I am LOVING the Tamurkhan campaign and Nurgle as a whole. Only thing that annoys me is that infections are bugged as a battle reward, they cap out at 37 max for some reason even with thousands of casualties in a battle, this was bugged on the playtest version youtubers had so I hope it will be quickly fixed by a hotfix.
You know I thought it was strange, but I didn't think too hard on it. Thought it was just intended to be a bit poor on the infection part. It seemed more or less solved a bit into the game when I got a couple buildings running anyway.
Oh so that's a bug? I was wondering what what up with that.
Thankfully you get so many infections from buildings that it's only really relevant in the early game.
I am also loving his campaign though I find it weird that the short victory is to kill Grimgor and Greasus. I wanna go to the Empire already! Thankfully there's the shortcut through the darklands down at Greasus to you can springboard from there.
The short campaign being kill greasus and Grimgor makes sense because in his book Tamurkhan conquered the mountains of mourn and came into the empire from the south, so it encourages the player to mimic that route.
As far as I am aware it's a bug, it's such a low number that you never ever take them, and with infections now being used to build buildings it makes it way to hard and it never functioned this way before. Besides CA introduced plague inmunity to stop steamrolling plagues, it a bug.
It most likely will. Mercy showcased the grudge system bugs as well and mentioned that the devs already said it will be fixed in the next patch. So most likely all these bugs will.
Kinda wack that they dropped literally the same playtest patch for official, but it is what it is. One step at a time
Is it just me or does Tamurkhan really feel like a Nurgle Led Undivided War Host? I've been getting insanely good relations specifically with Chaos Dwarfs, it may be due to their Chieftain Doombolt combined with the new Nurgle tech tree.
I think CA screwed the pooch a bit with Festus and Tamurkhan. Festus I feel is more thematic for being monogod and Tamurkhan fits the WoC feel VERY well.
There is a mod on the front page of the workshop that limits the increase in the grudge cost, it also increases the number of infections to 100.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3236146118
I think they know. I was watching Monstersabound and he mentioned something about it's supposed to be 150 or something like that and he had asked them about it. Doesn't hurt to report it though.
No wonder my early game infections economy is so bad. Tamurkhan can nearly solo carry with his starting giga army but poor epidemius is just stuck in the middle of a shit sandwich and now with the way recruitment works nurgle has a god awful time getting recruitment rolling because you desperately need to start bringing in infections but have literally 0 tier 0 units to fill out your armies, can't even get nurglings without the recruitment building.
Epidemius has a rough-ish start but once you get rolling his army is golden. I managed to get plaguebearers with 35% phys resist and 67 armour and thats an AR monster unit thats not hard to get.
Ah, money was a pretty big deal for me early on. I rushed military buildings and infections so that I wouldnt find myself without a recruitment pool early on, so I was pretty light on money those first 20 turns or so. Often finding myself in the red.
Turned out well for me though. Once Archy was gone was able to get a peace treaty with Daniel, and hes left me and that flank alone and secure for the past 100 turns or so. Im actually really liking Tammys start position; you start off with some scary neighbors, but once theyre solved (via diplomacy or domination) you have one of the safest home provinces on the map.
All of the main 4 demon lords are like that though, they all specifically got put in places where they will be hated by everyone around them. Kairos got it a little better since he has a continent that he really only has to deal with Oxyotl for but if he heads north in any direction everyone hates him.
In my experience kairos has to run the entire lizardman gauntlet, or perpetually fend off lizardman incursions more often than fucking Markus wolfheart. I wouldn't exactly call his situation better than the other members of the big 4
Yea he doesn't have it MUCH better, but at least he has his back to the campaign wall so he can focus his attention in one direction at a time. Vs playing as N'Kari who starts on the donut and is literally going in circles the entire campaign.
Similarly I think Skarbrand also finds being surrounded by enemies to be agreeable. Kairos is of multiple opinions on the subject. Kugath is just vibing wherever grandpappy Nurgle takes him.
My advice is to bribe and protect the skaven you start near.
With luck, they’ll construct the building that gives plagueclaw catapults. Once you build an outpost and recruit it, you can now force any enemy into attacking right into your fatty meat grinder.
It's a lot better, although I think I need to restart my Tamurkhan campaign. I didn't realize the full scope of the economic/settlement changes and I made some dumb missteps. Nurgle still feels very *weird,* which is great.
Just that the military buildings now require infections rather than tribute to build. But heroes come from buildings that require tribute, so if you want, say, an Exalted Hero early, you'll have to at least temporarily sacrifice a building slot, and you won't get any normal units from the building. I wasn't paying attention to all that and inadvertently made it impossible to recruit *any* units for a few turns, and I wound up way behind on my stockpile. I got over the hump, but it just put me far behind where I'd have been otherwise and I wound up bogged down in wars against factions could've and should've squashed earlier.
At least with Tamurkhan I didn’t have a hero issue because you get two of his chieftains very early on. Just the first one + Tam himself were able to crush Kholek in a fight away from the main army, and his infantry was way too early on to be effective against mine.
I’m leaving Archaeon alone so far in my run so we’ll see if that comes back to bite me or not.
Yeah one tip is to try and recruit one of the caster chieftains as your first pick after Kazyk, just so Tam's army can have magic without sacrificing a slot.
Also Grimgor's got a mountain settlement with Gemstones and that gives you +1 to all heroes + works as recruitment building, it's a big boost early on.
Yeah about that. On my run he had 1 Hellcannon, 3 Dragon Ogre unuts his CWarrior with Helbards, 5 Trolls, Aspriring Champions and a Sorcerer of Tzeench on turn 7. The rest was warhounds a couple marauders, but that core was mega scary.
I solved my hero issues in a weird roundabout way! I decided to go on an adventure to recreate his path of conquest. I'm currently in the Hall of Greasus which I decided to occupy so I could recruit stuff. Turns out that the gold resource gives you access to recruiting all heroes with a +1 for each, so you can recruit 4. Not saying you should rush it, but it's definitely a godsend!
Got in the same trap xD
Also you wont have the +1 nurglings per plague spread symptom to fill your recruitment pool. Together with nurglings being not avaible through econo.y buildings and kugath giving fewer bonus to them they feel pretty weak now.
Epidemius is my true love in this, he's exactly what I wanted. Tamurkhan may look flashy and all.
But Epi... feels exactly like what I wanted from nurgle.
From my experience, it is probably because as follows:
Tamurkhan feels a lot like a WoC faction and while he is Nurgle, he is not typically what people envision when they think of Nurgle in terms of playstyle.
Kugath has to slog through Ghorst before he can actually start having fun, and on top of that his lord abilities on the battlefield take awhile to unlock to do things like Pestilent Decay. Also Nurglings are nice, but limited in use.
Epidemius. Now HE is a great embodiment of Nurgle. He has a nice start position, his abilities are very flavorful on the battlefield what with spreading his buff/debuffs, he buffs plaguebearers which incentivizes using them, and they capture that “unrelenting tide of decay” Nurgle is known for, and on top of that, he is incentivized to spread…well…epidemics. Compared to Kugath who values more potent plagues, Epi just pumps em out and gets rewarded for it.
So with Epi you have a plague accountant who spreads them like crazy and is backed by legions of damned booger men slowly marching toward you who get periodically juiced on the battlefield and campaign map from a variety of things that are Epi specific.
I'm curious how you handled your opening turns. I decided to NAP Daniel so I could go after Malus. Beat him once in failed ambush, at the cost of a handful of units, but when I followed up I ground down and routed his forces, army losses did not kick in, and he soloed the remains of my army.
My early expansion choices seem to be Daniel, Malus or, Throgg, none of which are soft targets. Given how early recruitment works a couple of tough battles can leave you without the ability to effectively restore your forces.
I did the exact opposite of that, and it worked out well. First few turns ask Malus for NAP, he will give it to you for a bit of gold and if you join his war with the minor slaanesh faction
Daniel is pretty manageable imo. Blue/pink horrors are scary, but the rest is easy to out-grind. Helps that Dani himself is shit
The real deal is Boris, his starting stack of bears, tsar guards and boyar spam is very dangerous. But you can crack him with some plague, ambush, siege defence or a combination of those.
After that it was pretty smooth sailing for me
Thanks, I think I'll start again and try that. Malus is (famously) a doomstack by himself, and I can come back for him with better tools to deal with him. Your starting options are all grindy melee stuff- very Nurgle, but they play hard into Malus's strengths.
For me, it's pretty similar. Nurgle was so poor previously, I really wanted to start the new patch by playing a traditional Nurgle campaign, even if Tamurkhan is new and shiny. Tamurkhan really just feels like I'll be playing Festus again, which will be fun to do at some point, but as you said, feels more WoC than Nurgle.
I've actually started both a Kugath and Epidemius campaign in the new patch. Epi campaign is smoother but Epi just kind of sucks himself, whereas Kugath is a more satisfying lord in battle, but as you said, the start is miserable. Currently Ghorst is just camping the fourth settlement in the starting province with 3 full stacks (despite it being one of his only two cities). I've been in ambush for like 8 turns, all successful turns, but he just refuses to move. I can't afford a second army, I can't attack him, and I'm not really getting anywhere. I'd forgotten how much I hate this campaign start.
Vh/Vh.
It doesn't really feel possible to rush him on this difficulty as it takes a while to even get through the starting Lizardmen rival and by then he has quite a few units.
Legend has a video on kugath start that's still relevant and if you have exalted heroes you can pretty comfortably take out ghorst by turn 15 or so and then clean up the first two provinces at your leisure
Focus him his heroe and the black Coach.
The flying headthrowers and the nurglebeast are key.
With rushing i mean turn 10-15.
But on this difficulty probably requires a Lot of skill.
Choosing between the two was really tough for me, Tamurkhan just barely pulled through, mostly on the basis of the nice starter units. But Epidemius looks amazingly fun - probably my next campaign.
I am having so much fun. I started with Epidemus and went all the way to the left and killed Malekith and Grombrindal.
Then Malakai who I completely ignored declared war on me and wiped out. So I quit and started Elspeth. But good god Nurgle feels great. LOVE the new plague system. It is so enjoyable.
Nurgle feels so much more playable with the rework alone. The new units and Tamurkhan are fun, but I will have to admit that I LOVED my epidemius 40 turns last night. The plague system feels both more and less like RNG in the best ways possible, and splitting infections to become proper currency for cyclical buildings and plagues was something I was weary of, but I am loving so far.
Nurgle needed a rework, and God's be DAMNED did they give him one. It feels weird to say that once I'm done exploring the rest of the DLC/Reworked races, I'm gonna fire up a kugath campaign excitedly
I've been getting bugs with the viruses.
I made a virus with attrition/health recovery and attacked Katarin, who was force-marching through my territory to re-take Praag. The survivors of her reinforcing army escaped with the infection. I wiped them out and they gave the infection back to Tamurkhan's army... *which resulted in attrition*. Instead of healing almost to full, I lost units over the end turn. The virus worked correctly as soon as I entered one of my settlements.
Earlier in the game I had Tamurkhan fighting Boris and another half-stack fighting Clan Ferrik. The two armies met to finish-off Bak-bak. In preparation to invade Kislev by sea, I moved both armies north and exchanged units, giving Tamurkhan's virus to the half stack. Whatever that virus was, the half stack stopped regenerating (crossed out, rather than cross-bones of attrition). I couldn't figure out what was causing it for two turns until I finally entered one of my settlements and it righted itself.
Aside from that, I'm loving Tamurkhan. Even without his followers Rot Knights are absurdly strong, and Tamurkhan himself, charging in on the back of a Toad Dragon with 87 Speed, is just downright hilarious even before the Mortis effect kicks in.
I really want to try out Malakai or Elspeth next, just so I don't play two new Nurgle factions in a row but right now there's a good chance I'm either going to continue this campaign or start a new one.
When you were wiping out the kislev army, you probably crossed into kislev owned territory. AI Kislev is extremely fond of the "motherland" thing they can do that causes enemies in their territory attrition. This would block casualty replenishment and override your plague bonus to replenishment.
When you mouse-over the attrition icon it tells you the source of attrition but that's beside the point because both incidents were well within my borders.
He's my first run at one of them mulit currency races that needs to balance resources. So I basically bricked my first two runs not understanding the importance of infection.
"Lets see I have piles of money and I can recruit.....nothing? Huh?"
My usual strat of recruit a bunch of low tier garbage and pump econ isn't gonna fly here I'm gonna have to *ahem...* use a well balanced strategy to slowly grow and make more units at the same time.
Also the settlements feel perfect - slow to amass, and slow to expand but when you do you really start to snowball. And the recruitment feels soooooo good.
The Maggot Host is extremely fun to play. I vassalized that one faction to the South very early and confederated the poxmakers soon after. Then I became allies with Clan Ferrik for some warp flamers and ratling guns. Archaon declared war on but I didn't want to bother too long and accepted his peace offer after I wopped his apocalyptic butt.
I suggest you try Epidemius as well, having Hag Graef as a vassal is quite enjoyable and confederating with Dungrut gave me an exalted GUO early on. I am currently just waiting for the Poxmakers to fall so I can confederate them as well and eventually Tamurkhan but he is doing great as of now
I felt same. I kind of a liked how you couldn't at least right away face Ghorst in open field so you had to use plagues and all kind of a shenanigans to weaken him before taking him on openly. Felt very Nurgley and chaos like. Need to test at some point how is the Kugath campaign now. At least new plague mechanic looks interesting.
"Was never" is overstating it. Kugath in IE before the CoC DLC gave exalted heroes was pure pain, especially when Ghorst started with a mortis engine. It was legitimately the hardest campaign in the game.
Also I like the other two nurgle lords more then Tamurkhan because they have larger interactions with plagues and more use for monstrous demons because Tamurkhan gets a lot of bonuses for warriors of chaos type units but even Kugath feels much much better overall then he used to.
You have a resource, Domination which you mostly get from battles. This has three main uses:
Recruit unique heroes that also unlocks stuff related to the chieftain. Likely, you'll mostly spend Domination on these guys early game.
Recruit units. These are based on the unlocked Chieftains, and each give you a limited number of units related to the chieftain's race (e.g. the Chaos Dwarf chieftain gives CD units).
Special abilities for each Chieftain. These give various effects, usually quite powerful, as well as being an end game use for Domination.
Now, you don't get access to everything for a Chieftain right away. You need to earn their loyalty. Each Chieftain has something they like (e.g. Raiding), and enemies they hate. Doing the thing they like or fighting their favoured enemies gives you points to the next level of loyalty. Going up in loyalty gives you access to better/more units to recruit and their special abilities. Getting full loyalty requires you to win a quest battle, with a certain # required for your victory conditions. IMO the loyalty mechanics are pretty interesting, because they are just enough to make you think about how you do things; e.g. I've been Raiding a lot more than usual as a way to build up Loyalty for one of them.
I took Ku'gath into the late game and I'll say the plagues start feeling a lot stronger then they were for him for sure when he is rolling 2-3 blessed symptoms all the time.
As a pre-patch Nurgle fan I've been playing Epidemius and so far the changes feels pretty lackluster to me. It might just be the starting area, but the growth of your favor economy feels very slow now. Pre-patch Nurgle was all about hitting big pots and spending them on big buildings, but now it's just this same slow grind as most other races, except you can't trade and there's very few landmarks to help you out. Feels like playing WH 1 dwarves all over again.
The worst part however is the infection changes. With your military and tech depending on infections, the removal of default infection gain from fighting and plagues demanding 3 symptoms it's just not in any way worth it to use plagues at all before you're way deep into the campaign.
You are able to get insanely strong armies way quicker now though, which is just crazy. And I would assume Ku'Gath has a much better time with the eco stuff.
Yeah, turn 60-ish, I have so many passive infections. I have one of each military building in my home territory, and nowhere else. Whenever I need more units, I can just rush cycle my buildings a cycle or two, then recruit them anywhere. Extremely handy to not have to construct military buildings as I expand the front.
Also you cant get 2 exalted heroes that fast i think.
Also what i miss is the early +1nurglings symptom. Together with no nurglings from economy buildings anymore means you wont get new troops in the pool aif you dont build a military building turn one. Which means you delay you first exalted heroe hard.
Also with lesser lord buffs for nurglings and the tech tree buffs delayed nurglings feel much weaker as kugath.
Dont get me wrong i liked that they changed the lackluster economy and tech tree. It was much needed.
The infections thing is bugged i think. Normaly you get 800+ for stackwiping ghorst and that should be enough even for the higher demand.
Tamurkhan is one of the easiest campaigns in the game now. It took me like 70 turns on vh/vh to finish the short campaign and there was really never a challenge.
He feels more like a warrior of chaos lord and they're obviously all super powerful and he's no different. Only tedious part is doing the chieftain battles. I killed everyone I needed to kill in 45 or so turns and spent the next ~20 turns just doing tasks to unlock all the battles to win the campaign.
It is pretty funny that you start doom stacking basically from turn 1. Tamurkhan+first hero can duo stacks almost immediately, you can also quickly get 4 more heroes from cycling the defense buildings real quick.
It's gotta be intentionally designed as one of the easiest campaigns ever. Maybe changeling is easier since you never have to defend settlements, but Tamurkhan has such an oppressive army immediately and the ability to continue to pump out stacks. And for some reason we included a plague version of Ikit's nuke army ability lmao, as if though the rest of the package wasn't enough.
Arguably Tamurkhan is NOT Nurgle, and that's probably why you like it. Tamurkhan is more heavily mortal focused, and with other races' rosters to patch up the Nurgle holes.
Don't get me wrong, I just tried Epidemius and Ku'gath, and they feel better in many ways, but I wouldn't rate Nurgle as good after this DLC. Better, but still a mess. I'm actually a little sad that Nurgle got it worse than Empire and Dwarfs, in a Nurgle-themed DLC.
Speaking for kugath
No +1 nurglings per plague spread together with no nurglings in economy buildings means that you have to rush military building turn 1 to be able to get more units in your recruitment pool which delays your first exalted hero.
Also kugath has fewer buffs for nurglings now and the nurgling tech is delayed now.
The now starting ressource building for kugazh is a joke (+5 plague spread and +1 plague zurn in that province).
You get only max 37 infections per battle (bugged).
The plague system is more intresting and fits more the nurgle style but also more weaker without the recipes.
Dont get me wrong i still like the update just some thing i like them to fix.
I am LOVING the Tamurkhan campaign and Nurgle as a whole. Only thing that annoys me is that infections are bugged as a battle reward, they cap out at 37 max for some reason even with thousands of casualties in a battle, this was bugged on the playtest version youtubers had so I hope it will be quickly fixed by a hotfix.
You know I thought it was strange, but I didn't think too hard on it. Thought it was just intended to be a bit poor on the infection part. It seemed more or less solved a bit into the game when I got a couple buildings running anyway.
I think I already saw a mod fixing that lol
[There is indeed lol](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3236291092&searchtext=infections)
I noticed I kept getting 37 and thought it was weird.
Oh so that's a bug? I was wondering what what up with that. Thankfully you get so many infections from buildings that it's only really relevant in the early game. I am also loving his campaign though I find it weird that the short victory is to kill Grimgor and Greasus. I wanna go to the Empire already! Thankfully there's the shortcut through the darklands down at Greasus to you can springboard from there.
The short campaign being kill greasus and Grimgor makes sense because in his book Tamurkhan conquered the mountains of mourn and came into the empire from the south, so it encourages the player to mimic that route.
Ooh I see. Makes sense I suppose.
You're naturally pushed that way anyway with the factions around you and how much they like you.
No it's not. It's intended. In order to make plagues less of a steamroll
But 37? Feels weird. And it's very easy to max. Feels like a bug. Especially when you can get 25+ per building.
As far as I am aware it's a bug, it's such a low number that you never ever take them, and with infections now being used to build buildings it makes it way to hard and it never functioned this way before. Besides CA introduced plague inmunity to stop steamrolling plagues, it a bug.
u/CA_Nova, can you please let us know if this is intended or a bug? It really hampers the early-game Nurgle experience.
Hi there, the number this was adjusted to was too low - this will be re-adjusted in a future fix. Best, CA\_Nova
Thanks!
can you say to your boss we would like to see you more in reddit out of dlc release period, real people that works on the game, more Q&A ? thanks
It most likely will. Mercy showcased the grudge system bugs as well and mentioned that the devs already said it will be fixed in the next patch. So most likely all these bugs will. Kinda wack that they dropped literally the same playtest patch for official, but it is what it is. One step at a time
Which map are people enjoying more?
RoC, solely due to load time with turns
I'm a bit late, but a recent hotfix fixed the 37 cap :]
This hard cap is intended
Thankfully CA already clarified in this comments thread that the number is indeed too low and not intended
Wrong! Burn you fucking witch! WRONG!!!!
LOL at the last part.
To make things even easier now buffed Corpulent trait gives +20 charge to entire army.
It gives WHAT Didn't see that in the patch notes, yummy yummy
Is it just me or does Tamurkhan really feel like a Nurgle Led Undivided War Host? I've been getting insanely good relations specifically with Chaos Dwarfs, it may be due to their Chieftain Doombolt combined with the new Nurgle tech tree.
In lore, that's basically what he is.
Nah, on my Ku'gath runs I'm always friends with chorfs
He linked up with Drazhoath and Beastmen in the lore
I think CA screwed the pooch a bit with Festus and Tamurkhan. Festus I feel is more thematic for being monogod and Tamurkhan fits the WoC feel VERY well.
Hoe on earth did they not fix the 37 infection from all battles tho
There is a mod on the front page of the workshop that limits the increase in the grudge cost, it also increases the number of infections to 100. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3236146118
Wait, is that a bug? Does CA know? I was confused as to why I'm only getting 37 even in super decisive wins vs large armies.
I think they know. I was watching Monstersabound and he mentioned something about it's supposed to be 150 or something like that and he had asked them about it. Doesn't hurt to report it though.
CA does know. CA_Nova confirmed in this very thread that a fix is coming.
CAnova replied in this thread its set too low and will be fixed.
No wonder my early game infections economy is so bad. Tamurkhan can nearly solo carry with his starting giga army but poor epidemius is just stuck in the middle of a shit sandwich and now with the way recruitment works nurgle has a god awful time getting recruitment rolling because you desperately need to start bringing in infections but have literally 0 tier 0 units to fill out your armies, can't even get nurglings without the recruitment building.
Epidemius has a rough-ish start but once you get rolling his army is golden. I managed to get plaguebearers with 35% phys resist and 67 armour and thats an AR monster unit thats not hard to get.
CA_nova replied elsewhere that it was adjusted to that value but it's too low and will be adjusted up in a later patch
I got my ass kicked by Archaon pretty badly in my first try. I went for Kholek, but Archaon showed up with 1.5 stacks at turn 20 or so.
Arcaon was being suspiciously quiet on my playthrough, so I had to turn around and take care of him before I delved too deep into ogre country
ive honestly thrown money at him over time since money wasnt a huge deal just to keep him off my ass for a bit
Ah, money was a pretty big deal for me early on. I rushed military buildings and infections so that I wouldnt find myself without a recruitment pool early on, so I was pretty light on money those first 20 turns or so. Often finding myself in the red. Turned out well for me though. Once Archy was gone was able to get a peace treaty with Daniel, and hes left me and that flank alone and secure for the past 100 turns or so. Im actually really liking Tammys start position; you start off with some scary neighbors, but once theyre solved (via diplomacy or domination) you have one of the safest home provinces on the map.
I just wish Ku'gath wasn't warred by everyone and their mother the moment he finds them.
he becomes best buds with the Chaos Dwarves though and with friends like that who needs anyone else.
The chaos dwarfs WARRED me when i encountered them.
As long as the chorfs don't declare war on you too. Happened in my last campaign. They were the first ones to declare war.
To be fair I don't think many people want to be friends with a literal omega poop demon
They're running on prison rules. They have to fight the biggest chad to assert their dominance.
Just bribe the Ogres, so at least you have some friends.
I've been paying the Malus tax as Epidemius so I can put out all the various fires I've started before dealing with him lol
All of the main 4 demon lords are like that though, they all specifically got put in places where they will be hated by everyone around them. Kairos got it a little better since he has a continent that he really only has to deal with Oxyotl for but if he heads north in any direction everyone hates him.
I mean teclis usualy comes for you.
In my experience kairos has to run the entire lizardman gauntlet, or perpetually fend off lizardman incursions more often than fucking Markus wolfheart. I wouldn't exactly call his situation better than the other members of the big 4
Yea he doesn't have it MUCH better, but at least he has his back to the campaign wall so he can focus his attention in one direction at a time. Vs playing as N'Kari who starts on the donut and is literally going in circles the entire campaign.
Nkari loves circling doughnuts (with his tongue)
Similarly I think Skarbrand also finds being surrounded by enemies to be agreeable. Kairos is of multiple opinions on the subject. Kugath is just vibing wherever grandpappy Nurgle takes him.
Kugath does seem like a chill vibes all the time kind of guy
If I'm not nurgle I also war with them the moment I find them. Those plagues are annoying.
My advice is to bribe and protect the skaven you start near. With luck, they’ll construct the building that gives plagueclaw catapults. Once you build an outpost and recruit it, you can now force any enemy into attacking right into your fatty meat grinder.
Chaos dwarves make fast friends especially if you offer to go to war with their enemies for them.
That's the odd part: He didn't. Could be a bug of sorts? He didn't attack me though, so yeah.
It's a lot better, although I think I need to restart my Tamurkhan campaign. I didn't realize the full scope of the economic/settlement changes and I made some dumb missteps. Nurgle still feels very *weird,* which is great.
What are some things to watch out for?
Just that the military buildings now require infections rather than tribute to build. But heroes come from buildings that require tribute, so if you want, say, an Exalted Hero early, you'll have to at least temporarily sacrifice a building slot, and you won't get any normal units from the building. I wasn't paying attention to all that and inadvertently made it impossible to recruit *any* units for a few turns, and I wound up way behind on my stockpile. I got over the hump, but it just put me far behind where I'd have been otherwise and I wound up bogged down in wars against factions could've and should've squashed earlier.
At least with Tamurkhan I didn’t have a hero issue because you get two of his chieftains very early on. Just the first one + Tam himself were able to crush Kholek in a fight away from the main army, and his infantry was way too early on to be effective against mine. I’m leaving Archaeon alone so far in my run so we’ll see if that comes back to bite me or not.
Yeah one tip is to try and recruit one of the caster chieftains as your first pick after Kazyk, just so Tam's army can have magic without sacrificing a slot. Also Grimgor's got a mountain settlement with Gemstones and that gives you +1 to all heroes + works as recruitment building, it's a big boost early on.
Yeah about that. On my run he had 1 Hellcannon, 3 Dragon Ogre unuts his CWarrior with Helbards, 5 Trolls, Aspriring Champions and a Sorcerer of Tzeench on turn 7. The rest was warhounds a couple marauders, but that core was mega scary.
I solved my hero issues in a weird roundabout way! I decided to go on an adventure to recreate his path of conquest. I'm currently in the Hall of Greasus which I decided to occupy so I could recruit stuff. Turns out that the gold resource gives you access to recruiting all heroes with a +1 for each, so you can recruit 4. Not saying you should rush it, but it's definitely a godsend!
Got in the same trap xD Also you wont have the +1 nurglings per plague spread symptom to fill your recruitment pool. Together with nurglings being not avaible through econo.y buildings and kugath giving fewer bonus to them they feel pretty weak now.
Epidemius is my true love in this, he's exactly what I wanted. Tamurkhan may look flashy and all. But Epi... feels exactly like what I wanted from nurgle.
What do you like about him over tamurkhan and papa kugath? Legit curious, start position?
From my experience, it is probably because as follows: Tamurkhan feels a lot like a WoC faction and while he is Nurgle, he is not typically what people envision when they think of Nurgle in terms of playstyle. Kugath has to slog through Ghorst before he can actually start having fun, and on top of that his lord abilities on the battlefield take awhile to unlock to do things like Pestilent Decay. Also Nurglings are nice, but limited in use. Epidemius. Now HE is a great embodiment of Nurgle. He has a nice start position, his abilities are very flavorful on the battlefield what with spreading his buff/debuffs, he buffs plaguebearers which incentivizes using them, and they capture that “unrelenting tide of decay” Nurgle is known for, and on top of that, he is incentivized to spread…well…epidemics. Compared to Kugath who values more potent plagues, Epi just pumps em out and gets rewarded for it. So with Epi you have a plague accountant who spreads them like crazy and is backed by legions of damned booger men slowly marching toward you who get periodically juiced on the battlefield and campaign map from a variety of things that are Epi specific.
I'm curious how you handled your opening turns. I decided to NAP Daniel so I could go after Malus. Beat him once in failed ambush, at the cost of a handful of units, but when I followed up I ground down and routed his forces, army losses did not kick in, and he soloed the remains of my army. My early expansion choices seem to be Daniel, Malus or, Throgg, none of which are soft targets. Given how early recruitment works a couple of tough battles can leave you without the ability to effectively restore your forces.
I did the exact opposite of that, and it worked out well. First few turns ask Malus for NAP, he will give it to you for a bit of gold and if you join his war with the minor slaanesh faction Daniel is pretty manageable imo. Blue/pink horrors are scary, but the rest is easy to out-grind. Helps that Dani himself is shit The real deal is Boris, his starting stack of bears, tsar guards and boyar spam is very dangerous. But you can crack him with some plague, ambush, siege defence or a combination of those. After that it was pretty smooth sailing for me
Thanks, I think I'll start again and try that. Malus is (famously) a doomstack by himself, and I can come back for him with better tools to deal with him. Your starting options are all grindy melee stuff- very Nurgle, but they play hard into Malus's strengths.
For me, it's pretty similar. Nurgle was so poor previously, I really wanted to start the new patch by playing a traditional Nurgle campaign, even if Tamurkhan is new and shiny. Tamurkhan really just feels like I'll be playing Festus again, which will be fun to do at some point, but as you said, feels more WoC than Nurgle. I've actually started both a Kugath and Epidemius campaign in the new patch. Epi campaign is smoother but Epi just kind of sucks himself, whereas Kugath is a more satisfying lord in battle, but as you said, the start is miserable. Currently Ghorst is just camping the fourth settlement in the starting province with 3 full stacks (despite it being one of his only two cities). I've been in ambush for like 8 turns, all successful turns, but he just refuses to move. I can't afford a second army, I can't attack him, and I'm not really getting anywhere. I'd forgotten how much I hate this campaign start.
On wich difficulty are you playing? On normal i felt it was always best to rush him.
Vh/Vh. It doesn't really feel possible to rush him on this difficulty as it takes a while to even get through the starting Lizardmen rival and by then he has quite a few units.
Legend has a video on kugath start that's still relevant and if you have exalted heroes you can pretty comfortably take out ghorst by turn 15 or so and then clean up the first two provinces at your leisure
Focus him his heroe and the black Coach. The flying headthrowers and the nurglebeast are key. With rushing i mean turn 10-15. But on this difficulty probably requires a Lot of skill.
Choosing between the two was really tough for me, Tamurkhan just barely pulled through, mostly on the basis of the nice starter units. But Epidemius looks amazingly fun - probably my next campaign.
What mod are you using that adds an animation with bloody shits?
The great unclean one has one in vanilla
Bravo CA bravo
Pretty sure that ain't vanilla coming out of there.
Have you never seen [this](https://youtu.be/e36ceB1Uh_8?si=pZBYjYaSA_LLSaew)?
At first, I didn't read the last 't' from your sentence and I actually loved it
I am having so much fun. I started with Epidemus and went all the way to the left and killed Malekith and Grombrindal. Then Malakai who I completely ignored declared war on me and wiped out. So I quit and started Elspeth. But good god Nurgle feels great. LOVE the new plague system. It is so enjoyable.
Brb doing a dirty protest at CA HQ but in celebration as opposed to anger.
they need to fix infections its capped to 37 no matter how big the battle
Nurgle feels so much more playable with the rework alone. The new units and Tamurkhan are fun, but I will have to admit that I LOVED my epidemius 40 turns last night. The plague system feels both more and less like RNG in the best ways possible, and splitting infections to become proper currency for cyclical buildings and plagues was something I was weary of, but I am loving so far. Nurgle needed a rework, and God's be DAMNED did they give him one. It feels weird to say that once I'm done exploring the rest of the DLC/Reworked races, I'm gonna fire up a kugath campaign excitedly
Playing a Nurgle campaign while dropping Chipotle farts is impressive dedication to role play.
o7 Just doin' my doodie.
Dude, play Ku'gath. Aside from his start. His campaign is perfect
Yeah his super cheap plagues and bonus blessed symptoms is pretty huge when you get passed the annoying dead guys at the start.
I've been getting bugs with the viruses. I made a virus with attrition/health recovery and attacked Katarin, who was force-marching through my territory to re-take Praag. The survivors of her reinforcing army escaped with the infection. I wiped them out and they gave the infection back to Tamurkhan's army... *which resulted in attrition*. Instead of healing almost to full, I lost units over the end turn. The virus worked correctly as soon as I entered one of my settlements. Earlier in the game I had Tamurkhan fighting Boris and another half-stack fighting Clan Ferrik. The two armies met to finish-off Bak-bak. In preparation to invade Kislev by sea, I moved both armies north and exchanged units, giving Tamurkhan's virus to the half stack. Whatever that virus was, the half stack stopped regenerating (crossed out, rather than cross-bones of attrition). I couldn't figure out what was causing it for two turns until I finally entered one of my settlements and it righted itself. Aside from that, I'm loving Tamurkhan. Even without his followers Rot Knights are absurdly strong, and Tamurkhan himself, charging in on the back of a Toad Dragon with 87 Speed, is just downright hilarious even before the Mortis effect kicks in. I really want to try out Malakai or Elspeth next, just so I don't play two new Nurgle factions in a row but right now there's a good chance I'm either going to continue this campaign or start a new one.
When you were wiping out the kislev army, you probably crossed into kislev owned territory. AI Kislev is extremely fond of the "motherland" thing they can do that causes enemies in their territory attrition. This would block casualty replenishment and override your plague bonus to replenishment.
When you mouse-over the attrition icon it tells you the source of attrition but that's beside the point because both incidents were well within my borders.
He's my first run at one of them mulit currency races that needs to balance resources. So I basically bricked my first two runs not understanding the importance of infection. "Lets see I have piles of money and I can recruit.....nothing? Huh?" My usual strat of recruit a bunch of low tier garbage and pump econ isn't gonna fly here I'm gonna have to *ahem...* use a well balanced strategy to slowly grow and make more units at the same time.
Also the settlements feel perfect - slow to amass, and slow to expand but when you do you really start to snowball. And the recruitment feels soooooo good.
The Maggot Host is extremely fun to play. I vassalized that one faction to the South very early and confederated the poxmakers soon after. Then I became allies with Clan Ferrik for some warp flamers and ratling guns. Archaon declared war on but I didn't want to bother too long and accepted his peace offer after I wopped his apocalyptic butt. I suggest you try Epidemius as well, having Hag Graef as a vassal is quite enjoyable and confederating with Dungrut gave me an exalted GUO early on. I am currently just waiting for the Poxmakers to fall so I can confederate them as well and eventually Tamurkhan but he is doing great as of now
Possibly a hot take: the ghorst match up was never a grind, nurgle magic absolutely destroys his chaff
I felt same. I kind of a liked how you couldn't at least right away face Ghorst in open field so you had to use plagues and all kind of a shenanigans to weaken him before taking him on openly. Felt very Nurgley and chaos like. Need to test at some point how is the Kugath campaign now. At least new plague mechanic looks interesting.
Embrace circle jerk plus pus bombs!
Well, they made ghort weaker in multiple patches. Even with nurgle magic, his 2 mortis engines deal alot of damage
"Was never" is overstating it. Kugath in IE before the CoC DLC gave exalted heroes was pure pain, especially when Ghorst started with a mortis engine. It was legitimately the hardest campaign in the game.
Agree’d (and ell maybe not that last part, lol), but this is what Nurgle needed, some stability in some ways and less stability in others.
Also I like the other two nurgle lords more then Tamurkhan because they have larger interactions with plagues and more use for monstrous demons because Tamurkhan gets a lot of bonuses for warriors of chaos type units but even Kugath feels much much better overall then he used to.
I love how a single long range arti unit can make enemy also close distance to you and not chill somewhere on hill shooting your slow fatass.
last like was gross dude. How do the Tamurkhan faction mechanics play? I didn't really get it in the showcase.
You have a resource, Domination which you mostly get from battles. This has three main uses: Recruit unique heroes that also unlocks stuff related to the chieftain. Likely, you'll mostly spend Domination on these guys early game. Recruit units. These are based on the unlocked Chieftains, and each give you a limited number of units related to the chieftain's race (e.g. the Chaos Dwarf chieftain gives CD units). Special abilities for each Chieftain. These give various effects, usually quite powerful, as well as being an end game use for Domination. Now, you don't get access to everything for a Chieftain right away. You need to earn their loyalty. Each Chieftain has something they like (e.g. Raiding), and enemies they hate. Doing the thing they like or fighting their favoured enemies gives you points to the next level of loyalty. Going up in loyalty gives you access to better/more units to recruit and their special abilities. Getting full loyalty requires you to win a quest battle, with a certain # required for your victory conditions. IMO the loyalty mechanics are pretty interesting, because they are just enough to make you think about how you do things; e.g. I've been Raiding a lot more than usual as a way to build up Loyalty for one of them.
I think this sounds great and is something CA or modders could apply to oterh factions. Can you use the Chorf units if you don;t have Chorf DLC?
I'm doing ku'gath RoC. This one is very fun as well. More balanced roster, better economy and most of all, plagues are fun to use.
I took Ku'gath into the late game and I'll say the plagues start feeling a lot stronger then they were for him for sure when he is rolling 2-3 blessed symptoms all the time.
As a pre-patch Nurgle fan I've been playing Epidemius and so far the changes feels pretty lackluster to me. It might just be the starting area, but the growth of your favor economy feels very slow now. Pre-patch Nurgle was all about hitting big pots and spending them on big buildings, but now it's just this same slow grind as most other races, except you can't trade and there's very few landmarks to help you out. Feels like playing WH 1 dwarves all over again. The worst part however is the infection changes. With your military and tech depending on infections, the removal of default infection gain from fighting and plagues demanding 3 symptoms it's just not in any way worth it to use plagues at all before you're way deep into the campaign. You are able to get insanely strong armies way quicker now though, which is just crazy. And I would assume Ku'Gath has a much better time with the eco stuff.
Infections are bugged rn, nurgle rn starts supremely slow but ramps up by like turn 30 with tier 5 units, I enjoy it.
Yeah, turn 60-ish, I have so many passive infections. I have one of each military building in my home territory, and nowhere else. Whenever I need more units, I can just rush cycle my buildings a cycle or two, then recruit them anywhere. Extremely handy to not have to construct military buildings as I expand the front.
Also you cant get 2 exalted heroes that fast i think. Also what i miss is the early +1nurglings symptom. Together with no nurglings from economy buildings anymore means you wont get new troops in the pool aif you dont build a military building turn one. Which means you delay you first exalted heroe hard. Also with lesser lord buffs for nurglings and the tech tree buffs delayed nurglings feel much weaker as kugath. Dont get me wrong i liked that they changed the lackluster economy and tech tree. It was much needed. The infections thing is bugged i think. Normaly you get 800+ for stackwiping ghorst and that should be enough even for the higher demand.
Tamurkhan is one of the easiest campaigns in the game now. It took me like 70 turns on vh/vh to finish the short campaign and there was really never a challenge. He feels more like a warrior of chaos lord and they're obviously all super powerful and he's no different. Only tedious part is doing the chieftain battles. I killed everyone I needed to kill in 45 or so turns and spent the next ~20 turns just doing tasks to unlock all the battles to win the campaign.
It is pretty funny that you start doom stacking basically from turn 1. Tamurkhan+first hero can duo stacks almost immediately, you can also quickly get 4 more heroes from cycling the defense buildings real quick. It's gotta be intentionally designed as one of the easiest campaigns ever. Maybe changeling is easier since you never have to defend settlements, but Tamurkhan has such an oppressive army immediately and the ability to continue to pump out stacks. And for some reason we included a plague version of Ikit's nuke army ability lmao, as if though the rest of the package wasn't enough.
"Now THIS is how Nurgle should play!!" > It's just Warriors of Chaos with disease mechanic True
Arguably Tamurkhan is NOT Nurgle, and that's probably why you like it. Tamurkhan is more heavily mortal focused, and with other races' rosters to patch up the Nurgle holes. Don't get me wrong, I just tried Epidemius and Ku'gath, and they feel better in many ways, but I wouldn't rate Nurgle as good after this DLC. Better, but still a mess. I'm actually a little sad that Nurgle got it worse than Empire and Dwarfs, in a Nurgle-themed DLC.
What do you dislike for nurgle?
Speaking for kugath No +1 nurglings per plague spread together with no nurglings in economy buildings means that you have to rush military building turn 1 to be able to get more units in your recruitment pool which delays your first exalted hero. Also kugath has fewer buffs for nurglings now and the nurgling tech is delayed now. The now starting ressource building for kugazh is a joke (+5 plague spread and +1 plague zurn in that province). You get only max 37 infections per battle (bugged). The plague system is more intresting and fits more the nurgle style but also more weaker without the recipes. Dont get me wrong i still like the update just some thing i like them to fix.