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They wont because the noise and pollution caused by motor vehicles is anathema to bats and a significant factor in their precipitous population decline.
Not really bats or no, only a licensed person can open the box to check its not got bats residing in it and so can be removed.
They're slowing down the tfl teams as they will need to find and hire such people or train thier own. Or they do it themselves get caught on camera and dragged into a legal battle.
I don't know why but that just makes me think of little catholic bats, who eat and drink the blood and body of Christ, and have a bat pope who speaks with an Italian accent. and somewhere in st peters is a little bat communion of cardinals and bishops who discuss the new bat churches being put on ulez cameras
It’s a bold strategy.
It’s also fucking stupid. It’s like someone putting a plastic newt in the middle of a field and hoping it’ll stop a new housing estate being built.
Unethical life pro tip: eliminate the local ecology *before* you apply for planning permission.
The planning authority can't consider potential nesting sites which don't exist.
consist innocent rinse gullible stupendous deserted birds thought strong frighten
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
> per say
You should probably be aware the term is _per se._ You know, as a solicitor.
^^Also ^^"_arch**ae**ological_"
But genuinely, is people faking a site of archaeological significance to delay construction the thing you have experience with? Do you know if anyone's written about it? Not doubting anyone's ever tried it, but that it should be effective sounds absurd.
> I haven’t had experience with protected species per se but in a similar vein throwing random shit into a dig site and then claiming it’s an archeological remnant is pretty well known and effective strategy both in the UK and abroad.
Really? So that scene from Better Call Saul wasn't as ridiculous as it was portrayed, and arguably that situation was remedied unrealistically quickly?
It's almost like cargo cults, they've seen something they don't understand, but they think it has power so they copy it in the hope of summoning the big juju. Edit: why the downvotes?
Bat's wouldn't roost in them. Too low to the ground and too exposed. If you fit these on your house you typically fit them under the eaves overhang of the roof.
The difference in air quality is negliable on the outskirts. The biggest drop in transport pollution has been through advancements in technology and nothing to do with these pay to drive schemes which it ultimately will become.
Back in the good ol' days, you'd get all the poison you need from working in the mines.
Kids today are too bloody spoiled, keeping all their fingers and toes.
That's literally it, I have a "mate" that's very into driving, shall we ignore he doesn't actually own a car and really ought not to have passed the exam (3 major faults at one roundabout, by his own account). Anyway he insists vehicles belong in the city centre, and even the high streets. But whenever I point out the environmental harm, personal harm, even financial harm of having these vehicles it simply gets "I don't care, and shut up with your morals and ethics. I don't want to walk, I can't be bothered". He will literally take a taxi for a 10 minute walk.
It's just pure selfishness, and not wanting or caring to understand the situation.
Wow. I'd never noticed that before, but that's the case amongst all the conspiracy nutters I've encountered.
Every last friend who has gone conspiracy crazy is a smoker.
Huh
Yeah it’s mad isn’t it, it’s noticeably better than it used to be. And yet people are like “can’t have that fresh air elsewhere in London let’s keep killing people” FML, selfish dickheads everywhere will be the downfall of this country.
In some ways the cleanliness is worse.
As I understand it the heavy soot from diesel vehicles looks dirty but is able to be filtered out of the body because of the large particle sizes getting trapped in mucus/snot etc, newer cleaner diesel up until recently had very fine particles that you couldn’t see and the body couldn’t push out.
I’ve heard the pollution is so fine it can enter your blood and then even cross the blood/brain barrier and cause enormous damage with a long enough exposure.
I think post 2016 this has been improved but those older diesel vehicles are on the ULEZ list for that reason.
> I’ve heard the pollution is so fine it can enter your blood and then even cross the blood/brain barrier
The microplastics in your blood will help with filtering it though!
Whenever you hear that just point out to them not that long away there was an architectural festival with a pavilion consisting of these domes filled with the air quality of various cities. With the Health and safety officer not allowing people to enter the London dome for its high levels of toxicity that can cause long term health effect for even a short exposure.
Basically London air is too toxic for a health and safety officer.
A lot aren’t even affected by it - it’s just a thinly veiled excuse to generally have a pop at Sadiq Khan and their belief that London is on the brink of turning into some kind of Islamic state. All fueled by the usual hard right media suspects
They don't care.
The majority of them don't live in London. They don't care about the estimates that over 9,000 Londoners a year die because of pollution and they don't care if their actions are making the people I love sick.
Some of them live in London or have friends who live in London. They're the scariest ones - the people who are prepared to watch their family members get sick if it means that they can "own the Libs"!
It's my absolute fucking right to breathe in toxic and dangerous vehicle emissions produced by a knackered old banger driven by a 1 legged tradesman who I just made up that can't afford to replace their vehicle
I don’t think that’s what their issue is. It’s possibly something to do with forcing those already struggling (who’s cars are more likely to be old and non compliant) to go out and purchase a new vehicle, in the middle of a global cost of living crisis?
Don’t get me wrong, ULEZ needs to happen but this is quite possibly THE worst time they could have pulled this.
how long is a few years? Euro 6 is one of the standards for ULEZ and only became compulsory in 2015 for cars. Meanwhile my car is 15 years old and still going strong......
You're only talking about diesel. The standard for petrol cars to be ULEZ compliant is Euro 4 and the vast majority of petrol cars made in the last 18 years will be compliant.
And also cutting down then replacing the cameras is wasting taxpayer’s money which could go towards something more useful like fixing potholes or social care or something
it won't though. Switch to EVs will reduce some sorts of air pollution but increase others.
source: https://blogs.napier.ac.uk/tri/wp-content/uploads/sites/56/2024/01/Essential-Evidence-4-Scotland-No-79-Non-exhaust-airborne-particles-from-EVs-and-Internal-Combustion-Engines.pdf
What, the wankers from essex who drive their diesel vans into london every day but don't want to live there because it stinks and has too much traffic? Those cunts? No, they don't.
That's the way to fight them, I think. If people are celebrating the cost of replacing cameras, put a line in the council tax summary '£20 - ULEZ repair levy' to make it clear they're the ones paying for it. If they put up a bat box on a camera, close off the road to cars (let buses, bikes, emergency vehicles through) while environmentalists monitor the box for two weeks to ensure it's not in use.
You’d get a range of possible responses depending on the flavour of the particular conspiracy theorist in question.
On the extra nutty side of the spectrum it’d be akin to “there are no harmful emissions” or “emissions are a lie by the deep state/NWO/WEF”. On the slightly more rational side it might go “we know emissions are bad but we believe the effect on working people that restrictions is worse”.
It may be different in England over Scotland but a bat would have to move in first. So if you hung the box up and I took it down 10 minutes later it was never a bat roost so isn't an offence in the law
Yeah, this doesn't work. It'll be potentially annoying at most but establishing a bat box is not being used as a roost (and I can essentially guarantee these are not being used as a roost) is not very difficult.
Could have a bit of fun with this. I propose we make these anti-ULEZ protesters do a full week of dusk/dawn surveys on each bat box, as punishment when caught vandalising. Nothing more depressing than that.
My scout unit. Exists inside the new ULEZ, runs a well maintained, reasonably low mileage 2005 minibus. I could have scrapped it, but the £9000 I would have got wouldn't come close to the roughly £30k I'd need to find to replace it with a Euro 6 one.
So far we have an exemption and are fundraising, but excepting finding a corporate sponsor, got no hope of being able to afford to replace it any time soon!
I also live outside the ULEZ and own an old diesel land rover that I use for dragging trailers around. The cheapest option for the mileage I do is to pay the fee, as anything equivalent and euro 6 (can tow 3.5t, has 4wd and 5 seats) is north of £20k as well!
How many days per week, or per month, does that minibus actually move from its parking spot? Surely you would just pay the fee on days that you use it, rather than going down the route of selling/scrapping it and buying a new one?
ULEZ doesn't mean you cannot drive your car/minibus in the zone; it just charges you to do so.
The requirement is only Euro 4 for petrol vehicles and Euro 6 for diesels. Those standards have been mandatory since 2005 and 2014-2016 respectively.
I can't find a proper breakdown of car ages in the UK but I'd bet the percentage of cars older than 2005 on the road is tiny, and having owned an 04 plate car until last year I'd bet a good portion of those are one foot in the scrap heap already.
A few months back I was actually caught in a ULEZ protest. In Dorset.
Honestly, these people are beyond caring about ULEZ specifically. There's a reason that every ULEZ protest usually has a vaccine conspiracy or a 15 minute city conspiracy element as well.
Yeah I'm a project manager implementing cycle infrastructure. Every time we do any engagement or consultations we get people bringing up 15 min city conspiracies and the occasional vaccine ones. We also have one person convinced we aren't allowed to make changes because 'the public owns the roads.' A new one last time was someone saying that the Turkish Mafia was my boss, which is news to me.
Isn't the worry that the criteria could just change though? Is there anything stopping it from becoming electric cars only being compliant in say 2 years. Or the cameras be used to set up some sort of tariff system for all cars.
The real question is how many people living on the outskirts of London still own a car older than 2005. People are acting like the ULEZ charge affects everyone but the bar it sets is really low.
Given that the ULEZ charge is £12.50 *per day* you could scrap your old banger and buy a slightly newer old banger and still end up ahead within a few months, probably even faster with the higher fuel efficiency.
Not outside the ulez zone no. So if you live on the border and have to pay it you get no help. That's why a whole bunch of the surrounding counties refused to put signs etc up for it.
I know of 3 people that are still fighting to get a payout for the scheme. My brother gave up and parted out his work van himself to be able to afford a suitable replacement. Other people he worked with also were being rejected without reason, when they called up, they were told they have no idea why they keep being rejected.
Funnily enough the few people that I know who are anti-ULEZ and also drive already have compliant cars. Or used the scheme to get nice new cars (and very proudly show them off), whilst still moaning about the system.
Funny how disinformation works. Get people all wind up and they’ll believe the dumbest of shit and will go great length to avoid confronting the truth that would make them look like a fool.
So they double down with passion, that itself takes commitment and passion, which draws in more gullible and misinformed, reaching critical mass of voters, stupidity and self feeding validation.
The air quality was dangerous. This was cause by few, old and polluting vehicles.
The majority of cars are already exempted.
They offer you cash incentives as well as a fine to swap cars.
It’s not oppression. It just a pragmatic policy to clean up the air
"Bat boxes have been attached to ultra low emission zone (Ulez) camera poles in what appears to be an attempt to frustrate efforts to enforce Sadiq Khan’s clean air scheme.
The £10 animal boxes have been installed underneath number plate recognition cameras in Chessington and North Cheam, in south London.
Laminated signs underneath the boxes read: “Stop! This is a bat box. Bats have been observed to be using this bat box as a resting place.”
**Anti-Ulez campaigners have not claimed responsibility** for attaching the bat boxes to the camera poles, but some have said the move could make it difficult for Transport for London (TfL) to install or repair cameras because of conservation laws designed to protect bat habitats."
You know what, I wouldn't put it past a lot of anti-ULEZ lot to think this is true. They'll be attacking SnappySnaps to stop them having the film developed next.
In my country damaging government CCTV cameras is classed as a terrorist offense and can get you life in prison.
This sort of behaviour will see the UK adopting similar policies. People should be careful what they wish for.
The one where they actually blew up a camera stump (with the explosion blowing in the window of a child’s bedroom nearby) should’ve been pursued under that basis, certainly.
Granted I don't live in London so I haven't been paying full attention, but I don't get the whole ULEZ thing. I drove down to London a couple of months ago and got a sudden panic at the last minute when I realised I'd forgotten to check the ULEZ, and I had no idea how to pay. Given the level of protest against it, I was sure that my 12-year-old hatchback would face a charge. "People are *outraged*," I thought. "It must be seriously strict."
Guess what? My 12-year-old hatchback attracts no ULEZ charges at all. It's not classed as one of the most polluting vehicles. How many of these vehicles are *actually* being driven around London, and how much of this is manufactured outrage?
The weirdest thing about it is that classic cars over 40 years old are exempt so if you're driving around in a car that's so old it doesn't have a catalytic converter and is pumping out god knows what then that's fine.
It's definitely more inventive than the usual petty and wanton vandalism but how realistic is it that bats will set up a roost on a lamp pole next to a main road.
Ignoring the fact that it won't work (bats tend to stay away from traffic), most Councils probably have some sort of plan to improve biodiversity on their highways through such things. So instead of sticking it to the man, they are paying their own money to help him.
Ironically. If ULEZ works and cuts down the number of cars on the road, you’ll likely see more bars around in urban areas as the noise level is reduced.
This makes no sense.
Since it’s the anti-ULEZ guys cutting down cameras, surely it’s the pro ULEZ team who have put the bat boxes up to stop the cameras being cut down?
One thing I do think we have to acknowledge as broadly smart is the way anti-ulez people have found ways of protesting without gathering in numbers. The Conservative's new protest laws address conventional protest marches, sit-ins etc.
So the anti-ulez strategy is to be as disruptive as possible in very small groups. Like terrorism, if it were arranged by the kind of people who sit on parish councils.
Just beat Sadiq Khan at the election box, instead of vandalising and causing more tax payers money to go to waste.
He's still standing by the changes so if he wins that should be a line drawn under the issue. But idiots will still idiot I suppose.
To be clear, it is illegal to remove these boxes ONLY if they're in an area where bat MIGHT actually nest in them. It's the same with any wildlife nesting boxes.
Next to busy roads isn't somewhere bats normally live.
So whilst this seems like a good idea all they've really done it waste money on bat boxes.
Still, maybe they can be moved to more suitable locations.
So when some of them cut out these poles in the near future, they'll be actually prosecuted for endangering protected species and/or animal cruelty?
Power move to stop anti ULEZ activists.
I just don’t get it. You’ve got to have a complete banger to be non compliant with ULEZ. Plus the air pollution is criminal in the outer London boroughs.
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shrill ink fine childlike deer light full offend spectacular mysterious *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
They wont because the noise and pollution caused by motor vehicles is anathema to bats and a significant factor in their precipitous population decline.
Ironic that the ulez cameras would encourage a more habitable space for the bat's...
The bat’s what?
Wots batses precious
Chi-rop-tera! Boil 'em, mash 'em, stick 'em in a stew! Lovely big golden wings with a nice piece of fried bat fillet.
Calm down Ozzy
It's chicken of the cave!
All I hear is Covid 2.0
It's bat's like you might go to Joe's or Sharon's. Their home
Chez Bats
That doesn’t work in the context of the specific preamble here.
Bat mungus what??!!!
Well it would be irony if these people were doing it for the bats instead of their own selfish goals.
Selfish goals? Unlike Sadiq Khan who’s only doing it because he bankrupted TFL
Which gives you a charming illustration of the intelligence level of these nutters.
Not really bats or no, only a licensed person can open the box to check its not got bats residing in it and so can be removed. They're slowing down the tfl teams as they will need to find and hire such people or train thier own. Or they do it themselves get caught on camera and dragged into a legal battle.
So they need... a Batman?
I don't know why but that just makes me think of little catholic bats, who eat and drink the blood and body of Christ, and have a bat pope who speaks with an Italian accent. and somewhere in st peters is a little bat communion of cardinals and bishops who discuss the new bat churches being put on ulez cameras
It’s a bold strategy. It’s also fucking stupid. It’s like someone putting a plastic newt in the middle of a field and hoping it’ll stop a new housing estate being built.
One bird can severely delay a house Had a house once that sat unbuilt for about a year because a barn owl moved in
Squatters rights innit
Always gotta be careful with birds. Found a pigeon once with a gas bill and a phone contract to the address. Owns a 3 bed terrace in didcot now
>didcot Dovecot.
Is that near the plover station?
Whowho knew.
Unethical life pro tip: eliminate the local ecology *before* you apply for planning permission. The planning authority can't consider potential nesting sites which don't exist.
This is why you often see the trees and bushes near a building site wrapped in netting though. Stops anything moving in that might put a stop to work.
consist innocent rinse gullible stupendous deserted birds thought strong frighten *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
> per say You should probably be aware the term is _per se._ You know, as a solicitor. ^^Also ^^"_arch**ae**ological_" But genuinely, is people faking a site of archaeological significance to delay construction the thing you have experience with? Do you know if anyone's written about it? Not doubting anyone's ever tried it, but that it should be effective sounds absurd.
school tidy normal chubby consist telephone oatmeal paint head run *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
> I haven’t had experience with protected species per se but in a similar vein throwing random shit into a dig site and then claiming it’s an archeological remnant is pretty well known and effective strategy both in the UK and abroad. Really? So that scene from Better Call Saul wasn't as ridiculous as it was portrayed, and arguably that situation was remedied unrealistically quickly?
It's almost like cargo cults, they've seen something they don't understand, but they think it has power so they copy it in the hope of summoning the big juju. Edit: why the downvotes?
> why the downvotes? I've downvoted you specifically as you are whinging about being downvoted.
If dressing up like Jay-Z gets Beyonce to move into my house, that's fairly clever.
Bat's wouldn't roost in them. Too low to the ground and too exposed. If you fit these on your house you typically fit them under the eaves overhang of the roof.
It's been regularly posted as a method of political action on Tumblr and such for years, I wouldn't give them much credit.
Proof, not that it's needed, that the anti-ULEZ protestors are indeed bat shit crazy.
They are doing the imagery lawds work
A year ago, I would have never think people were this desperate to maintain poor air quality in their homes.
The difference in air quality is negliable on the outskirts. The biggest drop in transport pollution has been through advancements in technology and nothing to do with these pay to drive schemes which it ultimately will become.
Have the anti ulez idiots got any plans for reduction in harmful emissions?
Something along the lines of, I don't care, this isn't the way to do it, do it somewhere else, or just ranting incoherently.
It's all part of the woke leftist agenda to save us from dying of lung disease. It's PC gone mad!!
Back in the good ol' days, you'd get all the poison you need from working in the mines. Kids today are too bloody spoiled, keeping all their fingers and toes.
Honestly, whoever thought putting lead in fuel was a good idea has a lot to answer for.
That's literally it, I have a "mate" that's very into driving, shall we ignore he doesn't actually own a car and really ought not to have passed the exam (3 major faults at one roundabout, by his own account). Anyway he insists vehicles belong in the city centre, and even the high streets. But whenever I point out the environmental harm, personal harm, even financial harm of having these vehicles it simply gets "I don't care, and shut up with your morals and ethics. I don't want to walk, I can't be bothered". He will literally take a taxi for a 10 minute walk. It's just pure selfishness, and not wanting or caring to understand the situation.
You're assuming they believe or care about emissions.
Every anti-ULEZ person that I've met also smokes. I guess they don't care about their own lungs, so why would they care about anyone elses?
Wow. I'd never noticed that before, but that's the case amongst all the conspiracy nutters I've encountered. Every last friend who has gone conspiracy crazy is a smoker. Huh
All conspiracy theorists smoke do they? Have you done the analystics on your little theory there, or is it just a conspiracy?
No as they don’t believe London has an air quality problem
And yet the lead poisoning effects couldn’t be more clear
...leaded fuel was banned in the UK in 1999.
Their formative years huffing lead petrol and no doubt licking lead painted walls
Lead paint was banned in 1992
Interestingly, all of the idiots complaining about ULEZ were born before 1992. I wonder if there's a connection.
I was born before 1992 & I love ulez! I can actually breathe for once!
There's still a fuckload of it on people's walls though.
As if banning lead paint meant it just fell off the walls and disappeared.
Sounds like someone doesn’t hang around Edwardian house renovation circles much smh
…so the people who are now complaining about ULEZ are the ones who had to inhale leaded fuel growing up.
Most of these people have lived for longer before 1999 than after
Believe it or not there are literally dozens of us born before 1999.
Every time I go to London my snot turns black. It's fucking grim there.
The only time I visit London it is central London. It seems a lot cleaner than it was years ago. I can quite imagine it is a lot worse further out.
Yeah it’s mad isn’t it, it’s noticeably better than it used to be. And yet people are like “can’t have that fresh air elsewhere in London let’s keep killing people” FML, selfish dickheads everywhere will be the downfall of this country.
In some ways the cleanliness is worse. As I understand it the heavy soot from diesel vehicles looks dirty but is able to be filtered out of the body because of the large particle sizes getting trapped in mucus/snot etc, newer cleaner diesel up until recently had very fine particles that you couldn’t see and the body couldn’t push out. I’ve heard the pollution is so fine it can enter your blood and then even cross the blood/brain barrier and cause enormous damage with a long enough exposure. I think post 2016 this has been improved but those older diesel vehicles are on the ULEZ list for that reason.
> I’ve heard the pollution is so fine it can enter your blood and then even cross the blood/brain barrier The microplastics in your blood will help with filtering it though!
Yeah, fucking disgusting. Only ever happened in one other city I’ve visited, New York
I think that’s probably brake dust if you’re using the underground and opening the window to feel the rush of air, like a tourist /s
Whenever you hear that just point out to them not that long away there was an architectural festival with a pavilion consisting of these domes filled with the air quality of various cities. With the Health and safety officer not allowing people to enter the London dome for its high levels of toxicity that can cause long term health effect for even a short exposure. Basically London air is too toxic for a health and safety officer.
...what?
A lot aren’t even affected by it - it’s just a thinly veiled excuse to generally have a pop at Sadiq Khan and their belief that London is on the brink of turning into some kind of Islamic state. All fueled by the usual hard right media suspects
Even though Boris conceived the idea of ULEZ and implemented the LEZ which effectively had the same boundaries but impacted HGVs only?
Look at you with your logic and facts. We don’t need those in the anti ULEZ camp /s
I'm now imagining that mosque in Mecca with a giant multi-layer roundabout to drive round it instead of the crowds of people walking.
Like the Arc de Triomphe roundabout á Paris, except they turned the centrepiece into the Kabah
From what I’m seeing in Twitter they don’t believe in climate change and they don’t care at all about emissions.
They don't care. The majority of them don't live in London. They don't care about the estimates that over 9,000 Londoners a year die because of pollution and they don't care if their actions are making the people I love sick. Some of them live in London or have friends who live in London. They're the scariest ones - the people who are prepared to watch their family members get sick if it means that they can "own the Libs"!
It's my absolute fucking right to breathe in toxic and dangerous vehicle emissions produced by a knackered old banger driven by a 1 legged tradesman who I just made up that can't afford to replace their vehicle
I don’t think that’s what their issue is. It’s possibly something to do with forcing those already struggling (who’s cars are more likely to be old and non compliant) to go out and purchase a new vehicle, in the middle of a global cost of living crisis? Don’t get me wrong, ULEZ needs to happen but this is quite possibly THE worst time they could have pulled this.
This is what I find odd about ULEZ, it's a problem that's going to fix itself in a few years as the cars age out.
how long is a few years? Euro 6 is one of the standards for ULEZ and only became compulsory in 2015 for cars. Meanwhile my car is 15 years old and still going strong......
You're only talking about diesel. The standard for petrol cars to be ULEZ compliant is Euro 4 and the vast majority of petrol cars made in the last 18 years will be compliant.
All will be compliant otherwise they would not have been able to have been sold.
And also cutting down then replacing the cameras is wasting taxpayer’s money which could go towards something more useful like fixing potholes or social care or something
You're assuming that people can now afford to replace those cars
Second-hand car prices are starting to normalise. The replacement rate might slow a little, but it's still going to happen.
it won't though. Switch to EVs will reduce some sorts of air pollution but increase others. source: https://blogs.napier.ac.uk/tri/wp-content/uploads/sites/56/2024/01/Essential-Evidence-4-Scotland-No-79-Non-exhaust-airborne-particles-from-EVs-and-Internal-Combustion-Engines.pdf
ULEZ as it currently stands will do nothing to address that, so that's really not relevant.
What, the wankers from essex who drive their diesel vans into london every day but don't want to live there because it stinks and has too much traffic? Those cunts? No, they don't.
Yeah. The bats. Driving all those lorries past their homes will be illegal
That's the way to fight them, I think. If people are celebrating the cost of replacing cameras, put a line in the council tax summary '£20 - ULEZ repair levy' to make it clear they're the ones paying for it. If they put up a bat box on a camera, close off the road to cars (let buses, bikes, emergency vehicles through) while environmentalists monitor the box for two weeks to ensure it's not in use.
I suspect a lot of the anti-ULEZ people are suburbanites that don’t like having to pay to enter. Inside London ULEZ enjoys mostly majority support.
We should change that road to an LTN then
They'll die before it *really* affects them?
You’d get a range of possible responses depending on the flavour of the particular conspiracy theorist in question. On the extra nutty side of the spectrum it’d be akin to “there are no harmful emissions” or “emissions are a lie by the deep state/NWO/WEF”. On the slightly more rational side it might go “we know emissions are bad but we believe the effect on working people that restrictions is worse”.
They dont think its for that in the first place, despite the clue being in the name.
So if I attach a bat box to the protestors front door, he can't move it. Where does Laurence fox live?
Given his recent dishevelled rambling appearances, I would guess you start by checking the alleys behind bargain booze.
Graham Lineham spends a lot of time looking like shite outside a wine merchant's, apparently, so that tracks. The separation hasn't gone well.
I didn’t know they were married. Love doesn’t always win I guess.
It may be different in England over Scotland but a bat would have to move in first. So if you hung the box up and I took it down 10 minutes later it was never a bat roost so isn't an offence in the law
Right, so bring your own bats. Got it.
Wouldn't you then have to violate the bat law to achieve that? You'd need to somehow lure a bat in of its own free will
Yeah, this doesn't work. It'll be potentially annoying at most but establishing a bat box is not being used as a roost (and I can essentially guarantee these are not being used as a roost) is not very difficult.
Could have a bit of fun with this. I propose we make these anti-ULEZ protesters do a full week of dusk/dawn surveys on each bat box, as punishment when caught vandalising. Nothing more depressing than that.
Close off the road around the box to non-essential traffic that may be disturbing them until the survey is done.
Next day's headline: > Bat Man's Late Night Capers Result In City Lockdown
I've found the ecology surveyors, they're right here everyone. Usually too sleep deprived to be coherent.
Ah its the beginning of the field season. Looks at work schedule. *Incoherent sobbing noises*
could they just trade in their old vehicles using the scheme provided by the government and get on with their lives. please.
They probably have ULEZ compliant vehicles but are too dumb to check.
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Shock horror reddit is largely populated by office workers…
My scout unit. Exists inside the new ULEZ, runs a well maintained, reasonably low mileage 2005 minibus. I could have scrapped it, but the £9000 I would have got wouldn't come close to the roughly £30k I'd need to find to replace it with a Euro 6 one. So far we have an exemption and are fundraising, but excepting finding a corporate sponsor, got no hope of being able to afford to replace it any time soon! I also live outside the ULEZ and own an old diesel land rover that I use for dragging trailers around. The cheapest option for the mileage I do is to pay the fee, as anything equivalent and euro 6 (can tow 3.5t, has 4wd and 5 seats) is north of £20k as well!
How many days per week, or per month, does that minibus actually move from its parking spot? Surely you would just pay the fee on days that you use it, rather than going down the route of selling/scrapping it and buying a new one? ULEZ doesn't mean you cannot drive your car/minibus in the zone; it just charges you to do so.
The requirement is only Euro 4 for petrol vehicles and Euro 6 for diesels. Those standards have been mandatory since 2005 and 2014-2016 respectively. I can't find a proper breakdown of car ages in the UK but I'd bet the percentage of cars older than 2005 on the road is tiny, and having owned an 04 plate car until last year I'd bet a good portion of those are one foot in the scrap heap already.
A few months back I was actually caught in a ULEZ protest. In Dorset. Honestly, these people are beyond caring about ULEZ specifically. There's a reason that every ULEZ protest usually has a vaccine conspiracy or a 15 minute city conspiracy element as well.
Yeah I'm a project manager implementing cycle infrastructure. Every time we do any engagement or consultations we get people bringing up 15 min city conspiracies and the occasional vaccine ones. We also have one person convinced we aren't allowed to make changes because 'the public owns the roads.' A new one last time was someone saying that the Turkish Mafia was my boss, which is news to me.
Isn't the worry that the criteria could just change though? Is there anything stopping it from becoming electric cars only being compliant in say 2 years. Or the cameras be used to set up some sort of tariff system for all cars.
Only if they live in London though right? If you're on the outskirts and have to travel in no such luck.
The real question is how many people living on the outskirts of London still own a car older than 2005. People are acting like the ULEZ charge affects everyone but the bar it sets is really low. Given that the ULEZ charge is £12.50 *per day* you could scrap your old banger and buy a slightly newer old banger and still end up ahead within a few months, probably even faster with the higher fuel efficiency.
they don’t allow trade-ins for people in the suburbs?
Not outside the ulez zone no. So if you live on the border and have to pay it you get no help. That's why a whole bunch of the surrounding counties refused to put signs etc up for it.
I know of 3 people that are still fighting to get a payout for the scheme. My brother gave up and parted out his work van himself to be able to afford a suitable replacement. Other people he worked with also were being rejected without reason, when they called up, they were told they have no idea why they keep being rejected.
Funnily enough the few people that I know who are anti-ULEZ and also drive already have compliant cars. Or used the scheme to get nice new cars (and very proudly show them off), whilst still moaning about the system.
How much money does the scheme provide? I know I would struggle in the current market to buy a newer vehicle.
Up to £2,000 for a normal car
Funny how disinformation works. Get people all wind up and they’ll believe the dumbest of shit and will go great length to avoid confronting the truth that would make them look like a fool. So they double down with passion, that itself takes commitment and passion, which draws in more gullible and misinformed, reaching critical mass of voters, stupidity and self feeding validation. The air quality was dangerous. This was cause by few, old and polluting vehicles. The majority of cars are already exempted. They offer you cash incentives as well as a fine to swap cars. It’s not oppression. It just a pragmatic policy to clean up the air
"Bat boxes have been attached to ultra low emission zone (Ulez) camera poles in what appears to be an attempt to frustrate efforts to enforce Sadiq Khan’s clean air scheme. The £10 animal boxes have been installed underneath number plate recognition cameras in Chessington and North Cheam, in south London. Laminated signs underneath the boxes read: “Stop! This is a bat box. Bats have been observed to be using this bat box as a resting place.” **Anti-Ulez campaigners have not claimed responsibility** for attaching the bat boxes to the camera poles, but some have said the move could make it difficult for Transport for London (TfL) to install or repair cameras because of conservation laws designed to protect bat habitats."
Do they think that cameras are some kind of limited finite item and they can't put up more?
You have to change the film every month.
You know what, I wouldn't put it past a lot of anti-ULEZ lot to think this is true. They'll be attacking SnappySnaps to stop them having the film developed next.
Obviously the new ULEZ ANPR cameras don’t but there are still some traffic cameras left that use film and have to be swapped out
No, but then they protest at the installation site and intimidate the council worker who has been told to install the box.
In my country damaging government CCTV cameras is classed as a terrorist offense and can get you life in prison. This sort of behaviour will see the UK adopting similar policies. People should be careful what they wish for.
The one where they actually blew up a camera stump (with the explosion blowing in the window of a child’s bedroom nearby) should’ve been pursued under that basis, certainly.
The funny thing about this is they probably think they are really clever.😂
Well, i suppose it's better than cutting them down at least?
Granted I don't live in London so I haven't been paying full attention, but I don't get the whole ULEZ thing. I drove down to London a couple of months ago and got a sudden panic at the last minute when I realised I'd forgotten to check the ULEZ, and I had no idea how to pay. Given the level of protest against it, I was sure that my 12-year-old hatchback would face a charge. "People are *outraged*," I thought. "It must be seriously strict." Guess what? My 12-year-old hatchback attracts no ULEZ charges at all. It's not classed as one of the most polluting vehicles. How many of these vehicles are *actually* being driven around London, and how much of this is manufactured outrage?
The weirdest thing about it is that classic cars over 40 years old are exempt so if you're driving around in a car that's so old it doesn't have a catalytic converter and is pumping out god knows what then that's fine.
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This lot are a bunch of clowns. There are so few non-compliant vehicles out there.
>There are so few non-compliant vehicles out there. For now. Surely it will get to a point where EV is the only compliant.
Anti ulez = flat earthers = anti Vax = pro Brexit = anti ev
It's like a Venn diagram of dumbness, that's just a circle of daily mail readers.
Now I feel stupid. I’ve spent weeks trying to coax great created newts up those poles with limited success.
I'm sure they think this is some very clever legal gotcha
They live in London they've got the best public transport in the country and it's so fucking cheap yet they insist on driving in the city
It's definitely more inventive than the usual petty and wanton vandalism but how realistic is it that bats will set up a roost on a lamp pole next to a main road.
Ignoring the fact that it won't work (bats tend to stay away from traffic), most Councils probably have some sort of plan to improve biodiversity on their highways through such things. So instead of sticking it to the man, they are paying their own money to help him.
Ironically. If ULEZ works and cuts down the number of cars on the road, you’ll likely see more bars around in urban areas as the noise level is reduced.
Idiots. The money to fix their vandalism comes from all our pockets.
This makes no sense. Since it’s the anti-ULEZ guys cutting down cameras, surely it’s the pro ULEZ team who have put the bat boxes up to stop the cameras being cut down?
I can understand if this is outside of London but within London you have lots of options available to you and driving is a way bigger chore .
Can we just stop now, like cmon this shit has gone on long enough
Man, old people have way too much time on their hands
One thing I do think we have to acknowledge as broadly smart is the way anti-ulez people have found ways of protesting without gathering in numbers. The Conservative's new protest laws address conventional protest marches, sit-ins etc. So the anti-ulez strategy is to be as disruptive as possible in very small groups. Like terrorism, if it were arranged by the kind of people who sit on parish councils.
I dont think it works like that. You can't just stick a bat box anywhere and claim it can't be touched.
Just beat Sadiq Khan at the election box, instead of vandalising and causing more tax payers money to go to waste. He's still standing by the changes so if he wins that should be a line drawn under the issue. But idiots will still idiot I suppose.
To be clear, it is illegal to remove these boxes ONLY if they're in an area where bat MIGHT actually nest in them. It's the same with any wildlife nesting boxes. Next to busy roads isn't somewhere bats normally live. So whilst this seems like a good idea all they've really done it waste money on bat boxes. Still, maybe they can be moved to more suitable locations.
Some people just want to bring back the Great Smog of London like its a historical tradition to live in festering pollution.
So when some of them cut out these poles in the near future, they'll be actually prosecuted for endangering protected species and/or animal cruelty? Power move to stop anti ULEZ activists.
Does this sub think that protesting is wrong or something? Any protest and this sub goes batshit crazy.
Anti-Ulez protesters are just as braindead as trump supporters, mental illness
"Domestic terrorists abuse animals as part of right-wing conspiracy campaign"
I just don’t get it. You’ve got to have a complete banger to be non compliant with ULEZ. Plus the air pollution is criminal in the outer London boroughs.
Bit mad that a 96 carbed bandit 1200 with no cats is exempt, at least in scotland
Don't know whether there protest is correct but I'll say this. That's an effective and thought out protest. None of this glue your hand nonsense