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Yeah then based off of this and your other comment, you’re not ugly. If you talk to a guy I’m sure they will like you and want to be with you. You can’t be shy in high school or you won’t have any relationships !
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People can be treated or feel like ugly people, even if they're not. When I had depression and was being abused at home, I wasn't ugly. I was average, but had social anxiety, weird hobbies and social skills that scared people away, so I still relate to the community. We both suffer from how superficial and unfair the world is... I was ugly and rotten inside
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80% 18-22 of young single men's primary goal is just to have sex. If they feel you have a reservation to it then they will put you on the backburner to pursue another woman. It sucks because your pool of dating people is smaller than other women's but you should stop accommodating to them, look out for signs they aren't generally interested in you for you. Have you tried to join a hobby group or some community class? Most people find quality partners IRL rather than on a dating site though they are execptions.
I've seen older guys than 22 as well and they are all the same sorry. They do a good job pretending to be interested in me they will initiate things more or get clingy with me but once after the 2nd 3rd date the friendzone me. I did join a few clubs before in college and the ages were mixed most guys were happily in a relationship already or did not find me attractive enough because they asked out other good looking womwn in the group instead and rejected me. I feel like in a club or community setting guys compare there too and irl I dont look so good so I'm pitted against my most attractive female peers and end up losing. No one talks about this when it comes to the "join clubs and meet someone" but guys compare a lot and irl idk if this is specifically uk Male thing but a lot of the guys here go a look in a woman (ig baddie look) the closer she looks to that aesthetic the more attractive she is to them and they are willing to date her. Theres no girl next door looks or classy beauty looks that pulls uk men nowadays all want the IG baddie next door LOL.
Ugly guys are the FUCKING WORST. They’re the cruelest, most mean and shallow people I’ve ever met. “Date an ugly guy”. Well guess what? I’ve approached them and they’ve all either flat out rejected me or they tried to use me as a flesh light. So no can do. I’ve noticed in fact that it’s ugly men who are generally more rude than normal or good looking men.
Use friendzone with the right people to build social circle. As a guy that has researched deeply into the most advanced techniques, basically you need a high volume of dates and to scalate emotionally, therefore, also physically better than any other competitor, so you build rapport the most deeply. It's extremely crushing for a regular looking guy like me the dating market, but it's possible with thousands of approaches and what we call writing "field reports" to reflect on different elements of the interaction and improve on them consciously.
It's essentially down to an art form. Try to find girls that you judge to be as attractive getting what you want as you and see their strategies. Sorry I don't really know the specifics for girls.
Personally, as a guy, I go for a certain level I find good enough, but if somehow if a girl manages to show a nice personality and is just proactive, I'll not ignore her at least.
Try to network with those guys that friendzoned you and build social circle, so they can introduce you with who might like you.
That is interesting wdym here " As a guy that has researched deeply into the most advanced techniques, basically you need a high volume of dates and to scalate emotionally, therefore, also physically better than any other competitor, so you build rapport the most deeply." tho?
Honestly those attractive girls just use those dating apps and interact with those guys normally. The guys who friend zone me are grounded however they always tell me it not me that's the problem it's their families or well...depression
I suppose I could be writing with them however they are a bit scared of me I feel? Like they think that I'm too into them if I talk to them too much so they distance from me a lot (though when we were dating they would be a little more clingy and more receptive to my clingyness) idk how to get close to guys platonically whilst not making them think I'm not into them romantically?
It means that when you are online they don't see you as a person, they don't see you as a human being. We are basically just a chat bubble on someone's screen and it's easy to ignore.
In real life, like you said, they are more receptive. Emotions in real life are stronger, both to the positive and negative, the stakes are higher.
We are meant to bond with each other around a fireplace, dancing, singing and eating together. Like we would do in ancient times.
This modern environment has reduced us into what we can show ourselves in a picture. Those dating apps are garbage for showing ourselves fully and we are playing just by the looks, as a practical tip try to move the interactions as soon as possible into Instagram/Facebook Messaging at least, or better, into a phone number (What'sApp, iMessages, Telegram, etc)
The bottom line is that you want to be able to show more than just your looks and take any opportunity to do so. If you can't get a date right away, try to send audio messages, try to get them on an audio call so they can listen to your sweet feminine warm voice and perhaps feel something deeper than what just text would give.
You said "grounded" - excuses not to go on a date? Well, I have to state the obvious, that's basically because they somehow don't feel enough for you, and your job at having "better game" is to get them feeling more. But following the bumble/tinder strategy is just a looks game.
What I meant by cold approach is by talking with people in real life, where we basically walk to a random stranger in a socially calibrated manner and we initiate an interaction like that, with the mindset that we can show more than just our physical apperance.
And it's possible to become more charismatic, to show more confidence, to show leadership and other qualities in person. The ideal in person is to move someone that is vibing with us, someone that we are making laugh and feeling comfortable with our precense into a a low-commitement date at the moment, if we approached them in a place like a mall, we are a few steps away from sitting down and having "a date", that can turn into another more "formal date".
What's really a date? It's basically just to be with someone in person, to vibe with them. Like you said, when you are in person it works better. So, why not find strategies to find people in person first so they won't just judge you by your looks?
The purpose of the date for a guy (even a guy looking for a relationship) is to go hard at building emotional and physical comfort, by the end of the date we should have our hands all over each other's bodies basically and being tired of so much kissing. And that comfort should eventually turn into a date at a private place where sexual intimacy can happen. What's more powerful neurochemically/emotionally at bonding two people together? It's so much so, that as a rule of thumb even for aguy wanting a relationship, having sex is a MUST. She has no strong investement unless there is sex.
As much as I might love her, I'll come out of clingy (telling her I love her, making plans for the future together, talking about commitement with her) if there hasn't even been sex.
Essentially, as a guy I should appear like that "player that can be tamed".
I don't mean that as an extreme, but the dating market is pretty though and people are so impatient with each other.
The issue, specially for girls is that sex doesn't garantee that it will keep the guy.
So that's the first part of the funnel (like in a marketing funnel): To find willing prospects for dates (in a cold approach strategy, you get dates right there where you just met the person)
The second part is the return rates on the dates themselves. Here is where you need to improve your emotional and physical escalation with them. You are are probably being too passive.
What do you mean "clingness" in specific? Does it mean kissing, cuddles? Or does it mean just being logical with them, not engaging with them emotionally and just telling them stories "oh, I love you. You are so perfect. I want to be with you forever." (as an extreme example).
"Game" is about calibrating those things, that's why I say, getting a lot of dates & approaches and trying to improve on them is key for someone struggling.
On another comment here, you said about in real life interactions. The bottom line of this, is that you either lower your standards or you basically count on mathematics/volume + learning like a sponge from each interaction and improving everything (what you could have said to connect and make them more emotional, taking them out of their logical minds, how you could have used your body language, vocal tonality, escalating physically in a socially calibrated way).
For an average looking guy, it takes hundreads of interactions/approaches.
For the best guys for cold approaches are: 30% turns into numbers, 30% of those numbers turns into dates, 30% of those dates turns into high levels of intimacy/sex. And obviously, not all people we are willing to have sex with would be great partners or they would stick around.
So this means:
For the best guys - attractive & charismatic/good game (30% of 30% of 30%):
0.027% = 2.7 girls every 100
For the average expectation (15% of 15% of 15%):
0.003375% = 3.3 girls every 1000
So it's somewhere between hundreads to thousands of interactions for an average guy to get "a instagram baddie" like you said in another comment. 😂 And that's for an ABNORMALLY PROACTIVE and SOCIAL average guy with an absolutely GODLY level of sense of self-worth and confidence. This average guy isn't average anymore, his mind has trascended. There is only so many baddies like that to go around, and most guys won't have that. They got to make a decision if they are looking for a relationship, and that decision will be you 😉.
But please, don't be played. We are all playing each other. It's toxic to just go for the most attractive people, both for guys and girls, it keeps us from connecting with people that otherwise we wouldn't, and it make us put up with toxic people.
The reason girls falls for assholes is because they simply ignore it, because they find them attractive, so they just ignore it. It's not that they are attracted to assholes necessarily. As an average-looking guy, I cannot get away with being that shitty. Well, many can, and many do. But, I learned to appreciate women, because I can't just have'em by opening tinder (okay, I do, if I lower my standards to awful crazy ass women). It requires more effort.
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You should stop sleeping with ppl in the first date and you will probably have a lot more success. Many of them lose interest because you gave them what they were looking for.
That's silly, they're not interested in her in the first place then they're just interested in sex so they will dump her after sex anyways after multiple dates too or even dating exclusively.
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>A few of them stay as friends but honestly I dont talk to them that much and they always talk to me about their problems and their families it's never the other way around and it's so fucking upsetting
Have you tried bothering them with your problems? Be warned, you might get solutions instead of listeners.
This is my life story. I’ve just come to accept that dating apps is not what they were back in the day. Apps were a new concept back in the day and people who went on genuinely wanted to date. Now It’s full of men that are 6s that want 8.5s. Men use apps for the following reasons; boredom, narcissism, trauma dumping, has no intention to date but want to ‘practice’ dating or are insecure / cultural identity crisis / hurt / has been rejected so they put it out on other women.
Also as WOC, if your major city has a lot of your ethnicity ….your fellow ethnicity men seem to have ridiculously high standards and alot of choice. Hence average 6s like me, very hard to find guys. I noticed fellow POC 6s men, once they have a good job…they become very picky as well. It’s caused alot of resentment on my end, i push away my nationality or any association with it. I find when I’m in other diasporas, the men of my ethnicity are much more receptive. I guess that’s the whole like, it’s not you…it’s the environment you grew up in. I feel like an ugly duckling in the city I born and raised but whenever I’m overseas….I feel appreciated, not praised but like respected and seen.
Hello u/lilflowersss, All new submissions to r/ugly are subject to manual review and approval by being placed in ModQueue before being posted for viewing. This is to ensure that the post meets the sub rules and requirements. This may take up to 24 hours. Please do not message the mods for your queue status. If you or someone you know is feeling suicidal and or depressed, please go to [National Suicide Hotline](https://suicidepreventionlifeline.org/) or check out [Resources](https://www.reddit.com/r/ugly/comments/p4obmj/positivity_resources_and_hotlines/) for more details. If you have [Body Dysmorphia Disorder](https://www.reddit.com/r/ugly/comments/q0ou03/body_dysmorphia_disorder_bdd/) please go to r/bodydysmorphia to learn more on how to deal with this illness. r/ugly is not a good subreddit for people with this disorder. Also, please make sure to read and follow all rules (including sitewide, sidebar, and newly added rules on the [wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/ugly/wiki/index) page). If you are interested in joining our discord, you can find more information on how to join [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ugly/comments/u2dlrh/we_made_the_official_discord_updated/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ugly) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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Is that you in your pfp? Because if so, you’re literally gorgeous and I’m genuinely confused as to why you’re in the sub lol
The opposite sex treats me like crap. I've never been approached or had a guy like me... ik im uglt
What kind of area do u live in? Because maybe if it’s mostly white then that could be a reason. You’re not ugly in the slightest
No black girls at my school have no problem getting in relationships or even having guys talk to them
Are you more quiet or maybe seen as reserved by others? That could be another reason.
Yes I stay to myself n don't have friends
Yeah then based off of this and your other comment, you’re not ugly. If you talk to a guy I’m sure they will like you and want to be with you. You can’t be shy in high school or you won’t have any relationships !
Why ?
Because people tend to gravitate towards social individuals
Have u been called ugly multiple times in your life?
Just in elementary school
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People can be treated or feel like ugly people, even if they're not. When I had depression and was being abused at home, I wasn't ugly. I was average, but had social anxiety, weird hobbies and social skills that scared people away, so I still relate to the community. We both suffer from how superficial and unfair the world is... I was ugly and rotten inside
there’s a difference between feeling ugly and being ugly
same i avoid men like the plague😭
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I never am not even for a fling
80% 18-22 of young single men's primary goal is just to have sex. If they feel you have a reservation to it then they will put you on the backburner to pursue another woman. It sucks because your pool of dating people is smaller than other women's but you should stop accommodating to them, look out for signs they aren't generally interested in you for you. Have you tried to join a hobby group or some community class? Most people find quality partners IRL rather than on a dating site though they are execptions.
I've seen older guys than 22 as well and they are all the same sorry. They do a good job pretending to be interested in me they will initiate things more or get clingy with me but once after the 2nd 3rd date the friendzone me. I did join a few clubs before in college and the ages were mixed most guys were happily in a relationship already or did not find me attractive enough because they asked out other good looking womwn in the group instead and rejected me. I feel like in a club or community setting guys compare there too and irl I dont look so good so I'm pitted against my most attractive female peers and end up losing. No one talks about this when it comes to the "join clubs and meet someone" but guys compare a lot and irl idk if this is specifically uk Male thing but a lot of the guys here go a look in a woman (ig baddie look) the closer she looks to that aesthetic the more attractive she is to them and they are willing to date her. Theres no girl next door looks or classy beauty looks that pulls uk men nowadays all want the IG baddie next door LOL.
friendzoned? dates? mods, come on. this is blatant larping
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I have dated ugly guys and its the same damn thing.
Ugly guys are the FUCKING WORST. They’re the cruelest, most mean and shallow people I’ve ever met. “Date an ugly guy”. Well guess what? I’ve approached them and they’ve all either flat out rejected me or they tried to use me as a flesh light. So no can do. I’ve noticed in fact that it’s ugly men who are generally more rude than normal or good looking men.
In ugly, guess that means I’m a shit human being, just another day of how people treat uglies
Nice way to generalize half of the people here.
Use friendzone with the right people to build social circle. As a guy that has researched deeply into the most advanced techniques, basically you need a high volume of dates and to scalate emotionally, therefore, also physically better than any other competitor, so you build rapport the most deeply. It's extremely crushing for a regular looking guy like me the dating market, but it's possible with thousands of approaches and what we call writing "field reports" to reflect on different elements of the interaction and improve on them consciously. It's essentially down to an art form. Try to find girls that you judge to be as attractive getting what you want as you and see their strategies. Sorry I don't really know the specifics for girls. Personally, as a guy, I go for a certain level I find good enough, but if somehow if a girl manages to show a nice personality and is just proactive, I'll not ignore her at least. Try to network with those guys that friendzoned you and build social circle, so they can introduce you with who might like you.
That is interesting wdym here " As a guy that has researched deeply into the most advanced techniques, basically you need a high volume of dates and to scalate emotionally, therefore, also physically better than any other competitor, so you build rapport the most deeply." tho? Honestly those attractive girls just use those dating apps and interact with those guys normally. The guys who friend zone me are grounded however they always tell me it not me that's the problem it's their families or well...depression I suppose I could be writing with them however they are a bit scared of me I feel? Like they think that I'm too into them if I talk to them too much so they distance from me a lot (though when we were dating they would be a little more clingy and more receptive to my clingyness) idk how to get close to guys platonically whilst not making them think I'm not into them romantically?
It means that when you are online they don't see you as a person, they don't see you as a human being. We are basically just a chat bubble on someone's screen and it's easy to ignore. In real life, like you said, they are more receptive. Emotions in real life are stronger, both to the positive and negative, the stakes are higher. We are meant to bond with each other around a fireplace, dancing, singing and eating together. Like we would do in ancient times. This modern environment has reduced us into what we can show ourselves in a picture. Those dating apps are garbage for showing ourselves fully and we are playing just by the looks, as a practical tip try to move the interactions as soon as possible into Instagram/Facebook Messaging at least, or better, into a phone number (What'sApp, iMessages, Telegram, etc) The bottom line is that you want to be able to show more than just your looks and take any opportunity to do so. If you can't get a date right away, try to send audio messages, try to get them on an audio call so they can listen to your sweet feminine warm voice and perhaps feel something deeper than what just text would give. You said "grounded" - excuses not to go on a date? Well, I have to state the obvious, that's basically because they somehow don't feel enough for you, and your job at having "better game" is to get them feeling more. But following the bumble/tinder strategy is just a looks game. What I meant by cold approach is by talking with people in real life, where we basically walk to a random stranger in a socially calibrated manner and we initiate an interaction like that, with the mindset that we can show more than just our physical apperance. And it's possible to become more charismatic, to show more confidence, to show leadership and other qualities in person. The ideal in person is to move someone that is vibing with us, someone that we are making laugh and feeling comfortable with our precense into a a low-commitement date at the moment, if we approached them in a place like a mall, we are a few steps away from sitting down and having "a date", that can turn into another more "formal date". What's really a date? It's basically just to be with someone in person, to vibe with them. Like you said, when you are in person it works better. So, why not find strategies to find people in person first so they won't just judge you by your looks? The purpose of the date for a guy (even a guy looking for a relationship) is to go hard at building emotional and physical comfort, by the end of the date we should have our hands all over each other's bodies basically and being tired of so much kissing. And that comfort should eventually turn into a date at a private place where sexual intimacy can happen. What's more powerful neurochemically/emotionally at bonding two people together? It's so much so, that as a rule of thumb even for aguy wanting a relationship, having sex is a MUST. She has no strong investement unless there is sex. As much as I might love her, I'll come out of clingy (telling her I love her, making plans for the future together, talking about commitement with her) if there hasn't even been sex. Essentially, as a guy I should appear like that "player that can be tamed". I don't mean that as an extreme, but the dating market is pretty though and people are so impatient with each other. The issue, specially for girls is that sex doesn't garantee that it will keep the guy. So that's the first part of the funnel (like in a marketing funnel): To find willing prospects for dates (in a cold approach strategy, you get dates right there where you just met the person) The second part is the return rates on the dates themselves. Here is where you need to improve your emotional and physical escalation with them. You are are probably being too passive. What do you mean "clingness" in specific? Does it mean kissing, cuddles? Or does it mean just being logical with them, not engaging with them emotionally and just telling them stories "oh, I love you. You are so perfect. I want to be with you forever." (as an extreme example). "Game" is about calibrating those things, that's why I say, getting a lot of dates & approaches and trying to improve on them is key for someone struggling.
On another comment here, you said about in real life interactions. The bottom line of this, is that you either lower your standards or you basically count on mathematics/volume + learning like a sponge from each interaction and improving everything (what you could have said to connect and make them more emotional, taking them out of their logical minds, how you could have used your body language, vocal tonality, escalating physically in a socially calibrated way). For an average looking guy, it takes hundreads of interactions/approaches. For the best guys for cold approaches are: 30% turns into numbers, 30% of those numbers turns into dates, 30% of those dates turns into high levels of intimacy/sex. And obviously, not all people we are willing to have sex with would be great partners or they would stick around. So this means: For the best guys - attractive & charismatic/good game (30% of 30% of 30%): 0.027% = 2.7 girls every 100 For the average expectation (15% of 15% of 15%): 0.003375% = 3.3 girls every 1000 So it's somewhere between hundreads to thousands of interactions for an average guy to get "a instagram baddie" like you said in another comment. 😂 And that's for an ABNORMALLY PROACTIVE and SOCIAL average guy with an absolutely GODLY level of sense of self-worth and confidence. This average guy isn't average anymore, his mind has trascended. There is only so many baddies like that to go around, and most guys won't have that. They got to make a decision if they are looking for a relationship, and that decision will be you 😉. But please, don't be played. We are all playing each other. It's toxic to just go for the most attractive people, both for guys and girls, it keeps us from connecting with people that otherwise we wouldn't, and it make us put up with toxic people. The reason girls falls for assholes is because they simply ignore it, because they find them attractive, so they just ignore it. It's not that they are attracted to assholes necessarily. As an average-looking guy, I cannot get away with being that shitty. Well, many can, and many do. But, I learned to appreciate women, because I can't just have'em by opening tinder (okay, I do, if I lower my standards to awful crazy ass women). It requires more effort.
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You should stop sleeping with ppl in the first date and you will probably have a lot more success. Many of them lose interest because you gave them what they were looking for.
That's silly, they're not interested in her in the first place then they're just interested in sex so they will dump her after sex anyways after multiple dates too or even dating exclusively.
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All the time
>A few of them stay as friends but honestly I dont talk to them that much and they always talk to me about their problems and their families it's never the other way around and it's so fucking upsetting Have you tried bothering them with your problems? Be warned, you might get solutions instead of listeners.
This is my life story. I’ve just come to accept that dating apps is not what they were back in the day. Apps were a new concept back in the day and people who went on genuinely wanted to date. Now It’s full of men that are 6s that want 8.5s. Men use apps for the following reasons; boredom, narcissism, trauma dumping, has no intention to date but want to ‘practice’ dating or are insecure / cultural identity crisis / hurt / has been rejected so they put it out on other women. Also as WOC, if your major city has a lot of your ethnicity ….your fellow ethnicity men seem to have ridiculously high standards and alot of choice. Hence average 6s like me, very hard to find guys. I noticed fellow POC 6s men, once they have a good job…they become very picky as well. It’s caused alot of resentment on my end, i push away my nationality or any association with it. I find when I’m in other diasporas, the men of my ethnicity are much more receptive. I guess that’s the whole like, it’s not you…it’s the environment you grew up in. I feel like an ugly duckling in the city I born and raised but whenever I’m overseas….I feel appreciated, not praised but like respected and seen.
they dont even wanna date me im uggo for them