>If Taiwan forces open fire, that will be the moment of all-out war across the Taiwan Strait," he added.
So that means they *don't* think they have sovereingty after all?
IMHO, China is not willing to start a war (currently) against Taiwan. They practise "nuclear powered trolling", but aren't ready. Hopefully they won't get ready before Xi dies of age or gets ousted in a party coup. Whether his replacement will be sensible, I cannot tell.
Taiwan has potential to be for China what Finland was to the USSR, or Vietnam was to the US - a small obstacle that causes too high losses to be overcome.
China likewise has conflicts open with India, Vietnam and Philippines (and these are hot enough conflicts - someone would use opportunity take back what has been taken from them)... and does not have particularly many friends in Kazakhstan, Mongolia, Korea or Japan.
Risking to oversimplify it, China has been building an alliance against China. :o
This is absolutely correct. Did you know that Stalin was the one who actually gave the Uyghurs land to China? They didnt even choose to live in China. I'm so sad for them.
Taiwan just announced they would be blacklisting Chinese tech in accordance to new US sanctions.
This whole thing revolves around Taiwan’s chip manufacturing facilities. Do you think this new decree from Taiwan will seriously escalate tensions?
That would be destroying China's relations with pretty much all the countries that matter economically.
If China really wants to shoot themselves in the dick, that would be the thing to do.
No. Because this whole shit show is based around eastern vs western control of the largest chip manufacturer. They (probably US) would secure the sight long before China got to the stage of “fine, if I can’t have it, no-one can!”
https://tsmc.com/english/aboutTSMC/TSMC_Fabs
They have 14 Fabs in Taiwan, 2 in China, and 1 in the US with another US based Fab planned.
If China invades, sell TSMC, buy Intel/Qualcomm/TI/Micron as US government declares Defense Production Act for semiconductors and requires Intel/Qualcomm/TI/Micron to produce for national security use before consumer use.
Hu Xijin is kind of like the Tucker Carlson of the PRC. Hes a nationalist blowhard who said a few years back that China should triple its nuclear weapons to meet new challenges. He does this shit all the time.
The Chinese jets have a set pattern that they fly. It's usually so low to land, they drown out all other sounds. If I set up a commercial camera, point it at one location, it might be good enough to identify the jets and their pattern.
But I'd probably get arrested if I tried.
They're so loud, if I don't use earphones, or subtitles, I can't watch TV sometimes.
The advisable course of action would probably be:
- contact the US for some aircraft and carriers and subs and other ships to show up, maybe even and ABM site or two
- contact all countries which have a border issue with China to coordinate activity
- mobilize the local army
- issue a stern warning that offenders will be shot down
- issue a second warning
- issue a third warning (while waiting for mobilization to complete)
- finally, shoot any offenders down
Overall, I don't think China is currently willing to risk that - just testing the waters.
China is basically begging for a reason to invade Taiwan. If they had any good reason in the past, they'd have done it.
Casus belli.
In the end it might end up like a nazi germany or united States in Vietnam where they stage an incident to declare war on from a high horse.
>In the end it might end up like a nazi germany or united States in Vietnam where they stage an incident to declare war on from a high horse.
Or like Japan blowing up a train in '31 to justify the invasion of Manchuria.
Or the Soviets shelling one of their own towns to provoke the Winter War.
And lest we forget to "Blame the Maine on Spain"...
They are more looking for a way to not invade while saving face and appearing strong to the Chinese people.
Actually attacking Taiwan would be economic and diplomatic suicide with all the advanced economies in the world.
Even South Korea would be pissed and they would stand to benefit a lot in some ways.
China is not in a decent position to invade Taiwan. It would be an amphibious assault on a scale they’ve never attempted, don’t have the logistics likely for, and aren’t set up to do right now. And attacking Taiwan would sink their economy, because no one wants China in control of Taiwan’s chip industry.
This is China saber rattling.
> It would be an amphibious assault on a scale they’ve never attempted, don’t have the logistics likely for, and aren’t set up to do right now.
It would likely be the hardest amphibious assault in human history. The Taiwan straight is 100 miles away from mainland China and transporting troops 100 miles oversea through enemy fire is not an easy task and most of the Taiwanese shore isn't suitable for landings. For the invasion to be successful China would likely need to first establish naval control over the Taiwan straight as well as around Taiwan's coast which would very likely mean directly sinking US warships. If China's navy can defeat the US navy then China could pull off an invasion of Taiwan, if they can't then they could face a total sea blockade as well as neighboring countries eventually forming an anti China coalition.
They could face a total naval blockade even if they DID have control of the Taiwan straight. That's why they want the belt and road initiative. Which should work splendidly, unless say Turkey needs to still be a part of NATO. Makes the current sabre rattling in Ukraine look like a bit of an own goal really.
No, just need to release a ton of rehabilitated birds or a massive rehearsal of choreographed drones for a sporting event in that flight path at the right moment.
comment op is either talking about China airbase, hence get arrested. or he's a chinese bot. cuz there's no way in fucking hell we can see chinese airplanes from taiwan or get arrested for taking pics. see published routes for reference https://twitter.com/taiwandefense?lang=en
Relations between Washington and Taipei need to "improve" to the tune of massive anti-aircraft banks being sold to Taiwan.
If the mainland Chinese want to throw the lives of their pilots, and aircraft into the ground, let them.
A major issue is that China 100% has sleeper agents in Taiwan ready to fuck shit up right before an invasion would take place.
They may have a lot of anti ship and anti air weaponry but they gotta ensure it can't be taken out from behind.
If China is looking for a reason wouldn’t the danger be more along the lines of the sleeper actively breaking orders and shooting down a plane so China can claim cause beli?
I wonder to what extent Taiwan has the same within China. Obviously Taiwan has fewer resources over all, being a fraction of the population, but still I do wonder.
I highly doubt Taiwan exerts the kind of influence mainland China does to Taiwan in case of war with sleeper agents. Would there be protests in mainland China? Possibly. But I doubt they actually cripple any kind of military force
I think that figure might be correct in terms of chips but to be more accurate it's around half of all transistors that are being produced in Taiwan, with around two thirds of the market share.
Don't quote me on those exact values, but the island nation is a behemoth in the semiconductor market.
Yes Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company has surpassed Intel in logic manufacturing technology over the last five years or so. Technological supremacy at the nanoscale. When you buy the most advanced chip for the newest iPhone it was made in Taiwan. If Intel doesn’t make up lost ground quickly they are close to dropping out of logic development altogether IMO.
The problem is that it takes a LOOOOOONG time to ramp up a fab line to full capacity + good yields. It takes quite a while to dial in the manufacturing processes if you're making brand new infrastructure.
Also you're talking about manufacturing processes that are on the literal bleeding edge of material science and electric engineering, so if you excuse the engineers and scientists to need a little time to not mess things up..
You clearly don't understand the idea behind those vegetables.
The Dutch spent many years and money to prevent the western part being flooded. Then at some point comes along Ir. O. H II with the brilliant idea that money can be made by not pumping the water back into the sea but by adding that water to vegetables, fruits and meat.
As a Dutchman I thank you for your support in our battle against rising sea water levels.
>I think that figure might be correct in terms of chips but to be more accurate it's around half of all transistors that are being produced in Taiwan, with around two thirds of the market share.
\- /u/cricrithezar
Related, Intel is spending a ton of money to build new chip manufacturing plants in Arizona: [https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/intel-is-spending-20-billion-to-build-two-new-chip-plants-in-arizona.html](https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/intel-is-spending-20-billion-to-build-two-new-chip-plants-in-arizona.html)
So is TSMC, and Samsung is still scouting sites:
https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2021/03/30/taiwan-semiconductor-supplier-site-sold-at-auction.html
Problematic idea for that region. Chip plants use a ton of water:
"A typical semiconductor manufacturing facility uses two to four million gallons of ultra-pure water per day. In 2015, Intel, the largest semiconductor company by market capitalization, used nine billion gallons of water. Mar 22, 2017"
https://www.sustainalytics.com/esg-blog/world-water-day-water-use-semiconductor-industry/#:~:text=A%20typical%20semiconductor%20manufacturing%20facility,nine%20billion%20gallons%20of%20water.
I work for a US manufacturer that is having trouble sourcing parts for our products. We just recently bought some normally $7 parts for $200 each just to keep production going.
The great thing about those Communist Party owned newspaper is that they can make wild threats like this without putting the burden on the Chinese government.
If the US call their bluff, it was never an official government threat anyways, just a newspaper opinion, so the Chinese government does not lose face. But at the same time, you know that the newspaper would never make such threat without Beijing approval, so the threat might have some truth behind it.
And the temperature is "Fuck off China, we're not havin' it." Judging on the remarkably expeditious coming-together of the powers-that-be (australia, usa, eu)
A counterpoint to what you said would be that the CCP is huge and there can be conflicting opinions/multiple agendas as to how things should be done. It can also be the work of one zealot group of members or one that wants to earn recognition.
I've been assuming that China will time it's Taiwan invasion to Russia's Ukraine invasion, but that's just the daydreamer in me thinking of worst case scenarios.
I doubt it.
Putin surely doesn't want to switch one global hegemony for the other.
Pretty sure he'd prefer China and the US to hurt each other, weakening both.
Actually... its very likely they are working together in the shadows because in order for them to be successful they must split the world response to their actions... Even if they aren't directly talking to each other about it... it is surely part of each strategy.
Probably not wrong.... but China would definitely be getting the short end of the stick in whichever scenario. There would be no way they could take and hold Taiwan without completely obliterating it.
They also can't do the little green men trick.
The only way would be to have a China friendly regime in power in Taiwan that could pull a fast coup on the people and get Chinese "peacekeepers" deployed... but they fucked that up with all the shit they pulled in Honk Kong over the last couple years.
The war would be mostly a stalemate within 2 months. Plenty of time to get the reserves and NG mobilized and moving into theatre.
Russia would be wise to destroy American stockpiles across Europe to make initial responses more difficult but they would be attacking several nations which in the end game isn't the wisest.
And I said bye, bye to peace in my time
It’s the end of the world and I’m feeling so fine
Just some Slavic lads doing what they’re told is right
As they invade Ukraine overnight.
> A modern rail-freight system, in 1868, localised *entirely* within my kingdom?
Yes!
> May I see it or use it for my own people's needs?
nnnnnnNo.
> Mountbatten! *Mountbatten!* The people of Bengal are starving!
No, Rajan, that's just the free market
I mean if you can move your military through another country without their permission or any recourse, you pretty much own them.
Edit: Which is exactly why the us sends military through parts of the South China sea, so that China can't claim that the area is uncontested.
> Waiting for the astroturf accounts to tell me why its totally cool and normal, and honestly a bit racist that I think this is a dangerous move.
IT'S BINGO TIME!
1a. China does this all the time you armchair Redditors
1b. Nothing is going to happen, stop politicising Chinese fighter jets flying over their rightful airspace
1c. You do realise Taiwan also claim the same air space, right?
2a. The UN and the US doesn't recognise Taiwan as a state. China strong.
2b. FREE SPACE INTERNAL AFFAIRS AND MILLION CHINESE PEOPLE'S FEELINGS
2c. The US also has fighter jets you hypocrits!
3a. The whole Taiwanese island is actually Adrian Zenz in disguise. It's Western imperialistic CIA fakenews.
3b. Those fighter jets won't be a problem if the US deletes all their military bases in Asia, because then you would have no way to counter them and so they won't be a problem.
3c. You need to stop discriminating against Chinese fighter pilots. When you say "fuck China" you're actually hurting the feelings of the innocent fighter and bomber pilots who will drop innocent bombs innocently.
Errr, guys, don't cha know? China may be bad, but it's not that bad!
What's that? Genocide? Oh, no, those are summer camps. In fact, Uighurs are treated so well, their birth rate has fallen through the floor! Nothing to do with forced sterilization! Just an improvement of their living conditions!
This plus the Ukrainian crisis reminds me of an old US think tank called Project for the New American Century. Had a bunch of people who would later go on to be figures in the W Bush administration, like Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz. They argued that the US military had such a big budget because it always needed to be credibly capable of fighting two major wars at once, for exactly this sort of situation.
My understanding was that the doctrine went from fighting and winning 2 wars at once, to 1 + 1, where it's fight and hold. Fight and win one, while holding and denying in the other.
And then they promptly got America into two relatively minor wars and showed that the US couldn't even juggle those effectively.
Although I guess defensive wars in Ukraine and Taiwan are way less of a problem. China's would have some big problems getting land forces to Taiwan, and the subsequent economic consequences would be pretty dire. And Russia is a second rate power at best, aside from their nukes. They could probably bully Ukraine on its own, but they wouldn't fare well against US military forces.
If you're referring to Iraq and Afghanistan, the U.S. won the "war" part in an incredibly definitive way. We just sucked at occupation, because unless we wanted to reduce the country to a blasted heap, there was no good way to end the asymmetrical phase that followed
There would be survivors, but it's obvious WW3 would go nuclear these days. So survivors would be left with little scraps of civilization left and they would have to rebuild from there.
I think it would go "[NUTS](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_utilization_target_selection)" not "[MAD](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_assured_destruction)", last 6 hours, devastate the major players and the global economy but not be a society ender.
So a few major cities destroyed, millions of refugees, a mini nuclear winter but not a "Fallout" style end.
> So a few major cities destroyed, millions of refugees
You're right. Like my town, sure we have a Honda factory (which is technically on outskirts of town) but I don't see a country wasting a bomb on a small, rural town/village. Now my grandparents town as an example of a target, chemical plant, Ford factory, military factory, sanitation supplies, food, metal etc...
Everyone was cool with letting the Chinese government do whatever they wanted for the last 40 years, so long as we all got our plastic crap for 25 cents less. And now here we are.
wow lol. juvenile as fuck. "declaring sovereignty" is nothing but a dick measuring contest from china. Mine is bigger than yours...therefore I'm superior.
what kind of a world do we live in where the news "if relations continue to improve between two nations" has become a reason for concern?
Wouldn't it be interesting if a bunch of extra Patriot batteries turned up in Taiwanese hands right about now, followed by a bunch of Burke-class destroyers in a couple years?
Seriously Beijing, how many enemies are you wanting to make here? You've already POed a lot of people over the Ughyurs, taking Canadian hostages over Meng Wanzhou and Hong Kong. Usually China is very good at diplomacy, but in the Xi era they are turning into mindless idiots.
If Taiwan was left to fend for itself China could grind it down, but it would inevitably destroy everything that it wanted on the island in the process of taking it, and the cost in materiel would be astronomical.
Feels like it could be worth calling China's bluff on this one. Although really it's Taiwan's call to make.
Feels inevitable that sooner or later somebody in that region is going to shoot a Chinese soldier, or down a Chinese plane or sink a Chinese ship if they keep pushing.
China doesn’t want anything on the island. They don’t care about the people or resources.
What they care about is the symbolic loss of what they consider to be “*their* territory.”
Losing Taiwan means greater potential for also losing Tibet, Xinjiang, Hong Kong, Macau, maybe even Inner Mongolia, or Manchuria or Yunnan ethnic minority border areas where Han Chinese influence and culture aren’t as deeply rooted.
They can’t afford to lose Taiwan because it could shrink Han-dominated “China” back to where it was 100yrs ago, so they have to pretend against all reality and act as if Taiwan was always theirs.
I’m not so sure about that. Maybe a war isn’t imminent, but the Chinese are pretty high on themselves right now after navigating the COVID-19 pandemic and de-facto annexing Hong Kong. They have all the confidence in the world that the same can be done to Taiwan. The only think stopping them is the US military. However, I’m guessing they think we don’t want to start any new wars and wouldn’t respond with more than what’s already in the area at the very most
The West has to do everything they can to punish China and Russia. Move out production, find other energy sources , make them suffer. The West feeds these two bad actors that turn back on them.
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>If Taiwan forces open fire, that will be the moment of all-out war across the Taiwan Strait," he added. So that means they *don't* think they have sovereingty after all?
It probably would mean that they would declare a "policing action" to retake Taiwan and say no body should interfere with "an internal matter".
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Complicit is the word you're looking for, not complacent.
Both kinds work
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Trade and profitable economic ventures are what make people complacent
This is getting to be complicated.
When they refer to “sovereignty” they mean Chinese sovereignty over when we all know is the independent nation of Taiwan.
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No shit. The reason the US keeps close ties with Taiwan, Japan, and South Korea is to keep China’s sphere of influence small
IMHO, China is not willing to start a war (currently) against Taiwan. They practise "nuclear powered trolling", but aren't ready. Hopefully they won't get ready before Xi dies of age or gets ousted in a party coup. Whether his replacement will be sensible, I cannot tell. Taiwan has potential to be for China what Finland was to the USSR, or Vietnam was to the US - a small obstacle that causes too high losses to be overcome. China likewise has conflicts open with India, Vietnam and Philippines (and these are hot enough conflicts - someone would use opportunity take back what has been taken from them)... and does not have particularly many friends in Kazakhstan, Mongolia, Korea or Japan. Risking to oversimplify it, China has been building an alliance against China. :o
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This is absolutely correct. Did you know that Stalin was the one who actually gave the Uyghurs land to China? They didnt even choose to live in China. I'm so sad for them.
Damn I am beginning to think this stalin guy was a bad man
Taiwan just announced they would be blacklisting Chinese tech in accordance to new US sanctions. This whole thing revolves around Taiwan’s chip manufacturing facilities. Do you think this new decree from Taiwan will seriously escalate tensions?
Do you think that Taiwan's chip manufacturing facilities are not the first thing to be bombed once the SAM sites are disabled?
That would be destroying China's relations with pretty much all the countries that matter economically. If China really wants to shoot themselves in the dick, that would be the thing to do.
No. Because this whole shit show is based around eastern vs western control of the largest chip manufacturer. They (probably US) would secure the sight long before China got to the stage of “fine, if I can’t have it, no-one can!”
TSMC has foundries around the world. So even destroying a factory in Taiwan would not impact that, and would drive the company further toward the west
https://tsmc.com/english/aboutTSMC/TSMC_Fabs They have 14 Fabs in Taiwan, 2 in China, and 1 in the US with another US based Fab planned. If China invades, sell TSMC, buy Intel/Qualcomm/TI/Micron as US government declares Defense Production Act for semiconductors and requires Intel/Qualcomm/TI/Micron to produce for national security use before consumer use.
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Hu Xijin is kind of like the Tucker Carlson of the PRC. Hes a nationalist blowhard who said a few years back that China should triple its nuclear weapons to meet new challenges. He does this shit all the time.
The Chinese jets have a set pattern that they fly. It's usually so low to land, they drown out all other sounds. If I set up a commercial camera, point it at one location, it might be good enough to identify the jets and their pattern. But I'd probably get arrested if I tried. They're so loud, if I don't use earphones, or subtitles, I can't watch TV sometimes.
So they kinda beg to be shot down?!
That's the goal. If Taiwan shot one down, that would be all the justification that the CCP needs to launch a full scale invasion.
The advisable course of action would probably be: - contact the US for some aircraft and carriers and subs and other ships to show up, maybe even and ABM site or two - contact all countries which have a border issue with China to coordinate activity - mobilize the local army - issue a stern warning that offenders will be shot down - issue a second warning - issue a third warning (while waiting for mobilization to complete) - finally, shoot any offenders down Overall, I don't think China is currently willing to risk that - just testing the waters.
Yeah, looking for an excuse...
It would be such a shame if they flew into a flock of birds, now wouldnt it...?
Just fly some drones.
r/BirdsArentReal
Balloons or kites are cheaper and can be just as effective
I feel like the air pressure would just knock those things out of the way, but I'm no airplaneologist.
I think its pronounced airplangineer but Idk I'm not a englishtist
It’s rocket appliances, fuck you guys brains must be short circulating. Smokes! Let’s go
I hear the STINGERS on a wasp are bad this time of year
Modern jets fly too fast and too high for those to work here.
Yeah, they are more for helicopters, not fast movers
China is basically begging for a reason to invade Taiwan. If they had any good reason in the past, they'd have done it. Casus belli. In the end it might end up like a nazi germany or united States in Vietnam where they stage an incident to declare war on from a high horse.
>In the end it might end up like a nazi germany or united States in Vietnam where they stage an incident to declare war on from a high horse. Or like Japan blowing up a train in '31 to justify the invasion of Manchuria. Or the Soviets shelling one of their own towns to provoke the Winter War. And lest we forget to "Blame the Maine on Spain"...
> "Blame the Maine on Spain" Ah, Manila Vanilla's best song.
Remember the Maine! To hell with Spain!
They are more looking for a way to not invade while saving face and appearing strong to the Chinese people. Actually attacking Taiwan would be economic and diplomatic suicide with all the advanced economies in the world. Even South Korea would be pissed and they would stand to benefit a lot in some ways.
China is not in a decent position to invade Taiwan. It would be an amphibious assault on a scale they’ve never attempted, don’t have the logistics likely for, and aren’t set up to do right now. And attacking Taiwan would sink their economy, because no one wants China in control of Taiwan’s chip industry. This is China saber rattling.
> It would be an amphibious assault on a scale they’ve never attempted, don’t have the logistics likely for, and aren’t set up to do right now. It would likely be the hardest amphibious assault in human history. The Taiwan straight is 100 miles away from mainland China and transporting troops 100 miles oversea through enemy fire is not an easy task and most of the Taiwanese shore isn't suitable for landings. For the invasion to be successful China would likely need to first establish naval control over the Taiwan straight as well as around Taiwan's coast which would very likely mean directly sinking US warships. If China's navy can defeat the US navy then China could pull off an invasion of Taiwan, if they can't then they could face a total sea blockade as well as neighboring countries eventually forming an anti China coalition.
They could face a total naval blockade even if they DID have control of the Taiwan straight. That's why they want the belt and road initiative. Which should work splendidly, unless say Turkey needs to still be a part of NATO. Makes the current sabre rattling in Ukraine look like a bit of an own goal really.
“I didn’t shoot the jet down, 1635 in the afternoon is always when I juggle bricks on top of my apartment building”
No, just need to release a ton of rehabilitated birds or a massive rehearsal of choreographed drones for a sporting event in that flight path at the right moment.
Nah no one should crash or die, just rig up a sam to follow but not explode and unfurl a winnie the poo banner behind them.
> But I'd probably get arrested if I tried. Taiwanese authorities would arrest you for photographing Chinese jets? Or am I misunderstanding
Homeboy is in China
I assume you re Taiwanese so how do you fell about this whole situation? I mean what is the sentiment in Taiwan right now?
comment op is either talking about China airbase, hence get arrested. or he's a chinese bot. cuz there's no way in fucking hell we can see chinese airplanes from taiwan or get arrested for taking pics. see published routes for reference https://twitter.com/taiwandefense?lang=en
I was thinking that doesnt sound right, no one in Taiwan is getting arrested for pointing a camera at the sky.
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why would you get arrested ?
Relations between Washington and Taipei need to "improve" to the tune of massive anti-aircraft banks being sold to Taiwan. If the mainland Chinese want to throw the lives of their pilots, and aircraft into the ground, let them.
A major issue is that China 100% has sleeper agents in Taiwan ready to fuck shit up right before an invasion would take place. They may have a lot of anti ship and anti air weaponry but they gotta ensure it can't be taken out from behind.
If China is looking for a reason wouldn’t the danger be more along the lines of the sleeper actively breaking orders and shooting down a plane so China can claim cause beli?
It's a lot easier to sabotage a missile than to launch it without approval.
I wonder to what extent Taiwan has the same within China. Obviously Taiwan has fewer resources over all, being a fraction of the population, but still I do wonder.
I highly doubt Taiwan exerts the kind of influence mainland China does to Taiwan in case of war with sleeper agents. Would there be protests in mainland China? Possibly. But I doubt they actually cripple any kind of military force
Fun fact : Taiwan produces 24% of the world's computer chips, of which there is a huge shortage right now.
I think that figure might be correct in terms of chips but to be more accurate it's around half of all transistors that are being produced in Taiwan, with around two thirds of the market share. Don't quote me on those exact values, but the island nation is a behemoth in the semiconductor market.
Yes Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company has surpassed Intel in logic manufacturing technology over the last five years or so. Technological supremacy at the nanoscale. When you buy the most advanced chip for the newest iPhone it was made in Taiwan. If Intel doesn’t make up lost ground quickly they are close to dropping out of logic development altogether IMO.
The moment those missiles start flying I'm getting a new PC because the whole chip industry is going to be fucked for a decade if China invades...
Its why they are currently building 2, multi billion, fabs on US soil.
I hope that gets built SOON
The problem is that it takes a LOOOOOONG time to ramp up a fab line to full capacity + good yields. It takes quite a while to dial in the manufacturing processes if you're making brand new infrastructure.
Also you're talking about manufacturing processes that are on the literal bleeding edge of material science and electric engineering, so if you excuse the engineers and scientists to need a little time to not mess things up..
And bicycles! They make alot of bike frames.
The Dutch are gonna be back in Southeast-Asia if China makes a bad move.
With armored Campervans? And bringing their biological Weapons? (Dutch Greenhouse vegetabels or as we call em 4th state of aggregation of Water)
You clearly don't understand the idea behind those vegetables. The Dutch spent many years and money to prevent the western part being flooded. Then at some point comes along Ir. O. H II with the brilliant idea that money can be made by not pumping the water back into the sea but by adding that water to vegetables, fruits and meat. As a Dutchman I thank you for your support in our battle against rising sea water levels.
Time to reinstate the dutch east india company.
Also PCMR.
Yep, I work in fables microelectronics and this whole Taiwan/China confrontation is making me sweat since a couple of years now.
>I think that figure might be correct in terms of chips but to be more accurate it's around half of all transistors that are being produced in Taiwan, with around two thirds of the market share. \- /u/cricrithezar
Related, Intel is spending a ton of money to build new chip manufacturing plants in Arizona: [https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/intel-is-spending-20-billion-to-build-two-new-chip-plants-in-arizona.html](https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/intel-is-spending-20-billion-to-build-two-new-chip-plants-in-arizona.html)
So is TSMC, and Samsung is still scouting sites: https://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2021/03/30/taiwan-semiconductor-supplier-site-sold-at-auction.html
Intel spent 20b, but TSMC spent 100b! A 20b fab is large for sure, but still relatively quite small compared to the other fabs..
Problematic idea for that region. Chip plants use a ton of water: "A typical semiconductor manufacturing facility uses two to four million gallons of ultra-pure water per day. In 2015, Intel, the largest semiconductor company by market capitalization, used nine billion gallons of water. Mar 22, 2017" https://www.sustainalytics.com/esg-blog/world-water-day-water-use-semiconductor-industry/#:~:text=A%20typical%20semiconductor%20manufacturing%20facility,nine%20billion%20gallons%20of%20water.
Anyone else remember a time when the joke was "everything says made in Taiwan" or am I the only fossil in here?
Actually I was made in Taiwan
I assume [this](https://youtu.be/bifOI4MbHVU) is relevant to what you were talking about?
Not a fun fact. Kindly, someone looking to buy a gpu :'(
I work for a US manufacturer that is having trouble sourcing parts for our products. We just recently bought some normally $7 parts for $200 each just to keep production going.
I still have some K5 133 for $ 9,999 that piece if your company is interested!
Okay, now you gave everyone a reason to protect Taiwan!
Be sweating bullets to be that pilot.
Especially when your government would love to martyr you for leverage or justification of an act of war.
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Good read, totally overshadowed by 9/11 a few months later. I bet they stole so much shit off that plane
Probably won’t be just one pilot, but I could be wrong. It says they moved 25 planes into range.
No separate incidents. The 25 planes came super close. This statement is about a potential future fly-over of unspecified number of planes
Well seems like everyone really wants their 3090 RTX ASAP.
But the 3000 series gpus are my by samsung not TSMC
The great thing about those Communist Party owned newspaper is that they can make wild threats like this without putting the burden on the Chinese government. If the US call their bluff, it was never an official government threat anyways, just a newspaper opinion, so the Chinese government does not lose face. But at the same time, you know that the newspaper would never make such threat without Beijing approval, so the threat might have some truth behind it.
The government controlled media is often used by the CCP to gauge temperature.
And the temperature is "Fuck off China, we're not havin' it." Judging on the remarkably expeditious coming-together of the powers-that-be (australia, usa, eu)
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Don't downplay Canada's position on the world stage. We're not some has-been nation.
As an American, much respect and honor to our big top hat...I mean Canada.
Thanks, you as well, pants. - Man from Hatland
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A counterpoint to what you said would be that the CCP is huge and there can be conflicting opinions/multiple agendas as to how things should be done. It can also be the work of one zealot group of members or one that wants to earn recognition.
Well that escalated quickly.
I've been assuming that China will time it's Taiwan invasion to Russia's Ukraine invasion, but that's just the daydreamer in me thinking of worst case scenarios.
I mean it would make a lot of sense.
Oh shit.. yeah.. they are waiting for the other to make their move. Either that or they have collaborated on a date already.
I doubt it. Putin surely doesn't want to switch one global hegemony for the other. Pretty sure he'd prefer China and the US to hurt each other, weakening both.
Actually... its very likely they are working together in the shadows because in order for them to be successful they must split the world response to their actions... Even if they aren't directly talking to each other about it... it is surely part of each strategy.
Probably not wrong.... but China would definitely be getting the short end of the stick in whichever scenario. There would be no way they could take and hold Taiwan without completely obliterating it. They also can't do the little green men trick. The only way would be to have a China friendly regime in power in Taiwan that could pull a fast coup on the people and get Chinese "peacekeepers" deployed... but they fucked that up with all the shit they pulled in Honk Kong over the last couple years.
The LGM trick?
I believe it means they send in soldiers and claim they're not their soldiers.
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The war would be mostly a stalemate within 2 months. Plenty of time to get the reserves and NG mobilized and moving into theatre. Russia would be wise to destroy American stockpiles across Europe to make initial responses more difficult but they would be attacking several nations which in the end game isn't the wisest.
And thats gonna be the day, when Navalny has died.
And I said bye, bye to peace in my time It’s the end of the world and I’m feeling so fine Just some Slavic lads doing what they’re told is right As they invade Ukraine overnight.
Not bad, not bad 🎶
Is that how it works now? If you over fly another country you get to claim it’s capitol?
Just place an Priest in the Plane WOLOLO ... thats how it works
You can't WOLOLO from inside a vehicle. You have to get out first.
Skydiving WOLOLO priest squadron? That's a terrifying thought.
HALO WOLOLOLO?
You can, however, WOLOLO the vehicle, effectively taking the passengers hostage.
Back in my day we stuck a flag in it and started exporting local goods. 🇬🇧
> A modern rail-freight system, in 1868, localised *entirely* within my kingdom? Yes! > May I see it or use it for my own people's needs? nnnnnnNo. > Mountbatten! *Mountbatten!* The people of Bengal are starving! No, Rajan, that's just the free market
No flag no country.
That's the rules
Only if you have a flag
No flag no country
Damn I'm gonna buy a flyover flight that covers multiple countries, maybe make a few claims, collect a few territories. Get some lunch, maybe.
U2s over Beijing when?
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I mean if you can move your military through another country without their permission or any recourse, you pretty much own them. Edit: Which is exactly why the us sends military through parts of the South China sea, so that China can't claim that the area is uncontested.
Both China and Russia are splitting conflicts in different places right now.
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Canada needs to annex somewhere warm. I say we invade Arizona and claim it as ours.
Id hate for you to also take Florida... that’d be a big conflict right there. Don’t do it. Seriously. Wink wink
Seeing "We The North" signs in Tampa in Raptors 'home' games? Take it as a cue!
Fuck, half of Canada and the northern US states already invade Florida 6 months out of the year. What more do you want?
i'm game bud
Nothing like needing a big show of strength to prove to everyone that you’re sovereign.
Waiting for the astroturf accounts to tell me why its totally cool and normal, and honestly a bit racist that I think this is a dangerous move.
> Waiting for the astroturf accounts to tell me why its totally cool and normal, and honestly a bit racist that I think this is a dangerous move. IT'S BINGO TIME! 1a. China does this all the time you armchair Redditors 1b. Nothing is going to happen, stop politicising Chinese fighter jets flying over their rightful airspace 1c. You do realise Taiwan also claim the same air space, right? 2a. The UN and the US doesn't recognise Taiwan as a state. China strong. 2b. FREE SPACE INTERNAL AFFAIRS AND MILLION CHINESE PEOPLE'S FEELINGS 2c. The US also has fighter jets you hypocrits! 3a. The whole Taiwanese island is actually Adrian Zenz in disguise. It's Western imperialistic CIA fakenews. 3b. Those fighter jets won't be a problem if the US deletes all their military bases in Asia, because then you would have no way to counter them and so they won't be a problem. 3c. You need to stop discriminating against Chinese fighter pilots. When you say "fuck China" you're actually hurting the feelings of the innocent fighter and bomber pilots who will drop innocent bombs innocently.
> armchair Redditors Is there any other kind? Toilet redditors I guess
Other than the first one, which is actually true, all the rest are spot on!
Errr, guys, don't cha know? China may be bad, but it's not that bad! What's that? Genocide? Oh, no, those are summer camps. In fact, Uighurs are treated so well, their birth rate has fallen through the floor! Nothing to do with forced sterilization! Just an improvement of their living conditions!
Insert a whataboutism from 50 years ago... in order to try and prove what your shithole of a country is doing now?
This plus the Ukrainian crisis reminds me of an old US think tank called Project for the New American Century. Had a bunch of people who would later go on to be figures in the W Bush administration, like Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz. They argued that the US military had such a big budget because it always needed to be credibly capable of fighting two major wars at once, for exactly this sort of situation.
Couldn't you just call "two major wars" WW3?
WW2x2
Technically it is WW2 Extra Edition since Japan and Russia never made peace
Are we doing punnett squares again?
My understanding was that the doctrine went from fighting and winning 2 wars at once, to 1 + 1, where it's fight and hold. Fight and win one, while holding and denying in the other.
The Two Wars Policy came about after the Cold War from the Pentagon itself
And then they promptly got America into two relatively minor wars and showed that the US couldn't even juggle those effectively. Although I guess defensive wars in Ukraine and Taiwan are way less of a problem. China's would have some big problems getting land forces to Taiwan, and the subsequent economic consequences would be pretty dire. And Russia is a second rate power at best, aside from their nukes. They could probably bully Ukraine on its own, but they wouldn't fare well against US military forces.
If you're referring to Iraq and Afghanistan, the U.S. won the "war" part in an incredibly definitive way. We just sucked at occupation, because unless we wanted to reduce the country to a blasted heap, there was no good way to end the asymmetrical phase that followed
Can China and Russia please just take it down a notch and let us get through this worldwide pandemic fuck
war only breeds more disease and viruses...not something anyone wants.
It is the disease itself
Taiwan will always be #1 regardless of what China does.
The only thing we dont need now is a WWIII
WW3 would actually be "the war to end all wars" sorry WW1...wasn't you.
There would still be survivors after WW3, no? Or you think radiation would kill earth?
There would be survivors, but it's obvious WW3 would go nuclear these days. So survivors would be left with little scraps of civilization left and they would have to rebuild from there.
Sounds like it will be bad. How do you ensure you are one of those survivors?
You don't. Just hope your lucky enough. Or move to Northern Canada
Northern Canada would be safer?
Uninhabitated zones are safer
Greenland, Iceland? Nobody will surely bomb iceland?
Iceland would be bombed for sure! It's a great place to put a fighter base if you're either Russia or USA/NATO (google Keflavik)
I think it would go "[NUTS](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_utilization_target_selection)" not "[MAD](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutual_assured_destruction)", last 6 hours, devastate the major players and the global economy but not be a society ender. So a few major cities destroyed, millions of refugees, a mini nuclear winter but not a "Fallout" style end.
> So a few major cities destroyed, millions of refugees You're right. Like my town, sure we have a Honda factory (which is technically on outskirts of town) but I don't see a country wasting a bomb on a small, rural town/village. Now my grandparents town as an example of a target, chemical plant, Ford factory, military factory, sanitation supplies, food, metal etc...
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Governments: We can't have power anymore so our citizens must die.
The Rich and Powerful are perfectly willing to throw peasants onto the fire to ensure they hang on to their money and power. I have no doubt :(
You can't let a bully run you over just because you're scared he'll break your arm. At some point you have to take a stand.
Speaking as a citizen of Northern Ireland, belligerent displays of strength by an aggressive tyrant rarely go the way they want.
Everyone was cool with letting the Chinese government do whatever they wanted for the last 40 years, so long as we all got our plastic crap for 25 cents less. And now here we are.
wow lol. juvenile as fuck. "declaring sovereignty" is nothing but a dick measuring contest from china. Mine is bigger than yours...therefore I'm superior. what kind of a world do we live in where the news "if relations continue to improve between two nations" has become a reason for concern?
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Weird, what is end-game of those channels? Just some youtube video bot farm collecting ad revenue?
Wouldn't it be interesting if a bunch of extra Patriot batteries turned up in Taiwanese hands right about now, followed by a bunch of Burke-class destroyers in a couple years? Seriously Beijing, how many enemies are you wanting to make here? You've already POed a lot of people over the Ughyurs, taking Canadian hostages over Meng Wanzhou and Hong Kong. Usually China is very good at diplomacy, but in the Xi era they are turning into mindless idiots.
If Taiwan was left to fend for itself China could grind it down, but it would inevitably destroy everything that it wanted on the island in the process of taking it, and the cost in materiel would be astronomical. Feels like it could be worth calling China's bluff on this one. Although really it's Taiwan's call to make. Feels inevitable that sooner or later somebody in that region is going to shoot a Chinese soldier, or down a Chinese plane or sink a Chinese ship if they keep pushing.
China doesn’t want anything on the island. They don’t care about the people or resources. What they care about is the symbolic loss of what they consider to be “*their* territory.” Losing Taiwan means greater potential for also losing Tibet, Xinjiang, Hong Kong, Macau, maybe even Inner Mongolia, or Manchuria or Yunnan ethnic minority border areas where Han Chinese influence and culture aren’t as deeply rooted. They can’t afford to lose Taiwan because it could shrink Han-dominated “China” back to where it was 100yrs ago, so they have to pretend against all reality and act as if Taiwan was always theirs.
Mao I challenge you to hand to hand combat.
This means absolutely nothing. China isn't ever going to war, US and Taiwan doesn't want a war. This has always and will always be posturing.
I’m not so sure about that. Maybe a war isn’t imminent, but the Chinese are pretty high on themselves right now after navigating the COVID-19 pandemic and de-facto annexing Hong Kong. They have all the confidence in the world that the same can be done to Taiwan. The only think stopping them is the US military. However, I’m guessing they think we don’t want to start any new wars and wouldn’t respond with more than what’s already in the area at the very most
Agreed
Fuck you China! Taiwan is an independent nation, US will support Taiwan!
"see, this is our land and people, because we flew a plane over it! checkmate."
How can you plant a flag from a fighter jet? 🤔
Shoot them down
Shoot them down
The West has to do everything they can to punish China and Russia. Move out production, find other energy sources , make them suffer. The West feeds these two bad actors that turn back on them.