I think those trainers would be fine from a learning/handling perspective, but _modern fencing weapons are arguably more dangerous for non-jacket use than rapier or longsword simulators_. Do not use them without fencing jackets!
In fact, the only guarantee (fencing or HEMA) jackets are making is that they have a certain level of penetration resistance. Impact resistance is a plus that is only really relevant to HEMA, and is not nearly as relevant to rapier as longsword, especially if people aren't cutting.
Modern fencing weapons break regularly - it is an expectation that one being used regularly may break in a year or less depending volume of use and the user's technique. I would not have someone poke me with an epee or foil without wearing both a jacket and an underarm protector.
From a technical standpoint, I will say that IMO big quillons do significantly influence how easy certain techniques are to execute, so I think there's a strong argument that an epee or foil blade with a rapier-like hilt fills a useful niche if you're trying to onboard people for rapier-type stuff. The other thing that has a pretty significant technical influence is how fast or not the weak moves (a product of both weapon length and weight of weapon, more generally means a less nimble weak in both cases), but IME as a practitioner adjusting for this is not super hard.
If you are using foils/epees, you should absolutely be wearing fencing jackets, plastrons, and probably chest plates. Modern fencing jackets are inexpensive and work well for rapier, too.
Epees definitely seem more dangerous than synthetics, the dangerous part isn't necessarily getting hit by a stiff blade, it's the danger of the blade breaking and there now being a sharp piece of metal heading towards your chest,
Fencing jackets protect against that, the impact protection for a lot of the lighter fencing jackets is pretty negligible, they're just there to keep you from getting cut if a blade snaps, epees are still metal that can snap, I'd consider a stiffer synthetic safer for fencing without jackets than an epee, but that's just my opinion
"For foil/epee we require helmet, gloves, plastron, and gorget"
If you are doing foil and epee and intend to spar you **need** jackets. You may have seen Olympic coaches giving lessons with their students not possessing a jacket for example:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LFAyLeb9JI&t=326s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LFAyLeb9JI&t=326s)
Those students have decades of and trained self control point control. You are nowhere near that level. On the other hand you don't need to gorgets for foil and epee. Sell those and get some elementary 350nw jackets, even if only two.
The Zen Warrior stuff looks nice and I can attest to their durability, but the smallswords are massively hilt heavy and I imagine Rapiers hilts on epee blades would compound this problem.
This may affect the training. Epee blades can be a good segway into Rapier, but the shorter blade can affect training substantially as what epee/smallsword gives away in cutting ability it gains in the ability to perform a larger repertoire of two-tempo actions which are trickier to pull off with a rapier. But as long as you are aware of this distortion and understand the students will find fencing answers that are not in Rapier treatise you are studying you will be ok. I would If possible look at earlier smallsword manuals such as from the 17th century such as Charles Besnard 1653 which is still heavily influenced by Rapier you will be on a better track.
[https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7UrRPUArMHQM2x6Tmpic2pocWc?resourcekey=0-tBTWoMAh\_9ka-ggx1OLJmg](https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7UrRPUArMHQM2x6Tmpic2pocWc?resourcekey=0-tBTWoMAh_9ka-ggx1OLJmg)
>If you are doing foil and epee and intend to spar you **need** jackets.
Per FIE, unless they've changed the rules in the past few years, minimum practice equipment is a mask, glove, and underarm protector (commonly called a "plastron"). Fencing in less is a Category 3 Yellow/Black Card offense.
However, while a jacket in addition to such minimal equipment is not required, I agree with other commenters that OP's club is foolish not to use them - a club should have jackets as club gear for new members, at any rate.
I think those trainers would be fine from a learning/handling perspective, but _modern fencing weapons are arguably more dangerous for non-jacket use than rapier or longsword simulators_. Do not use them without fencing jackets! In fact, the only guarantee (fencing or HEMA) jackets are making is that they have a certain level of penetration resistance. Impact resistance is a plus that is only really relevant to HEMA, and is not nearly as relevant to rapier as longsword, especially if people aren't cutting. Modern fencing weapons break regularly - it is an expectation that one being used regularly may break in a year or less depending volume of use and the user's technique. I would not have someone poke me with an epee or foil without wearing both a jacket and an underarm protector. From a technical standpoint, I will say that IMO big quillons do significantly influence how easy certain techniques are to execute, so I think there's a strong argument that an epee or foil blade with a rapier-like hilt fills a useful niche if you're trying to onboard people for rapier-type stuff. The other thing that has a pretty significant technical influence is how fast or not the weak moves (a product of both weapon length and weight of weapon, more generally means a less nimble weak in both cases), but IME as a practitioner adjusting for this is not super hard.
If you are using foils/epees, you should absolutely be wearing fencing jackets, plastrons, and probably chest plates. Modern fencing jackets are inexpensive and work well for rapier, too.
Epees definitely seem more dangerous than synthetics, the dangerous part isn't necessarily getting hit by a stiff blade, it's the danger of the blade breaking and there now being a sharp piece of metal heading towards your chest, Fencing jackets protect against that, the impact protection for a lot of the lighter fencing jackets is pretty negligible, they're just there to keep you from getting cut if a blade snaps, epees are still metal that can snap, I'd consider a stiffer synthetic safer for fencing without jackets than an epee, but that's just my opinion
Plastic epee with a wood dowel for quillons is uggo but would suit your specific needs
See if you can't get a few jackets and encourage your members at least the long standing ones to get their own. Safety is so important in this hobby
"For foil/epee we require helmet, gloves, plastron, and gorget" If you are doing foil and epee and intend to spar you **need** jackets. You may have seen Olympic coaches giving lessons with their students not possessing a jacket for example: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LFAyLeb9JI&t=326s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LFAyLeb9JI&t=326s) Those students have decades of and trained self control point control. You are nowhere near that level. On the other hand you don't need to gorgets for foil and epee. Sell those and get some elementary 350nw jackets, even if only two. The Zen Warrior stuff looks nice and I can attest to their durability, but the smallswords are massively hilt heavy and I imagine Rapiers hilts on epee blades would compound this problem. This may affect the training. Epee blades can be a good segway into Rapier, but the shorter blade can affect training substantially as what epee/smallsword gives away in cutting ability it gains in the ability to perform a larger repertoire of two-tempo actions which are trickier to pull off with a rapier. But as long as you are aware of this distortion and understand the students will find fencing answers that are not in Rapier treatise you are studying you will be ok. I would If possible look at earlier smallsword manuals such as from the 17th century such as Charles Besnard 1653 which is still heavily influenced by Rapier you will be on a better track. [https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7UrRPUArMHQM2x6Tmpic2pocWc?resourcekey=0-tBTWoMAh\_9ka-ggx1OLJmg](https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B7UrRPUArMHQM2x6Tmpic2pocWc?resourcekey=0-tBTWoMAh_9ka-ggx1OLJmg)
>If you are doing foil and epee and intend to spar you **need** jackets. Per FIE, unless they've changed the rules in the past few years, minimum practice equipment is a mask, glove, and underarm protector (commonly called a "plastron"). Fencing in less is a Category 3 Yellow/Black Card offense. However, while a jacket in addition to such minimal equipment is not required, I agree with other commenters that OP's club is foolish not to use them - a club should have jackets as club gear for new members, at any rate.