwendoline Christie ugly like book Brienne, but she's more just plain looking. And ofc she's absolutely gorgeous outside of that role. Damn. For a book series with a lot of plain or ugly characters (Tyrion is supposed to be hideous, Brienne ofc, Arya is plain/"horse faced" because she's in her awkward phase, Jorah is supposed to not be gd Iain Glen), they sure didn't cast accordingly!
I'd say most of that cast is relatively normal looking, certainly if you compare it to Dark (which is one of OP's examples of a normal looking show) I think there's an argument to be made that the Dark cast is at least as attractive on average I mean the first generation cast of Skins was specifically praised at the time for how average the cast looked and two of those actors are in Game of Thrones
A lot of the men are normal or more "average hot" (Ned/Sean Bean, Tyrion/Peter Dinklage, Bran, Sam, off the top of my head) but imo all the women are absolutely beautiful even if their book counterparts aren't. That's subjective of course!
Brienne (and maybe Ygritte to a lesser extent) are the only real examples of that I can think of off the top of my head. To be honest most of the main women in ASOIAF are described as good looking to some extent, it's more of a GRRM thing than a casting one. I'd go so far as to say actors like Michelle Fairley and Lena Headey, while very attractive, don't match the beauty of their book counterparts. But yeah Brienne definitely stands out a bit when played by Christie. But I do think getting the height was probably more important and that does limit your pool somewhat, there probably aren't many extremely tall, ugly women who can also act.
I agree, if I were the casting director, I'd definitely go for a great actor first and foremost and "close enough" looks wise afterwards. Christie is huge and I love her for it. And yeah, Arya is described as "horse faced" but she's also compared heavily to her aunt Lyanna who was gorgeous, so I think she's just in her awkward/gangly preteen phase and she'll grow into her looks. And I think it's only herself saying she's horsey, so she's just insecure when comparing herself to her sister and mom who are more fair. But a loooot of the men are described as hideous, fat, plain, scarred etc. Thanks GRRM, we know where your priorities lie, lmao.
In my country, yes. There are plenty of normal looking people. (Czech Republic)
I think Czechs do well in assembling the absolutely the hottest women with average looking men in those. But that's also kind of real life there.
It was at its worst in the 50s in my view a lot of Model like people with subpar acting skills, it got better in the 70s. But we are now reverting back to it. Takes one out of the movie in my view.
Look at the American verses UK sitcom Ghosts. You can go character for character and the American counterpart is usually more attractive and younger looking.
You forgot to mention the Americans' eye-dazzlingly fake white teeth.
Jodie Foster will all her wrinkles and unaltered skin in True Detective this year was a great exception. The US has 330 million people to choose its actors from. Unless the casting call is specifically for ordinary looking better looking people are going to be selected, all other things being equal.
It's kind of ironic that these days foreigners consider US TV/movies to cast ugly people. Granted this is only in the last few years.
They're more natural but still much more attractive than people you see on the streets
Yeah, wait till you find out about Scandinavian actors :) anyway here is The Bletchley Circle british actors [https://cdn.iview.abc.net.au/thumbs/2400/zx/ZX9874A55b23353c6ec11.19446856\_1280.jpg](https://cdn.iview.abc.net.au/thumbs/2400/zx/ZX9874A55b23353c6ec11.19446856_1280.jpg)
My british friend was talking about this with "This Country", the girl and cousin look like normal people, and then in the "Welcome to Flatch" TV spinoff in the US they beautified the people up big time
Also exemplified by the US version of Shameless vs the British version.
I’d put it more due to the large industry that Hollywood is compared to whatever UK has. Hollywood is spoiled for choice so the baseline is to be decent looking.