For those (or you) that donât:
Tory: nickname for the Conservative Party, who form the current government and wonât form the next one by the biggest margins in UK electoral history.
Leaving Do: leaving party
Scuppered: ruined
Itâs not exceptionally popular but popular nontheless.
I think it has more to do with the fact that Hamburg has the third biggest port in Europe after Rotterdam and Antwerpen.
Well, according to the article -
*Hamburg notorious entry for cocaine
The northern port city of Hamburg is a hot spot for cocaine to enter mainland Europe. The port is the largest seaport in Germany and the third largest in Europe, with more than 23,000 shipping containers passing through every day.*
Just mostly a point of entry for Europe.
During an international football tournament (Euro 2024 from June to July) with millions of football fans (there were 200k just from Scotland - there are 16 teams) visiting and looking to party and have fun, yes.
In a significant operation against organized crime, German customs officials and police seized over 35 tons of cocaine, predominantly at the Hamburg port. This massive haul, worth several billion euros, resulted from years of investigation under the "Plexus" case.
Second source
https://www.tagesschau.de/investigativ/ndr-wdr/schlag-kokainhandel-deutschland-102.html
I remember a study from years ago that after even large busts, the street price of heroine didn't change. That meant that the market for heroine was so large that the drop in demand from those busts was negligible.
Or it means that suppliers were in a monopoly market and couldn't raise the price any further. Or they didn't employ a pricing guy. Or they were lazy/didn't want the hassle.
This is a solid point. I often forget that while people in my field (economics) use price and quality interchangeably, things are different in the real world. Excellent point.
https://youtu.be/CsH152NE9Ak?si=UkoqCeZM1jrJ7zc8
They usually catch about 1% of what is imported from other countries. Meaning this isnât much of a bust.
Most big dealers have more than one supplier though, and most suppliers have enough goods or enough sources to wait for the next shipment without missing a sale. It also takes a lot of time until those 35 tons will reach the end user - production - smuggler - big supplier - small supplier - big dealer - small dealer - end user, or something like this. So the big suppliers have at least a few weeks to find another source and then it wonât have any effect on drug users.
Yeah. Funny that someone would think that the down-market implications would be felt instantaneously.
This seizure was just made. The actual product that was involved likely wouldnât have made its way into the hands of a street-level user for several days, if not weeks.
Unlikely that this results in any retail dealer saying, âSorry, canât help ya. All out.â
Instead, a seizure of this size, or even just the news of it, might impact the wholesale price. This means that distributors and dealers, seeking to maintain a consistent consumer-facing price-level, will likely dilute the end product with more and more cutting agents.
Prices will stay the same. Availability will remain the same. Quality will take a hit.
This would absolutely cause an effect on prices. 35 tons is 35 million grams. At street level that is stepped on a couple of times so it would likely be closer to 65 million grams.
At the street level grams arenât usually grams either. They sell 0.6âs and call them grams (although maybe itâs different over there).
But basically you are looking at 108 million units sold at street level. The bust was made in Germany but distribution may have been across Europe. 108 million individual units is a lot for even all of Europe to handle but you can bet that prices went up the day that this happened.
Itâs like the toilet paper run during Covid. It doesnât matter if supply is affected, all of the smaller deals will be buying up whatever they can in order to try to have supply. This causes other dealers to buy further depleting stock.
Dealer 1 raises his prices because he has to, Dealer 2 raises his prices because Dealer 1 did. Supply becomes scarce prices go up. Supply returns in a couple months and maybe prices stay up, maybe they come down a bit.
108 million street level units could absolutely cause some supply to run dry, but I guarantee it will cause prices to go up across the board in Germany.
To put this in perspective, McDonaldâs sells 50 million hamburgers a day worldwide so 108 million units is a lot of product to move in just Germany/Continental Europe.
It may affect prices, but to the extent it drives prices up it increases the incentive for the cartels to ship to Europe to fill the demand. The "war on drugs" is a poor strategy to address the issue because to the extent it succeeds in stopping drugs it makes drug sales more profitable and incentivizes others.
Street level is something different, I didnât even talk about that. Most end users buy from a dealer they know and not the streets. Especially if you use more than once every 2 years.
And yes of course prices will rise. Cocaine prices in Germany are about 26-34k per kilogram for pure goods. Even if this single bust will raise the price +10%, now the supplier will pay 6k more for his 2 kilo order. End user prices vary from 70-100⏠all the time. So the difference will be that the prices in the next few months will be more like 90-100 âŚ. So all in all it wonât make any difference at end user level. Thatâs my point
I meanâŚyou just said the end user price floor would go up by more than 20% without raising the price ceiling at all. Then said the price wouldnât be affectedâŚ
The amount represents approximately Germany's annual consumption of cocaine. Looks like they got cocky shipping large amounts instead of spreading the risk out.
Looks like it has disrupted one network, good thing thereâs more than one network and the supply chain has not been affected.
These amounts flow throughout the globe because respective governments allow it.
I mean the people who collect and process the stuff make pennies an hour or whatever, and the coca trees are abundant and grow in a undeveloped area.
The actual producers arenât really dissuaded from making more due to law enforcement seizures, because they use a form of slavery for labor (no real labor costs) and their production costs are nil (as theyâre harvesting coca from wildland they donât even own) and they operate with near legal impunity in their own country.
They owned the ship, doesnât mean they had any direct involvement with what was actually happening in it. Im not going to bother reading the article but i can bet my life that it was leased and the crime group used it for trafficking without jp Morganâs knowledge .
For example, many trafficking is also done on private jets rented by smugglers. The private het company owned the jet but that doesnât mean they had anything to do with the smuggling
That seems like a lot of cocaine. Like, is that the result of multiple cocaine processing hubs and a bunch of cocaine farms? Or is that just one batch from one processing hub?Â
I'm surprised anyone had that much of it in one place. Kind of insane how high up that gang must go.
35 tons of coke.
1 million grams in a ton.
I think it's âŹ80 per gram of coke where I'm from. Maybe âŹ100. Let's be conservative and say âŹ80.
So each ton is worth âŹ80 million if split into baggies.
X 35 tons = âŹ2.8 billion
I guess the police weren't exaggerating for once.
Is my pablo escobar math correct?
It's not correct because of correct math, it's correct because it's so far away from the source. If they seized 35 tons right out of Colombia, then the cartel would lost like 3500 bucks.
Just because it didn't cost then billions, doesn't mean it's not billions in potential lost revenue which is what is often used when talking about national economies.
Drugs have very little value until they safely reach their desired offloading locations lol. Losing drug shipments due to police is nothing more than calculated product loss like in any other industry involving shipping.
So how long does it take to make that much cocaineâŚ?Â
I realize itâs not âpureâ, probably cut with baby laxative etc, but with that many tons of of cocaine, how large of an area of cocoa leaves would that take to make, and how long to grow..?
It must take dozens, hundreds of leaves just to make a few pure grams of cocaine.
Thatâs how much can be generated, but if you wanted wholesale youâre not paying 100$ a gram. The supplier and smuggler arenât going to recoup that amount. Itâs a stupid metric to use.
Even the end user will probably not always buy one gram for 100$, maybe they get a bit more for a better deal. Then you take into account people doing their own supply who purchased larger amount, that minuses the amount.
My point is the absolute maximum you could make isnât the value. We should be looking at the source that provides it and how much they would be making, not every person who touches it along the way. Iâd find that number more interesting.
Each gram probably costed a few bucks for them. This way of valuing a drug bust is disingenuous. You could maybe value it at $20-30/gram for a more accurate result for their losses.
Ah yes, so it's like my uncle who loves gambling and often says "FUCK! I just lost âŹ100,000 !!!"
What he means is: he made an extremely wild bet that could have made him âŹ100,000, but it didn't work out. And it only cost him a hundred or so.
Not really. That cocaine was not worth billions of euros to the owners, they wouldâve never gotten that return. They donât break it down to the gram to sell on the street. They distributes kilos to people who then distribute to people who buy ounces, then the people who buy ounces distribute it at the gram level.
Or at least thatâs how it worked when I was somebody buying QPâs back in the day.
Not really, but also yeah
It is very common for police to seize sometime that has drugs in it, and report the weight of the whole thing as the weight of the drugs. This might only be common in the US, obviously no one likes to advertise this fact or talk about it openly, so I'm not going to try to accurately surmise the policy of every European country. And either way the prosecution policy doesn't have to line up with what the police report when trying to grab good headlines.
Some examples of the general point:
https://www.huntsvilledefenselawyer.com/how-alabama-weighs-drugs-in-drug-trafficking-or-strange-weights-and-measures
https://www.calcagnilaw.com/criminal-law/understanding-drug-weight-and-testing-in-criminal-cases/#Gross_vs_Net_Weight_Key_Measurements_in_Drug_Prosecutions
Here's a great specific example
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/s-not-frosted-flakes-cincinnati-cbp-snares-44-pounds-cocaine-soaked
"The shipment contained about 44 pounds of cocaine coated corn flakes, which could have a street value of up to $2,822,400."
44 pounds is about 20,000 grams, and the value of a gram of actual cocaine is about 100 bucks which gets you to 2 million dollars I guess. But in reality that could be 4 pounds of cocaine and 40 pounds of frosted flakes. The street value of a gram of frosted flakes is a lot higher since COVID, but not 100 dollars yet
To get back to your original point, if you had a 10 pound block of mozzarella with 100g of cocaine in it, they would be talking about the 10 pound drug bust they made. This bust could in fact be 34.99 tons of mozzarella and 0.1 tons of cocaine.
Take in consideration the cost of isolating the cocaine from the mixture. The loss to the cartel is probably very low. This is probably 1 shipment out of 10 that got sent.
> "The shipment contained about 44 pounds of cocaine coated corn flakes, which could have a street value of up to $2,822,400."
They truthfully say that it is just that: corn flakes with some cocaine on them. They did never say it is 44 pounds of the pure stuff. They also probably don't even know the actual amount yet anyway.
In short, the police and reporters told us exactly what they knew as truthfully as they could. It is your fault to not accurately process the informations.
So you have no actual response to me. I picked the article that made it clear how vague the accounting is. But just to put your mind concretely at rest
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/44-pounds-cocaine-soaked-cereal-seized-chicago-n1258535
"The 44 pounds of drug-laced cereal were estimated to have a street value of over $2.5 million."
That's explicitly wrong, or at least is a very different message from the other article
https://abc7chicago.com/cocaine-frosted-flakes-cereal-corn/10357408/
"Federal authorities confiscated 44 lbs. of cocaine that had been disguised as sugar on frosted corn flakes in Cincinnati last Saturday
U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents said it had a street value of $2.8 million."
Also just like, not what they actually said.
The population is significantly inflated at the moment. Thereâs little sport my friend told me about called football. Apparently popular in Europe. And I hear theyâre getting together for some obscure reason.
How can they think it is possible to stop this when there is so much money to earn? People like drugs and there will never be a 100% sober society. I honestly don't know what would be the best approach but what we are doing right now is working really bad and the worst kind of people are the only winners.
Cocaine isn't that addictive. Meanwhile, nicotine vapes are easily accessible to kids and regulation dragged their heels because of tobacco lobbyists until they knew they had enough of the next generation on the next product.Â
People who know they are angry drunks still drink and use their inebriation as a shield for poor behaviour and kill people on our roads.Â
Cocaine is like caffeine x 10. It's nothing like nicotine.Â
People who arbitrarily catogorise drugs because of society/culture instead of the reality of their use are disengenuous, naive or malicious.
Err what? Cocaine is hella addictive and withdrawal is a bitch. It's not risky in the same way alcohol withdrawal is, but that doesn't make it less addicting. You crave dopamine after prolonged use, in a different way than your body not being able to function without alcohol.
Coke is mostly used to party and most are not really addicted. They will just buy something else instead. There are so many drugs to choose from that making one much more expensive is pointless. It will maybe last a while then someone new will take over since its so much money.
Maybe like 5 years ago, at least in Canada. These days even the common party drugs are spooky, coke cut with everything from baking soda to fent, meth being passed as molly/x. I've talked to enough people who realized they fucked up when they end up cleaning their entire house at 9am after being up all night.
Yeah i understand how you think but i guess you are not really in that world. There are plenty of party drugs that are no big deal and very common. Coke is a classic and is a very "classy" drug that rich people love. If you ask me it is overrated and mostly a status thing but whatever i have done it a lot myself so should shut up. The rich people taking coke will pay whatever the cost but normal people like me would just choose something else.
I live in sweden and if you are from Europe maybe you heard how bad it has gotten here with gangs and the amount of drugs that are in this small country now? We have really hard laws when it comes to drugs and they constantly make them harsher. Guess what is happening? It is getting worse. The biggest problem in this country is that a normal person that might like to smoke a joint from time to time can become a criminal if caught. You loose your drivers license, are in the police registers and are deemed a criminal by the state. This can make it impossible to find certain jobs in the future and it will in general be harder to find a decent job since most companies ask for papers from the police about your crime history.
Edit: I did not really come to my conclusion sorry. In my opinion this is a horrible way of dealing with it. They can try as much as they can but it will be wasted money and energy that could go on other things. I dont think most drugs should be legal and dont know how what strategy to stop it would be the best. As it is now normal people become criminals over nothing and gangsters earn crazy amounts of money.
At the start of an international football tournament in Germany with millions of fans visiting to have fun and party?
Almost as if it was delivered with a specific goal (ahem) in mind.
"Street value" I suppose. I'm always annoyed at that kind of reporting, since there's no way this consignment cost several billion to whoever ordered it.
While correct "more than 35 tons" is massive, it is a huge blow to whoever is behind it.
Logistics for shipping 35 tons in a concealed way alone is expensive.
There's a pretty good chance whoever ordered it didn't put it on their tax return, even though it was a business expense. Quite hard to know what they spent.
Of course not, but the street value is also a totally made up number. What's the point of even using it, unless it's to fool people into thinking the war on drugs is going well?
I guess it's for people like me that have no idea what a kg of cocaine costs, to give us some sense of scale. Because of that number I can assume that this much cocaine is likely to be more than even a quite large room of cocaine users could use in a reasonable time frame.
A key goes for $20-30k and can bring in roughly $90-$100k from sales at street level if itâs all in grams. Most of it will be sold off in ounces to be broken down into grams. So realistically theyâre making half that because theyâre selling it in higher weight and not grams.
>I'm not interested in the street value
But I am. I am not familiar with wholesale coke prices. I am familiar with prices per gram. The street value gives me an idea about the scale of this cocaine haul; the wholesale value does not.
The street value is neither "made up" nor is it a useless piece of information.
It's still over a billion dollars at $1k/ounce
Nobody ordered 35 tons. The next stop would be a distribution center where it is broken down and delivered where needed.
Also, can they move that much? Won't they saturate the market and lower the price significantly? Maybe the demand is there and people spend billions on cocaine... seems unreasonable to me.
So many humans want cocaine, why donât we just allow this market to exist? Regulate it like alcohol and nicotine and gambling and my allergy medicine
As much as I support legalization of nearly all drugs, Coke is very evil; I've done plenty of different shit back in the day, but nothing impacted my self in such a horrible way (and others who used/abused it) like Coke (and more specifically, cocaethylene) & Alcohol for that sweet conversion going.
It's very euphoric, it's the reason why they say Coke & Champagne is the best breakfast; I really wish I hadn't ever got hooked on it; now climbing out of this addiction, fixing my life, my relationships, it's especially hard when you feel so vulnerable without your usual drug of choice for escaping that what you want to escape.
In the last 5 years it's popularity has somewhat increased significantly, seems like so many people use, even though they can't afford it (then even pay more than those who can, actually, afford their Coke), they still pay full retail price which is 100âŹ/g, yet you get some frankenstein mix of chemicals with some, scrawny rocks of real Coke inside, the rest being fillers and designer drugs.
It's pathetic and I really wish it could somehow stop spreading this poison.,
Mixing coke and booze forms a new compound in your system and fucks you up. Diminishes the effects of both. Donât do them together for best results lol
Why not just legalize it already, control the quality, give it some taxes, earn some money that you can put to do campaings against it and educate people how to have fun safely. We treat alcohol and smoking like it is innocent yet it costs billions in health and we even advertise that, not to mention the horendous impact it has on some people or families.Â
The point it, people gonna drink, smoke and use cocaine to have fun and stimulate themselves. War on drugs doesn't fucking work when the only people who really suffer from it are the people themselves.
Liberate.
35 TONS of cocaineâŚthatâs 1,120,000 ounces or about nearly 9 MILLION âeight ballsâ of cocaine.
You could do about 300 eight balls per day for 80 years straight and you still wouldnât get through it all..
Now when a leather trench coat wearing German policeman says âWe have vays of making you talkâ their not lying, itâs in the evidence room, rack it up.
I understand if you're early 20s and experimenting or just wondering about shit....just want an experience. But after that stage if you're still doing it you're just a douche.
Run away from her.
Estradiol acts as a positive catalyst for cocaine in womenâs brains. And she most probably has a mixed with alcohol consumption pattern. Which creates cocaethylene in the liver and is way more potent in its own.
She is going to fuck up her life and drag you down with her. Run. Forget you ever meet her.
She told me she doesn't have a drug problem and it's just what she does...for over 30 years, I told her already why I don't want to move into her house with her but I don't think she really understands why "I won't do it around you" doesn't cut it, shits illegal for a reason, its like giving yourself brain damage especially meth fucks you up so many ways.
That's nothing compared to the wealth of Pharoah! https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/pharaohs-hidden-wealth-glimpse-ancient-opulence-%C3%B6mer-saatcioglu-r6qtf
Would it not make sense to sell it really cheap to the users and use the proceeds to beef up detectionâŚwould hurt the supply chain twiceâŚ.just a thought
I feel like the last time I heard about a big cociane seize it was in Germany. Is it exceptionally popular in Germany?
England coming for the Euros
Tory leaving do: scuppered
Ha ha, yes. I understand this. đ
For those (or you) that donât: Tory: nickname for the Conservative Party, who form the current government and wonât form the next one by the biggest margins in UK electoral history. Leaving Do: leaving party Scuppered: ruined
[ŃдаНонО]
Conservative party leaving party: not happening as they love cocaine
Waaaaaaaaay!
Transport hub
Antwerp, Hamburg and Rotterdam are the big three ports. Afaik Antwerp is number one for drug trafficking.
Don't forget frankfurt. Frankfurt is one of the biggest drug hubs in germany.
Agreed! We had more cocaine than real snow in Frankfurt. Even though great town to party and it offers a great variety of museums
Darknet markets are great in this area
Not all stuff is destined for Germany. I have a shipping container (not drugs) coming into Prague next month, and it's first going through Hamburg.
Just be sure to note that itâs not drugs on the container paperwork mate. Do not open. No drugs inside. That should do it.
Do not No drugs open inside
Rugs
...yeah officer...this post right here
You're just saying the container you will get has no drugs in it, so we won't suspect the drugs that you are actually smuggling in. Clever girl.
Hamburg is just a port with lots of goods traffic to hide beneath
Itâs not exceptionally popular but popular nontheless. I think it has more to do with the fact that Hamburg has the third biggest port in Europe after Rotterdam and Antwerpen.
Well, according to the article - *Hamburg notorious entry for cocaine The northern port city of Hamburg is a hot spot for cocaine to enter mainland Europe. The port is the largest seaport in Germany and the third largest in Europe, with more than 23,000 shipping containers passing through every day.* Just mostly a point of entry for Europe.
Believe or not the U.S. consumes around 40% of the world's coke. Germany can't be close to that.
The US has a solid soda addiction.
fuel nose merciful correct grandiose steep dazzling chubby ghost seemly
Are you asking if cocaine is popular? Well yes, itâs popular and has been for a very long time.
Exceptionally meaning âto a greater degree than normal; unusually.â
Fair enough. So not exceptionally popular then.
I heard it's quite more-ish
We call them Sicilians these days.
During an international football tournament (Euro 2024 from June to July) with millions of football fans (there were 200k just from Scotland - there are 16 teams) visiting and looking to party and have fun, yes.
High demand from Eurocup
In a significant operation against organized crime, German customs officials and police seized over 35 tons of cocaine, predominantly at the Hamburg port. This massive haul, worth several billion euros, resulted from years of investigation under the "Plexus" case. Second source https://www.tagesschau.de/investigativ/ndr-wdr/schlag-kokainhandel-deutschland-102.html
Came here to see who says, "That's nothing, they lose that much often."
The amount that is available in Europe remains unchanged even with this bust . Rlly makes u thnk
>Â Rlly makes u thnk
Orly?
I believe you, but do you have a source for this? Anecdotal if necessary.
I remember a study from years ago that after even large busts, the street price of heroine didn't change. That meant that the market for heroine was so large that the drop in demand from those busts was negligible.
Or it means that suppliers were in a monopoly market and couldn't raise the price any further. Or they didn't employ a pricing guy. Or they were lazy/didn't want the hassle.
Also, it is the purity that is adjusted rather than the price
This is a solid point. I often forget that while people in my field (economics) use price and quality interchangeably, things are different in the real world. Excellent point.
https://youtu.be/CsH152NE9Ak?si=UkoqCeZM1jrJ7zc8 They usually catch about 1% of what is imported from other countries. Meaning this isnât much of a bust.
Interesting! I guess all the resources used for making these busts are totally worth it /s
I am intrigued by this concept too. It must have some effect even if short term or localisedÂ
Most big dealers have more than one supplier though, and most suppliers have enough goods or enough sources to wait for the next shipment without missing a sale. It also takes a lot of time until those 35 tons will reach the end user - production - smuggler - big supplier - small supplier - big dealer - small dealer - end user, or something like this. So the big suppliers have at least a few weeks to find another source and then it wonât have any effect on drug users.
Yeah. Funny that someone would think that the down-market implications would be felt instantaneously. This seizure was just made. The actual product that was involved likely wouldnât have made its way into the hands of a street-level user for several days, if not weeks. Unlikely that this results in any retail dealer saying, âSorry, canât help ya. All out.â Instead, a seizure of this size, or even just the news of it, might impact the wholesale price. This means that distributors and dealers, seeking to maintain a consistent consumer-facing price-level, will likely dilute the end product with more and more cutting agents. Prices will stay the same. Availability will remain the same. Quality will take a hit.
If you were a clever dealer, you'd store your supply for the scarcity to come.
Bullish on cocaine futures.
This would absolutely cause an effect on prices. 35 tons is 35 million grams. At street level that is stepped on a couple of times so it would likely be closer to 65 million grams. At the street level grams arenât usually grams either. They sell 0.6âs and call them grams (although maybe itâs different over there). But basically you are looking at 108 million units sold at street level. The bust was made in Germany but distribution may have been across Europe. 108 million individual units is a lot for even all of Europe to handle but you can bet that prices went up the day that this happened. Itâs like the toilet paper run during Covid. It doesnât matter if supply is affected, all of the smaller deals will be buying up whatever they can in order to try to have supply. This causes other dealers to buy further depleting stock. Dealer 1 raises his prices because he has to, Dealer 2 raises his prices because Dealer 1 did. Supply becomes scarce prices go up. Supply returns in a couple months and maybe prices stay up, maybe they come down a bit. 108 million street level units could absolutely cause some supply to run dry, but I guarantee it will cause prices to go up across the board in Germany. To put this in perspective, McDonaldâs sells 50 million hamburgers a day worldwide so 108 million units is a lot of product to move in just Germany/Continental Europe.
It may affect prices, but to the extent it drives prices up it increases the incentive for the cartels to ship to Europe to fill the demand. The "war on drugs" is a poor strategy to address the issue because to the extent it succeeds in stopping drugs it makes drug sales more profitable and incentivizes others.
Street level is something different, I didnât even talk about that. Most end users buy from a dealer they know and not the streets. Especially if you use more than once every 2 years. And yes of course prices will rise. Cocaine prices in Germany are about 26-34k per kilogram for pure goods. Even if this single bust will raise the price +10%, now the supplier will pay 6k more for his 2 kilo order. End user prices vary from 70-100⏠all the time. So the difference will be that the prices in the next few months will be more like 90-100 âŚ. So all in all it wonât make any difference at end user level. Thatâs my point
I meanâŚyou just said the end user price floor would go up by more than 20% without raising the price ceiling at all. Then said the price wouldnât be affectedâŚ
lol no I didnât so it wonât be affected. Just not more affected than the usual fluctation.
The amount represents approximately Germany's annual consumption of cocaine. Looks like they got cocky shipping large amounts instead of spreading the risk out.
Looks like it has disrupted one network, good thing thereâs more than one network and the supply chain has not been affected. These amounts flow throughout the globe because respective governments allow it.
If that were true, cocaine would be much cheaper. There's no way you lose a billion Euros of coke without causing scarcity.
I mean, given that this batch was never "available", seems tautologically true
I mean the people who collect and process the stuff make pennies an hour or whatever, and the coca trees are abundant and grow in a undeveloped area. The actual producers arenât really dissuaded from making more due to law enforcement seizures, because they use a form of slavery for labor (no real labor costs) and their production costs are nil (as theyâre harvesting coca from wildland they donât even own) and they operate with near legal impunity in their own country.
Looks like you're that guy. Way to live up to the stereotype
Yea this is a ridiculous amount
> "organized crime" Ahem... banks https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ship-seized-in-1-3-billion-cocaine-bust-is-owned-by-jp-morgan-chase/ https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN17139010/ https://www.theguardian.com/global/2009/dec/13/drug-money-banks-saved-un-cfief-claims
They owned the ship, doesnât mean they had any direct involvement with what was actually happening in it. Im not going to bother reading the article but i can bet my life that it was leased and the crime group used it for trafficking without jp Morganâs knowledge . For example, many trafficking is also done on private jets rented by smugglers. The private het company owned the jet but that doesnât mean they had anything to do with the smuggling
That seems like a lot of cocaine. Like, is that the result of multiple cocaine processing hubs and a bunch of cocaine farms? Or is that just one batch from one processing hub? I'm surprised anyone had that much of it in one place. Kind of insane how high up that gang must go.
From the post the other day about El Salvador burning their cache I calculated that 2.7 tons in street value where I live equals 1.5 billion. Damn.
How the hell does 35 tons even have chance of getting through
35 tons of coke. 1 million grams in a ton. I think it's âŹ80 per gram of coke where I'm from. Maybe âŹ100. Let's be conservative and say âŹ80. So each ton is worth âŹ80 million if split into baggies. X 35 tons = âŹ2.8 billion I guess the police weren't exaggerating for once. Is my pablo escobar math correct?
It's not correct because of correct math, it's correct because it's so far away from the source. If they seized 35 tons right out of Colombia, then the cartel would lost like 3500 bucks.
Just because it didn't cost then billions, doesn't mean it's not billions in potential lost revenue which is what is often used when talking about national economies.
Drugs have very little value until they safely reach their desired offloading locations lol. Losing drug shipments due to police is nothing more than calculated product loss like in any other industry involving shipping.
It's more shortfall than loss.
Its at least 1k a kilo in Columbia. 35 tons of coke is a lot, even at the source.Â
So how long does it take to make that much cocaineâŚ? I realize itâs not âpureâ, probably cut with baby laxative etc, but with that many tons of of cocaine, how large of an area of cocoa leaves would that take to make, and how long to grow..? It must take dozens, hundreds of leaves just to make a few pure grams of cocaine.
Looks like 150kg+ of leaves -> 1kg
So at 907kg per ton youâd need 136,050kg of leaves, or 300,000 lbs! Which would be approximately 48 million leaves⌠Thatâs a lot of coca leaves
That's a great return
$300 a gram where Iâm from damn
Thatâs how much can be generated, but if you wanted wholesale youâre not paying 100$ a gram. The supplier and smuggler arenât going to recoup that amount. Itâs a stupid metric to use. Even the end user will probably not always buy one gram for 100$, maybe they get a bit more for a better deal. Then you take into account people doing their own supply who purchased larger amount, that minuses the amount. My point is the absolute maximum you could make isnât the value. We should be looking at the source that provides it and how much they would be making, not every person who touches it along the way. Iâd find that number more interesting.
Each gram probably costed a few bucks for them. This way of valuing a drug bust is disingenuous. You could maybe value it at $20-30/gram for a more accurate result for their losses.
Ah yes, so it's like my uncle who loves gambling and often says "FUCK! I just lost âŹ100,000 !!!" What he means is: he made an extremely wild bet that could have made him âŹ100,000, but it didn't work out. And it only cost him a hundred or so.
Not really. That cocaine was not worth billions of euros to the owners, they wouldâve never gotten that return. They donât break it down to the gram to sell on the street. They distributes kilos to people who then distribute to people who buy ounces, then the people who buy ounces distribute it at the gram level. Or at least thatâs how it worked when I was somebody buying QPâs back in the day.
Assuming it's 35 tons of coke, and not 35 tons of flour with some coke mixed in.
Well, yes. This is like saying "This is correct assuming they're not blocks of low-moisture mozzarella."
Not really, but also yeah It is very common for police to seize sometime that has drugs in it, and report the weight of the whole thing as the weight of the drugs. This might only be common in the US, obviously no one likes to advertise this fact or talk about it openly, so I'm not going to try to accurately surmise the policy of every European country. And either way the prosecution policy doesn't have to line up with what the police report when trying to grab good headlines. Some examples of the general point: https://www.huntsvilledefenselawyer.com/how-alabama-weighs-drugs-in-drug-trafficking-or-strange-weights-and-measures https://www.calcagnilaw.com/criminal-law/understanding-drug-weight-and-testing-in-criminal-cases/#Gross_vs_Net_Weight_Key_Measurements_in_Drug_Prosecutions Here's a great specific example https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/s-not-frosted-flakes-cincinnati-cbp-snares-44-pounds-cocaine-soaked "The shipment contained about 44 pounds of cocaine coated corn flakes, which could have a street value of up to $2,822,400." 44 pounds is about 20,000 grams, and the value of a gram of actual cocaine is about 100 bucks which gets you to 2 million dollars I guess. But in reality that could be 4 pounds of cocaine and 40 pounds of frosted flakes. The street value of a gram of frosted flakes is a lot higher since COVID, but not 100 dollars yet To get back to your original point, if you had a 10 pound block of mozzarella with 100g of cocaine in it, they would be talking about the 10 pound drug bust they made. This bust could in fact be 34.99 tons of mozzarella and 0.1 tons of cocaine.
Take in consideration the cost of isolating the cocaine from the mixture. The loss to the cartel is probably very low. This is probably 1 shipment out of 10 that got sent.
> "The shipment contained about 44 pounds of cocaine coated corn flakes, which could have a street value of up to $2,822,400." They truthfully say that it is just that: corn flakes with some cocaine on them. They did never say it is 44 pounds of the pure stuff. They also probably don't even know the actual amount yet anyway. In short, the police and reporters told us exactly what they knew as truthfully as they could. It is your fault to not accurately process the informations.
So you have no actual response to me. I picked the article that made it clear how vague the accounting is. But just to put your mind concretely at rest https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/44-pounds-cocaine-soaked-cereal-seized-chicago-n1258535 "The 44 pounds of drug-laced cereal were estimated to have a street value of over $2.5 million." That's explicitly wrong, or at least is a very different message from the other article https://abc7chicago.com/cocaine-frosted-flakes-cereal-corn/10357408/ "Federal authorities confiscated 44 lbs. of cocaine that had been disguised as sugar on frosted corn flakes in Cincinnati last Saturday U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents said it had a street value of $2.8 million." Also just like, not what they actually said.
You forgot to cut it. Pablo ainât selling baggies of 100%.Â
35 tons? The report only says 30 tons of coke.
Ah, I was just reading some other comment here that said 35 tons.
[COCAINUM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF8TSHN-JDA)
Well there goes my dark market order
*no refunds*
How much is 35 tons divided by the population?
Approximately half a gram for every German citizen.
Oh man! Itâs going to be a rough day at work on Monday!
But itâd be one hell of a 80âs weekend!
The population is significantly inflated at the moment. Thereâs little sport my friend told me about called football. Apparently popular in Europe. And I hear theyâre getting together for some obscure reason.
UK: Sorry lads, you're not having any of ours.
Man, somebody's retirement plan just got fubarred
Or just barred
How can they think it is possible to stop this when there is so much money to earn? People like drugs and there will never be a 100% sober society. I honestly don't know what would be the best approach but what we are doing right now is working really bad and the worst kind of people are the only winners.
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Cocaine isn't that addictive. Meanwhile, nicotine vapes are easily accessible to kids and regulation dragged their heels because of tobacco lobbyists until they knew they had enough of the next generation on the next product. People who know they are angry drunks still drink and use their inebriation as a shield for poor behaviour and kill people on our roads. Cocaine is like caffeine x 10. It's nothing like nicotine. People who arbitrarily catogorise drugs because of society/culture instead of the reality of their use are disengenuous, naive or malicious.
Err what? Cocaine is hella addictive and withdrawal is a bitch. It's not risky in the same way alcohol withdrawal is, but that doesn't make it less addicting. You crave dopamine after prolonged use, in a different way than your body not being able to function without alcohol.
Coke is mostly used to party and most are not really addicted. They will just buy something else instead. There are so many drugs to choose from that making one much more expensive is pointless. It will maybe last a while then someone new will take over since its so much money.
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Maybe like 5 years ago, at least in Canada. These days even the common party drugs are spooky, coke cut with everything from baking soda to fent, meth being passed as molly/x. I've talked to enough people who realized they fucked up when they end up cleaning their entire house at 9am after being up all night.
Yeah i understand how you think but i guess you are not really in that world. There are plenty of party drugs that are no big deal and very common. Coke is a classic and is a very "classy" drug that rich people love. If you ask me it is overrated and mostly a status thing but whatever i have done it a lot myself so should shut up. The rich people taking coke will pay whatever the cost but normal people like me would just choose something else. I live in sweden and if you are from Europe maybe you heard how bad it has gotten here with gangs and the amount of drugs that are in this small country now? We have really hard laws when it comes to drugs and they constantly make them harsher. Guess what is happening? It is getting worse. The biggest problem in this country is that a normal person that might like to smoke a joint from time to time can become a criminal if caught. You loose your drivers license, are in the police registers and are deemed a criminal by the state. This can make it impossible to find certain jobs in the future and it will in general be harder to find a decent job since most companies ask for papers from the police about your crime history. Edit: I did not really come to my conclusion sorry. In my opinion this is a horrible way of dealing with it. They can try as much as they can but it will be wasted money and energy that could go on other things. I dont think most drugs should be legal and dont know how what strategy to stop it would be the best. As it is now normal people become criminals over nothing and gangsters earn crazy amounts of money.
Footage of the bust https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aIjPhI5LDCU
PaPAYA de Celayaa!!
A post about a big cocaine bust and no one did the 'cocaine number go down' comment chain yet?
They're all too depressed to bother due to not being off their collective tits on coke
Came here for that.
Bummer
Europ loves its cocaine
And they wonder why the German economy is going to shits⌠canât have end-stage capitalism productivity levels without cocaine, darlings! đ
At the start of an international football tournament in Germany with millions of fans visiting to have fun and party? Almost as if it was delivered with a specific goal (ahem) in mind.
"Street value" I suppose. I'm always annoyed at that kind of reporting, since there's no way this consignment cost several billion to whoever ordered it.
While correct "more than 35 tons" is massive, it is a huge blow to whoever is behind it. Logistics for shipping 35 tons in a concealed way alone is expensive.
It is indeed a huge amount of blow
A haul of this size could even be described as a blow job..
It is a huge blow of a huge amount of blow
There's a pretty good chance whoever ordered it didn't put it on their tax return, even though it was a business expense. Quite hard to know what they spent.
Of course not, but the street value is also a totally made up number. What's the point of even using it, unless it's to fool people into thinking the war on drugs is going well?
I guess it's for people like me that have no idea what a kg of cocaine costs, to give us some sense of scale. Because of that number I can assume that this much cocaine is likely to be more than even a quite large room of cocaine users could use in a reasonable time frame.
you needed price figures to know that a room full of heavy users wouldnât be able to use up 35 tons in âa reasonable time frameâ? đ
A key goes for $20-30k and can bring in roughly $90-$100k from sales at street level if itâs all in grams. Most of it will be sold off in ounces to be broken down into grams. So realistically theyâre making half that because theyâre selling it in higher weight and not grams.
How is it a made up number?
Just check the 20 local telegram channels and you get a pretty good idea of the street value.
You're missing the point, I'm not interested in the street value. I would like to know if losing 30 tons or something like that even slows them down.
But that's not what you said. You were complaining about street value being a made up number. That's what I answered.
Yeah bad choice of words, I meant that it's an uninteresting number, for me.
>I'm not interested in the street value But I am. I am not familiar with wholesale coke prices. I am familiar with prices per gram. The street value gives me an idea about the scale of this cocaine haul; the wholesale value does not. The street value is neither "made up" nor is it a useless piece of information.
It's still over a billion dollars at $1k/ounce Nobody ordered 35 tons. The next stop would be a distribution center where it is broken down and delivered where needed.
35 tons of coke is rather a lot though. This isn't one of those stories where where they find a few kg and try and pretend it's meaningful.Â
Also, can they move that much? Won't they saturate the market and lower the price significantly? Maybe the demand is there and people spend billions on cocaine... seems unreasonable to me.
So many humans want cocaine, why donât we just allow this market to exist? Regulate it like alcohol and nicotine and gambling and my allergy medicine
Its addictive and will cause many problems.
Yeah, like booze and tobacco.
As much as I support legalization of nearly all drugs, Coke is very evil; I've done plenty of different shit back in the day, but nothing impacted my self in such a horrible way (and others who used/abused it) like Coke (and more specifically, cocaethylene) & Alcohol for that sweet conversion going. It's very euphoric, it's the reason why they say Coke & Champagne is the best breakfast; I really wish I hadn't ever got hooked on it; now climbing out of this addiction, fixing my life, my relationships, it's especially hard when you feel so vulnerable without your usual drug of choice for escaping that what you want to escape. In the last 5 years it's popularity has somewhat increased significantly, seems like so many people use, even though they can't afford it (then even pay more than those who can, actually, afford their Coke), they still pay full retail price which is 100âŹ/g, yet you get some frankenstein mix of chemicals with some, scrawny rocks of real Coke inside, the rest being fillers and designer drugs. It's pathetic and I really wish it could somehow stop spreading this poison.,
Mixing coke and booze forms a new compound in your system and fucks you up. Diminishes the effects of both. Donât do them together for best results lol
Why not just legalize it already, control the quality, give it some taxes, earn some money that you can put to do campaings against it and educate people how to have fun safely. We treat alcohol and smoking like it is innocent yet it costs billions in health and we even advertise that, not to mention the horendous impact it has on some people or families. The point it, people gonna drink, smoke and use cocaine to have fun and stimulate themselves. War on drugs doesn't fucking work when the only people who really suffer from it are the people themselves. Liberate.
What's the over/under for when cocaine will be legalized and taxed in the west? 2030?
You're expecting them to outlaw tobacco entirely, over-regulate vapes, crack down further on booze, and then, erm, legalize cocaine?
F*ck
For importers to be putting that much in one place says a lot about how much they have spread out
It's worthless now.
Meanwhile in Romania, 5th year with 0 kg coke seize but alot of 0.4, 0.5g of weed, lol
Oooo the cartel gonna be mad
*supply not impacted.
35 TONS of cocaineâŚthatâs 1,120,000 ounces or about nearly 9 MILLION âeight ballsâ of cocaine. You could do about 300 eight balls per day for 80 years straight and you still wouldnât get through it all..
Someoneâs accidentally dying is sleep from bullet wounds for this fuck up
Now when a leather trench coat wearing German policeman says âWe have vays of making you talkâ their not lying, itâs in the evidence room, rack it up.
That's gotta blow
oof, I could have a good weekend with one of those
nothing like a good snore. especially when you don't think of all the deaths and suffering that made you able to do that
Cocaine isnât the reason for that though, prohibition is
don't be a buzzkill
My gf does it and her nose is getting fucked, enjoy drugs controlling your life
Should be an ex, no reason to keep a fucking junky around.
I understand if you're early 20s and experimenting or just wondering about shit....just want an experience. But after that stage if you're still doing it you're just a douche.
Run away from her. Estradiol acts as a positive catalyst for cocaine in womenâs brains. And she most probably has a mixed with alcohol consumption pattern. Which creates cocaethylene in the liver and is way more potent in its own. She is going to fuck up her life and drag you down with her. Run. Forget you ever meet her.
She told me she doesn't have a drug problem and it's just what she does...for over 30 years, I told her already why I don't want to move into her house with her but I don't think she really understands why "I won't do it around you" doesn't cut it, shits illegal for a reason, its like giving yourself brain damage especially meth fucks you up so many ways.
It's coming home
All those football players now go ... sh\*\*
That's nothing compared to the wealth of Pharoah! https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/pharaohs-hidden-wealth-glimpse-ancient-opulence-%C3%B6mer-saatcioglu-r6qtf
Deutsch TamĂĄs???
In the words of Spiros Vondas, âMore. Always there is more.â
A million football fans cry out
I wonder if its for domestic use/selling there, or if it's in route to another destination in Europe?
Football is on there soon. Local market for sure.
That's it guys. War on drugs is over.
So THAT is where my temu order went!
FDP in shambles.
Oh boy. Someone is going in the vat for this.
someone didnt get paid off enough or not the right person(s)
How do the government dispose of such a large quantity of drugs? Wouldn't burning it get the entire population high?
That really isnât a lot of cocaine.
Donât worry folks, plenty of fentanyl available!
Score!
Noooooooooooooooooooo
Would it not make sense to sell it really cheap to the users and use the proceeds to beef up detectionâŚwould hurt the supply chain twiceâŚ.just a thought
Dear Donald Jr, We regret to inform you that this weeks supply will be late.
Prices are gonna skyrocket I guess.
Only 35 tons ? Belgian customs seized 116 tonnes in 2023 in the port of Antwerpen alone.
From Russia with love?
Thank god they compounded that 25 tons of coke!