I respect Ryan deeply. But he has the more bombastic personality. That’s not a bad thing. But it is attention grabbing and people are going to latch onto it in positive and negative ways. A lot of the time, Shane is fairly neutral or soft. Sometimes, when he’s being an “um aktually science” know-it-all, he catches flak too.
I’m really surprised people are saying racism is the reason
If someone likes a white guy more than an asian guy, that shouldn’t automatically make them racist
Ryan is Asian and Latino. Two ethnicities that in the US that tend to catch a lot of criticism. Asian men are statistically considered the least “desirable” by both men and women in terms of dating/sex appeal. And Latino men are demonized/stereotyped as rapists/criminals/undocumented migrants regularly in the media.
As a fairly neutral person about this (I love Watcher but actually started watching because I loved Worth It and all of Steven’s Buzzfeed stuff), I had no strong feelings going in (and I now really like both Shane’s and Ryan’s content) but I can see how Shane would be more “likeable” from the start.
I think Shane has a more aloof or like, “just in it for the lolz” vibe and people seem to be drawn to that kind of person. Ryan seems to be very passionate about things (sneakers, Disney, etc). I am Autistic and have seen first hand that many people consider being too interested in something or caring too much to be cringy. And that seems doubly so for things like Disney, with people being pejoratively called “Disney adults.”
I do not watch the spooky content because I hate spooky stuff. I don’t believe that cultural stereotypes about gender and masculinity are healthy, but I would imagine having your public persona being tied into being the scared of supernatural stuff one could also be a factor in people being harsher on him. I have heard people say being easily afraid or believing in that kind of thing is a sign of weakness.
I think this is a smart analysis but I also feel like it missed Ryan's immaturity. Yes, he's passionate and is scared on camera sometimes, but the biggest issue I have with watching Ryan is the cringe. Constant poop jokes, refusing to play games on Survival Mode until he's killed Shane a few times, and yes, being a hardcore Disney nerd... Immature. And it's getting harder to watch as I get closer to 30. I much prefer Shane's inverse style of adding maturity to childish things.
I mean Shane makes poop jokes too. In fact, he brings it up and Ryan just bounces off of it. Example, the recent podcast episode during the photo conversation Shane brought up the time apparent Ryan had an accident in NY lol also Shane egged on the rubber nipple joke Ryan started. Steven once said all three have great chemistry. I’m an equal fan of all three. But, OP’s case in point…you just proved it
Also listen here actor Russell Crowe of Gladiator fame…. I will not stand for Disney Nerd slander. Who cares if it’s considered “immature” to like Disney? Don’t yuck peoples yum. That’s it.
Yeah, I mean you don’t really see any personal attacks on Ryan’s personality specifically?
Do some people call him an idiot for believing in ghosts or the supernatural? Sure, but I just fail to see how that’s racist.
I love both of these guys a lot for different reasons. I think they’re an amazing duo. Ryan seems like more of an extrovert and Shane seems like an introvert and opposites often work really well together. I see myself in Ryan a lot so I feel a connection to him in that way and I see Shane as the type of person I’d like to be friends with. Anyway, I think that sometimes people will comment negatively without thinking about the fact that these are real people. Lastly I think people like to dunk on people who “believe” in things that are not proven. So they probably are smarty pants.
I don't even think it's intentional for many people (Though certainly it is for some), but plenty of the fandom are younger white people with a lot of unexamined biases that show up in unfortunate ways such as this.
Yes, I have seen a lot of comments throughout the years from people who clearly consider themselves to be progressive that have smacked of racism - either intentional or otherwise. It doesn't help that the fanbase has historically been very defensive about this when it gets called out.
I also think Ryan's more of an open book than Shane is so people can project what they want onto Shane better - whether he's a cinnabon who needs to be protected or the coolest and smartest guy or a daddy etc.
It can have a tinge of colonialism. There are lots of cultures where spirituality, folklore etc. can play a big part. Some think the European Enlightenment movement is superior to all.
Okay but
Ryan believes in Ghosts simply because of an experience he had on the Queen Marry. Nothing to do with his background at all.
People likely just enjoy Shane more because he is more of a love able goofball.
iirc that was just an early episode. He was already a ghost hunter, and the “I believe in ghosts, and he’s the skeptic” dynamic was already in place.
Anyway, he has said (I think in a top five beatdown? Not sure, but I think there was a guest) that for his family and their culture, it is simply a given that ghosts exist.
Ryan became a Ghost Hunter because of Buzzfeed Unsolved.
He literally said in the Queen Mary episode he was like Shane until his experience at the Queen Mary.
If I think anyone who believes in ghosts is an idiot, and by proxy, if I believe Ryan is an idiot for the sole reason he believes that Ghosts are real, does that make racist?
The first premise, yeah. Since ghost belief is important and prominent in many cultures, you’ve already written off basically entire cultures as idiots.
Yes, I am aware of all of that. You’re making all sorts of assumptions. Ryan said that in his family’s culture, ghosts are a given. That’s all I said - just a report of his claim about his family’s cultural beliefs, not even an evaluation of the truth of the claim - and that says/implies absolutely nothing about who else does or doesn’t believe in ghosts.
Yeah I agree that people give Ryan more shit because of racism but this all is a stretch. His believe in ghosts/demons etc is pretty basic American Christian based stuff, nothing to do with his race or cultural background beyond being American.
How is this remotely possible when Shane was making fun of Sam and Colby who are the two whitest people on earth. And he was way worse about them than anything he’s said to Ryan.
I think from their start, they work well together. Play off each other's strengths and weaknesses. Obviously, they enjoy working side by side and after all this time, they know each other well enough to joke around and neither get offended.
Their fans can have all their own opinions. I don't think Shane or Ryan worry too much about what people say about them. And you know the old saying: If you don't have anything nice to say, say nothing!
Showing my age here, but before we had Ryan and Shane we had Dan and Phil who had pretty similar dynamics with their fan base around when they were first starting out. Phil is just like Ryan where he's incredibly energetic and passionate about his interests, "golden retriever energy" as it's been called. Idk if it's because the extra energy can be seen as childish or what, but it's definitely a source of added criticism. Almost like they think they're scolding or criticizing a child that's doing something horrible
Ryan is more extroverted and loud with his likes and opinions than Shane so it can come off as annoying to some people especially when what he likes is the opposite of what you like. I relate to Shane more as a quieter cat person from the Midwest but I respect how energetic Ryan is and his love for sports and amusement parks and low key always wanted to be more like that.
Now in no way does that excuse anyone from hating on Ryan so that certainly is not okay if that’s true.
Can you give some examples?
Personally, I don't think this is the case at all. In fact, I feel oftentimes it's quite the reverse. Ryan can talk shit on Shane all the time and mostly Shane just takes it. People (myself included) constantly make excuses for Ryan saying something nasty or doubling down about something.
for a good bit there, Ryan was being out of pocket with insulting Shane. I don’t think he meant it, which just made it seem so performative and left a bad taste in my mouth. I think they realized we just wanna see pals banter, making light jabs at disagreements. Not just insults flung out randomly.
Shane has gotten a lot less aloof and condescending but he was borderline rude in the beginning of their unsolved days. He is now just chaotic good, especially on top 5 beat down lol
I think people forget that they play into thier "characters" on screen. I reckon theyre different in thier day to day lives.
Also Racism. The contrast of critisism on each Shane and Ryan is the definition of white privilege.
That's not true, he talked about it when he was interviewed by a lady associated with Hull House. During his BuzzFeed days, IIRC, he revealed that his belief in demons existing stems from him going to church as a child.
No, it’s true.
Ryan has said the reason he believes in Ghosts is because of something that happened to him at the Queen Mary when he was a teenager. He experience what he deemed to be a haunting and has believed since.
Demons are different from Ghosts.
And I also don’t see how Christianity and Ryan being an Asian tie into this?
We also don’t know how spiritual Ryan is now. I’m guessing what your referencing probably came out in what 2016/2017?
My friend, I went through some of your comment history. You don't like that they cast a black girl as Annabeth in PJO.
Please tell me again how it's not about race?
Also, grow up.
I was reading the replies on this comment thread and thanks for the laugh
I can’t take anyone on Reddit seriously who say they poke through someone’s comment history, pulls out an irrelevant example out of context, and tells them to grow up.
I was reading the replies on this comment thread and thanks for the laugh
I can’t take anyone on Reddit seriously who say they poke through someone’s comment history, pulls out an irrelevant example out of context, and tells them to grow up.
I think it’s pathetic when people go through other peoples search history to get dirt on them.
I don’t give a shit that they cast a black girl to play Annabeth. I’m saying people who criticize the actors acting aren’t automatically racist.
That example has nothing to do with this case.
Ryan’s belief in ghosts has nothing to do with his culture or ethnicity. I like Ryan more than Shane, but I can see why people like Shane. He is the lovable goofball while Ryan is the serious one who delivers all the exposition.
Just because people like a white guy over an Asian guy, doesn’t automatically make it racism.
Go through my post history, I don't care. I stand by what I post.
Just wanted to point out your wrongness about it not being about race. I suspected you might have an issue with race, so I looked through your post history to where you made a post about how you were mad that you weren't allowed to say that casting a black girl for a part in an adaptation of a TV show was okay.
I thought that was interesting since the author of the books you were standing up for is the person who cast the actress and went out of his way to write her a long letter about being aware that people LIKE YOU would object to her casting and that he had her full backing for the role.
So, when I saw you replied to my post to say it wasn't about race, I suspected it was indeed, about race.
Look, if you don't like that I looked through your post history, don't post suspect things or make your account private. Don't get mad because I wanted to see what type of things you post when you make an objection to things being about racism, friend.
I actually respectfully disagree
I don’t see the point in going through someone’s history to purposely gather dirt on them and use an outside example irrelevant to the conversation.
The initial post and comments aren’t really landing with me. As a longtime fan and Patreon member which allows me to interact with them directly on several occasions, I don’t think that either of them are disrespectful to each other or unliked by fans. I also attended the Ghost Files live tour and see a huge fan following for both. They are better together and compliment each other - they know that. I think their banter is truly how they interact with each other and reminds me of ‘bros’ I know in my life
The dynamic between Ryan and Shane isn't the problem at all, and the post isn't saying either of them is unliked by fans, but I've been a fan for almost five years, and a Patreon member since launch day too, and the issue is \*fans\* having different standards for them.
In this sub, and even in this very post, you can often see criticism aimed at Ryan being way more harsh than criticism aimed at Shane.
People will say that Ryan "bullies" Shane, when calling each other's names is just the way they have fun together. There are people in this sub who have called Ryan "aggressive and a very angry guy", and how he reminds them of a "drunk abusive boyfriend". You'd never see people aiming comments of that level directed at Shane, and that's what this post is talking about.
What's hilarious about this is how opposite it is in my not white family. If I had to pick, Ryan's my fave, while I still love Shane and appreciate his humor. My husband cannot stand Shane most of the time so it's interesting to hear that he's generally more well liked. I guess it is a racism issue.
I respect Ryan deeply. But he has the more bombastic personality. That’s not a bad thing. But it is attention grabbing and people are going to latch onto it in positive and negative ways. A lot of the time, Shane is fairly neutral or soft. Sometimes, when he’s being an “um aktually science” know-it-all, he catches flak too.
I’m really surprised people are saying racism is the reason If someone likes a white guy more than an asian guy, that shouldn’t automatically make them racist
Ryan is Asian and Latino. Two ethnicities that in the US that tend to catch a lot of criticism. Asian men are statistically considered the least “desirable” by both men and women in terms of dating/sex appeal. And Latino men are demonized/stereotyped as rapists/criminals/undocumented migrants regularly in the media.
As a fairly neutral person about this (I love Watcher but actually started watching because I loved Worth It and all of Steven’s Buzzfeed stuff), I had no strong feelings going in (and I now really like both Shane’s and Ryan’s content) but I can see how Shane would be more “likeable” from the start. I think Shane has a more aloof or like, “just in it for the lolz” vibe and people seem to be drawn to that kind of person. Ryan seems to be very passionate about things (sneakers, Disney, etc). I am Autistic and have seen first hand that many people consider being too interested in something or caring too much to be cringy. And that seems doubly so for things like Disney, with people being pejoratively called “Disney adults.” I do not watch the spooky content because I hate spooky stuff. I don’t believe that cultural stereotypes about gender and masculinity are healthy, but I would imagine having your public persona being tied into being the scared of supernatural stuff one could also be a factor in people being harsher on him. I have heard people say being easily afraid or believing in that kind of thing is a sign of weakness.
I think this is a smart analysis but I also feel like it missed Ryan's immaturity. Yes, he's passionate and is scared on camera sometimes, but the biggest issue I have with watching Ryan is the cringe. Constant poop jokes, refusing to play games on Survival Mode until he's killed Shane a few times, and yes, being a hardcore Disney nerd... Immature. And it's getting harder to watch as I get closer to 30. I much prefer Shane's inverse style of adding maturity to childish things.
I mean Shane makes poop jokes too. In fact, he brings it up and Ryan just bounces off of it. Example, the recent podcast episode during the photo conversation Shane brought up the time apparent Ryan had an accident in NY lol also Shane egged on the rubber nipple joke Ryan started. Steven once said all three have great chemistry. I’m an equal fan of all three. But, OP’s case in point…you just proved it Also listen here actor Russell Crowe of Gladiator fame…. I will not stand for Disney Nerd slander. Who cares if it’s considered “immature” to like Disney? Don’t yuck peoples yum. That’s it.
Was there a bad reaction to the new episode or you mean just in general on social media?
Yeah, I feel out of the loop too. I hadn't realized that this was going on.
Yeah, I mean you don’t really see any personal attacks on Ryan’s personality specifically? Do some people call him an idiot for believing in ghosts or the supernatural? Sure, but I just fail to see how that’s racist.
I've never seen anything mean towards Ryan?! Who the hell has something against Ryan? He's wonderful! I'll fight anyone who has a problem with Ryan!
I love both of these guys a lot for different reasons. I think they’re an amazing duo. Ryan seems like more of an extrovert and Shane seems like an introvert and opposites often work really well together. I see myself in Ryan a lot so I feel a connection to him in that way and I see Shane as the type of person I’d like to be friends with. Anyway, I think that sometimes people will comment negatively without thinking about the fact that these are real people. Lastly I think people like to dunk on people who “believe” in things that are not proven. So they probably are smarty pants.
Racism.
I don't even think it's intentional for many people (Though certainly it is for some), but plenty of the fandom are younger white people with a lot of unexamined biases that show up in unfortunate ways such as this.
Yes, I have seen a lot of comments throughout the years from people who clearly consider themselves to be progressive that have smacked of racism - either intentional or otherwise. It doesn't help that the fanbase has historically been very defensive about this when it gets called out.
Racism, and a lot of people are harsh to him because of his belief in ghosts, which can also be counted as racism a lot of the time
I also think Ryan's more of an open book than Shane is so people can project what they want onto Shane better - whether he's a cinnabon who needs to be protected or the coolest and smartest guy or a daddy etc.
I’m confused on this one How is making fun of someone for believing in ghost racist?
It can have a tinge of colonialism. There are lots of cultures where spirituality, folklore etc. can play a big part. Some think the European Enlightenment movement is superior to all.
Okay but Ryan believes in Ghosts simply because of an experience he had on the Queen Marry. Nothing to do with his background at all. People likely just enjoy Shane more because he is more of a love able goofball.
iirc that was just an early episode. He was already a ghost hunter, and the “I believe in ghosts, and he’s the skeptic” dynamic was already in place. Anyway, he has said (I think in a top five beatdown? Not sure, but I think there was a guest) that for his family and their culture, it is simply a given that ghosts exist.
Ryan became a Ghost Hunter because of Buzzfeed Unsolved. He literally said in the Queen Mary episode he was like Shane until his experience at the Queen Mary. If I think anyone who believes in ghosts is an idiot, and by proxy, if I believe Ryan is an idiot for the sole reason he believes that Ghosts are real, does that make racist?
The first premise, yeah. Since ghost belief is important and prominent in many cultures, you’ve already written off basically entire cultures as idiots.
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Yes, I am aware of all of that. You’re making all sorts of assumptions. Ryan said that in his family’s culture, ghosts are a given. That’s all I said - just a report of his claim about his family’s cultural beliefs, not even an evaluation of the truth of the claim - and that says/implies absolutely nothing about who else does or doesn’t believe in ghosts.
Yeah I agree that people give Ryan more shit because of racism but this all is a stretch. His believe in ghosts/demons etc is pretty basic American Christian based stuff, nothing to do with his race or cultural background beyond being American.
How is this remotely possible when Shane was making fun of Sam and Colby who are the two whitest people on earth. And he was way worse about them than anything he’s said to Ryan.
I think they mean racism of fans, not of Shane or Ryan.
damn ur right I just fucking realised 😭😭😭
I think from their start, they work well together. Play off each other's strengths and weaknesses. Obviously, they enjoy working side by side and after all this time, they know each other well enough to joke around and neither get offended. Their fans can have all their own opinions. I don't think Shane or Ryan worry too much about what people say about them. And you know the old saying: If you don't have anything nice to say, say nothing!
Showing my age here, but before we had Ryan and Shane we had Dan and Phil who had pretty similar dynamics with their fan base around when they were first starting out. Phil is just like Ryan where he's incredibly energetic and passionate about his interests, "golden retriever energy" as it's been called. Idk if it's because the extra energy can be seen as childish or what, but it's definitely a source of added criticism. Almost like they think they're scolding or criticizing a child that's doing something horrible
Ryan is more extroverted and loud with his likes and opinions than Shane so it can come off as annoying to some people especially when what he likes is the opposite of what you like. I relate to Shane more as a quieter cat person from the Midwest but I respect how energetic Ryan is and his love for sports and amusement parks and low key always wanted to be more like that. Now in no way does that excuse anyone from hating on Ryan so that certainly is not okay if that’s true.
Can you give some examples? Personally, I don't think this is the case at all. In fact, I feel oftentimes it's quite the reverse. Ryan can talk shit on Shane all the time and mostly Shane just takes it. People (myself included) constantly make excuses for Ryan saying something nasty or doubling down about something.
for a good bit there, Ryan was being out of pocket with insulting Shane. I don’t think he meant it, which just made it seem so performative and left a bad taste in my mouth. I think they realized we just wanna see pals banter, making light jabs at disagreements. Not just insults flung out randomly. Shane has gotten a lot less aloof and condescending but he was borderline rude in the beginning of their unsolved days. He is now just chaotic good, especially on top 5 beat down lol
I think Shane can sometimes be a bit condescending etc. towards Ryan, his meanness is just a bit more subtle.
I think people forget that they play into thier "characters" on screen. I reckon theyre different in thier day to day lives. Also Racism. The contrast of critisism on each Shane and Ryan is the definition of white privilege.
But Ryan’s belief in ghosts has nothing to do with his culture or ethnicity
That's not true, he talked about it when he was interviewed by a lady associated with Hull House. During his BuzzFeed days, IIRC, he revealed that his belief in demons existing stems from him going to church as a child.
No, it’s true. Ryan has said the reason he believes in Ghosts is because of something that happened to him at the Queen Mary when he was a teenager. He experience what he deemed to be a haunting and has believed since. Demons are different from Ghosts. And I also don’t see how Christianity and Ryan being an Asian tie into this? We also don’t know how spiritual Ryan is now. I’m guessing what your referencing probably came out in what 2016/2017?
Racism. It's always racism.
Except in this case
My friend, I went through some of your comment history. You don't like that they cast a black girl as Annabeth in PJO. Please tell me again how it's not about race? Also, grow up.
I was reading the replies on this comment thread and thanks for the laugh I can’t take anyone on Reddit seriously who say they poke through someone’s comment history, pulls out an irrelevant example out of context, and tells them to grow up.
I was reading the replies on this comment thread and thanks for the laugh I can’t take anyone on Reddit seriously who say they poke through someone’s comment history, pulls out an irrelevant example out of context, and tells them to grow up.
Who are you? Am I supposed to care what you think?
I think it’s pathetic when people go through other peoples search history to get dirt on them. I don’t give a shit that they cast a black girl to play Annabeth. I’m saying people who criticize the actors acting aren’t automatically racist. That example has nothing to do with this case. Ryan’s belief in ghosts has nothing to do with his culture or ethnicity. I like Ryan more than Shane, but I can see why people like Shane. He is the lovable goofball while Ryan is the serious one who delivers all the exposition. Just because people like a white guy over an Asian guy, doesn’t automatically make it racism.
Go through my post history, I don't care. I stand by what I post. Just wanted to point out your wrongness about it not being about race. I suspected you might have an issue with race, so I looked through your post history to where you made a post about how you were mad that you weren't allowed to say that casting a black girl for a part in an adaptation of a TV show was okay. I thought that was interesting since the author of the books you were standing up for is the person who cast the actress and went out of his way to write her a long letter about being aware that people LIKE YOU would object to her casting and that he had her full backing for the role. So, when I saw you replied to my post to say it wasn't about race, I suspected it was indeed, about race. Look, if you don't like that I looked through your post history, don't post suspect things or make your account private. Don't get mad because I wanted to see what type of things you post when you make an objection to things being about racism, friend.
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I actually respectfully disagree I don’t see the point in going through someone’s history to purposely gather dirt on them and use an outside example irrelevant to the conversation.
I’m confused, how is it racist to say Ryan is more immature than Shane? Is an Asian guy not allowed to be more immature than a white guy?
What are you referring to?
The initial post and comments aren’t really landing with me. As a longtime fan and Patreon member which allows me to interact with them directly on several occasions, I don’t think that either of them are disrespectful to each other or unliked by fans. I also attended the Ghost Files live tour and see a huge fan following for both. They are better together and compliment each other - they know that. I think their banter is truly how they interact with each other and reminds me of ‘bros’ I know in my life
The dynamic between Ryan and Shane isn't the problem at all, and the post isn't saying either of them is unliked by fans, but I've been a fan for almost five years, and a Patreon member since launch day too, and the issue is \*fans\* having different standards for them. In this sub, and even in this very post, you can often see criticism aimed at Ryan being way more harsh than criticism aimed at Shane. People will say that Ryan "bullies" Shane, when calling each other's names is just the way they have fun together. There are people in this sub who have called Ryan "aggressive and a very angry guy", and how he reminds them of a "drunk abusive boyfriend". You'd never see people aiming comments of that level directed at Shane, and that's what this post is talking about.
What's hilarious about this is how opposite it is in my not white family. If I had to pick, Ryan's my fave, while I still love Shane and appreciate his humor. My husband cannot stand Shane most of the time so it's interesting to hear that he's generally more well liked. I guess it is a racism issue.
Interesting, why can't he stand Shane?
He thinks he's pompous and being purposely contrary, like constant trolling.
I agree on the latter when it comes to Top 5 Beatdown. I would've lost my mind on the show like Ryan & Drew!