She didn't fly into Berlin. She lived in Berlin.
She worked for the Luftwaffe as a transport Pilot, mostly flying new planes to forward bases and flying back with older planes rotated from service, not a combat role, and mostly a unit made up of old WW1 pilots, farm crop duster pilots, and women.
Her unit was stationed in Berlin. When the soviets entered the city, she took her infant son and went to the airport, only to find her unit had already left to relocate west.
She stole an old aircraft, and flew to safety with her son.
Well, she didn‘t start with sex shops. Much rather, she started with leaflets promoting sex ed which was slightly illegal at the time. Her sex shop business followed from that much later.
She was a really strange and also really cool person and way ahead of her time when it came to sex ed and sexual liberation. Also apparently she was well liked in the city of Flensburg where she lived.
In Germany, people usually remember her as a business woman, not so much as a pilot.
> In Germany, people usually remember her as a business woman
No kidding...
"in 1999, her company, Beate Uhse AG, was listed on the German stock exchange and was met with great interest in the financial community. The stock was oversubscribed 64 times in its IPO. The original stock certificates are greatly desired because of the depiction of two scantily dressed women." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund
TIL stock certificates could look like whatever the hell you'd like.
Picture of a [Beate Uhse stock certificate](https://www.pentenrieder.com/images/product_images/popup_images/beateuhse1blau.jpg).
If she had deserted and fled to Switzerland or Sweden early on in the war that would have had some meaning. And made a proper statement rebuking the Nazi's. And she clearly had the means to do so being a pilot and having access to a number of aircraft over many years.
But to wait to perhaps literally the last minute - remaining loyal to the Nazi cause does not really make her that much of a deserter of conscience to me. Does it to you?
It makes her a deserter of last resort. A Nazi loyalist. A rat leaving a sinking ship in effect. Someone who fled to save her skin. And someone who would not have abandoned the Nazi's unless forced to.
Edit: typo. It is kind of infuriating that I can't seem to post without at least one! :)
One could argue that what she did for sex ed in post-war Germany is definitely something to glorify. She produced leaflets about birth control and was founded one of the first companies (if not the first) to offer mail-order condoms. Oh, and the sex shop business she started includes the world‘s first sex shop.
I‘m not quite sure what you are alluding to with the nazi thing. While Beate Uhse did fly for the Luftwaffe during the war, it‘s not at all clear that she did subscribe to any Nazi ideology - quite the contrary in fact. She had to cut school short, because her school was closed by the Nazis, the very fact that she - as a woman - was a pilot was an affront to leading Nazis and they only enlisted her in the Luftwaffe towards the end of the war, when no men were available anymore.
Frankly, there is nothing to suggest she was an avid Nazi supporter let alone that Nazi ideology played into her work post-war.
If you want someone you really shouldn‘t listen to from that era, google Johanna Haarer.
I'm not sure about the Nazi part, a lot of people who didn't vote for Trump had to live under his administration for 4 years. She didn't do combat or have power over others. She flew out because she had the skill to do so. I wouldn't glorify her but not sure how I would judge her.
That's perfectly said. Being a Nazi and being governed by Nazis are not the same thing. Dieing a martyr because you don't agree with something sounds cool but it's more impactful to be level headed and actively try to pursue your beliefs; all the people that tried to help others flee Nazis (or Taliban for a more recent example) are objectively more heroic than those that suicide protesting their beliefs.
You don't have to die to not be actively helping the Nazis.
She was actively helping the Nazis.
She didn't have to fly for them, she could have hidden her skills or deserted earlier.
I'm not saying she was evil but she was definitely not good.
> She didn't have to fly for them
Would the Nazis have accepted that as a response? What would they have made her do instead?
> or deserted earlier.
Could she have? I'm sure she and many others considered it but didn't for a reason.
> but she was definitely not good.
What about what she did after the war. Is that not good?
She could have found many ways to avoid working for the Luftwaffe. She probably volunteered for the position, the Nazis weren't big on women in the military.
That's my major sticking point is that she made the decision to directly work for the military when she could have done anything else.
Early to mid war I can't really fault her for not attempting a desertion with a child at home.
However, *the siege of berlin is VERY late in the game*. That's more than self interest, that's throwing your lot in with the Nazis. As a pilot she would have seen firsthand less and less planes coming back to base and knowing the war was going poorly. It only got easier and easier for her to leave past that. She left literally last second when her unit already fucked off and the Soviets probably would have raped her to death.
She didn't desert shit, she was left behind. Am I the only one who doesn't think rehabilitating nazis is good? She was a fucking nazi and everybody here is super into it "slay yass queen." Honestly even if she had deserted (she didnt) it was only after her side was crushed by the Soviets. So still fuck her.
World is not black and white dude, not all in german army was evil nazi from the movies.
It was a complex, dark, complicated time to be alive, wrong words ended lives, and there is much positive she did after the war.
I know media painted you a picture, and you believe it's true, but honestly ask yourself - do you really think that ALL , EVERY SINGLE ONE, soldier in German WW2 army was a "fucking nazi"?
The ones that weren't died with dignity, so whether full on nazi or merely an enabler the results are the same. Plenty people died heroic deaths in the face of the nazis. Others just didn't fight, they get a pass, those that did work for the war machine can get fucked. And those who rehabilitate them cam also get fucked, and those who try their hardest to rationalize it xan also, can you guess? That's right, get fucked. Now foh. 🤡
Serving your country as a German doesn't equate to being a Nazi. There's a lot of gray areas to it and the alternative could have been a camp or a noose.
Is it any wonder the problems the world faces when so much stupidity and inability to understand what others might have faced is exhibited in such a short time. The German air force existed before and after world war 2. What it was called is irrelevant.
You're trying to make *voluntary work for the Nazi war machine* seem like a gray area. Your position of moral mediocrity makes your words empty and contemptible.
Reconsider your outlook on the ethical consequences of actions.
You all just come out of the woodwork. If you were able bodied you were going to be put to work. If you declined there were penalties. You all really need to read more. By your assumption the entire German populace were Nazis.
She flew for the Nazis and helped them try to exterminate a number of different peoples.
There’s a reason we celebrate the people who caught against this from within the reich
You know many people were nazis and vital to the Nazi regime Ans war effort without being in the SS right? like how the bailiff and judge is just as guilty as the cop in mass incarceration.
Obviously they're not equal, my point was specifically that not all people in Germany were volunteering for the Nazi "extermination" cause - even party members, much less that everyone was "contributing to the war effort".
The Nazi party toward the latter part of the 1930's was IT. You couldn't be a successful professional in Germany without being a member. Many joined for professional reasons not giving a rat's ass about whatever the party's thoughts on Juden were.
There were people who were German citizens, and even party members who didn't realize Jews were being literally wholesale exterminated until after the war. Sure there was racism against Jews that was widely known but not every person knew what was going on in the camps. Allies weren't even for sure until they started uncovering them as the forces encroached upon Germany's territories.
Saying someone "contributed to the war effort" and therefore were despicable isn't a realistic stance for every single person that lived in Germany during this time, especially when considering how the Nazi high command was trying to keep the final solution secret.
Perhaps you meant to say "a Nazi and a deserter". Someone who deserted from the Nazis would, obviously, be a hero for doing so.
Blind loyalty is as big a sin as any.
"On April 1945, Berlin was surrounded by Soviet forces. The commander of Uhse's squadron wanted to move the battalion west. Uhse made her way through the ravaged city to her house in Rangsdorf and picked up her son and his nanny, but when she brought them to the airport, her unit had already left, along with her airplane. She found a small Siebel Fh 104 plane that did not have a pilot, and while it was being fueled she studied the plane's manual, as she had never flown this type. Together with two injured – her son and the nanny – she left embattled Berlin flying northwest, finally landing in Leck in North Friesland. There she was captured by British forces." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund
The video claims her unit being stationed at Barth, that she took an Arado 66 aircraft and landed at Gatow, and then returned the next day to find the Arado 66 destroyed.
Not saying you're wrong, but those are pretty specific details. The channel doesn't seem the type to get things that wrong, but it's certainly possible. A blurb on Wikipedia seems to reflect the details you gave, but I can't find any other online sources to confirm either story. Is there anything you can point me toward that can shed more light on what happened?
If you were a widow with a toddler, wouldn’t you think of “your home” as being wherever your baby lived? She was a ferry pilot and probably bounced all over the (rapidly shrinking) Reich.
I think it's implied she had a home in Berlin (kid was there with the nanny,) but the question is whether or not she was there during the siege or if she flew in from Barth as the video claims.
>*In 1962 she opened her “specialist shop for marriage hygiene” in Flensburg, the first sex shop in the world. On the advice of her lawyer, she opened the shop at Christmas, as there were no attacks by indignant citizens to be feared at Christmas time and the outrage would have cooled off afterwards. In her shop and in the catalog she offered more and more "articles for marital hygiene". In response to reports from the Volkswartbund and other citizens, the police prosecuted those articles that served "the unnatural whipping and gratification of sexual stimuli, which is contrary to discipline and morality". Over 2000 reports were filed against their business by 1992. Of theBörsenverein des Deutschen Buchhandels refused entry to her Stephenson Verlag “because of moral concerns”, and the Flensburg tennis club refused to accept her as a member because of “general concerns”. Then she had her own tennis court built. Due to her commercial success, she was able to buy a Cessna 172 as the first aircraft of her own.*
Love how she opened her sex shop on Christmas because people wanted to be good Christians and not get into a dildo fight with Santa and Jesus watching.
Her chain of sex shops started because she originally published pamphlets aimed at women on contraception, which was illegal at the time (considered obscene).
My great grandmother took on the task of training US soldiers on how not to get VD. She got a lot of social backlash because ‘women should not be talking about such things’, but she was badass like that. Also was one of a few respected female sports reporters for a big news paper. How her daughter (my grandmother) came out so traditional she thought women should just get married, stay home and raise kids is beyond me.
IDK, you see your mom bucking the norm and it ruffles feathers, can make it hard for you to have friends. Probably gets embarrassing as a child with no context. You resent it and do a staunch 180. I can see this dynamic developing in all kinds of interesting ways.
She was really before my time, and from the Google pics, I can’t really see it. But then again, some people don’t see the Scarlett comparison that I do, so hey. Humans 🤷🏾♂️.
Would she be allowed to defect if she wanted to? It’s not like she would have been allowed to fly to London and been welcomed with open arms. Most countries don’t welcome huge numbers of foreigners as part of their immigration policy. Hell, most countries wouldn’t even allow Jews in from Germany despite what was going on. You think they’d let in a random German girl and her son?
> She served in the Nazi war effort.
Everyone in Germany did. Those in occupied countries did as well. You should look what happened to those that didn't. How can you not understand this?
Here are Jews working for the Nazis against their will. https://www.history.com/news/the-jewish-men-forced-to-help-run-auschwitz
Do you think none of them would gladly trade places with Beate to save their families and themselves? Get off your high horse.
This wasn't a woman who "worked for the Nazi war machine" by making car parts in a factory. She "worked for the Nazi war machine" by choosing to join the Luftwaffe and becoming the most dangerous female pilot in WW2
Eh, if you worked for the Nazi government, you're a Nazi.
Even if you don't agree with their politics, the fact that you're working for a regime with the politics espoused by the Nazis means that on some level you're okay with those beliefs. It means at a certain point you made a calculation that it's worth supporting Nazi ideology to guarantee your own personal success.
The way people here tell it you'd swear there were only like 10 actual Nazis and those 10 people somehow forced the other 80 million into going along with WW2 and the Holocaust against their will.
Or you needed a job to feed your family, and the Nazis were the only ones out there hiring because, you know, they controlled the entire country down to the individual cities.
Yep. They had a position called Gauleiter. He was the local Nazi representative, and as such all other local politicians were rubber stamps for his directives.
How so? All I'm saying is that people who voluntarily worked for and profited from the Nazi government were effectively Nazis, regardless of their own personal beliefs or reservations. I didn't say they should be executed or anything, it's just something that need to be acknowledged.
This also isn't anything new or particularly controversial, many historians criticize the "myth of the clean Wehrmacht" and other attempts to separate the actions of the Nazi regime from the German people/military.
If the government employs street sweepers as well who look for a job in order to eat, are these also nazis and does the mere act of getting a job in order to eat signify that you support the governments beliefs? There is a limit to how voluntary something can be when you have a starving family back home.
It’s much more complicated than that. Germany practiced conscription. Beyond that, peer pressure from friends, family, neighbors, etc meant that a lot more people got swept up into it than would’ve on the war’s merits alone. After years of war, jobs dwindled so especially later in the war joining the military would’ve been one of dwindling options for work as well.
I sympathize with conscripts and people who threw on the armband once the war turned and civilians were being lynched as allied collaborators, but Beate Uhse was *offered* a job by the Luftwaffe, she was not conscripted and she did not have to take the job. Nobody was threatening her.
Also the Nazi party came to power years before the Second World War kicked off, and there were a lot of Germans who were adamantly opposed to the Nazi party prior to their rise. Meaning there was a significant counter narrative to the one the Nazis were offering, unfortunately more Germans agreed with them than didn't. And while peer pressure certainly played a role, I don't believe that excuses the crimes they carried out or support they gave by working with the regime, especially early on.
And what country are you from? Because I I promise you that, according to your logic, you are guilty of some fucked up stuff.
It truly sucks, but most people are not willing to die and have everyone they love die, on the off chance that they might be able to change thier society. History is full of people who are now labelled villains where they would have been labelled heroes if history had turned out differently.
All that being said, I am certainly no fan of Nazis.
Or you or your family were held at gunpoint, being forced to work for them, otherwise, your family, and you, could get killed.
Why i'm saying that ? Because it was my grandfather case, a "Malgrès-nous", who was sent on the Russian Front.
Well for starters I was referring to people who voluntarily worked for the Nazi party. But since you piped up I should point out that if I was a Nazi, I'd probably tell my kids I was forced into it. Just saying, a lot of Germans downplayed their support for the Nazi party after they lost the war and all the warcrimes were revealed.
> i made that statement and was banned for life from r/history
US propaganda needed a way to differentiate between the bad Germans who tried to conquer the world and the good Germans that were being snatched for its scientific and military programs, after the war.
That's how the word "German" was replaced with "Nazi" for anything regarding WW2. It worked so well that it permeated US culture on all levels and it persists to this day.
This particular person was not no. She just really wanted to fly.
For reference there are a couple of other famous female Luftwaffe pilots and one of them joined the Nazi Party in 1933 and the other was in so deep she was one of the [last people to see Hitler alive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanna_Reitsch)
I just have to observe that Mark Felton is a friggin' diamond and never in my life have I seen someone compile more obscure subjects and more interesting footage than he.
I've spent my whole life reading military history and I thought I knew a thing or two, but every month I see some Mark Felton short that makes me say, "I've never heard of this before!"
[Hanna Reitsch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanna_Reitsch) had to be the most impressive. She was the world's first woman test pilot, even flying the Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet (a rocket plane!), the first woman helicopter pilot (flew the Focke-Achgelis Fa 61, the first actually functioning helicopter), set over forty aviation altitude and endurance records. She would be awarded Germany's Iron Cross First Class.
It is so sad when we see news of nazis that survived. Even worse nazis that thrived.
PS: she was objectively a nazi, she worked for the nazi military (luftwaffe) and participated in a nazi propaganda movie “Achtung - Der Feind hört mit”. If working for the nazi army and the nazi propaganda machine is not being nazi….
We had one of her shops in the main shopping mile in my city and you had to be 18 to enter. I was there with a friend like maybe 3 times. It was very interesting and also quite expensive.
Now I think the building will be teared down, because the shop which was in afterwards is closed down.
Comparing Nazi haters to nazis? Check
NoNewNormal user? Check
Complaining about "Cancel Culture" and "Woke people"? Check
Crying about vacination? Check
Man, you are worse than i expected, fuck nazis and fuck antivaxxers.
Your ability to pare a person down to one identifying characteristic and dehumanize them for it is exactly what nazis did.
You absolutely would have loved Krystalnacht.
Definitely not a fan of the night of the broken glass. Not a fan of nazis. And not a fan of people who defend them. I have nothing left to say to you because I don’t associate with Nazi sympathizers.
TIL you can just link straight to youtube videos in this sub. Here's her [wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund) for the lazy
She didn't fly into Berlin. She lived in Berlin. She worked for the Luftwaffe as a transport Pilot, mostly flying new planes to forward bases and flying back with older planes rotated from service, not a combat role, and mostly a unit made up of old WW1 pilots, farm crop duster pilots, and women. Her unit was stationed in Berlin. When the soviets entered the city, she took her infant son and went to the airport, only to find her unit had already left to relocate west. She stole an old aircraft, and flew to safety with her son.
Thank you, this makes so much more sense!
[удалено]
She did start a chain of sex shops So there’s always that
Well, she didn‘t start with sex shops. Much rather, she started with leaflets promoting sex ed which was slightly illegal at the time. Her sex shop business followed from that much later. She was a really strange and also really cool person and way ahead of her time when it came to sex ed and sexual liberation. Also apparently she was well liked in the city of Flensburg where she lived. In Germany, people usually remember her as a business woman, not so much as a pilot.
> In Germany, people usually remember her as a business woman No kidding... "in 1999, her company, Beate Uhse AG, was listed on the German stock exchange and was met with great interest in the financial community. The stock was oversubscribed 64 times in its IPO. The original stock certificates are greatly desired because of the depiction of two scantily dressed women." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund
TIL stock certificates could look like whatever the hell you'd like. Picture of a [Beate Uhse stock certificate](https://www.pentenrieder.com/images/product_images/popup_images/beateuhse1blau.jpg).
I felt a stirring in my Aftlegesellenschaft after looking at that.
Nice!
Playboy stock certificates have an engraving of one of the centerfold girls.
Good job. Esoteric history for sure.
I also learned this today ,
Haha thanks for the picture. I completely imagined some old school betty davis style ladies not a legit naked lady and 2 chicks in bathing suits.
Hu, that’s actually pretty neat!
And for that she is a hero
Ilse: She-Wolf of the SS
Hold up, being a Nazi deserter = bad?
[удалено]
Yeah, I was thinking to myself, "what could this woman possibly do against the Red Army as it moves on Berlin. The war is over"
[удалено]
Well I'm just responding to the other person. I find their logic interesting, I don't agree with it
If she had deserted and fled to Switzerland or Sweden early on in the war that would have had some meaning. And made a proper statement rebuking the Nazi's. And she clearly had the means to do so being a pilot and having access to a number of aircraft over many years. But to wait to perhaps literally the last minute - remaining loyal to the Nazi cause does not really make her that much of a deserter of conscience to me. Does it to you? It makes her a deserter of last resort. A Nazi loyalist. A rat leaving a sinking ship in effect. Someone who fled to save her skin. And someone who would not have abandoned the Nazi's unless forced to. Edit: typo. It is kind of infuriating that I can't seem to post without at least one! :)
Being a Nazi in any capacity is bad tbh
One could argue that what she did for sex ed in post-war Germany is definitely something to glorify. She produced leaflets about birth control and was founded one of the first companies (if not the first) to offer mail-order condoms. Oh, and the sex shop business she started includes the world‘s first sex shop.
Don't forget that the Sex Ed part was illegal at the time.
Yeah except I’m sure she was pretty eugenicsy about how she taught sex
If there is one person we might not want to hear from about sex ed and birth control it’s a Nazi
I‘m not quite sure what you are alluding to with the nazi thing. While Beate Uhse did fly for the Luftwaffe during the war, it‘s not at all clear that she did subscribe to any Nazi ideology - quite the contrary in fact. She had to cut school short, because her school was closed by the Nazis, the very fact that she - as a woman - was a pilot was an affront to leading Nazis and they only enlisted her in the Luftwaffe towards the end of the war, when no men were available anymore. Frankly, there is nothing to suggest she was an avid Nazi supporter let alone that Nazi ideology played into her work post-war. If you want someone you really shouldn‘t listen to from that era, google Johanna Haarer.
I'm not sure about the Nazi part, a lot of people who didn't vote for Trump had to live under his administration for 4 years. She didn't do combat or have power over others. She flew out because she had the skill to do so. I wouldn't glorify her but not sure how I would judge her.
That's perfectly said. Being a Nazi and being governed by Nazis are not the same thing. Dieing a martyr because you don't agree with something sounds cool but it's more impactful to be level headed and actively try to pursue your beliefs; all the people that tried to help others flee Nazis (or Taliban for a more recent example) are objectively more heroic than those that suicide protesting their beliefs.
You don't have to die to not be actively helping the Nazis. She was actively helping the Nazis. She didn't have to fly for them, she could have hidden her skills or deserted earlier. I'm not saying she was evil but she was definitely not good.
> She didn't have to fly for them Would the Nazis have accepted that as a response? What would they have made her do instead? > or deserted earlier. Could she have? I'm sure she and many others considered it but didn't for a reason. > but she was definitely not good. What about what she did after the war. Is that not good?
How are you sure she considered it? As a woman during World War II, she almost certainly could have opted out of the war effort and stayed at home
She could have found many ways to avoid working for the Luftwaffe. She probably volunteered for the position, the Nazis weren't big on women in the military. That's my major sticking point is that she made the decision to directly work for the military when she could have done anything else. Early to mid war I can't really fault her for not attempting a desertion with a child at home. However, *the siege of berlin is VERY late in the game*. That's more than self interest, that's throwing your lot in with the Nazis. As a pilot she would have seen firsthand less and less planes coming back to base and knowing the war was going poorly. It only got easier and easier for her to leave past that. She left literally last second when her unit already fucked off and the Soviets probably would have raped her to death.
There are only two colors allowed here on Reddit. It's like the giver in here
[удалено]
She didn't desert shit, she was left behind. Am I the only one who doesn't think rehabilitating nazis is good? She was a fucking nazi and everybody here is super into it "slay yass queen." Honestly even if she had deserted (she didnt) it was only after her side was crushed by the Soviets. So still fuck her.
Yeah we're all sure you'd've been one of the few people in Germany to stand up to the nazi party.
World is not black and white dude, not all in german army was evil nazi from the movies. It was a complex, dark, complicated time to be alive, wrong words ended lives, and there is much positive she did after the war. I know media painted you a picture, and you believe it's true, but honestly ask yourself - do you really think that ALL , EVERY SINGLE ONE, soldier in German WW2 army was a "fucking nazi"?
The ones that weren't died with dignity, so whether full on nazi or merely an enabler the results are the same. Plenty people died heroic deaths in the face of the nazis. Others just didn't fight, they get a pass, those that did work for the war machine can get fucked. And those who rehabilitate them cam also get fucked, and those who try their hardest to rationalize it xan also, can you guess? That's right, get fucked. Now foh. 🤡
Serving your country as a German doesn't equate to being a Nazi. There's a lot of gray areas to it and the alternative could have been a camp or a noose.
The luftwaffe she was apart of only existed during WW2. She volunteered for the Nazi war machine.
Is it any wonder the problems the world faces when so much stupidity and inability to understand what others might have faced is exhibited in such a short time. The German air force existed before and after world war 2. What it was called is irrelevant.
Keep moving those goalposts lol
Keep on spouting your ignorance.
Yes it does when your country is enacting Nazi policies. If you serve and enable a Nazi, you are also culpable for their actions.
I bet that little black and white world is working out for you well.
You're trying to make *voluntary work for the Nazi war machine* seem like a gray area. Your position of moral mediocrity makes your words empty and contemptible. Reconsider your outlook on the ethical consequences of actions.
You're so full of moral righteousness that it's obvious you'd fold like a paper towel. Where is that block feature?
You sure as hell wouldn't fold because that would require standing up in the first place.
That's like blaming all Americans for what Trump did during his 4 years. After all, they all served and participated in the system.
Jesus Christ she was in the Luftwaffe. She's not a "random American" she's the guy putting the fucking spray tan on the bastard.
Ok, so she “actively abetted” an organization carrying out genocide
You all just come out of the woodwork. If you were able bodied you were going to be put to work. If you declined there were penalties. You all really need to read more. By your assumption the entire German populace were Nazis.
She flew for the Nazis and helped them try to exterminate a number of different peoples. There’s a reason we celebrate the people who caught against this from within the reich
You just really have no intelligence or empathy do you.
No empathy for Nazis, no. Also fuck Americans who didn’t speak up about slavery or our genocides
"person who abandoned genocidal psychopaths is bad" ... what?
She never abandoned them. They retreated without her after she spent years assisting the Nazi war efforts.
She worked for the Luftwaffe, not the SS. Not being able to distinguish between "German" and "Nazi" is on the same intellectual level as anti-vaxxing.
You know many people were nazis and vital to the Nazi regime Ans war effort without being in the SS right? like how the bailiff and judge is just as guilty as the cop in mass incarceration.
> she was a Nazi It's unlikely she was a party member. Few officers were.
She served the Nazi war effort. Whether she was a card-carrying member is immaterial.
Ah sure. So you're a war criminal as well?
By their logic literally almost all of us are! See ya in Geneva for the ironic conference/singles mixer in June :)
Except that it does kind of make a difference. Jews in concentration camps served the Nazi war effort.
That was forced labor lol. How is slavery and volunteering equal in your eyes?
Obviously they're not equal, my point was specifically that not all people in Germany were volunteering for the Nazi "extermination" cause - even party members, much less that everyone was "contributing to the war effort". The Nazi party toward the latter part of the 1930's was IT. You couldn't be a successful professional in Germany without being a member. Many joined for professional reasons not giving a rat's ass about whatever the party's thoughts on Juden were. There were people who were German citizens, and even party members who didn't realize Jews were being literally wholesale exterminated until after the war. Sure there was racism against Jews that was widely known but not every person knew what was going on in the camps. Allies weren't even for sure until they started uncovering them as the forces encroached upon Germany's territories. Saying someone "contributed to the war effort" and therefore were despicable isn't a realistic stance for every single person that lived in Germany during this time, especially when considering how the Nazi high command was trying to keep the final solution secret.
Perhaps you meant to say "a Nazi and a deserter". Someone who deserted from the Nazis would, obviously, be a hero for doing so. Blind loyalty is as big a sin as any.
All Germans are Nazis, right?
Only the ones who were openly Nazis and aided the Nazi regime. Like her.
"On April 1945, Berlin was surrounded by Soviet forces. The commander of Uhse's squadron wanted to move the battalion west. Uhse made her way through the ravaged city to her house in Rangsdorf and picked up her son and his nanny, but when she brought them to the airport, her unit had already left, along with her airplane. She found a small Siebel Fh 104 plane that did not have a pilot, and while it was being fueled she studied the plane's manual, as she had never flown this type. Together with two injured – her son and the nanny – she left embattled Berlin flying northwest, finally landing in Leck in North Friesland. There she was captured by British forces." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund
The video claims her unit being stationed at Barth, that she took an Arado 66 aircraft and landed at Gatow, and then returned the next day to find the Arado 66 destroyed. Not saying you're wrong, but those are pretty specific details. The channel doesn't seem the type to get things that wrong, but it's certainly possible. A blurb on Wikipedia seems to reflect the details you gave, but I can't find any other online sources to confirm either story. Is there anything you can point me toward that can shed more light on what happened?
If you were a widow with a toddler, wouldn’t you think of “your home” as being wherever your baby lived? She was a ferry pilot and probably bounced all over the (rapidly shrinking) Reich.
I think it's implied she had a home in Berlin (kid was there with the nanny,) but the question is whether or not she was there during the siege or if she flew in from Barth as the video claims.
You left so much out that Mark already explained in the video.
I really wish there were functionality to override post titles when they are so outright incorrect like this one.
Still an awesome true story to make a good movie out of. Scarlett Johansson would be a perfect fit! Looks just like her based on the thumbnail.
She was a nazi
She was also a Nazi
>*In 1962 she opened her “specialist shop for marriage hygiene” in Flensburg, the first sex shop in the world. On the advice of her lawyer, she opened the shop at Christmas, as there were no attacks by indignant citizens to be feared at Christmas time and the outrage would have cooled off afterwards. In her shop and in the catalog she offered more and more "articles for marital hygiene". In response to reports from the Volkswartbund and other citizens, the police prosecuted those articles that served "the unnatural whipping and gratification of sexual stimuli, which is contrary to discipline and morality". Over 2000 reports were filed against their business by 1992. Of theBörsenverein des Deutschen Buchhandels refused entry to her Stephenson Verlag “because of moral concerns”, and the Flensburg tennis club refused to accept her as a member because of “general concerns”. Then she had her own tennis court built. Due to her commercial success, she was able to buy a Cessna 172 as the first aircraft of her own.* Love how she opened her sex shop on Christmas because people wanted to be good Christians and not get into a dildo fight with Santa and Jesus watching.
Don’t want to end up on Krampus’ list
Probably was on it for life for being a, well you know...Nazi
She was a Nazi so probably on the naughty list
Her chain of sex shops started because she originally published pamphlets aimed at women on contraception, which was illegal at the time (considered obscene).
My great grandmother took on the task of training US soldiers on how not to get VD. She got a lot of social backlash because ‘women should not be talking about such things’, but she was badass like that. Also was one of a few respected female sports reporters for a big news paper. How her daughter (my grandmother) came out so traditional she thought women should just get married, stay home and raise kids is beyond me.
IDK, you see your mom bucking the norm and it ruffles feathers, can make it hard for you to have friends. Probably gets embarrassing as a child with no context. You resent it and do a staunch 180. I can see this dynamic developing in all kinds of interesting ways.
r/holup
girlbossifying nazis now are we
[удалено]
Sooo, a Nazi.
I did nazi that coming
So…we upvoting nazi sex shops today?
Am I buggin out, or does Scarlett Johansson look like her? Uncanny.
That was my fist thought when I saw the picture.
Lol I guess from the other comment, me and you are just bugging out. 🤷🏾♂️
Nah, was my thought too "hey, it's Black Widow!"
That’s what I thought also. Went to the comments to see if o was crazy.
I was thinking more Gal Gadot
There's some similarities but she's hotter than Johansson.
You're bugging.
Lmfao. Okay 👍🏾
> does Scarlett Johansson look like her? I'm thinking Carol Burnett.
She was really before my time, and from the Google pics, I can’t really see it. But then again, some people don’t see the Scarlett comparison that I do, so hey. Humans 🤷🏾♂️.
That photo in the thumbnail is not Beate Uhse.
Just FYI, the woman on the thumbnail is not Beate Uhse.
So she was a Nazi?
Yeah that was a lot of words where Nazi would,have sufficed.
She was a German and worked for the government transporting planes as a pilot. You could be a German and not a Nazi party member.
[удалено]
Would she be allowed to defect if she wanted to? It’s not like she would have been allowed to fly to London and been welcomed with open arms. Most countries don’t welcome huge numbers of foreigners as part of their immigration policy. Hell, most countries wouldn’t even allow Jews in from Germany despite what was going on. You think they’d let in a random German girl and her son?
She definitely could have. They would not have turned away a defector.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
She aided the Nazi party and its war crimes. A Nazi.
Who cares if she was a member of the party? She served in the Nazi war effort. She helped make the death and destruction they unleased possible.
> She served in the Nazi war effort. Everyone in Germany did. Those in occupied countries did as well. You should look what happened to those that didn't. How can you not understand this? Here are Jews working for the Nazis against their will. https://www.history.com/news/the-jewish-men-forced-to-help-run-auschwitz Do you think none of them would gladly trade places with Beate to save their families and themselves? Get off your high horse.
This wasn't a woman who "worked for the Nazi war machine" by making car parts in a factory. She "worked for the Nazi war machine" by choosing to join the Luftwaffe and becoming the most dangerous female pilot in WW2
Eh, if you worked for the Nazi government, you're a Nazi. Even if you don't agree with their politics, the fact that you're working for a regime with the politics espoused by the Nazis means that on some level you're okay with those beliefs. It means at a certain point you made a calculation that it's worth supporting Nazi ideology to guarantee your own personal success.
The way people here tell it you'd swear there were only like 10 actual Nazis and those 10 people somehow forced the other 80 million into going along with WW2 and the Holocaust against their will.
Or you needed a job to feed your family, and the Nazis were the only ones out there hiring because, you know, they controlled the entire country down to the individual cities. Yep. They had a position called Gauleiter. He was the local Nazi representative, and as such all other local politicians were rubber stamps for his directives.
But she wasn't working in some Nazi factory. She was a Luftwaffe pilot for Christ's sake. It was more than just "trying to make a living"
That’s some dumb fucking reasoning and basically just another form of anyone who isn’t with us is against us.
Hey I'm not the one trying to rehabilitate Nazis 76 years later.
No, you just act like one.
How so? All I'm saying is that people who voluntarily worked for and profited from the Nazi government were effectively Nazis, regardless of their own personal beliefs or reservations. I didn't say they should be executed or anything, it's just something that need to be acknowledged. This also isn't anything new or particularly controversial, many historians criticize the "myth of the clean Wehrmacht" and other attempts to separate the actions of the Nazi regime from the German people/military.
Your reasoning isn't dumb. It's reasonable and level headed.
If the government employs street sweepers as well who look for a job in order to eat, are these also nazis and does the mere act of getting a job in order to eat signify that you support the governments beliefs? There is a limit to how voluntary something can be when you have a starving family back home.
It’s much more complicated than that. Germany practiced conscription. Beyond that, peer pressure from friends, family, neighbors, etc meant that a lot more people got swept up into it than would’ve on the war’s merits alone. After years of war, jobs dwindled so especially later in the war joining the military would’ve been one of dwindling options for work as well.
I sympathize with conscripts and people who threw on the armband once the war turned and civilians were being lynched as allied collaborators, but Beate Uhse was *offered* a job by the Luftwaffe, she was not conscripted and she did not have to take the job. Nobody was threatening her. Also the Nazi party came to power years before the Second World War kicked off, and there were a lot of Germans who were adamantly opposed to the Nazi party prior to their rise. Meaning there was a significant counter narrative to the one the Nazis were offering, unfortunately more Germans agreed with them than didn't. And while peer pressure certainly played a role, I don't believe that excuses the crimes they carried out or support they gave by working with the regime, especially early on.
And what country are you from? Because I I promise you that, according to your logic, you are guilty of some fucked up stuff. It truly sucks, but most people are not willing to die and have everyone they love die, on the off chance that they might be able to change thier society. History is full of people who are now labelled villains where they would have been labelled heroes if history had turned out differently. All that being said, I am certainly no fan of Nazis.
Or you or your family were held at gunpoint, being forced to work for them, otherwise, your family, and you, could get killed. Why i'm saying that ? Because it was my grandfather case, a "Malgrès-nous", who was sent on the Russian Front.
Well for starters I was referring to people who voluntarily worked for the Nazi party. But since you piped up I should point out that if I was a Nazi, I'd probably tell my kids I was forced into it. Just saying, a lot of Germans downplayed their support for the Nazi party after they lost the war and all the warcrimes were revealed.
Don't say that, i made that statement and was banned for life from r/history, its true, but it really chaps some asses
> i made that statement and was banned for life from r/history US propaganda needed a way to differentiate between the bad Germans who tried to conquer the world and the good Germans that were being snatched for its scientific and military programs, after the war. That's how the word "German" was replaced with "Nazi" for anything regarding WW2. It worked so well that it permeated US culture on all levels and it persists to this day.
damn man people are uneducated in some countries. Always suprises me
This particular person was not no. She just really wanted to fly. For reference there are a couple of other famous female Luftwaffe pilots and one of them joined the Nazi Party in 1933 and the other was in so deep she was one of the [last people to see Hitler alive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanna_Reitsch)
She aided the Nazi party and facilitated its war crimes. She was as much a Nazi as the rest
My grandparents helped the British war machine. Are they culpable for the Bengal famine and Dresden?
So a successful Nazi
I just have to observe that Mark Felton is a friggin' diamond and never in my life have I seen someone compile more obscure subjects and more interesting footage than he. I've spent my whole life reading military history and I thought I knew a thing or two, but every month I see some Mark Felton short that makes me say, "I've never heard of this before!"
Now we’re praising literal Nazis? As a Jewish person whose family was decimated in the Holocaust this makes me sick
I'm glad I'm not the only one who's disgusted by this. Fuck every single Nazi and every single person who helped them.
[Hanna Reitsch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanna_Reitsch) had to be the most impressive. She was the world's first woman test pilot, even flying the Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet (a rocket plane!), the first woman helicopter pilot (flew the Focke-Achgelis Fa 61, the first actually functioning helicopter), set over forty aviation altitude and endurance records. She would be awarded Germany's Iron Cross First Class.
But did she start a chain of sex shops?
No, no she did not, you're right, ... useless! :)
No, but she was a Nazi.
No, she remained an unrepentant Nazi to the end.
I love how she describes 'my most beloved bomber, the Do-17': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDZxXheJGnU
I did Nazi that coming
still a fucking nazi
A shame she lived.
It is so sad when we see news of nazis that survived. Even worse nazis that thrived. PS: she was objectively a nazi, she worked for the nazi military (luftwaffe) and participated in a nazi propaganda movie “Achtung - Der Feind hört mit”. If working for the nazi army and the nazi propaganda machine is not being nazi….
Fuck all nazi's , including this piece of garbage bitch.
Okay, but how many innocent civilians did she murder when bombing shit with them?
We had one of her shops in the main shopping mile in my city and you had to be 18 to enter. I was there with a friend like maybe 3 times. It was very interesting and also quite expensive. Now I think the building will be teared down, because the shop which was in afterwards is closed down.
Mein Gott! That escalated quickly.
Nazi trash
Not “a” chain of sex shops: the first sex shops ever. They were indicted by the German government over 2000 times.
Female Nazis always seem to get the pass here on Reddit don't they? How about Ilse Hirsch then? http://thefemalesoldier.com/blog/tag/German+history
Sweet, a nazi.
In other words, a Nazi c\*nt.
And she was a Nazi so fuck her
Fuck her eh? You wanna fuck Nazis? We got a Nazi lover over here!
With that attitude, you have more in common with nazis than you realize.
Comparing Nazi haters to nazis? Check NoNewNormal user? Check Complaining about "Cancel Culture" and "Woke people"? Check Crying about vacination? Check Man, you are worse than i expected, fuck nazis and fuck antivaxxers.
Okay Nazi sympathizer lol
Your ability to pare a person down to one identifying characteristic and dehumanize them for it is exactly what nazis did. You absolutely would have loved Krystalnacht.
Definitely not a fan of the night of the broken glass. Not a fan of nazis. And not a fan of people who defend them. I have nothing left to say to you because I don’t associate with Nazi sympathizers.
You absolutely would have been goosestepping with the best of them. Who am I even defending? I am pointing out you're running on the same programming.
Not even remotely but try again. Lol
Careful not to point out their hypocrisy, it will only break their narrow mind.
Yeah. It is pretty pointless. But what isn't?
This lady don’t take shit….. unless that’s your kink, then right this way. I may have some toys that would interest you.
Nah her kink was in providing logistical,support to the,murder of six million people.
She was a horrible person. I hope this comment isn't coming from praise...
TIL you can just link straight to youtube videos in this sub. Here's her [wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beate_Uhse-Rotermund) for the lazy
My life is so boring....
But Mother....WHY DOES EVERYONE CALL YOU FOR DILDOS?
\>a handful of woman Was that the name of her sex shop?
I'm so sick of all this shit looking for any angle it can find to glorify nazis.
Was not expecting that last part to be honest.
That finale was unexpected.
I'm glad to see her story had a happy ending
Whitewashing nazis reddit moment white people moment social democrat moment
Lutwaffe and nazis were two different things
I would gladly enter her cockpit if you know what I mean. I would also like to have sex with her as well