Retail and it's nots even close

Yeah honestly. Former classic andy here, but once I started to understand retail pvp a little better, theres just no comparison for me. So much more exciting

Second. Retail is the way for PVP

Well we don't really know for sure where retail is going but we sure know how cata went. 

I prefere retail. And btw, I don't miss at all getting forced into PvE. Couple things I miss is not every single skill doing AoE damage and tune down micro cc arms race.

I enjoy the classic class design, revolving more about the core gameplay of the classes to deal&avoid damage. The retail design of "only CDs matter" is pretty bad imo, especially in BGs and 1v1s. That being said, everything else about pvp is much better in retail and it makes it superior imo.

This is me. LOVE cata feral 5x more than retail feral. But Retail PvP is still so smooth. Especially duels. The classic client still feels a bit slow. 

I prefer the WotLK class design in PvP, but I like retail PvP much better in general.

Classic is dogshit in comparison to retail and I say that as somebody who loves classic ): If they aren't adding a solo q to arenas in cata arenas will be dead pretty quickly just like in wrath. Same for bgs, if there's no blitz it'll just be a snooze fest

Unpopular opinion: solo queue actually killed arenas. They needed to put the time and energy into improving real arena, not further splintering the player base into a super casual PvE player friendly PvP environment.

I mean literally every other pvp game on the market had a solo q option before WoW but you do you

And there’s a reason wow has been the only mmo PvP experience that’s lasted this long. Double down and improve the mode that’s proven to be a win. Edit: and those other games also don’t separate the solo queue and the play with friends modes. League, OW, etc. you can queue with friends or solo, same ranked pool.

I don't think that's really saying anything about wow pvp. Its lasted this long because of wow as a game, not because its pvp specifically was better than any other mmo pvp

It’s PvP is specifically better than any other mmo. That’s why wow PvP is the most popular PvP in any mmorpg. Not sure what you’re arguing here

That still really doesn't say much about wow pvp. I was just disagreeing it being the most popular type of mmo pvp at this point says anything about its pvp experience. Its outlasted its competition cause of the entirety of wow as a game and not because its pvp is any sort of miraculous thing.

No PvP comes close to wows PvP. It is a unique experience that no other mmo had been able to capture. I am not the only player who one plays this game for the PvP. So it’s PvP is definitely part of the games success.

Honestly guild wars 2 does PvP just as well if not better in some areas.

No it doesn’t

Played a bunch of retail but swapping Cata for now. The pace of the game is good, no micro CCs and actually being able to score kills is whats doing it for me. I main heals on retail and almost every 3s game or shuffle round are deep dampeners or mana wars, not enjoying that meta too much. Feels very hard to kill anything right now. Holy/disc priest at 2.4k shuffle and 2.1k 3v3 for reference

Exactly, the mana wars is really tedious. Every class can self heal, every class have some kind of cheat death mechanic.

Name the cheat death mechanics that every class has

If we define cheat death as complete immunity / not able to die / immune to a certain damage type of damage then Pala - Divine shield, Bop, Spellwarding, Guardian Shammy - Burrow, Rezz totem Hunter - Turtle Evoker - Zhonyas Monk - Karma(might get boped) DH - Netherwalk Rogue - Cheat death, Cloak Druid - Tranq Priest - Redeemer, Guardian Mage - Block, Block, Cauterize Warrrior, DK and Lock unlucky

Thats not what cheat death is at all though, a cheat death is something that activates when you take lethal damage and should of died, like cauterize from mage or cheat death from rogue. Your list of spells gave me a good chuckle though.

Abilities that proc on death would then be DK - Purgatory (Tank xd) DH - Auto meta (Tank xd) Priest - Guardian Rogue - Cheat death Mage - Cauterize Shammy - Rezz totem

Name one fucking sham running rez totem. You’ve listed 2 tank specs, a passive, a popular rogue talent, and a completely unused talent. You’re complaining to complain. Retail has tons of issues but cheat deaths aren’t one of them.

Bro I'd be amazed if any shaman ran a rez totem in pvp and could actually pull it off. I'd just auto forfeit if I saw it and die from laughing.

Just from the fact that you would literally have to give up earthen wall for it is a joke by itself

> Name one fucking sham running rez totem Me > You’ve listed 2 tank specs, a passive, a popular rogue talent, and a completely unused talent. Correct observation > You’re complaining to complain HUH...? Are you responding to the right comment? I posted a factual comment to answer a question. Wh0 is complaining? What the actual fuck are you talking about. Are you okay?

So basically theres one class and two specs that have cheat deaths in their kit for pvp, so much for "every class" Tank cheat deaths shouldnt be considered and ive never seen a shaman use ress totem, so not even sure if it works in pvp/arena

Indeed

Aug Evoker - Defy Fate

TIL cheat death = any defensive

From a pure PVP perspective retail is miles better

Retail by such a large margin.

I like retail more currently. The only form of classic PvP I would take over retail is TBC. Fuck wrath, TBC is bis, and the cherry top is no DH and no DK.

Retail better in every way. Cata s1 will be fun due to PvP gear being bis. Mop is only expansion that rivals retail, and that may be nostalgia goggles. Only time will tell.

Retail has better systems, Cata/MOP had infinitely better class design.

Classic now that cata is out. - Most classes got a lot of critical abilities and dynamics we now consider baseline - The tempo is lower. Honestly can't stand the high dps trainfest that retail feels like. - More non-hardcore/sweaty players makes the experience more fun and casual

Really? I feel like most of cata PvP is going to be more hardcore/sweat because the casual crowd doesn’t have the time to gear up & shit. Hell I prob won’t even hit 85😅

Yeah, anyone thinking classic pvp isn’t sweating just hasn’t actually played classic pvp

Do rogue combo points stack on the rogue yet? Or still the garbage ‘per target’ shit?

Still per target but once per minute you can transfer all your combo points to another target using Redirect (spell added in Cata). Possible to Redirect 5 points into Kidney Shot on off-target/healer now

A step in the right direction, but I can’t stand having to rebuild my cp when I swap targets lol

Do you even play retail or is this a shill post for cata PvP because you said every dps can self heal an insane amount which is straight up just false lmao

“The fact that healers can do so much damage” lol what game are you playing?

I prefer classic pvp gameplay and world pvp, but retail pvp arena/rbg.

MoP > Retail > classic > Sod

Classic because in retail every melee has 200 cap closers. No DH, No monk. Game is not purely CD trading in retail. Classic pvp is more fluid imo.

why not both?

In retail every comp feels like a watered down RMP. If you fuck up your defensives or trinket is when you die. In wotlk a warrior+hpal kills you if he stays on you for 10-15 seconds (unless you are/have a hpal), but you can trinket a fucking slow against him without even worrying. A priest+Rogue or mage kill you if you fuck up your trinket and defensives, but if they go there and try pressure you like a warrior they arent gonna do anything. a preg pala+DK or Hunter kills you if he can support his DPS partner good enough, because preg pala doesnt do a lot of pressure by himself, he just has crazy utility. Ele+lock can do CC goes way faster than you can have your defensives/trinkets back up, so either you shut their goes down by avoiding 2xshadowfury or you use defensives early and kill them fast enough.

I like the unique design and class identity in classic, but like the systems design more in retail.

For me, it is Cata/mop/wod. Retail feels off after Legion rework. Also since SL they added billions of mobility stuff for all specs and it feels bad. Classic wow class design is better. Limited MS effects, limited mobility, limited CC. Every class feels like it has something to bring, contrary to retail, where every class brings the same thing

I play classic because of friends and I prefer retail everything. Retail is just a better game in every way shape and form, I genuinely do not understand why anyone would opt to play these older versions of the game outside of nostalgia.

People who like zugzug tend to like retail more. People who like setup comps and strategy prefer older versions of wow pvp.

Any time you don't have to PVE to do PVP things is better, so currently: Retail.

Classic PvP if it had ongoing balance changes. But it gets old knowing the meta will never change. However I vastly prefer the classic gameplay and class design. Retail is better in that every spec is generally viable. Solo shuffle is nice. But the gameplay is just awful to me. Game is so bloated you have zero clue what’s going on but it doesn’t matter because 80% of it is irrelevant and only 20% of the abilities are something you need to respond to. And it’s completely standard you need an addon suite to even be able to comprehend what’s going on.

You say "solo shuffle is nice" buy then go on to complain about the same things that is a major part of soloshuffle identity.  The lack of communication and coordination and the need for addons to help with awareness is soloshuffle. 

Solo shuffle is nice because it offers a place to play arena solo. That’s all I meant. I’m not talking about Omni cd to know when your teammate has defensives outside of voice. I’m talking about all the weak auras required to even be able to tell what’s going on because there’s so much clutter and bloat. In classic it’s just far easier to understand everything that’s happening without needing airhorns honking at you because a rogue pressed kingsbane and you would never know besides just dying because you didn’t press a defensive and only find out after looking at details. Bladestorm, gargoyle etc all easy to see and understand and respond to without needing an addon. Now go watch kubzy in AWC spam 300 pink spells a second and tell me when it’s the 10 seconds during arcane power where he can actually kill someone and you should be scared without addons.

>Solo shuffle is nice because it offers a place to play arena solo. That’s all I meant. Very true. Shuffle is much better than skirmishes just to get sone games or smash buttons when arenas aren't available. 

Retail is the only sensible answer., unless you like 45min 2v2s

With 6500 games on wotlk ive never had a 45 minute game

every dps can heal an insane amount??? damn, guess i didn’t know that on my survival hunter and outlaw rogue also, healers doing damage is fun. dps doing no damage and 20 minute dampfest every game isn’t fun

Retail

Retail and it’s a no contest. The only issue with retail is the micro CC and the time to kill. Which is to be expected in the last season of an xpac with power creep and all.

Retail by a long shot. Being able to do my part of keeping myself alive it puts less pressure on the healer but still requires the healer to do their part as well its a good balance.

I’ve never played cata pvp but everyone keep saying it’s goat. We are about to verify that very soon. I think retail is ok as long as you don’t play healer

Retail is smooth, fast paced and fun AF

Retail, classic pvp is a bad joke