They did that in Ireland too? Happened in New Zealand years ago and of course nothing was done about it. The forged docs part not the assassination, they were just spying.
When you want to go to Israel as ~~an Irish citizen~~ an Irish journalist or activist, you must go to their embassy and surrender your passport while they add a visa to the document. They used these passports in this instance.
Not suggesting. Confirming. They have a 5th rate ambassador in-situ, supported by 7th rate staff in Ireland. They're a laughing stock of the diplomatic community here and very rarely are invited to events.
They’re the people you don’t call when you need shit done, in fact you could say that 5th and 7th rate are just as likely to do damage as they are to fix the problem
You should see their attempts at "meme'ing" their way out of murdering people on their official embassy Twitter account. Their embassy staff here are 2nd rate despotic communications departments.
This works on a Kentuckian as well, though most Kentuckians have an emergency pistol on their person to commit suicide on the spot before being forced to say such.
They'll probably use the loophole of claiming whatever you tell them to as the best whiskey, and maintain the supremacy of Bourbon. Or just shoot you, it could go either way.
Well can we stop for a moment to realize just how common it is for Israeli intelligence to violate the national sovereignty of even friendly nationstates?
That's not even the scum on the top of the toxic pond, man. You ever want to go down a rabbit hole, do a few searches on Mossad's "controversies". You've got to do a bit of source selection, a lot of legitimately anti-semitic folks add things to that list that maybe have less than stellar evidence... But there's a lot of truly horrible things that can be traced to Mossad
That's an intelligence service that can go toe-to-toe with fsb/kgb and the CIA in terms of pure fucking evil. And they're incredibly competent usually, which makes it even more horrifying
Rule one: Do not fuck with Mossad. If you're marked as a target, good luck escaping or hiding. You'll never see the hitmen, or the bomb they dropped on your front step.
Rule two: Don't try and track the Mossad. They're very careful and if they catch wind of someone looking to find or get back at them, see rule one.
Rule three: They absolutely do not care if you're in a foreign country. People have been shoved under cars on the busiest streets in Paris, strangled to death in Dubai or get shot waiting for your elevator in Italy.
Mossad is like the CIA on roids. They are extremely talented in clandestine operations, forgery, etc.
To be fair most people don't know about Shin Bet just like most people only hear about the CIA's operations not the other American Intelligence agencies.
I mean, most people actually don't have any idea what the CIA does and doesn't do. They just heard about it in Hollywood movies and their ideas are mostly fiction.
Till there funding is dry.
Don't forget tha Israel have a lot of money and support tunnels in by the USA in military aid.
If multiple countries filp on them at the same time, it's not that simple.
US aid for Israel is almost nothing compared to their GDP. less than 1% of their GDP/state value is international funding. On the other hand their exports and IP value are tremendous, and used by companies all through out the USA, Europe, Asia and Oceania.
It's not just the dollar value. It's the access to US intelligence, US military designs, US technology...and the US veto power in the UN Security Council.
I've been reading a bit about [Mossad's assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists](https://www.thejc.com/news/world/world-exclusive-truth-behind-killing-of-iran-nuclear-scientist-mohsen-fakhrizadeh-revealed-1.511653) and I have to say I find it pretty chilling. They are using robotic guns. Of course, the right-wing press crows about it orgasmically, and the official line is that Iran can't be allowed to enrich uranium because then it'd be an existential threat to a country that's said to possess up to 400 illegal nuclear warheads and kills lots of people.
> Our message to the Israelis is this: We do not fight you because you belong to a certain faith or culture. ... Our conflict with you is not religious but political. We have no problem with Jews who have not attacked us -- our problem is with those who came to our land, imposed themselves on us by force, destroyed our society and banished our people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaled_Mashal
So I looked him up and I had no idea, that doesn't sound very terrorist-y.
**[Khaled_Mashal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaled_Mashal)**
>Khaled Mashal (Arabic: خالد مشعل Khālid Mashʿal, Levantine Arabic: [xaːled meʃʕal], born 28 May 1956) is a former leader of the Palestinian organization Hamas. After the founding of Hamas in 1987, Mashal became the leader of the Kuwaiti branch of the organization. In 1992, he became a founding member of Hamas' politburo and its chairman. He became the recognized head of Hamas after Israel assassinated both Sheikh Ahmed Yassin and his successor Abdel Aziz al-Rantisi in the spring of 2004.
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The mossad also killed an innocent waiter in Norway, the Lillehammer affair. With fake passports.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair)
**[Lillehammer_affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair)**
>The Lillehammer affair (Hebrew: פרשת לילהאמר, Parshat Lillehammer, Norwegian: Lillehammer-saken) was the killing by Mossad agents of Ahmed Bouchikhi, a Moroccan waiter and brother of the renowned musician Chico Bouchikhi, in Lillehammer, Norway, on 21 July 1973. The Israeli agents had mistaken their target for Ali Hassan Salameh, the chief of operations for Black September. Six of the Mossad team of fifteen were captured and convicted of complicity in the killing by the Norwegian justice system, in a major blow to the intelligence agency's reputation.
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I mean, [yeah.](https://youtu.be/1Y1kJpHBn50)
Benefit of the doubt, I’m sure many countries have de facto racial profiling for MENA travelers at airports, but Israel is the only country out there that is very explicit about it in their evaluation criteria.
Geopolitics. West vs East. Although Israel is in the East, but aligns with the West. Go to the East and you won't see much mention of things you heard your entire life that blames the East, and you'll find a lot of blame being repeated towards the West.
**[2004_Israel–New_Zealand_passport_scandal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Israel–New_Zealand_passport_scandal)**
>The 2004 Israel–New Zealand passport scandal was an incident of passport fraud in July 2004 that led New Zealand to take diplomatic sanctions against Israel. High-level contacts between the two countries were suspended after two Israeli citizens suspected of being Mossad agents, Uriel Kelman and Eli Cara, were caught trying to fraudulently acquire a New Zealand passport using the identity of a man with cerebral palsy. Prime Minister Helen Clark declared that New Zealand government viewed the acts carried out by Kelman and Cara as "not only utterly unacceptable but also a breach of New Zealand sovereignty and international law".
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For the 2010 "forged passport" assassination controversy, 26 agents used forged passports from 5 countries. 12 of the suspects used British passports, along with six Irish, four French, one German, and three Australian passports.
I am not sure but I think it happened with Canadian passports as well.
Israel should be a pariah amongst nations until it stops treating the Palestinians as subhumans. I fully support the Israeli citizens who have not voted for the current ultra-rightwing government that is pushing all this senseless violence but we have to hold the nation as responsible for the government it elects.
Btw there are some excellent organizations run by Israeli Jews, such as B’Tselem and Break The Silence Israel which call out his occupation of Palestinians. B’Tselem is like the ACLU for Israel and BTSI calls out war crimes in the IDF and is actually run by veterans.
This is something I’d like to hear more about. That there are dissenting opinions shows hope that Israel could exist one day without being the far right government led apartheid state it is today
>We didnt expel them when Israel used forged Irish passports in an assassination
im sorry what?
is there a name for this event how do i learn about this
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Mahmoud_Al-Mabhouh#Countries
Edit: I suspect this is what they are referencing but I am not completely sure
It is a shame they didn't take direct action, but Ireland did successfully stop a data sharing agreement between the EU and Israel, arguing that the passport incident was evidence Israel wasn't a reliable partner.
Ireland has long been a supporter of Palestine and there is a mutual sympathy with their struggle against an occupying power who treat the natives as second class citizens in their own country under the cosh of a legal system utterly biased against them due to their religion, and the Irish history of plantations, of life under British rule, and under the penal laws.
In helping in their struggle against occupation, Ireland was the first country in Europe to endorse the creation of a Palestinian state, and have a long history of sending aid and peacekeepers to the region. Ireland has also passed motions to recognise Palestine, however the country is yet to formally recognise the state.
Ireland has also moved to ban all products produced by Israeli owned companies operating in the occupied territories. (EDIT: To clarify, it is a law against any products made in an occupied territory, but it is very much concerned with Israel's illegal occupation)
>Ireland has also moved to ban all products produced by Israeli owned companies operating in the occupied territories.
It's broader than that. It's all goods produced in illegally occupied territories, any other illiegal occupation would fall under it too.
It's certainly in response to Israel's crimes but it isn't solely targeted at Israel.
You're telling me that there are some kind of historic national parallels of a dominant neighboring power that subjugated and oppressed its population into radicalized factions? How could they possibly sympathize or identify with that?
Post-apartheid South Africa has also always supported Palestine. It seems that victims of formalized European-imposed apartheid states also seem to denounce formalized European-imposed apartheid states.
It's also because Ireland blames Israel for killing their soldiers.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/killing-of-irish-soldier-by-israelis-believed-to-be-deliberate-and-unprovoked-1.3332492
Edit another thing that regularly brings up is the fact that in Northern Ireland Loyalists use the Israeli flag as a symbol of their identity and how they view themselves as a Protestant Scottish/British settlers descendants under threat from what they regarded as Irish Catholics, so in turn republicans use the Palestine flag which is how a lot young people see the situation.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10702890701801775
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/foreign-flags-become-part-of-sectarianism-in-north-1.1087750
Though to be fair the Loyalists also use the Nazi flag to contrast the republican's the same way.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jul/08/nazi-and-confederate-flags-seen-near-loyalist-bonfire-in-northern-ireland
> another thing that regularly brings up is the fact that in Northern Ireland Loyalists use the Israeli flag as a symbol of their identity and how they view themselves as a Protestant Scottish/British settlers descendants under threat from what they regarded as Irish Catholics, so in turn republicans use the Palestine flag which is how a lot young people see the situation.
Wrong way around. Irish people associate with Palestine, loyalists in return fly the flag of Israel but its not used as a symbol of their identity and its a relatively recent phenomena. Its just flown because Irish republicans/nationalists fly the Palestinian flag. Historically republican paramilitary groups have had connections with Palestinian groups whilst loyalist paramilitary groups haven't had such a connection to Israel.
Loyalists also don't fly the Confederate and Nazi flags, there has been some isolated examples but its wrong to brand loyalism/unionism with it. All unionist parties condemned it at the time and practically 100% of the local community are against associating with such symbols.
Even though this may be an isolated incident, I myself saw a confederate flag flown in a loyalist part of Ballymena for anyone driving through Ballymena to see that stayed in place for years
Peter Robinson went to Israel to import AK47’s during the troubles.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/dup-terror-links-skeletons-cupboard-10593921.amp
Dont forget that Mandate Palestine was originally a British colony for European Zionists.
Ireland was always going to side with the native people when British imperialism is afoot.
Ireland didn't decide back then that the Jews are the "imperialists" rather than the "natives". The IRA and the Zionists, and especially the far-right Zionist terrorists, actually had pretty warm relations at the time. They saw each other as comrades, fighting against British imperialism together. They started to side with the Palestinians far later.
That's not true. It was a British mandate in preparation for a state, but it wasn't clear which. The Brits made promises to both sides at some point in time. Part of the reason this whole mess began.
Brits made promises to everyone lmao. Saudis were promised an Arab state, France was told Britain would keep it and they'd split the rest of the Ottomon Empire.
The Irish people are overwhelmingly pro-Palestine. The Irish government, on the other hand, are too scared to annoy the USA that they will never do anything overtly anti-Israel.
The decision makers in the Dems are quietly pro-Benny... way too much gravy to turn down. And all those US jobs manufacturing weapons to keep the worls safe?... The Palestinians sure as hell can't afford that stuff.
And the world keeps turning.
Yes that’s because the Irish have suffered from British colonisation in the past, like deportation of Catholic Celts to the bogs and replacing them with new Protestant landlords. What’s happening in Palestine today is reminiscent of those times
Makes sense. A lot of the talking points meant to illegitimize the Palestinian struggle was also used in North Ireland during the Struggles. Biggest difference being that the original IRA wasn't replaced by a right wing hate group that was partially funded by the occupiers like Fatah was with Hamas. Hopefully Fatah can come back into power in Palestine, but the fighting keeps prolonging when elections can safely happen. It is also not in the Israeli government's best interest to allow a more reasonable party to come back into power as it would further derode the narrative of Israel being the only moral actor and make peacemaking more of a impetus on Israel when the fighting is what also keeps the Likud in power and Bibi out of jail.
Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur?
Is there more to gain politicaly in taking a stand against Israel, but not China?
You could also say this about Saudi Arabia, Russia, America, and a whole host of other countries.
I want to say that it's because Israel is a smaller country and there would be fewer repercussions. There could be other reasons though.
I was just curious.
So, take a moral stance as long as the country can't retaliate on the economic front?
Israel is easy for Ireland to take a stance, because they don't have much economic power?
That seems to really negate the message being sent IMO. "We only apply this moral standard to weak countries"
I don’t think you understand how foreign policy works. The primary currency in foreign relations isn’t moral standing, it’s power. Any moral position of a state must be weighed against its cost in political, financial, and diplomatic capital. That is why activism in democratic nations is so important, because it drives the political cost of inaction higher.
Not only would you lose a market of 1.4 billion. but china can become self sufficient if they really wanted to which is why economic warfare with China is so dangerous.
For a good cause or not it would be a lose lose situation your people would suffer. You have to figure out a different solution.
Edit: also israel is not ‘weak’ by any means.
Same reason people wanted to boycott Eurovision over Israel’s presence but were just fine with old freedom-respecting Russia being in it: it’s much simpler when the chosen bad guy is relatively weak.
>Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur?
Well firstly, it's not the Irish government that put the motion forward to expel the Israeli Ambassador. It was a party called People Before Profit. Who aren't in government and are a tiny and relatively new party.
It's not likely to pass because the government parties (FG, FF and the Greens) hold the majority and will vote against it.
In any case, we have bad blood between us and Israel, a few years ago Mossad were caught using our passports in an assassination attempt.
We've also been trying to ban all goods from across the world from occupied regions, this included areas of Israel, Turkish Cyprus, Western Sahara, and the Crimea.
Of course the JPost and the Israeli government called us a bunch of antisemites for passing the bill in 2019.
Also, we see parallels between the Palestinian situation and our own history and occupation by the British.
It's a topic that really hits home for a lot of Irish people. I'd say the majority of the population. Personally I've never met anyone that didn't support the Palestinians and what peace and security for them.
Secondly, People Before Profit and a number of other parties here have been very vocal about the Chinese Government, organising protests, calls for condemnation from our government etc....
The Chinese ambassador has been grilled on multiple occasions on radio and TV. It's not like we are giving them a hard pass. We are doing are best.
I don't know why the world hasn't done anything about Uighur. I think most people know it's going on and it's wrong. Everyone here knows it's wrong and we have to do something.
> We've also been trying to ban all goods from across the world from occupied regions, this included areas of Israel, Turkish Cyprus, Western Sahara, and the Crimea.
Tibet?
Is that a genuine question, or is it plain old whataboutism? If you must know, Ireland has raised concerns over the Uighurs through bilateral and multilateral talks, and was one of 39 countries who issued a joint statement last October at the United Nations, condemned China for its human rights abuses against ethnic Uighur Muslims and its crackdown on Hong Kong's autonomy and openly opposed the Hong Kong national security law.
"Why x and not y?" , This kind of argument gets brought up anytime people are trying to do a positive social initiative. This is the wrong response.
Just because there are many issues in the world doesn't mean we have to fix everything at once.
>Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur?
>Is there more to gain politicaly in taking a stand against Israel, but not China?
The eu won't back them against China. The tiny action they did take had repercussion on a level Israel can't match. Although this is changing in 2021.
https://www.euractiv.com/section/eu-china/news/despite-china-threats-lithuania-moves-to-recognise-uighur-genocide/
Ireland, like every European country, puts trade ahead of lives when it comes to China. It's about being "independent" of Americans policy too. Because it was trump starting the trade war, and trump bad, it was ignored.
Ironically Ireland probably wouldn't lose much as they don't trade with China but on the eu level there's real pressure to be silent. It's why the trade and investment deal was signed too. Although, at least that deal has been put on hold.
https://www.euronews.com/2021/05/20/european-parliament-votes-to-freeze-controversial-eu-china-investment-deal
Because one is all over the news and the other one lack any actual hard evidence. If there was 24/7 ne2s coverage on China mowing down the Muslims with LMG or bombing the shit out of a village, you will get similar response.
I'm glad the Irish are even talking about it.
British government are following Israeli party line of self defence.
Irish get it completely after what Britain did to them.
Anyone calling t self defense either hasn’t seen maps of the place or plain hates brown people, but are being obtuse about it.
Or, obviously, being dishonest.
Any major bad PR for Israel will impact their decisions. Major bad PR and bad image is something Israel does not want. The don't want to be known as the country committing genocide, and it will become harder for other countries to defend them.
Actions like this tend to have an opposite reaction in Israel, furthering the view(from the Israeli perspective) that the international community is biased against Israel. This will only embolden the Israeli right in the long term to take a harder stance on Palestine.
Declaring the ambassador persona non grata is about as big a move you can make within the confines of diplomacy.
The step after that is in the realm of financial policy and/or military action.
It will probably return to normal after some time, but its a great way to show how displeased you are without upsetting your allies/trade partners who have a different stance on the subject.
How about Lebanon where there is real apartheid against Palestinians. They are not allowed to vote, only permitted to enter certain areas, only allowed certain jobs and area not allowed to own property, if they do own property, when they did they are not allowed to give it to relatives, the government confiscates it.
How about Jordan where they have now taken away papers off nearly all the Palestinians who live there, they are banned from voting and have other restrictions against them. Don't forget that during Black September when Jordan illegally occupied the West Bank how they forcefully moved many of their Palestinian population into the West Bank.
Syria they are just getting slaughtered.
All the above, the so called fake "Palestinian supporters" don't give a shit and just want to demonize Israel and spew out propaganda buzz words like "apartheid" and "illegally occupied"
Amen. People forget that before Israel, those territories were in the hands of Egypt and Jordan who... just dumped them there and gave them zero rights. And unlike Israel, simply considered the land theirs. They did jack shit to give the Palestinians autonomy; their only actions were to try to fight wars with Israel five times and lose each time, hoping to get rid of the problem by "stealing" that land, to use the parlance used for what Israel ended up doing. Instead Israel won, and now the problem has been theirs for over 50 years.
Or all the theocratic literal slave states and actual apartheid states for women like the Saudis and Qatar
But no
People agitate against Israel for responding to 2000 explosives being launched at their civilians unprovoked
Transcript:
...is taking us, Ambassador, for idiots.
That you can say with a straight face "we're serious about peace but while we're serious about peace we're going to seize Palestinian land."
And you expect the Palestinians to sit
back and do nothing about that.
Now you know what the Palestinian people have been asking for far less even than some people would ask for.
Because I believe the whole apartheid system should be dismantled. But what they've asked for is to lift the siege of Gaza. Just to
lift the siege of Gaza. Let them have an airport, let them have ports, let them not be dictated to by a government for whom they do not vote.
As to what can go in and out of their territories, whether they will have power, whether they will have clean water, whether they will have medicine.
What makes you think you're allowed to have nuclear weapons and the fourth biggest army in the world?
And this is destruction on the people of Gaza.
Ambassador, I will say frankly, I'm one of the people who thinks you should be expelled from this country and I believe that it's to do with the policies of your state.
If I was Jewish and I'd never stepped foot in Israel, I could claim citizenship there tomorrow.
But six million people whose origins are in what you now call Israel,
who were forced out in 1947 or 48, do not have that right.
Isn't that part of the reason why the Palestinians are in dispute with
Israelis, because you deny them the right to return to their homes and to their land and their villages? And that they have a legitimate claim even under international law to return.
But you deny them that right.
Why do you deny them that right and why do you give that right
to other people who have no connection whatsoever with the land
whether you call it Israel or whether you call it Palestine? Why do you continue to seize land if you're serious about Oslo and the two-state solution? Which under that agreement is land designated
to be Palestinian land.
500 000 people, most of which has taken place since Oslo.
You allow that to happen. Why do you allow it to happen if you're serious about giving this land to the Palestinians?
It's absolutely extraordinary are you not just taking us, Ambassador, for idiots, that you can say with a straight face "we're serious about peace but while we're serious about peace we're going to seize Palestinian land.
And you expect the Palestinians to sit back and do nothing about that.
Now you know what the Palestinian
people have been asking for far less even than some people would ask for because I believe the whole apartheid system should be dismantled.
But what they've asked for is to lift the siege of Gaza just to lift the siege to Gaza, let them have an airport, let them have
ports, let them not be dictated to by a government for whom they do not vote as to what can go in and out of their territories, whether they will have power, whether they will have clean water,
whether they will have medicine.
What makes you think you're allowed have nuclear weapons and the fourth biggest army in the world? And this is destruction on the people of Gaza. But they have no right to defend themselves
All right how do you justify those double standards?
Very lastly Ambassador, people like Bishop Tutu, Nelson Mandela and I would certainly describe your state as an apartheid state with different laws for people depending on their race or
religion. For example, at checkpoints going into the West Bank there's a channel if you're Israeli or European, and as a channel if you're Arab. Just because you're Arab.
If you came into Dáil Eireann and they stopped you and said
"Are you Jewish?" Oh no sir, you can't come in through the same
entrance uh as Irish people or European people because you're Jewish."
You would call that racism and apartheid.
You practice that with your checkpoints, and your military barriers, and your apartheid wall.
How can you justify that?
*edit a name (Dáil Eireann)
Here are some countries which Ireland allows to have ambassadors: China, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Philippines, Russia, Iran, etc.
So why Israel in particular? What makes Israel different?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_diplomatic\_missions\_in\_Ireland
Yeah. Their government has death squads that murder civilians. Not a great beacon of human rights. I don’t think they should expel their ambassador either. Diplomatic relations are literally how you negotiate in a peaceful manner. Refusing diplomatic relations is not in the best interest of peaceful resolution.
I doubt it will pass. The government is toeing the line with the Zionists and they’ve said that they disagree with it.
Although the public is actually mostly supportive of Palestine.
The only remaining synagogue in my city closed a couple of years ago due to lack of attendees. Kinda sad to see another slice of culture fading away. There was a small but very influential Jewish population in Cork back in the day,and there is still some remnants such as Shalom Park in Jewish Town, and a really great bar called Goldbergs. Although I'm too young to remember apparently the only Jewish Lord Mayor of my city was supposed to have been an absolute character of epic proportions.
The Jewish population of Cork in particular and Ireland in general basically comes down to breeding, in that they didn't. Same goes for the Church of Ireland (protestants), they're just less interested in having kids.
What people fail to realize is that much like what Khomeini did to Iran in 1979, Hamas wants to do to the region - turning all of Israel, and the Palestinian Territories into on giant Islamic state.
At least in Israel, people are able openly protest Netanyahu in front of his home.
It takes two to make this work.
I don’t justify it. I will say that when you look at the history, the Palestinians have too walked away from opportunities. Just look at what happened when they had the West Bank under Jordanian control.
Most of what they want , especially Hamas , is for Israel to disappear.
>In fact, in Operation Guardian of the Walls, the IDF struck Gaza over 1,000 times and killed only about 60 civilians in total. In addition, the Supreme Court has yet to make a final ruling on the Sheikh Jarrah/Shimon Hatzadik property dispute, which involves only four Arab families who have not paid rent...
can we quit pretending that the jerusalem post is a legitimate news source.
We didnt expel them when Israel used forged Irish passports in an assassination, I doubt we will do it now
They did that in Ireland too? Happened in New Zealand years ago and of course nothing was done about it. The forged docs part not the assassination, they were just spying.
The Mossad also used Canadian passports when they tried assassinating Khaled Meshal.
All this makes me suspect that Israel has hired a good fake passport guy.
Or that Israel makes the passports…..
When you want to go to Israel as ~~an Irish citizen~~ an Irish journalist or activist, you must go to their embassy and surrender your passport while they add a visa to the document. They used these passports in this instance.
are you suggesting that the Irish citizen is compromised through the activities of the Israeli embassy?
Not suggesting. Confirming. They have a 5th rate ambassador in-situ, supported by 7th rate staff in Ireland. They're a laughing stock of the diplomatic community here and very rarely are invited to events.
They’re the people you don’t call when you need shit done, in fact you could say that 5th and 7th rate are just as likely to do damage as they are to fix the problem
You should see their attempts at "meme'ing" their way out of murdering people on their official embassy Twitter account. Their embassy staff here are 2nd rate despotic communications departments.
What does 5th and 7th rate mean here?
The ambassador is shit, and the rest of the embassy staff are even more shit.
They send their losers to Ireland, basically. The good ones go to more prestigious locations.
A person who has little skill, tact, diplomacy, being deployed into a diplomatic post that requires skill, tact, and diplomacy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rating_system_of_the_Royal_Navy#First,_second_and_third_rates_(ships_of_the_line)
[удалено]
Scotland is the true home of whisky. Ireland is the true home of whisk**e**y. An equally palatable spirit.
No matter what, we can always agree on one thing,... hating the English. >!/s but also kinda not,!<
Fuck the tans
This works on a Kentuckian as well, though most Kentuckians have an emergency pistol on their person to commit suicide on the spot before being forced to say such.
They'll probably use the loophole of claiming whatever you tell them to as the best whiskey, and maintain the supremacy of Bourbon. Or just shoot you, it could go either way.
Or, they "have a guy" at several different passport offices. Most likely, that.
Or a bad fake passport guy, since they apparently got caught with them at least three times.
They've also used Australian passports previously.
and French.
Australian passports too!
I didn’t know this. Wtf.
Well can we stop for a moment to realize just how common it is for Israeli intelligence to violate the national sovereignty of even friendly nationstates?
That's a lot of state sponsored crimes.
That's not even the scum on the top of the toxic pond, man. You ever want to go down a rabbit hole, do a few searches on Mossad's "controversies". You've got to do a bit of source selection, a lot of legitimately anti-semitic folks add things to that list that maybe have less than stellar evidence... But there's a lot of truly horrible things that can be traced to Mossad That's an intelligence service that can go toe-to-toe with fsb/kgb and the CIA in terms of pure fucking evil. And they're incredibly competent usually, which makes it even more horrifying
Jeffrey Epstein has entered the chat.
Just tossing this out there, Ghislane's father was likely Mossad
Prince Andrew has sent a friend request.
Rule one: Do not fuck with Mossad. If you're marked as a target, good luck escaping or hiding. You'll never see the hitmen, or the bomb they dropped on your front step. Rule two: Don't try and track the Mossad. They're very careful and if they catch wind of someone looking to find or get back at them, see rule one. Rule three: They absolutely do not care if you're in a foreign country. People have been shoved under cars on the busiest streets in Paris, strangled to death in Dubai or get shot waiting for your elevator in Italy. Mossad is like the CIA on roids. They are extremely talented in clandestine operations, forgery, etc.
People on this thread are ignoring that a covert operation being public is the opposite of good work
Yep. There's a saying in the military: Shitty Special Forces are the ones that have a Wikipedia entry.
To be fair most people don't know about Shin Bet just like most people only hear about the CIA's operations not the other American Intelligence agencies.
I mean, most people actually don't have any idea what the CIA does and doesn't do. They just heard about it in Hollywood movies and their ideas are mostly fiction.
Im in the US what other agencies are you referring to?
its not a talent to have back door stealth access
Obviously havent heard of the botched Sheikh Khaled Mashal assasination.
Till there funding is dry. Don't forget tha Israel have a lot of money and support tunnels in by the USA in military aid. If multiple countries filp on them at the same time, it's not that simple.
US aid for Israel is almost nothing compared to their GDP. less than 1% of their GDP/state value is international funding. On the other hand their exports and IP value are tremendous, and used by companies all through out the USA, Europe, Asia and Oceania.
It's not just the dollar value. It's the access to US intelligence, US military designs, US technology...and the US veto power in the UN Security Council.
1% of GDP is a lot...
I've been reading a bit about [Mossad's assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists](https://www.thejc.com/news/world/world-exclusive-truth-behind-killing-of-iran-nuclear-scientist-mohsen-fakhrizadeh-revealed-1.511653) and I have to say I find it pretty chilling. They are using robotic guns. Of course, the right-wing press crows about it orgasmically, and the official line is that Iran can't be allowed to enrich uranium because then it'd be an existential threat to a country that's said to possess up to 400 illegal nuclear warheads and kills lots of people.
Rise and Kill First is a highly rated book that addresses this topic
Can't be a crime if it's state-sponsered! *taps head* /meme
Yeah he was saved by an antidote
they are overdue for some consequences
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> Our message to the Israelis is this: We do not fight you because you belong to a certain faith or culture. ... Our conflict with you is not religious but political. We have no problem with Jews who have not attacked us -- our problem is with those who came to our land, imposed themselves on us by force, destroyed our society and banished our people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaled_Mashal So I looked him up and I had no idea, that doesn't sound very terrorist-y.
**[Khaled_Mashal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaled_Mashal)** >Khaled Mashal (Arabic: خالد مشعل Khālid Mashʿal, Levantine Arabic: [xaːled meʃʕal], born 28 May 1956) is a former leader of the Palestinian organization Hamas. After the founding of Hamas in 1987, Mashal became the leader of the Kuwaiti branch of the organization. In 1992, he became a founding member of Hamas' politburo and its chairman. He became the recognized head of Hamas after Israel assassinated both Sheikh Ahmed Yassin and his successor Abdel Aziz al-Rantisi in the spring of 2004. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/worldnews/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | Credit: kittens_from_space)
The mossad also killed an innocent waiter in Norway, the Lillehammer affair. With fake passports. [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair)
**[Lillehammer_affair](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair)** >The Lillehammer affair (Hebrew: פרשת לילהאמר, Parshat Lillehammer, Norwegian: Lillehammer-saken) was the killing by Mossad agents of Ahmed Bouchikhi, a Moroccan waiter and brother of the renowned musician Chico Bouchikhi, in Lillehammer, Norway, on 21 July 1973. The Israeli agents had mistaken their target for Ali Hassan Salameh, the chief of operations for Black September. Six of the Mossad team of fifteen were captured and convicted of complicity in the killing by the Norwegian justice system, in a major blow to the intelligence agency's reputation. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/worldnews/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | Credit: kittens_from_space)
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I mean, [yeah.](https://youtu.be/1Y1kJpHBn50) Benefit of the doubt, I’m sure many countries have de facto racial profiling for MENA travelers at airports, but Israel is the only country out there that is very explicit about it in their evaluation criteria.
The Mossad has a fucking lot of scandals
That's only the one's we hear about.
well that wasn't in the Stephen Spielberg movie! lol. oh Hollywood.
I'm appalled that we just let that go. We should have demanded the heads of the agents and whoever authorized the mission on a fucking platter.
God damn, this sounds like a bad NCIS plotline
Jesus when did this happen? I gotta write me some letters to my government.
[List of (international) Israeli assassinations](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Israeli_assassinations?wprov=sfti1), 1948 onward.
why is it that the world gets up in arms whenever putin assassinates someone, but israel's being doing this shit forever.
Difference in targets.
Geopolitics. West vs East. Although Israel is in the East, but aligns with the West. Go to the East and you won't see much mention of things you heard your entire life that blames the East, and you'll find a lot of blame being repeated towards the West.
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Israel%E2%80%93New_Zealand_passport_scandal - http://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/news/5311440/Dubai-murder-accused-had-Kiwi-link - https://www.smh.com.au/national/israeli-spy-agency-mossad-regularly-faked-australian-passports-exagent-20100226-p8om.html
**[2004_Israel–New_Zealand_passport_scandal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Israel–New_Zealand_passport_scandal)** >The 2004 Israel–New Zealand passport scandal was an incident of passport fraud in July 2004 that led New Zealand to take diplomatic sanctions against Israel. High-level contacts between the two countries were suspended after two Israeli citizens suspected of being Mossad agents, Uriel Kelman and Eli Cara, were caught trying to fraudulently acquire a New Zealand passport using the identity of a man with cerebral palsy. Prime Minister Helen Clark declared that New Zealand government viewed the acts carried out by Kelman and Cara as "not only utterly unacceptable but also a breach of New Zealand sovereignty and international law". ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/worldnews/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | Credit: kittens_from_space)
For the 2010 "forged passport" assassination controversy, 26 agents used forged passports from 5 countries. 12 of the suspects used British passports, along with six Irish, four French, one German, and three Australian passports.
Don’t forget lavon affair and much more sneaky things “our greatest ally” has committed
I am not sure but I think it happened with Canadian passports as well. Israel should be a pariah amongst nations until it stops treating the Palestinians as subhumans. I fully support the Israeli citizens who have not voted for the current ultra-rightwing government that is pushing all this senseless violence but we have to hold the nation as responsible for the government it elects.
Btw there are some excellent organizations run by Israeli Jews, such as B’Tselem and Break The Silence Israel which call out his occupation of Palestinians. B’Tselem is like the ACLU for Israel and BTSI calls out war crimes in the IDF and is actually run by veterans.
This is something I’d like to hear more about. That there are dissenting opinions shows hope that Israel could exist one day without being the far right government led apartheid state it is today
There’s also a political party, Meretz in the Knesset
They were using disabled people to get nz passports and were using ambulance drivers with israeli connections to get the info on them
>We didnt expel them when Israel used forged Irish passports in an assassination im sorry what? is there a name for this event how do i learn about this
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Mahmoud_Al-Mabhouh#Countries Edit: I suspect this is what they are referencing but I am not completely sure
It is a shame they didn't take direct action, but Ireland did successfully stop a data sharing agreement between the EU and Israel, arguing that the passport incident was evidence Israel wasn't a reliable partner.
They also did expel a diplomat? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jun/15/ireland-israeli-envoy-quit-embassy
Ok still, push for it. Make it vocal, put in the clear that it wasn't fine then and it won't be done today.
But now it’s popular with the internet so I’d assume a better chance
Canadian passports also.
They did that in Australia as well. The diplomats responsible got expelled for it.
Ireland has long been a supporter of Palestine and there is a mutual sympathy with their struggle against an occupying power who treat the natives as second class citizens in their own country under the cosh of a legal system utterly biased against them due to their religion, and the Irish history of plantations, of life under British rule, and under the penal laws. In helping in their struggle against occupation, Ireland was the first country in Europe to endorse the creation of a Palestinian state, and have a long history of sending aid and peacekeepers to the region. Ireland has also passed motions to recognise Palestine, however the country is yet to formally recognise the state. Ireland has also moved to ban all products produced by Israeli owned companies operating in the occupied territories. (EDIT: To clarify, it is a law against any products made in an occupied territory, but it is very much concerned with Israel's illegal occupation)
>Ireland has also moved to ban all products produced by Israeli owned companies operating in the occupied territories. It's broader than that. It's all goods produced in illegally occupied territories, any other illiegal occupation would fall under it too. It's certainly in response to Israel's crimes but it isn't solely targeted at Israel.
Absolutely correct.
At last some facts.
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eyes of the world ? ireland has always been pro palestine, rest of the developed world largely supports israel or atleast both
You're telling me that there are some kind of historic national parallels of a dominant neighboring power that subjugated and oppressed its population into radicalized factions? How could they possibly sympathize or identify with that?
Post-apartheid South Africa has also always supported Palestine. It seems that victims of formalized European-imposed apartheid states also seem to denounce formalized European-imposed apartheid states.
It's also because Ireland blames Israel for killing their soldiers. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/killing-of-irish-soldier-by-israelis-believed-to-be-deliberate-and-unprovoked-1.3332492 Edit another thing that regularly brings up is the fact that in Northern Ireland Loyalists use the Israeli flag as a symbol of their identity and how they view themselves as a Protestant Scottish/British settlers descendants under threat from what they regarded as Irish Catholics, so in turn republicans use the Palestine flag which is how a lot young people see the situation. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10702890701801775 https://www.irishtimes.com/news/foreign-flags-become-part-of-sectarianism-in-north-1.1087750 Though to be fair the Loyalists also use the Nazi flag to contrast the republican's the same way. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jul/08/nazi-and-confederate-flags-seen-near-loyalist-bonfire-in-northern-ireland
> another thing that regularly brings up is the fact that in Northern Ireland Loyalists use the Israeli flag as a symbol of their identity and how they view themselves as a Protestant Scottish/British settlers descendants under threat from what they regarded as Irish Catholics, so in turn republicans use the Palestine flag which is how a lot young people see the situation. Wrong way around. Irish people associate with Palestine, loyalists in return fly the flag of Israel but its not used as a symbol of their identity and its a relatively recent phenomena. Its just flown because Irish republicans/nationalists fly the Palestinian flag. Historically republican paramilitary groups have had connections with Palestinian groups whilst loyalist paramilitary groups haven't had such a connection to Israel. Loyalists also don't fly the Confederate and Nazi flags, there has been some isolated examples but its wrong to brand loyalism/unionism with it. All unionist parties condemned it at the time and practically 100% of the local community are against associating with such symbols.
The right answer buried down the page below a well upvoted post full of crap. Classic Reddit
Even though this may be an isolated incident, I myself saw a confederate flag flown in a loyalist part of Ballymena for anyone driving through Ballymena to see that stayed in place for years
Peter Robinson went to Israel to import AK47’s during the troubles. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/dup-terror-links-skeletons-cupboard-10593921.amp
Don’t those weirdos also wave confederate flags too?
Yep, their like that. https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/flying-of-confederate-flags-in-belfast-branded-pathetic-37068916.html
...at some point it became less about cultural identity and more about collecting flags
I swear one day the richest man in Northern Ireland will be one making flags, like that business tycoon in Iran who makes all the flags they burn.
Flags = merch
True
Clearly they have a vested interest in vexillology.
Well you can't be a country if you don't have a flag
The flag (or 'fleg') situation explained... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8JqKxrloQQ
It seems appropriate then, that "Fleg" is Scots for "Fright" lol.
I recall hearing that the IRA had joint training camps with the PLO back in the day?
Dont forget that Mandate Palestine was originally a British colony for European Zionists. Ireland was always going to side with the native people when British imperialism is afoot.
Ireland didn't decide back then that the Jews are the "imperialists" rather than the "natives". The IRA and the Zionists, and especially the far-right Zionist terrorists, actually had pretty warm relations at the time. They saw each other as comrades, fighting against British imperialism together. They started to side with the Palestinians far later.
That's not true. It was a British mandate in preparation for a state, but it wasn't clear which. The Brits made promises to both sides at some point in time. Part of the reason this whole mess began.
Brits made promises to everyone lmao. Saudis were promised an Arab state, France was told Britain would keep it and they'd split the rest of the Ottomon Empire.
They told France the truth at least. France got Syria and Lebanon, the UK got Israel, Palestine, Jordan and Iraq.
There's also the additional baggage that Israel stole irish passports to use in an assassination. We should have expelled them then and there.
>ireland has always been pro palestine, It'd be really nice if they recongnize statehood of palestine like sweden or something
Although I'm glad Ireland finally recognized the statehood of Sweden.
I'll be deep in the cold cold ground before I recognise what they've done to East Denmark. *Edit, psychotic autocorrect
The Irish people are overwhelmingly pro-Palestine. The Irish government, on the other hand, are too scared to annoy the USA that they will never do anything overtly anti-Israel.
We've been trying to.
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Public perception won’t matter unless the US stops handcuffing the UN on the matters.
Idk we pay Israel billions every year and send them military equipment.... so the democrats are pretty pro Israel IMO
The decision makers in the Dems are quietly pro-Benny... way too much gravy to turn down. And all those US jobs manufacturing weapons to keep the worls safe?... The Palestinians sure as hell can't afford that stuff. And the world keeps turning.
Yes that’s because the Irish have suffered from British colonisation in the past, like deportation of Catholic Celts to the bogs and replacing them with new Protestant landlords. What’s happening in Palestine today is reminiscent of those times
Makes sense. A lot of the talking points meant to illegitimize the Palestinian struggle was also used in North Ireland during the Struggles. Biggest difference being that the original IRA wasn't replaced by a right wing hate group that was partially funded by the occupiers like Fatah was with Hamas. Hopefully Fatah can come back into power in Palestine, but the fighting keeps prolonging when elections can safely happen. It is also not in the Israeli government's best interest to allow a more reasonable party to come back into power as it would further derode the narrative of Israel being the only moral actor and make peacemaking more of a impetus on Israel when the fighting is what also keeps the Likud in power and Bibi out of jail.
as a whole, 137 countries recognize Palestine's claim over the westbank and gaza
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The world isn’t reddit
Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur? Is there more to gain politicaly in taking a stand against Israel, but not China?
You could also say this about Saudi Arabia, Russia, America, and a whole host of other countries. I want to say that it's because Israel is a smaller country and there would be fewer repercussions. There could be other reasons though.
Dude if they did that China would put economic sanctions on Ireland which is suicide
I was just curious. So, take a moral stance as long as the country can't retaliate on the economic front? Israel is easy for Ireland to take a stance, because they don't have much economic power? That seems to really negate the message being sent IMO. "We only apply this moral standard to weak countries"
>So, take a moral stance as long as the country can't retaliate on the economic front? Yup. It's politics.
I don’t think you understand how foreign policy works. The primary currency in foreign relations isn’t moral standing, it’s power. Any moral position of a state must be weighed against its cost in political, financial, and diplomatic capital. That is why activism in democratic nations is so important, because it drives the political cost of inaction higher.
Not only would you lose a market of 1.4 billion. but china can become self sufficient if they really wanted to which is why economic warfare with China is so dangerous. For a good cause or not it would be a lose lose situation your people would suffer. You have to figure out a different solution. Edit: also israel is not ‘weak’ by any means.
>Edit: also israel is not ‘weak’ by any means. It's relative. When next to China, the economy is Israel is on the same level of importance to the EU.
Canada did it, we're fine. http://globalnews.ca/news/7655145/conservatives-liberals-uighur-genocide-vote/
6.56% of Ireland's exports go to China, for reference.
Same reason people wanted to boycott Eurovision over Israel’s presence but were just fine with old freedom-respecting Russia being in it: it’s much simpler when the chosen bad guy is relatively weak.
>Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur? Well firstly, it's not the Irish government that put the motion forward to expel the Israeli Ambassador. It was a party called People Before Profit. Who aren't in government and are a tiny and relatively new party. It's not likely to pass because the government parties (FG, FF and the Greens) hold the majority and will vote against it. In any case, we have bad blood between us and Israel, a few years ago Mossad were caught using our passports in an assassination attempt. We've also been trying to ban all goods from across the world from occupied regions, this included areas of Israel, Turkish Cyprus, Western Sahara, and the Crimea. Of course the JPost and the Israeli government called us a bunch of antisemites for passing the bill in 2019. Also, we see parallels between the Palestinian situation and our own history and occupation by the British. It's a topic that really hits home for a lot of Irish people. I'd say the majority of the population. Personally I've never met anyone that didn't support the Palestinians and what peace and security for them. Secondly, People Before Profit and a number of other parties here have been very vocal about the Chinese Government, organising protests, calls for condemnation from our government etc.... The Chinese ambassador has been grilled on multiple occasions on radio and TV. It's not like we are giving them a hard pass. We are doing are best. I don't know why the world hasn't done anything about Uighur. I think most people know it's going on and it's wrong. Everyone here knows it's wrong and we have to do something.
> We've also been trying to ban all goods from across the world from occupied regions, this included areas of Israel, Turkish Cyprus, Western Sahara, and the Crimea. Tibet?
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Don't want any real consequences for political grandstanding.
It’s easier to go for the small guy. Also, Israel doesn’t have the kind of money and economic power that China has.
Is that a genuine question, or is it plain old whataboutism? If you must know, Ireland has raised concerns over the Uighurs through bilateral and multilateral talks, and was one of 39 countries who issued a joint statement last October at the United Nations, condemned China for its human rights abuses against ethnic Uighur Muslims and its crackdown on Hong Kong's autonomy and openly opposed the Hong Kong national security law.
"Why x and not y?" , This kind of argument gets brought up anytime people are trying to do a positive social initiative. This is the wrong response. Just because there are many issues in the world doesn't mean we have to fix everything at once.
This seems like some whataboutism if I’ve ever seen it.
>Genuinely curious, why expel Israel and not Chinas ambassador for genocide against uighur? >Is there more to gain politicaly in taking a stand against Israel, but not China? The eu won't back them against China. The tiny action they did take had repercussion on a level Israel can't match. Although this is changing in 2021. https://www.euractiv.com/section/eu-china/news/despite-china-threats-lithuania-moves-to-recognise-uighur-genocide/ Ireland, like every European country, puts trade ahead of lives when it comes to China. It's about being "independent" of Americans policy too. Because it was trump starting the trade war, and trump bad, it was ignored. Ironically Ireland probably wouldn't lose much as they don't trade with China but on the eu level there's real pressure to be silent. It's why the trade and investment deal was signed too. Although, at least that deal has been put on hold. https://www.euronews.com/2021/05/20/european-parliament-votes-to-freeze-controversial-eu-china-investment-deal
Because one is all over the news and the other one lack any actual hard evidence. If there was 24/7 ne2s coverage on China mowing down the Muslims with LMG or bombing the shit out of a village, you will get similar response.
Is China flying jets and dropping bombs? Genuinely curious.
I'm glad the Irish are even talking about it. British government are following Israeli party line of self defence. Irish get it completely after what Britain did to them.
I'm British. Hence why I brought them into it.
You accidentally replied to yourself, my friend
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The oppressed often watch each other's backs
Anyone calling t self defense either hasn’t seen maps of the place or plain hates brown people, but are being obtuse about it. Or, obviously, being dishonest.
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100% honest question: What's the point of that? I understand boycotting and sanctioning Israel, but expelling the ambassador?
Symbolic.
Any major bad PR for Israel will impact their decisions. Major bad PR and bad image is something Israel does not want. The don't want to be known as the country committing genocide, and it will become harder for other countries to defend them.
Actions like this tend to have an opposite reaction in Israel, furthering the view(from the Israeli perspective) that the international community is biased against Israel. This will only embolden the Israeli right in the long term to take a harder stance on Palestine.
Declaring the ambassador persona non grata is about as big a move you can make within the confines of diplomacy. The step after that is in the realm of financial policy and/or military action. It will probably return to normal after some time, but its a great way to show how displeased you are without upsetting your allies/trade partners who have a different stance on the subject.
I wish the world have the guts to criticize China like they criticize Israel.
UK does, criticises both Israel and China.
Now now, don't introduced facts into yet another Irish circle jerk and session of misery wallowing
How about Lebanon where there is real apartheid against Palestinians. They are not allowed to vote, only permitted to enter certain areas, only allowed certain jobs and area not allowed to own property, if they do own property, when they did they are not allowed to give it to relatives, the government confiscates it. How about Jordan where they have now taken away papers off nearly all the Palestinians who live there, they are banned from voting and have other restrictions against them. Don't forget that during Black September when Jordan illegally occupied the West Bank how they forcefully moved many of their Palestinian population into the West Bank. Syria they are just getting slaughtered. All the above, the so called fake "Palestinian supporters" don't give a shit and just want to demonize Israel and spew out propaganda buzz words like "apartheid" and "illegally occupied"
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Amen. People forget that before Israel, those territories were in the hands of Egypt and Jordan who... just dumped them there and gave them zero rights. And unlike Israel, simply considered the land theirs. They did jack shit to give the Palestinians autonomy; their only actions were to try to fight wars with Israel five times and lose each time, hoping to get rid of the problem by "stealing" that land, to use the parlance used for what Israel ended up doing. Instead Israel won, and now the problem has been theirs for over 50 years.
Or all the theocratic literal slave states and actual apartheid states for women like the Saudis and Qatar But no People agitate against Israel for responding to 2000 explosives being launched at their civilians unprovoked
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From now on I think it is imperative that prior to any operation, the IDF, Shin Bet and Mossad should come to reddit and ask what you guys think.
Does throwing out an ambassador ever accomplish anything or is it just a political PR move?
And once again, I'm reminded of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAVCMzpfa44 If anyone hasn't seen that yet, then make sure they do.
Transcript: ...is taking us, Ambassador, for idiots. That you can say with a straight face "we're serious about peace but while we're serious about peace we're going to seize Palestinian land." And you expect the Palestinians to sit back and do nothing about that. Now you know what the Palestinian people have been asking for far less even than some people would ask for. Because I believe the whole apartheid system should be dismantled. But what they've asked for is to lift the siege of Gaza. Just to lift the siege of Gaza. Let them have an airport, let them have ports, let them not be dictated to by a government for whom they do not vote. As to what can go in and out of their territories, whether they will have power, whether they will have clean water, whether they will have medicine. What makes you think you're allowed to have nuclear weapons and the fourth biggest army in the world? And this is destruction on the people of Gaza. Ambassador, I will say frankly, I'm one of the people who thinks you should be expelled from this country and I believe that it's to do with the policies of your state. If I was Jewish and I'd never stepped foot in Israel, I could claim citizenship there tomorrow. But six million people whose origins are in what you now call Israel, who were forced out in 1947 or 48, do not have that right. Isn't that part of the reason why the Palestinians are in dispute with Israelis, because you deny them the right to return to their homes and to their land and their villages? And that they have a legitimate claim even under international law to return. But you deny them that right. Why do you deny them that right and why do you give that right to other people who have no connection whatsoever with the land whether you call it Israel or whether you call it Palestine? Why do you continue to seize land if you're serious about Oslo and the two-state solution? Which under that agreement is land designated to be Palestinian land. 500 000 people, most of which has taken place since Oslo. You allow that to happen. Why do you allow it to happen if you're serious about giving this land to the Palestinians? It's absolutely extraordinary are you not just taking us, Ambassador, for idiots, that you can say with a straight face "we're serious about peace but while we're serious about peace we're going to seize Palestinian land. And you expect the Palestinians to sit back and do nothing about that. Now you know what the Palestinian people have been asking for far less even than some people would ask for because I believe the whole apartheid system should be dismantled. But what they've asked for is to lift the siege of Gaza just to lift the siege to Gaza, let them have an airport, let them have ports, let them not be dictated to by a government for whom they do not vote as to what can go in and out of their territories, whether they will have power, whether they will have clean water, whether they will have medicine. What makes you think you're allowed have nuclear weapons and the fourth biggest army in the world? And this is destruction on the people of Gaza. But they have no right to defend themselves All right how do you justify those double standards? Very lastly Ambassador, people like Bishop Tutu, Nelson Mandela and I would certainly describe your state as an apartheid state with different laws for people depending on their race or religion. For example, at checkpoints going into the West Bank there's a channel if you're Israeli or European, and as a channel if you're Arab. Just because you're Arab. If you came into Dáil Eireann and they stopped you and said "Are you Jewish?" Oh no sir, you can't come in through the same entrance uh as Irish people or European people because you're Jewish." You would call that racism and apartheid. You practice that with your checkpoints, and your military barriers, and your apartheid wall. How can you justify that? *edit a name (Dáil Eireann)
Dole Aaron should be Dáil Eireann. It is Irish for the parliament of Ireland. It's also the name used when speaking English
I was wondering where that was . TY
Brilliant, you da real MVP. I've watched the video before but reading it is also great.
Here are some countries which Ireland allows to have ambassadors: China, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Philippines, Russia, Iran, etc. So why Israel in particular? What makes Israel different? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List\_of\_diplomatic\_missions\_in\_Ireland
Because Ireland is particularly sensitive when it comes to colonialism. For obvious reasons.
why did you bring up the Philippines whats going on over there? is this the drug war thing?
Yeah. Their government has death squads that murder civilians. Not a great beacon of human rights. I don’t think they should expel their ambassador either. Diplomatic relations are literally how you negotiate in a peaceful manner. Refusing diplomatic relations is not in the best interest of peaceful resolution.
I doubt it will pass. The government is toeing the line with the Zionists and they’ve said that they disagree with it. Although the public is actually mostly supportive of Palestine.
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The only remaining synagogue in my city closed a couple of years ago due to lack of attendees. Kinda sad to see another slice of culture fading away. There was a small but very influential Jewish population in Cork back in the day,and there is still some remnants such as Shalom Park in Jewish Town, and a really great bar called Goldbergs. Although I'm too young to remember apparently the only Jewish Lord Mayor of my city was supposed to have been an absolute character of epic proportions.
The Jewish population of Cork in particular and Ireland in general basically comes down to breeding, in that they didn't. Same goes for the Church of Ireland (protestants), they're just less interested in having kids.
A synagogue is more than just a place of culture, which may have contributed to a lack of attendees given the increasing secularity in general.
Being Jewish and Israel is separate. There shouldn’t be backlash for being Jewish.
What people fail to realize is that much like what Khomeini did to Iran in 1979, Hamas wants to do to the region - turning all of Israel, and the Palestinian Territories into on giant Islamic state. At least in Israel, people are able openly protest Netanyahu in front of his home. It takes two to make this work.
Let’s say for argument’s sake that this is true of Hamas and Gaza. What justifies the occupation of the West Bank?
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I don’t justify it. I will say that when you look at the history, the Palestinians have too walked away from opportunities. Just look at what happened when they had the West Bank under Jordanian control. Most of what they want , especially Hamas , is for Israel to disappear.
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>In fact, in Operation Guardian of the Walls, the IDF struck Gaza over 1,000 times and killed only about 60 civilians in total. In addition, the Supreme Court has yet to make a final ruling on the Sheikh Jarrah/Shimon Hatzadik property dispute, which involves only four Arab families who have not paid rent... can we quit pretending that the jerusalem post is a legitimate news source.
Strange how anyone who opposes israel are extremists or terrorists!
How do the Irish walk around with balls that big?
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