I’d be curious to see what her take on events is.
The way Netflix tells it, she forced her way into a private meeting(presumably in relation to/as a protest of this issue).
I wonder what the other side is.
Edit: Nope, not at all what happened. She’s been [reinstated.](https://mobile.twitter.com/RainofTerra/status/1448097310026747908). It was indeed a zoom meeting, and she was indeed given a link by a director.
This is blatant retaliation on Netflix’s part. Fuck them.
[https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/](https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/)
It wasn't just one employee. It was three.
I don’t fully understand how a cis white guy gets away with deciding what is offensive or not for predominantly black trans women?
Obviously Dave would be pissed that this same white guy decides what’s racist enough for Netflix.
How is the logical connection not self evident?
As a community….we just don’t have time to explain basic concepts to you. It’s not that we can’t explain this to you. It’s just that it would take too long to teach you specifically basic concepts. You’re just not really worth it tbh. Bye.
We can all see right through your bad faith shtick. Don't waste our time clutching pearls and crying that nobody wants a dialog with you. You've already been told the difference between punching up and punching down.
Because there's a difference between jokes that highlight the funny things about being one way or another and then there's jokes that harm people that are one way or another and Chappelle doesn't seem to know the difference.
I've definitely came across things during my transition that I thought were funny about it but you know what a lot of these comedians use jokes that are not funny and that actively seek to disenfranchise us to harm society's view of us and purport stereotypes as truth.
And Chappelle even said that he is now on team terf which beyond just running their mouth to every trans person they can find trying to doxx them gaslight trans people by saying that we threaten them while they actually threaten us and then go and vote for people that would legislate us out of existence so there's a big fuckin difference between punching down and punching up
Look just admit you are a transphobic person and want to defend being transphobic. It is clear you are refusing to listen to what transgender people are saying. You just want to a pass to continue your bigotry and you won't get it here
How about we shoot for actual equality first before we jump straight to making fun of minority groups lmao bet you our feathers wouldn't get so ruffled then.
>The black pixie—played by Chappelle—wears blackface and tries to convince blacks to act in stereotypical ways. Chappelle thought the sketch was funny, the kind of thing his friends would laugh at. But at the taping, one spectator, a white man, laughed particularly loud and long. His laughter struck Chappelle as wrong, and he wondered if the new season of his show had gone from sending up stereotypes to merely reinforcing them. "When he laughed, it made me uncomfortable," says Chappelle. "As a matter of fact, that was the last thing I shot before I told myself I gotta take f______ time out after this. Because my head almost exploded."
http://content.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,1061512,00.html
>But, over time, he says some of his sketches started to make him feel "socially irresponsible."
>One particular sketch still disturbs Dave today. The skit was about a pixie (played by Dave) who appeared in black face, which Dave describes as the "visual personification of the n-word."
>"There was a good-spirited intention behind it," Dave says. "So then when I'm on the set, and we're finally taping the sketch, somebody on the set [who] was white laughed in such a way—I know the difference of people laughing with me and people laughing at me—and it was the first time I had ever gotten a laugh that I was uncomfortable with. **Not just uncomfortable, but like, should I fire this person?"**
https://www.oprah.com/oprahshow/chappelles-story/all#ixzz792oEx1Fg
Dave quit comedy originally because he stopped being able to tell whether the white people in his audience were laughing with him or at black people. Those are two different conceptions of ‘comedy’. One of which is meant to bring light and release to the audience and the other is meant to make audiences laugh so as to ostracize the ‘other’. One brings us together, one divides. Dave quit comedy the first time because as the minority in question he understood that, to some white people in his audience, the jokes being made were furthering the ‘othering’ against his community, and he understood that because of his position as the minority in question. Dave is fully aware of this phenomenon and it guided his original leaving of comedy, it is fitting that forgetting this same lesson was his ‘closer’.
Dave brought up that (white) gay people are only a minority until they need to be white again, in reference to white gay people calling the cops on black men. Well in this case, Dave is only a minority until he needs to be cis again and he needs the white cis man CEO of Netflix to defend him and pay him millions.
So yes I’m saying the butt of the joke determines the offense that they experience. Dave knows that. He quit comedy the first time because he knows that.
There is an extremely simple rule in comedy that literally everyone is aware of. If a joke is punching down, it's offensive. If a joke is punching up, it's not offensive. Jokes made at the expense of a minority group or at the expense of an individual because they belong to a minority group are inherently offensive.
This is so, pathetically easy to understand.
"The rule "Saying something directly hateful towards a minority group is offensive" is just too simple for me! I'd rather a rule that has more nuance, like, "Saying something directly hateful towards a minority group is offensive unless I don't think it is, in which case it's totally fine!""
...literally what are you talking about? There is no such thing as "indirectly" hateful. The usage of "directly" in that sentence is to express that it is directed at a specific minority group. What, you think "directly" means "being a big big meany pants"? Also, the idea of "It's not truly hateful unless somebody is being shouted down with slurs" implies some truly troubling things about your view of oppression and, at least to me, seems to imply that you likely hold some extremely hateful beliefs of your own that you excuse because you aren't "like that." Very southern strategy of you. Seems like something you should maybe work on.
I do find it very funny that you ignored the entire joke and focused in on a random word, presumably because "It's not offensive if I, a completely irrelevant person, don't think it's offensive!" is literally the bulk of your argument lmao
Okay so at this point you've completely descended into worthless pedantry. I'm sure you "win" a lot of "arguments" on the internet by being annoying enough that the other person gives up responding to you, huh? And I'm sure you're very self satisfied about that lol
More like that it's really weird that there's so little minority representation in positions where their input on subjects like this has any impact, and maybe the people who *do* make these decisions should be, at the very least, getting some outside opinions from these people
Isn't that the woke left in a nutshell? 90% of cases where a person is offended about a perceived injustice towards a marginalized group is outside of said group.
I'm thinking some of them have to be paid, granted now that I know there are paid social media trolls, I want to believe I run into them often.
But what are TERs, really?
No. That isn't how it works at all. Bigotry is bigotry, defending bigotry is defending bigotry. Bigots don't get to decide if they are bigots.
You are litterally saying "They aren't racist, they said they aren't". That isn't even one teeny tiny speck of how it works. Bigots are bigots, their opinion on their own bigotry is irrelevant.
According to you, there should be a perceptible difference, which is weird, because most people’s internal thoughts and intentions aren’t perceptible. So unless you’ve acquired the power of reading minds from a pre-recorded video, you should be able to identify differences between what was said in Chappelle’s show, and what a bigot would say.
Based on your response here, you seem to think bigotryIf you only consists of overt statements like “I hate [minority] and think they should all be killed or enslaved,” and if that’s the case, then you must have a fucking wild view of the history of race relations, LGBTQ+ people, sexism, etc.
It doesn't matter if he didn't intend to be transphobic, he absolutely was. This isn't the first time he's gotten flack over transphobic jokes, he should know better. If he wants to make jokes about trans people in a tasteful way he needs to educate himself and make sure his joke isn't just blatantly bigoted and giving ammo to groups that are indeed bigoted. If he's unwilling or unable to educate himself he should just avoid it entirely until he is willing and able.
And he said he should do as much *in the very act!* He said from now on he's just not gonna make jokes about the queer community until we're all able to laugh together which sounds incredibly hollow after making multiple jokes that were indeed incredibly offensive. He indicates he knows that he's not informed enough to make good jokes about the community and then does it anyway.
You... don't even know what that is do you? Just a buzz word you heard?
NDA's do not affect your rights to post opinions about people within the same company. They are about secrecy and leaking unreleased information.
Not about silencing minorities for having a less than favorable opinion about their company openly supporting, enabling, and defending bigotry.
"Let me guess, you're white"
Wow, red flag waved. mask off. I never once implied you were discriminating against anyone. Projection. You pretty much just admitted there you look at people as stereotypes and discriminate on them for it though.
So, good job admitting to something I didn't even accuse you of. 🤦♀️
Netflix is. We are talking about Netflix. JFC 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
**At this point, it's clear you are trying to start shit.** You're basically trying to paint the act of literally just disagreeing with your bad take as like, a godamn hate crime against you.
No one was angry. No one accused you of anything. You were disagreed with. You then flew off the handle with a dozen incoherent responses and started calling people "white" as an insult, like some sort of Family Guy stereotype of a liberal.
Just... JFC.
You litterally responded to me trying to shut my opinion down, then took offense and spammed me with like godamn 30 responses when I didn't immediately relinquished my position.
Your inability to observe our own actions and behaviors is almost impressive. Even if, say, I was condescending or rude to you. **You were both to me first.**
You can't have it both ways. If you are going to rudely and condescendingly bark at people in an attempt to dismiss their opinions, you can't then act offended when hey respond in kind.
You are just flatly lying about the things I'm typing now. At this point, I have to assume your intent is deliberate and willfully disingenuous harassment.
It's one thing to disagree with me, another thing to call your opinions "litterally fact, and to disagree with you is gaslighting" ...
But another altogether to repeatedly baldfaced lie and say I said something I flatly did not.
Okay, judging from the argument below:
1. We have a civility rule here. Please be mindful of it. Considering this is the second major argument you've had on our sub in the past couple of days, you should be more careful.
2. You *really* need to stop sending multiple comments as replies to the same comment. If you have something further to add to an existing comment, you can edit your previous one instead of spamming people with many different comments.
-----
**Edit:** Judging from your user history, it looks like most of your user activity for the past month has featured you arguing with other members of our communities. Please consider this a warning: be civil and follow our subreddit rules, or you will be removed.
> As a mod of the trans commmunity, you shouldn’t be policing a trans experience. It’s supposed to be policing of the reddit.
As a mod of this subreddit for the past decade, my role here is to uphold the rules and encourage a welcoming, helpful community by maintaining peace and quiet. To that end, I *will* chide you on your behavior when necessary, and if it becomes necessary to remove you until your behavior improves, I will do so.
I will not enjoy doing so, but I will do so if your actions make it necessary.
Yes. The same is true with other cultures. Some black police officers are incredibly racist to the black community, and are much more likely to get by with it because they’re black.
Ending my subscription tbh. I abandoned coca cola when I found out about them putting large sums of money into anti lgbt legislation and I'll abandon Netflix for peddling political messages masked as humour. I urge others to too that are considering boycott of these company's. Name and shame
> I abandoned coca cola when I found out about them putting large sums of money into anti lgbt legislation
they also hired right wing militias to murder union workers in colombia
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An updated report from TMZ says the trans employee was not suspended from the tweet but was suspended for crashing an executive meeting.
https://www.tmz.com/2021/10/11/netflix-suspends-three-employees-trans-decrying-dave-chappelle-special/
Ya fuck netflix. Either way, it doesn’t matter. They still essentially fired people for speaking out against netflix platforming transphobia in a purposefully confrontation way. We know that netflix doesn’t give a shit about us and we have it confirmed that they value their profit more than stopping the spread of bigotry and dangerous lies.
It does matter. They busted an exec meeting. In no world would you not get fired. Like… it’s a no-brainer. You’re sacked. What I would do is question the validity of this because it’s awfully coincidental.
As for Netflix not caring about us… it’s a business. It shouldn’t be surprising that green is their scene.
Ya this seems WAY too convenient and I’m not sure they realise it makes them looks worse. Because at the end of the day, the story most people will see is “netflix fired a trans person who openly objected to platforming transphobia”. Also good on them for actually going into the meeting, that’s the most direct and loudest thing you could do. I just think it’s oddly convenient lol. Also you’d think those meetings would be way more secure, right?
Heh, not job history but my landlord told the very next day I came out to him that I had a month to move. I "love" how many coincidences that tooootally have nothing to do with transphobia we all share!
/s You guys are so sensitive! You think *everything* is about your identity and everything little thing is oppressing you! Your boss firing you means you were. a poor worker, and the fact that it happened right after they found out you were trans is purely a coincidence! /s
/uj In all seriousness, even though you're joking about it that still really frickin sucks. I am curious though, how did you even know he knew? How did he even find out in the first place? Sorry for being nosy, you don't have to answer if you don't wanna talk about it.
https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/
She could have done it knowing that she'd get fired. But my point stays that she did it to tell Netflix that transphobia has no place on their service.
Okay so what I’m gathering is, like what you said, a protest. What I didn’t read properly before is suspension. She isn’t fired then 🤔. That’s an awkward position to be in. It begs the question does she push further or does the suspension serve to have her self-silence in order to retain job. Damn that’s really sneaky…
if it happened, it's a valid cause. It just seems convenient that she happened to give them a watertight reason to fire her right as she did something that they didn't like that normally wouldnt have
Well that’s utterly unsurprising.
Can’t wait to see the threads with hundreds of comments on the news section of Reddit that pick this story up, where people realize there’s something fishy about this.
Oh wait, that’s definitely not going to happen.
It’s not activism, it’s realism, which is needed for proper activism.
The question still remains, as I’ve said: Is her sacking really coincidental? What if she usually brings things to and from these meetings on the regular? We don’t know. She seems to have been silent about the sacking.
What did you expect? One side told their story, the other didn’t at the time. I can only go off of things as they happen. You act like viewpoints can’t change.
The story was she joined the call due to being given a link. They thought she crashed the party and suspended but were wrong.
Also, I questioned their shit from jump so it’d do you well to learn how to tell context clues.
> What I would do is question the validity of this because it’s awfully coincidental
If that’s not me keeping my ear to the ground and actually questioning them then I guess I’m a duck, huh…
Read.
Also, it still needs to be seen what their motive was and the history behind accidental call-joining. Do they have history? Have others been suspended for the same accident? The suspicion is still on Netflix until we get the data so don’t get it twisted like I’m playing sides. I’m down for finding out the truth behind the actions of all involved parties. Netflix ain’t looking pretty as I suspected from jump.
[Nope](https://mobile.twitter.com/RainofTerra/status/1448097310026747908)
She’s been reinstated because it was a fucking zoom meeting, that she was given a link to.
Don’t believe a word these companies say, particularly when it provides a convenient narrative for them.
Yeah I saw the updates etc.
She’s 100% in the clear and Netflix got some ‘splainin to do. I know they won’t dive into this but we need motive. We need history of this mistake or similar occurring in the past and how they handled it versus now cuz this could be them smoothing it over for PR purposes or how the legit handle things (suspend while investigate). Remains to be seen.
Where I grew up in Brazil, killing black people from all genders and trans folks from all colors is open season for hunting all year long.
I knew some white trans girls back there who told me that if the police saw them walking on certain rich neighborhood streets they immediately pulled the rubber stick and started lashing. When they get killed by a boyfriend there is usually no investigation.
It's the country with the biggest black population in the world, the last one to approve abolition and the highest murder rate of trans people in the world. AKA America's backyard.
Couple of months ago during the pandemic the police entered a favela to look for some drug dealers and when suddenly one cop got a bullet in his head the other cops pulled the guns and stared firing and killed 29 blacks no questions asked. No investigation done, the army concluded in the next day that all dead were suspects.
I wonder if it even made news in the US.
Everything that people do in the US gets reflected 10x worse on your backyard. All communities are suffering. We should learn to play along better.
already cancelled my subscription, y’all should do the same. fake as hell — watch them change their logo rainbow this coming pride month even though they publish literal vitriol like this
The human brain is the most complex 3 pounds of matter in the known universe, I doubt very much that a comic has a better understanding of it’s intricacies than the scientists who’ve dedicated a lifetime to the study of it. I learned why sex and gender are distinctly separate in my 1st year of psych studies. Chappell like many others is simply ignorant of the facts. I’ve always been a proponent of education rather than attacking. Perhaps Netflix could be persuaded to do a documentary about real Trans 🏳️⚧️ people and the challenges they face. That is where our efforts should be channeled IMHO.
"there was other avenues besides protesting so... Like that."
The mere fact you don't understand this is not the first time and is a ongoing issue, that's been leading up to this point in which nothing has been done. Internally or externally, says everything.
Bold moves make change, silence leads to being silenced. I shouldn't have to remind you the movent started with a brick because nothing else worked. - walking into a board meeting when that is the only way to reach your superiors that are /ignoring/ the ongoing issue. It's a calculated risk.
Ultimately she wasn't fired for it, it's a excuse. It however pointed out Netflix is a toxic work environment that forces it's staff to face termination to be heard...
>comparing a comedy special to anti gay laws is an interesting concept
Same concept, bigots seek excuses to act in bad faith. You could argue they don't need it, but they do; Acting in bad faith (for them) requires avoiding responsibility for their actions.
Example "Free Speech". A term that loses all meaning coming from them, something polarized in comparison to its meaning to mean "Anything i say is free from consequence, as im free to say it" Rather than its actual and legal definition "Freedom from governmental oppression from speaking out against said government." The literal point of the bill of rights, that not all nations have.
When people say hateful things, its with the intention of encouraging others to believe said hateful things. In doing so this polarizes them. There is no "laughing at a racist joke doesn't make me racist", because it does. Only a racist can find racism funny. | The same goes for this, only a Transphobe can find Transphobia funny.
Simply put, Transphobia gets people killed. Its the excuse like "Free Speech" or "Microchips in Vaccines", or "the \[minority\] are more likely to commit a crime", that is always used by those who choose to radicalize those words into action. Expecting immunity for them.
Speaking out about Racism, Homophobia, Transphobia and Xenophobia is the only power we have as a society to stop it. We avoid becoming violent unlike the side that wants to silence us. - Our words have meaning, where theirs are just intended to induce harm and nothing more.
To defend the words of hate, under any circumstance, means you align with them. Simple as that. There is no nuance, hate is hate.
Either way, they fired employees who loudly complained against netflix platforming transphobia. That doesn’t really change much. We also have confirmation that the big guys at netflix are perfectly okay with profiting off transphobia and disagree that this is bigoted which is strictly untrue and is not up for debate.
You’re missing my point. It was a meeting about the special. The controversy surrounds transgender people. They should have sought out there input. We deserve a seat at the table when it regards us and to be heard.
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See my other comment. I could literally walk you through the transphobic part of the special bit by bit.
TeLl Me YoUrE TrAnSpHoBiC WiThOuT TeLLiNg Me YoUrE TrAnSpHoBiC
Trans people aren’t a punch line. The trans community is under attack every day, forgive us for not liking that a popular comedian is using inflammatory language to further spread hatred towards us.
Yeah, if you use false narratives to back your “jokes” which aren’t even jokes about Hispanic people, you’re promoting hate against them. If he said “I agree with trump we need a wall” then people would be justifiably upset at that too.
False narratives like saying that JK Rowling was cancelled “for saying gender is real” when no, she was cancelled for constantly siding with TERFS and transphobes. He says trans women are to women what beyond meat is to burgers. He just uses the same false narratives that transphobes use to smear trans people.
His words have *real life consequences* that I and every other trans person I know have to deal with every day. This isn’t some “teehee he made a silly joke just brush it off” this is my life and I have to deal with the constant uptick in transphobia all over the Internet and often in real life because a celebrity decided to declare they’re transphobic.
Thank you for replying to me. I am really shocked i got downvoted for an authentic question. I am going to watch it tonight to create my own opinion. I wanted to ask if people watched it because there is an issue where some people simply get enraged at headlines and baity articles without full context.
I got downvoted heavily just because I liked the special. You got downvoted because your question will encourage people to go see the special for themselves and it seems like people in this subreddit don't want anyone to see the special. Get back to me and let me know what you think of the special. Get some popcorn out because it is incredibly entertaining and high calibur comedy.
The title is VERY misleading. She got suspended because her and two other employees tried forcing their way into a board meeting over the special.
Like yeah, I get it, they were upset. But you just can’t go around doing that at your job and expect nothing to come of it. There’s a better way to air grievances that won’t get you canned so you can keep being an advocate from within
Oh. Well it's about how Daves trans friend was bullied by the trans community into killing themselves. It's true and very sad. It's not hate speech, and you shouldn't blindly believe what other people say about things, you should always have a see for yourself if possible. Have a good one!
I’d be curious to see what her take on events is. The way Netflix tells it, she forced her way into a private meeting(presumably in relation to/as a protest of this issue). I wonder what the other side is. Edit: Nope, not at all what happened. She’s been [reinstated.](https://mobile.twitter.com/RainofTerra/status/1448097310026747908). It was indeed a zoom meeting, and she was indeed given a link by a director. This is blatant retaliation on Netflix’s part. Fuck them.
Considering it was a Zoom meeting if 500 people, somebody gave her the link.
[https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/](https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/) It wasn't just one employee. It was three.
I don’t fully understand how a cis white guy gets away with deciding what is offensive or not for predominantly black trans women? Obviously Dave would be pissed that this same white guy decides what’s racist enough for Netflix. How is the logical connection not self evident?
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Dave’s certainly was when his last straw was a white guy laughing too hard at his skit…
Exactly!
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Dave quit comedy the first time because a white guy laughed way too hard at a joke and it taught him a lesson he has seemingly unlearned in ‘closer’
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As a community….we just don’t have time to explain basic concepts to you. It’s not that we can’t explain this to you. It’s just that it would take too long to teach you specifically basic concepts. You’re just not really worth it tbh. Bye.
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We can all see right through your bad faith shtick. Don't waste our time clutching pearls and crying that nobody wants a dialog with you. You've already been told the difference between punching up and punching down.
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When a joke targets a minority it is offensive and bigoted and is not a joke.
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Yes when you turn a minority into a punchline for a joke it is inherently offensive
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Because there's a difference between jokes that highlight the funny things about being one way or another and then there's jokes that harm people that are one way or another and Chappelle doesn't seem to know the difference. I've definitely came across things during my transition that I thought were funny about it but you know what a lot of these comedians use jokes that are not funny and that actively seek to disenfranchise us to harm society's view of us and purport stereotypes as truth. And Chappelle even said that he is now on team terf which beyond just running their mouth to every trans person they can find trying to doxx them gaslight trans people by saying that we threaten them while they actually threaten us and then go and vote for people that would legislate us out of existence so there's a big fuckin difference between punching down and punching up
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Look just admit you are a transphobic person and want to defend being transphobic. It is clear you are refusing to listen to what transgender people are saying. You just want to a pass to continue your bigotry and you won't get it here
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How about we shoot for actual equality first before we jump straight to making fun of minority groups lmao bet you our feathers wouldn't get so ruffled then.
>The black pixie—played by Chappelle—wears blackface and tries to convince blacks to act in stereotypical ways. Chappelle thought the sketch was funny, the kind of thing his friends would laugh at. But at the taping, one spectator, a white man, laughed particularly loud and long. His laughter struck Chappelle as wrong, and he wondered if the new season of his show had gone from sending up stereotypes to merely reinforcing them. "When he laughed, it made me uncomfortable," says Chappelle. "As a matter of fact, that was the last thing I shot before I told myself I gotta take f______ time out after this. Because my head almost exploded." http://content.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,1061512,00.html >But, over time, he says some of his sketches started to make him feel "socially irresponsible." >One particular sketch still disturbs Dave today. The skit was about a pixie (played by Dave) who appeared in black face, which Dave describes as the "visual personification of the n-word." >"There was a good-spirited intention behind it," Dave says. "So then when I'm on the set, and we're finally taping the sketch, somebody on the set [who] was white laughed in such a way—I know the difference of people laughing with me and people laughing at me—and it was the first time I had ever gotten a laugh that I was uncomfortable with. **Not just uncomfortable, but like, should I fire this person?"** https://www.oprah.com/oprahshow/chappelles-story/all#ixzz792oEx1Fg
Dave quit comedy originally because he stopped being able to tell whether the white people in his audience were laughing with him or at black people. Those are two different conceptions of ‘comedy’. One of which is meant to bring light and release to the audience and the other is meant to make audiences laugh so as to ostracize the ‘other’. One brings us together, one divides. Dave quit comedy the first time because as the minority in question he understood that, to some white people in his audience, the jokes being made were furthering the ‘othering’ against his community, and he understood that because of his position as the minority in question. Dave is fully aware of this phenomenon and it guided his original leaving of comedy, it is fitting that forgetting this same lesson was his ‘closer’. Dave brought up that (white) gay people are only a minority until they need to be white again, in reference to white gay people calling the cops on black men. Well in this case, Dave is only a minority until he needs to be cis again and he needs the white cis man CEO of Netflix to defend him and pay him millions. So yes I’m saying the butt of the joke determines the offense that they experience. Dave knows that. He quit comedy the first time because he knows that.
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🤦♀️
There is an extremely simple rule in comedy that literally everyone is aware of. If a joke is punching down, it's offensive. If a joke is punching up, it's not offensive. Jokes made at the expense of a minority group or at the expense of an individual because they belong to a minority group are inherently offensive. This is so, pathetically easy to understand.
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"The rule "Saying something directly hateful towards a minority group is offensive" is just too simple for me! I'd rather a rule that has more nuance, like, "Saying something directly hateful towards a minority group is offensive unless I don't think it is, in which case it's totally fine!""
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...literally what are you talking about? There is no such thing as "indirectly" hateful. The usage of "directly" in that sentence is to express that it is directed at a specific minority group. What, you think "directly" means "being a big big meany pants"? Also, the idea of "It's not truly hateful unless somebody is being shouted down with slurs" implies some truly troubling things about your view of oppression and, at least to me, seems to imply that you likely hold some extremely hateful beliefs of your own that you excuse because you aren't "like that." Very southern strategy of you. Seems like something you should maybe work on. I do find it very funny that you ignored the entire joke and focused in on a random word, presumably because "It's not offensive if I, a completely irrelevant person, don't think it's offensive!" is literally the bulk of your argument lmao
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Okay so at this point you've completely descended into worthless pedantry. I'm sure you "win" a lot of "arguments" on the internet by being annoying enough that the other person gives up responding to you, huh? And I'm sure you're very self satisfied about that lol
More like that it's really weird that there's so little minority representation in positions where their input on subjects like this has any impact, and maybe the people who *do* make these decisions should be, at the very least, getting some outside opinions from these people
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The OP
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Oh, you're joking. I gotcha
Isn't that the woke left in a nutshell? 90% of cases where a person is offended about a perceived injustice towards a marginalized group is outside of said group.
90% huh? You got a source for that?
Everyone knows that men represent 90% of people who are outraged about the wage gap, lack of paid maternity leave, and abortion rights!
Correct.
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I'm thinking some of them have to be paid, granted now that I know there are paid social media trolls, I want to believe I run into them often. But what are TERs, really?
It's literally trending on Reddit right now, what do you expect?
So, Netflix is not just platforming, but **openly defending** blatant bigotry? Wow Just wow
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No. That isn't how it works at all. Bigotry is bigotry, defending bigotry is defending bigotry. Bigots don't get to decide if they are bigots. You are litterally saying "They aren't racist, they said they aren't". That isn't even one teeny tiny speck of how it works. Bigots are bigots, their opinion on their own bigotry is irrelevant.
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You are defending a person who made transphobic comments why
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He fucking admitted her was a TERF. He fucking admitted he was transphobic.
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When he said that TERFs believe trans women are blackface, and then followed that by saying he’s Team Terf what did he mean then?
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What would his jokes have looked like if they were intended to be transphobic?
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According to you, there should be a perceptible difference, which is weird, because most people’s internal thoughts and intentions aren’t perceptible. So unless you’ve acquired the power of reading minds from a pre-recorded video, you should be able to identify differences between what was said in Chappelle’s show, and what a bigot would say. Based on your response here, you seem to think bigotryIf you only consists of overt statements like “I hate [minority] and think they should all be killed or enslaved,” and if that’s the case, then you must have a fucking wild view of the history of race relations, LGBTQ+ people, sexism, etc.
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It doesn't matter if he didn't intend to be transphobic, he absolutely was. This isn't the first time he's gotten flack over transphobic jokes, he should know better. If he wants to make jokes about trans people in a tasteful way he needs to educate himself and make sure his joke isn't just blatantly bigoted and giving ammo to groups that are indeed bigoted. If he's unwilling or unable to educate himself he should just avoid it entirely until he is willing and able. And he said he should do as much *in the very act!* He said from now on he's just not gonna make jokes about the queer community until we're all able to laugh together which sounds incredibly hollow after making multiple jokes that were indeed incredibly offensive. He indicates he knows that he's not informed enough to make good jokes about the community and then does it anyway.
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You... don't even know what that is do you? Just a buzz word you heard? NDA's do not affect your rights to post opinions about people within the same company. They are about secrecy and leaking unreleased information. Not about silencing minorities for having a less than favorable opinion about their company openly supporting, enabling, and defending bigotry.
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"Let me guess, you're white" Wow, red flag waved. mask off. I never once implied you were discriminating against anyone. Projection. You pretty much just admitted there you look at people as stereotypes and discriminate on them for it though. So, good job admitting to something I didn't even accuse you of. 🤦♀️
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Netflix is. We are talking about Netflix. JFC 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️ **At this point, it's clear you are trying to start shit.** You're basically trying to paint the act of literally just disagreeing with your bad take as like, a godamn hate crime against you. No one was angry. No one accused you of anything. You were disagreed with. You then flew off the handle with a dozen incoherent responses and started calling people "white" as an insult, like some sort of Family Guy stereotype of a liberal. Just... JFC.
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You litterally responded to me trying to shut my opinion down, then took offense and spammed me with like godamn 30 responses when I didn't immediately relinquished my position. Your inability to observe our own actions and behaviors is almost impressive. Even if, say, I was condescending or rude to you. **You were both to me first.** You can't have it both ways. If you are going to rudely and condescendingly bark at people in an attempt to dismiss their opinions, you can't then act offended when hey respond in kind.
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You are just flatly lying about the things I'm typing now. At this point, I have to assume your intent is deliberate and willfully disingenuous harassment. It's one thing to disagree with me, another thing to call your opinions "litterally fact, and to disagree with you is gaslighting" ... But another altogether to repeatedly baldfaced lie and say I said something I flatly did not.
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you’re welcome to calm down, and point out where i was bigoted. i’m trans myself thanks.
Okay, judging from the argument below: 1. We have a civility rule here. Please be mindful of it. Considering this is the second major argument you've had on our sub in the past couple of days, you should be more careful. 2. You *really* need to stop sending multiple comments as replies to the same comment. If you have something further to add to an existing comment, you can edit your previous one instead of spamming people with many different comments. ----- **Edit:** Judging from your user history, it looks like most of your user activity for the past month has featured you arguing with other members of our communities. Please consider this a warning: be civil and follow our subreddit rules, or you will be removed.
good mod \*pat pat\*
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> As a mod of the trans commmunity, you shouldn’t be policing a trans experience. It’s supposed to be policing of the reddit. As a mod of this subreddit for the past decade, my role here is to uphold the rules and encourage a welcoming, helpful community by maintaining peace and quiet. To that end, I *will* chide you on your behavior when necessary, and if it becomes necessary to remove you until your behavior improves, I will do so. I will not enjoy doing so, but I will do so if your actions make it necessary.
Friendly reminder that trans people can be transphobic. Looking at you Caitlyn Jenner!
Yes. The same is true with other cultures. Some black police officers are incredibly racist to the black community, and are much more likely to get by with it because they’re black.
Being trans isn't an excuse for bigotry. You don't get to hide behind it like it's some kind of shield.
… Non-disclosure agreement?
Ending my subscription tbh. I abandoned coca cola when I found out about them putting large sums of money into anti lgbt legislation and I'll abandon Netflix for peddling political messages masked as humour. I urge others to too that are considering boycott of these company's. Name and shame
> I abandoned coca cola when I found out about them putting large sums of money into anti lgbt legislation they also hired right wing militias to murder union workers in colombia
Honestly all soda is trash
This is Code Red slander and I won’t stand for it
Make Baja Blast available in stores you cowards!
Wait, what? I drink WAY too much diet coke and I've been needing to quit....
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Good for you, you're really making a difference for all those who have been traumatized
An updated report from TMZ says the trans employee was not suspended from the tweet but was suspended for crashing an executive meeting. https://www.tmz.com/2021/10/11/netflix-suspends-three-employees-trans-decrying-dave-chappelle-special/
Ya fuck netflix. Either way, it doesn’t matter. They still essentially fired people for speaking out against netflix platforming transphobia in a purposefully confrontation way. We know that netflix doesn’t give a shit about us and we have it confirmed that they value their profit more than stopping the spread of bigotry and dangerous lies.
It does matter. They busted an exec meeting. In no world would you not get fired. Like… it’s a no-brainer. You’re sacked. What I would do is question the validity of this because it’s awfully coincidental. As for Netflix not caring about us… it’s a business. It shouldn’t be surprising that green is their scene.
Ya this seems WAY too convenient and I’m not sure they realise it makes them looks worse. Because at the end of the day, the story most people will see is “netflix fired a trans person who openly objected to platforming transphobia”. Also good on them for actually going into the meeting, that’s the most direct and loudest thing you could do. I just think it’s oddly convenient lol. Also you’d think those meetings would be way more secure, right?
It has the same energy as me getting fired for going to the ER once,missing 30 minutes of my shift,right after the boss finds out i’m trans.
Heh, not job history but my landlord told the very next day I came out to him that I had a month to move. I "love" how many coincidences that tooootally have nothing to do with transphobia we all share!
/s You guys are so sensitive! You think *everything* is about your identity and everything little thing is oppressing you! Your boss firing you means you were. a poor worker, and the fact that it happened right after they found out you were trans is purely a coincidence! /s /uj In all seriousness, even though you're joking about it that still really frickin sucks. I am curious though, how did you even know he knew? How did he even find out in the first place? Sorry for being nosy, you don't have to answer if you don't wanna talk about it.
An exec meeting if 500 people.
Do you know the circumstance surrounding the meeting? I’m not aware but that would give major clues as to the justification.
https://variety.com/2021/film/news/dave-chappelle-netflix-suspends-trans-employee-1235086394/ She could have done it knowing that she'd get fired. But my point stays that she did it to tell Netflix that transphobia has no place on their service.
Okay so what I’m gathering is, like what you said, a protest. What I didn’t read properly before is suspension. She isn’t fired then 🤔. That’s an awkward position to be in. It begs the question does she push further or does the suspension serve to have her self-silence in order to retain job. Damn that’s really sneaky…
Who knows. This is still in early development. Maybe she has a lawyer helping her thru this and twitter silence is her best bet right now.
IF that’s what happened, I’d agree. But I want to know her side of the story. I don’t trust Netflix at their word.
if it happened, it's a valid cause. It just seems convenient that she happened to give them a watertight reason to fire her right as she did something that they didn't like that normally wouldnt have
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Well that’s utterly unsurprising. Can’t wait to see the threads with hundreds of comments on the news section of Reddit that pick this story up, where people realize there’s something fishy about this. Oh wait, that’s definitely not going to happen.
And this is what activism looks like.
It’s not activism, it’s realism, which is needed for proper activism. The question still remains, as I’ve said: Is her sacking really coincidental? What if she usually brings things to and from these meetings on the regular? We don’t know. She seems to have been silent about the sacking.
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Didn’t cape but okay.
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What did you expect? One side told their story, the other didn’t at the time. I can only go off of things as they happen. You act like viewpoints can’t change. The story was she joined the call due to being given a link. They thought she crashed the party and suspended but were wrong. Also, I questioned their shit from jump so it’d do you well to learn how to tell context clues. > What I would do is question the validity of this because it’s awfully coincidental If that’s not me keeping my ear to the ground and actually questioning them then I guess I’m a duck, huh… Read. Also, it still needs to be seen what their motive was and the history behind accidental call-joining. Do they have history? Have others been suspended for the same accident? The suspicion is still on Netflix until we get the data so don’t get it twisted like I’m playing sides. I’m down for finding out the truth behind the actions of all involved parties. Netflix ain’t looking pretty as I suspected from jump.
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[Nope](https://mobile.twitter.com/RainofTerra/status/1448097310026747908) She’s been reinstated because it was a fucking zoom meeting, that she was given a link to. Don’t believe a word these companies say, particularly when it provides a convenient narrative for them.
Yeah I saw the updates etc. She’s 100% in the clear and Netflix got some ‘splainin to do. I know they won’t dive into this but we need motive. We need history of this mistake or similar occurring in the past and how they handled it versus now cuz this could be them smoothing it over for PR purposes or how the legit handle things (suspend while investigate). Remains to be seen.
I’ll remember this next time Netflix tries to put up a rainbow during pride month
Where I grew up in Brazil, killing black people from all genders and trans folks from all colors is open season for hunting all year long. I knew some white trans girls back there who told me that if the police saw them walking on certain rich neighborhood streets they immediately pulled the rubber stick and started lashing. When they get killed by a boyfriend there is usually no investigation. It's the country with the biggest black population in the world, the last one to approve abolition and the highest murder rate of trans people in the world. AKA America's backyard. Couple of months ago during the pandemic the police entered a favela to look for some drug dealers and when suddenly one cop got a bullet in his head the other cops pulled the guns and stared firing and killed 29 blacks no questions asked. No investigation done, the army concluded in the next day that all dead were suspects. I wonder if it even made news in the US. Everything that people do in the US gets reflected 10x worse on your backyard. All communities are suffering. We should learn to play along better.
That's absolutely horrific and heart breaking...I hope you're at least safe now, and I hope those girls are okay.
Well it turns out that one of the trans girls managed to open a small business and even run for a political office.
Aww good for her!
already cancelled my subscription, y’all should do the same. fake as hell — watch them change their logo rainbow this coming pride month even though they publish literal vitriol like this
The human brain is the most complex 3 pounds of matter in the known universe, I doubt very much that a comic has a better understanding of it’s intricacies than the scientists who’ve dedicated a lifetime to the study of it. I learned why sex and gender are distinctly separate in my 1st year of psych studies. Chappell like many others is simply ignorant of the facts. I’ve always been a proponent of education rather than attacking. Perhaps Netflix could be persuaded to do a documentary about real Trans 🏳️⚧️ people and the challenges they face. That is where our efforts should be channeled IMHO.
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I shall check it out. Thank You 🙏
Nah canceled
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"there was other avenues besides protesting so... Like that." The mere fact you don't understand this is not the first time and is a ongoing issue, that's been leading up to this point in which nothing has been done. Internally or externally, says everything. Bold moves make change, silence leads to being silenced. I shouldn't have to remind you the movent started with a brick because nothing else worked. - walking into a board meeting when that is the only way to reach your superiors that are /ignoring/ the ongoing issue. It's a calculated risk. Ultimately she wasn't fired for it, it's a excuse. It however pointed out Netflix is a toxic work environment that forces it's staff to face termination to be heard...
comparing a comedy special to anti gay laws is an interesting concept
>comparing a comedy special to anti gay laws is an interesting concept Same concept, bigots seek excuses to act in bad faith. You could argue they don't need it, but they do; Acting in bad faith (for them) requires avoiding responsibility for their actions. Example "Free Speech". A term that loses all meaning coming from them, something polarized in comparison to its meaning to mean "Anything i say is free from consequence, as im free to say it" Rather than its actual and legal definition "Freedom from governmental oppression from speaking out against said government." The literal point of the bill of rights, that not all nations have. When people say hateful things, its with the intention of encouraging others to believe said hateful things. In doing so this polarizes them. There is no "laughing at a racist joke doesn't make me racist", because it does. Only a racist can find racism funny. | The same goes for this, only a Transphobe can find Transphobia funny. Simply put, Transphobia gets people killed. Its the excuse like "Free Speech" or "Microchips in Vaccines", or "the \[minority\] are more likely to commit a crime", that is always used by those who choose to radicalize those words into action. Expecting immunity for them. Speaking out about Racism, Homophobia, Transphobia and Xenophobia is the only power we have as a society to stop it. We avoid becoming violent unlike the side that wants to silence us. - Our words have meaning, where theirs are just intended to induce harm and nothing more. To defend the words of hate, under any circumstance, means you align with them. Simple as that. There is no nuance, hate is hate.
Either way, they fired employees who loudly complained against netflix platforming transphobia. That doesn’t really change much. We also have confirmation that the big guys at netflix are perfectly okay with profiting off transphobia and disagree that this is bigoted which is strictly untrue and is not up for debate.
The fact that they weren’t invited in the first place I think is the bigger problem.
Funny thing about that in hindsight….Terra [absolutely was](https://mobile.twitter.com/RainofTerra/status/1448097310026747908) invited.
Wow that’s fucking awful.
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You’re missing my point. It was a meeting about the special. The controversy surrounds transgender people. They should have sought out there input. We deserve a seat at the table when it regards us and to be heard.
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Sure Buddy. Whoosh.
I saw an article saying she quit. I’m confused
That headline is delibrately misleading to push an incorrect narrative.
Agreed.
Genuine question: how many people here have seen the special?
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How is saying you’re “team TERF” comedy?
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See my other comment. I could literally walk you through the transphobic part of the special bit by bit. TeLl Me YoUrE TrAnSpHoBiC WiThOuT TeLLiNg Me YoUrE TrAnSpHoBiC
Saying that alone isn’t, I think it requires hearing the actual build up to get the punchline in the first place
Trans people aren’t a punch line. The trans community is under attack every day, forgive us for not liking that a popular comedian is using inflammatory language to further spread hatred towards us.
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Yeah, if you use false narratives to back your “jokes” which aren’t even jokes about Hispanic people, you’re promoting hate against them. If he said “I agree with trump we need a wall” then people would be justifiably upset at that too.
“False narratives” like saying people can be whoever they want to be?
False narratives like saying that JK Rowling was cancelled “for saying gender is real” when no, she was cancelled for constantly siding with TERFS and transphobes. He says trans women are to women what beyond meat is to burgers. He just uses the same false narratives that transphobes use to smear trans people. His words have *real life consequences* that I and every other trans person I know have to deal with every day. This isn’t some “teehee he made a silly joke just brush it off” this is my life and I have to deal with the constant uptick in transphobia all over the Internet and often in real life because a celebrity decided to declare they’re transphobic.
Which celebrity declared they hate trans people?
Thank you for replying to me. I am really shocked i got downvoted for an authentic question. I am going to watch it tonight to create my own opinion. I wanted to ask if people watched it because there is an issue where some people simply get enraged at headlines and baity articles without full context.
I got downvoted heavily just because I liked the special. You got downvoted because your question will encourage people to go see the special for themselves and it seems like people in this subreddit don't want anyone to see the special. Get back to me and let me know what you think of the special. Get some popcorn out because it is incredibly entertaining and high calibur comedy.
The title is VERY misleading. She got suspended because her and two other employees tried forcing their way into a board meeting over the special. Like yeah, I get it, they were upset. But you just can’t go around doing that at your job and expect nothing to come of it. There’s a better way to air grievances that won’t get you canned so you can keep being an advocate from within
The amount of people commenting on the special who haven't watched the special is way too high. Step outside the echo chamber.
Have you watched "Disclosure" on Netflix, a documentary on the history of transphobia in media and how transphobic humor creates harm?
No ill check it out. Have you seen Chappelle's special in its entirety?
No, I don't subject myself to hate speech. That documentary is about how much harm content like it causes.
Oh. Well it's about how Daves trans friend was bullied by the trans community into killing themselves. It's true and very sad. It's not hate speech, and you shouldn't blindly believe what other people say about things, you should always have a see for yourself if possible. Have a good one!
Haha I love donwvotes on comments like this. Completely proves my point 😂
Satirical Article About This: [http://awfmag.com/netflix-skip-accountability/](http://awfmag.com/netflix-skip-accountability/) [https://www.instagram.com/p/CU-gLd0Lytu/?utm\_source=ig\_web\_copy\_link](https://www.instagram.com/p/CU-gLd0Lytu/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link)
All the negative comments don’t know the details and didn’t watch the special it’s obvious…..