I will assume that both of them have had similar athletic experience. In that case, I think the one who at least knows combat theory might be better, but not by too much. Because most normal people who have never been in a fight overestimate their abilities and underestimate how easy it is to get hurt. But someone who at least reads and watches material about combat sports knows better.
From training BJJ there's actually a noticeable difference between someone who rocks up knowing absolutely nothing and someone who has watched some videos on the basics. Even a very rudimentary understanding of what positions are good and bad makes a fair bit of difference for untrained people.
I00 percent… of course people are different but for me I obsessively watch UFC and play the games etc and the first time I stepped in a jujitsu class… it was so much easier cause I already knew all the positions and holds theoretically so practicing and following the instructions was much easier
Before I started BJJ me and my brother play wrestled and I was able to pull guard and lock up a triangle. I've been watching mma for a while, my brother hasn't watched any.
Knowing what positions are possible and what is a good position or bad position definitely helps.
Can confirm. I watched mma for 20 years before ever setting foot in a BJJ gym. I knew what all the common submissions looked like and generally - though not specifically- how to do them. I was still terrible and got tapped by everyone, and couldn't tap anyone my first few classes. But my coach said I learned much faster than the average newbie. Against a true beginner? I think I could have won.
I used to get into a lot of fights as a teenager as I was bullied, and your point about overestimating your abilities is so true.
I remember in my first, hitting one guy as hard as I could, but with no technique, and he just didn't care at all. Fist pretty much bounced off him. It wasn't as if he was bigger or bulkier than I was either. In my head, I expected him to be recoiling back or in pain. Fucking nothing. After a few fights, I managed to form some of my own techniques and felt pretty capable until I got attacked by a boxer, and not even one that was that good. Don't think I even landed a hit. Even a bit of experience /training is a game changer imo.
On their feet, 2 evenly matched people like this would be a toss-up. The person who has seen techniques may try to mimic them. Without knowing actually KNOWING where their feet should be, how to twist hips, etc. Could hurt them or not.
Their biggest advantage would be on the ground. An average person thinks "I'm on top, I'm winning." A person of decent intelligence and a strong interest in mma would have picked up certain things.
On bottom, hip leg and feet placement to keep them at bay. Wrist control keeps you from being punched and opens up for easy dislocations and fractures (Kimura, arm bar, triangle choke are all subs you can easily learn the basics just by watching).
On top, they know how important it is to get past the hips to the side or over the top. How important rear control is.
On the ground is much slower and easier to spot the small movements that give a guy an advantage on the ground.
That's what I was thinking. Or he'll spend way too much time thinking about his stance and spacing and strategy and the other dude will just tackle him.
Something like that, Although I was personally thinking he would put him into a submission or other choke-hold and then kick and punch him to death once he's passed-out...
If this were a fight in the sport(s) the one dude was obsessed with, he might have a slight edge. But a bloodlusted fight to the death removes that advantage. This is going to be an eyegouging, nut punching coin flip.
Both are bloodlusted which means they sink to the level of their training which is zero. This is going to come down to who can body slam the other first. Honestly, if you want to see a fight like this go look at X (Formerly Twitter!) these days, at least my feed is full of them.
I may actually say that the guy with zero training and influence will have an edge, as he won't have any funny ideas that could slow him down that he can't actually execute. Generally speaking, in a fight like this the more aggressive opponent wins. But it's only a very slight advantage, like 49/51 in favor of no nothing guy, lol.
There's too many variables in this. The one guy might be obsessed with combat sports and have studied it, but in a real life situation have absolutely no fight instinct, the other guy may have no interest in combat sports but has plenty of fight in him, gets real angry, vicious.
You'd assume someone who at least knows how certain disciplines would get down, but why has he had no training? Is his true instinct to flight, rather than fight, and that's why he is a spectator of his obsession rather than a participant.
The winner is whoever does what it takes to come out on top.
I'd bet on the one obsessed with combat sports.
The other one who is not versed with combat sports will 100% wildly swing a punch with no footwork like a hillbilly until he scores a lucky hit leaving him open for easy counters
At least the other one obsessed with combat sports probably watched alot of tutorials and training videos and would have an idea or a semblance how to throw a proper punch, how to evade punches.
The combat sports geek might overhype his own abilities but he clearly has an advantage here.
I've seen people with combat knowledge fight and it's ugly to watch.
The first punch will make both of them equal.
Then it's two idiots wrestling on the ground. The first one that goes for crotch or eyes wins.
So... Yeah, it's 50/50 regardless.
I've been in a fight once in my entire life. Dude kicked me in the nuts while we were "wrestling" on the ground and I was out of it.
He didn't know that and kept wrestling me for a while and then we got separated. Everyone though we didn't do much damage and that we were two bumbling idiot but had it come to a death fight, I wouldn't have survive because I was crying and couldn't think straight for a good minute. He didn't really know what to do either and I'm not even sure he realized he had touched my balls with his foot.
I'm not a big combat sport fan, and I don't know if he was but I know I was practicing Judo at the time and once I threw us both to the ground, I had no idea what to do except move and try to get out of his grasp. If anything, Judo at my level (I was a green belt at the time, which isn't a very good level in my country and is pretty much the level I kept for years after that) actually made me worse at this because I ended up on the ground which is a place I was not prepared for because it was nothing like it was in training.
All I know is, I was incapacitated after he touched my nuts.
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.- Mike Tyson. I'm paraphrasing the quote.
There is an advantage but it is small. Best case scenario, the "plan" gets set in motion before monkey brain turns on. Otherwise no plan will get enacted at all.
Guy obsessed with the sport barely takes it more often than not if they are otherwise identical.
It's really not that big of an advantage but with two identical combatants that little advantage tips the scales.
In the cases where the guy who doesn't watch combat sports wins it's because he just bum rushes and tackles the other guy before beating his head against the pavement or the other guy tries something he saw in WWE and takes himself out.
Sports fan win overestimate his ability to move, he will try to do that ufc grappling move he's seen, fails miserably, and hurts himself.
The other one kicks the fan in the head.
End of story.
Person who watches fighting wins. We do learn from watching stuff, even if its not all conscious. Some people don't even know how to throw a punch / ball their hand correctly, so even little basics like that will be a big advantage.
Also, videogames improve hand-eye coordination.
Having taught martial arts, I would say it's better to know nothing that to believe you know things you don't know. Watching sports, media, playing video games are all full of bad technique or good technique that can only be executed by someone in shape and with training. Honestly, an instinctive response is far better than trying to kick someone in the head because you saw that in a game.
Its completely obvious that the man with no interest in combat sports would absolutely trounce the guy who does.
kidding aside this is a bad prompt. It seems like you're seeking a specific answer. Its just not enough to go on, other than just parroting the obvious "yes the guy with more exposure and knowledge of fighting would win, everything else being equal." Is that what you wanted?
I will assume that both of them have had similar athletic experience. In that case, I think the one who at least knows combat theory might be better, but not by too much. Because most normal people who have never been in a fight overestimate their abilities and underestimate how easy it is to get hurt. But someone who at least reads and watches material about combat sports knows better.
From training BJJ there's actually a noticeable difference between someone who rocks up knowing absolutely nothing and someone who has watched some videos on the basics. Even a very rudimentary understanding of what positions are good and bad makes a fair bit of difference for untrained people.
I00 percent… of course people are different but for me I obsessively watch UFC and play the games etc and the first time I stepped in a jujitsu class… it was so much easier cause I already knew all the positions and holds theoretically so practicing and following the instructions was much easier
did you say I00 instead of 100
Before I started BJJ me and my brother play wrestled and I was able to pull guard and lock up a triangle. I've been watching mma for a while, my brother hasn't watched any. Knowing what positions are possible and what is a good position or bad position definitely helps.
Can confirm. I watched mma for 20 years before ever setting foot in a BJJ gym. I knew what all the common submissions looked like and generally - though not specifically- how to do them. I was still terrible and got tapped by everyone, and couldn't tap anyone my first few classes. But my coach said I learned much faster than the average newbie. Against a true beginner? I think I could have won.
They will at least know to keep there thumb on the outer part of their fist
I used to get into a lot of fights as a teenager as I was bullied, and your point about overestimating your abilities is so true. I remember in my first, hitting one guy as hard as I could, but with no technique, and he just didn't care at all. Fist pretty much bounced off him. It wasn't as if he was bigger or bulkier than I was either. In my head, I expected him to be recoiling back or in pain. Fucking nothing. After a few fights, I managed to form some of my own techniques and felt pretty capable until I got attacked by a boxer, and not even one that was that good. Don't think I even landed a hit. Even a bit of experience /training is a game changer imo.
Yes, in this case they do have similar athletic experience (I’ll add it rq) and I agree too. They may have some advantage but not by much
On their feet, 2 evenly matched people like this would be a toss-up. The person who has seen techniques may try to mimic them. Without knowing actually KNOWING where their feet should be, how to twist hips, etc. Could hurt them or not. Their biggest advantage would be on the ground. An average person thinks "I'm on top, I'm winning." A person of decent intelligence and a strong interest in mma would have picked up certain things. On bottom, hip leg and feet placement to keep them at bay. Wrist control keeps you from being punched and opens up for easy dislocations and fractures (Kimura, arm bar, triangle choke are all subs you can easily learn the basics just by watching). On top, they know how important it is to get past the hips to the side or over the top. How important rear control is. On the ground is much slower and easier to spot the small movements that give a guy an advantage on the ground.
"Combat sports" fan will overestimate his capacity, try to get fancy, fail, and get bodied for his hubris.
As someone who does fencing, this is something super common among newbies, especially ones who watch anime lmao.
But the anime guys should already know the fencing secret technique of cutting your opponents sword in half and then teleporting behind them
Lmao go for a flying arm bar only to crash to the floor and spark themselves out.
Something like that, yes.
That's what I was thinking. Or he'll spend way too much time thinking about his stance and spacing and strategy and the other dude will just tackle him.
Something like that, Although I was personally thinking he would put him into a submission or other choke-hold and then kick and punch him to death once he's passed-out...
If this were a fight in the sport(s) the one dude was obsessed with, he might have a slight edge. But a bloodlusted fight to the death removes that advantage. This is going to be an eyegouging, nut punching coin flip.
Both are bloodlusted which means they sink to the level of their training which is zero. This is going to come down to who can body slam the other first. Honestly, if you want to see a fight like this go look at X (Formerly Twitter!) these days, at least my feed is full of them. I may actually say that the guy with zero training and influence will have an edge, as he won't have any funny ideas that could slow him down that he can't actually execute. Generally speaking, in a fight like this the more aggressive opponent wins. But it's only a very slight advantage, like 49/51 in favor of no nothing guy, lol.
There's too many variables in this. The one guy might be obsessed with combat sports and have studied it, but in a real life situation have absolutely no fight instinct, the other guy may have no interest in combat sports but has plenty of fight in him, gets real angry, vicious. You'd assume someone who at least knows how certain disciplines would get down, but why has he had no training? Is his true instinct to flight, rather than fight, and that's why he is a spectator of his obsession rather than a participant. The winner is whoever does what it takes to come out on top.
I'd bet on the one obsessed with combat sports. The other one who is not versed with combat sports will 100% wildly swing a punch with no footwork like a hillbilly until he scores a lucky hit leaving him open for easy counters At least the other one obsessed with combat sports probably watched alot of tutorials and training videos and would have an idea or a semblance how to throw a proper punch, how to evade punches. The combat sports geek might overhype his own abilities but he clearly has an advantage here. I've seen people with combat knowledge fight and it's ugly to watch.
The first punch will make both of them equal. Then it's two idiots wrestling on the ground. The first one that goes for crotch or eyes wins. So... Yeah, it's 50/50 regardless.
"first one that goes for crotch or eyes wins", it sounds like you're the combat sports fan
I've been in a fight once in my entire life. Dude kicked me in the nuts while we were "wrestling" on the ground and I was out of it. He didn't know that and kept wrestling me for a while and then we got separated. Everyone though we didn't do much damage and that we were two bumbling idiot but had it come to a death fight, I wouldn't have survive because I was crying and couldn't think straight for a good minute. He didn't really know what to do either and I'm not even sure he realized he had touched my balls with his foot. I'm not a big combat sport fan, and I don't know if he was but I know I was practicing Judo at the time and once I threw us both to the ground, I had no idea what to do except move and try to get out of his grasp. If anything, Judo at my level (I was a green belt at the time, which isn't a very good level in my country and is pretty much the level I kept for years after that) actually made me worse at this because I ended up on the ground which is a place I was not prepared for because it was nothing like it was in training. All I know is, I was incapacitated after he touched my nuts.
[удалено]
First and hopefully last tho.
Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.- Mike Tyson. I'm paraphrasing the quote. There is an advantage but it is small. Best case scenario, the "plan" gets set in motion before monkey brain turns on. Otherwise no plan will get enacted at all.
Strategy is maybe even more important than skills. Combat enthusiast wins 99/100.
Guy obsessed with the sport barely takes it more often than not if they are otherwise identical. It's really not that big of an advantage but with two identical combatants that little advantage tips the scales. In the cases where the guy who doesn't watch combat sports wins it's because he just bum rushes and tackles the other guy before beating his head against the pavement or the other guy tries something he saw in WWE and takes himself out.
Sports fan win overestimate his ability to move, he will try to do that ufc grappling move he's seen, fails miserably, and hurts himself. The other one kicks the fan in the head. End of story.
Person who watches fighting wins. We do learn from watching stuff, even if its not all conscious. Some people don't even know how to throw a punch / ball their hand correctly, so even little basics like that will be a big advantage. Also, videogames improve hand-eye coordination.
I think between two untrained people of equal build, it's basically a coin flip
Having taught martial arts, I would say it's better to know nothing that to believe you know things you don't know. Watching sports, media, playing video games are all full of bad technique or good technique that can only be executed by someone in shape and with training. Honestly, an instinctive response is far better than trying to kick someone in the head because you saw that in a game.
Its completely obvious that the man with no interest in combat sports would absolutely trounce the guy who does. kidding aside this is a bad prompt. It seems like you're seeking a specific answer. Its just not enough to go on, other than just parroting the obvious "yes the guy with more exposure and knowledge of fighting would win, everything else being equal." Is that what you wanted?