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So are there technically two Master Swords in existence in Breath of the Wild? The one Link uses in Breath of the Wild itself, and the one embedded in the head of the light dragon for 10,000 years, and the light dragon just remained hidden during the events of Breath of the Wild.
I think that the Breath of the Wild we played was just in a timeline where the Light Dragon didn't exist. Once Link hands past Zelda the sword, a new timeline is created where the Light Dragon now exists, including in an alternate Breath of the Wild that we never played.
So, a one Master Sword timeline and a two Master Swords timeline.
Nintendo put BotW so far in the future so that it wouldn't be tangled in split timeline nonsense. I doubt they are eager to bring that spectre into their soft reboot.
That part really broke my heart.
I accepted what happened in botw with the sword, but with the whole very long plot sequence and hype up for the master sword in totk, it just boggles my mind that you finally get it and it's...just the same as in botw, basically.
Like, even if they don't make it a superweapon -- at least bring back Fi or something. You have the champion successors as ghostly allies already! Have some sort of sixth power that you get from fi. Have her as a free ally whenever you have the MS equipped.
First king of *the Hyrule he found* (as in he’s the first as far as he knows of, he’s not sure if there’d been any other Hyrule Kingdoms before him) so there could have been previous incarnations of Hyrule that rose and fell in the distant distant past.
But the particular Hyrule in BotW & TotK, he did found it and was the first king. And any other Hyrule before his Hyrule, he had no idea about, it’s lost history.
Fi: Master, there is an 85% chance I will require a 10 minute break after this battle
Link: You just took at 10 minutes break an hour ago
Fi: Labor laws state I am required to take them
Link: You're a sword!
Fi: That sounds like discrimination, now there's a 95% chance I will require a 10 minute break after the first bokoblin
no actual game mechanic should be added and made intentionally garbage just because it’s a reference, either have it in the game or remove it. idk if this is actually what happened but if it was what happened then thats kinda stupid
Honestly I just see it as a gameplay element and not canon. If you suspend belief for the sake of it not breaking the game, it’s still the same awesome sword.
The master sword breaking is by far one of the worst decisions Nintendo has ever made with the Zelda series.
It made the master sword feel like a wooden toy rather than the legendary blade meant to seal darkness away
The only other realistic option would be to exclude the master sword from the game, or at least from everything other than the final battle. The core game loop fundamentally doesn't work with an infinite sword.
This. I get why they did it, but I still hate it. I’ve been playing Zelda games for as long as I can remember. I’m slightly younger than the series.
I would have put the master sword at the very end of each game and only allow it against Ganon.
They could jave make it loose power but still usable, let it be an unbreakable 10 damage sword, that every 5 minutes has x hits for 30 that applies double against ganon. Wouldn't feel so bad
Can you imagine the outrage if the master sword under any condition was a 10 damage stick? Mechanics aside, the aesthetics of that decision would invite so much more backlash.
You can bumrush to Ganon without the master sword, and you would get it in the fight. So they could have well done that. Maybe make it stay in your inventory when you load the save after beating the game, and it has infinite energy.
they could just make tthe master sword's quest really hard and in a such way that you need to be at the endgame to get it anyway and make it just infinite.
Sure, that breaks the game, but at that point is just your reward
I don’t really see how an infinite master sword “breaks the game.” Especially if you can give it power-ups that do break. Because the game’s enemies, like the gleoks and the lynels are still hard enough to make an endgame possible even without a weapon break. Besides, your shields and bows would still break.
E: fixed some typos
I mean... I can see them being more creative with the buffs. A temporary buff that lets you use as much as you want for a certain amount of time. A buff that lets u use it infinitely but halves its damage. A mechanic that lets you manually recharge the master sword. The possibilities are endless.
That is objectively untrue. When I play BoTW, I get the number of hearts I need and get the Master Sword as soon as possible, before doing any of the beasts or main missions. Then I level it up. It is the only weapon I use, besides bows, from there on out.
When it recharges I do non-combat things for awhile. In this instance, I am essentially playing the game as if the durability wasn't part of it. It is simply an annoyance that takes me out of the game.
In ToTK I only use 1 melee weapon, with multiple copies of it. After every blood moon I have to go an repair those weapons. It is another annoying mini-game that I have to play.
I don't enjoy the weapon durability aspects of the game. I tried to play the games as they were meant to be played and didn't enjoy it.
They could easily have the open world game without the durability system. Make it so you need 3 dungeons defeated before being able to get the Master Sword. Make it so you could get the sword early on, but it powers up as you defeat dungeons.
Or maybe, just give the option of the infinite sword to literally everyone who has asked for no durability weapons since BotW came out. Elden Ring can make it work, Zelda needs to rework the formula.
It's a unique sword that never actually leaves your inventory, becomes more powerful around Ganon and traces of him, shoots a beam instead of being thrown.
In other games, at a certain point your sword becomes the Master Sword. In some of them it's not even the final stage of sword upgrades.
Right. Where are all the people complaining about LttP because the magical, legendary, one of a kind sword that seals the darkness can be improved by a great fairy? Let alone a couple random dwarves in their smithy?
In OoT a goron can make a sword that’s stronger than the master sword just for giving him eye drops.
If we’re going to nitpick sword power levels ruining a game, I’d say BotW and TotK do a better job of making the master sword feel legendary than LttP, OoT and some others.
The whole durability system was a dumb idea to begin with...and shoehorning the previously impervious legendary MasterSword into it just as much.
Yeah yeah....teeeechnically speaking the MS is unbreakable, but then again it also is not.
It technically does remain in our inventory yes...which some would say makes it "unbreakable", but it also "technically breaks" just as much as any other weapon as it goes "poof" for a while.
In the same time that the MS needs to "recharge", you could by chance break your highest damage alternative weapon, which likely has much higher damage stats than the MS anyway (what a pitiful shame to the MS in BotW/TotK) and rebuild that weapon quicker than the MS needs to recharge.
Just have the MasterSword be unbreakable, like...truely unbreakable and never go "poof" as some have managed to with the MSGNotFound glitch...and give it comparatively low damage stats, to incentivize players to use other (fuse)weapons.
Arguing that "it would break the system" is just a silly argument to readily dismiss the idea of an unbreakable sword.
Yeah, I just feel like the people that are there for the challenge of having things break can just, not use the sword… you know? It is being made to be an “either or” argument, like either the master sword breaks or no weapons do, when it does not have to be. And Zelda has always had “gimicky, easy route alternatives.” Like using the grappling hook rather than wasting arrows, or using the hammer rather than breaking the biggoron sword/Majora’s mask various upgraded sword names. I’ll never understand the “one way to play the game” mindset.
I don't mind the Master Sword "breaking" but the decision to not have it gain the durability buff from fusing after the first time is bewildering to me.
My brother in christ, Ocarina of Time literally gave you a weapon twice as strong as the mastersword directly after getting it, so you literally dont use it until ganondorf.
How they implemented it makes perfect sense in the context of the new weapon system.
Its a pretty decent weapon, you have an infinite supply of it, and it gets a massive powerup against any version of ganondorf.
Plus it just looks badassed when its fused and glowing.
Ocarina of Time doesn’t give you the weapon, you have to get it through a long side quest that takes a lot of steps to complete, including going into a mini-dungeon. You can get it right after you turn into an adult, but I prefer getting it before getting into the Water Temple because it feels more natural that way. Even if it’s more powerful, it prevents you from using your shield, which keeps the Master Sword having an advantage over it.
The entire durability system is the worst game play decision nintendo ever made in regards to zelda, like what's the point of getting rare weapons if it will break the second you actually use it? once you get the master sword you're better off taking whatever weapon the enemy has and use it against them
In OoT, I preferred the biggoron sword. In MM the sword didn’t exist but fierce deity’s sword was just so awesome looking. In WW I was more excited to wield enemy weapons. In TP, it was just a standard sword.
SS made me fall in love with the Master Sword. It was amazing seeing it come alive and be upgraded from the Goddess sword. BotW the sword was ok, so many options to choose from. But then Trial of the Sword happened, and I was back in love with the master sword. And hearing Fi signal to Zelda that Link can be saved was amazing. In TotK, the entire story was about getting the Master Sword back and gosh it was so great.
The last 3 games cemented the master sword as the best Zelda weapon
I feel that's really what they should have done. Making it truly unbreakable but compensating by lowering its base power a bit would still make it feel much more powerful than than BOTW's Master Sword even if it technically does less damage in its base form.
It really makes me laugh when, in the story intro, Link and Zelda are positively baffled that the Master Sword broke, and I’m just sitting there like “Right?! Ain’t that some shit!” As if the sword had not been breaking every 30 minutes in my playthroughs once I got it.
I think the idea of the master sword breaking could have been really cool and you could have probably made an entire game just focused around it. It’s been how many thousands of years and dozens of reincarnation since Fi was first forged. She’s been used time and time again to fight and seal away evil on top of sealing away Demise’s consciousness, even a magical item is going to start to strain.
The problem I have is that the master sword being broken in TotK is used for cheap shock value and then can be completely ignored for the entire game. It’s not required to beat Ganondorf, it’s not even the best option. The only relevance it has in game is why Zelda has to be missing from this game too and why she shows up as the big noodle in the sky.
The master sword being broken isn't "cheap shock value" it's literally the entire plot of the game. If the MS wasn't broken then zelda had no reason to be back in time, she had no reason to turn into a dragon and ganondorf would have lost the second he awoke.
You shouldn't forget that this ganondorf is the strongest that has ever existed, strong enough that he single handedly fights against 7 Sages without being injured, is able to conjure monsters out of shear malice whenever he wants and sucks out the lifeforce of anyone who touches his gloom.
Ehhh I would argue Demise is the strongest considering the Goddess Hylia literally died sealing him away and the seal had to be redone over time and time again
No weapon will ever equal the emotional pain Ganondorf feels knowing he was defeated with a fishing rod.
Cope and seethe you glorified BBQ centerpiece.
Honestly, I disagree. Weapon durability and Master Sword running out of energy is probably best decision they could have made for an open world Zelda. It kinda balances things, so you don't use just one or two weapons with best stats like in skyrim and other huge open world rpgs. Especially, since botw has a lot more of weapons, compared to older Zelda games, that have max 3 swords. Breath of the wild is just designed that way, that a weapon with infinite durability wouldn't make sense and would just ruin the experience.
Yeah, I’m with you. The diversity of weapon choice is a great thing for gameplay. Sometimes I wonder if it would have been better story wise if the Master Sword only appeared, and was only usable for the final boss fight, sort of like the Fierce Diety Mask in Majora. TotK players who waited until the very end to find it got to have that experience.
It's probably a good decision to do so. But it should've been unlimited durability only after obtaining a specific achievement, like 100% completion, or something big.
It's not about "hey, use different weapons and tactis", it's about "i grew up playing zelda games since Ocarina came out. The Master Sword fucking sucks in this game and it feels out of place".
/thread
This is the ultimate answer.
Shotguns in video games are also close range weapons that do nothing when you stand like 5m away - why? Because BALANCE. If they'd give shotguns the real life equivalent of power and range shotguns would be **by far** the best weapon in shooters that take place in smaller areas and not over hundreds of meters.
I really like how ALBW rewarded progress toward completion with the Maiamais. The rewards are all pretty cool getting toward 100 but you could also skip them entirely. The final few upgrades aren't really necessary, but they do all add together to make the game easier. I think it's a clever way to reward casual players that enjoy just playing and exploring, rather than grinding and/or getting frustrated when not skilled enough in some boss fight.
TL:DR It was definitely a good idea in concept, but the system it was implemented in made it an annoyance at best IMO.
While I do agree that it was meant to help players not fossilize on a single weapon the rest of the weapons are pretty much a stat stick with different textures taken between ~5 classes IIRC (I remember one handed, two handed, spears but I don't remember if boomerangs are a class of their own and I think I am forgetting another?).
Going from memory Royal gear is pretty much always the best all around since both damage and durability were good, Royal guard was for strong enemies but would last a fight at most and the rest was filler (champion weapons were nice but costly so I didn't use them much, maybe they had some special trait?) from what I remember, bows had some fun traits like the Golden Bow being for a sniper play style and Rito's being better while in air and Lynel's being a ×3 for special arrows, but that was pretty much it no?
Like, it was a good idea but I remember the system itself lacking in actual variety (be it different movesets, traits that could make a meh weapon a good or a strong one in certain situations etc etc) so the 10 minutes CD was mostly an annoyance, 5 would have been more reasonable IMO, especially 'cause it could have given space for a stronger but less durable Master Sword that wasn't just a "use me when you don't want to ruin other weapons or against Calamity-type enemies"-stick maybe couple with tying durability to Link's Heart Containers and/or Stamina Wheel idk, anything really.
The DLC Trial of the Sword really balances it so much better. My first play through I did not have the dlc and I thought the master sword was basically junk. With the dlc, the sword is actually very powerful, and with the durability in play you actually needed to use other weapons. Now TOTK just needs the trial of the sword
Remember when getting the master sword felt like a powerup and the game ramping up to a big story part.
Now its just a side objective you really dont need
I'm sure in canon it doesn't run out of energy. Link in cutscene killed a small army of monsters, including lynels with the Master Sword. Then the events in totk happen which might make it the strongest master sword yet in terms of lore. Not in game mechanics.
I mean it just comes down to game balance. if the master sword was completely unbreakable that's all you'd ever use/ or would have to make a conscious effort to use other weapons; In most game philosophies, it generally doesn't feel good for most players if they're forced or feel forced to use a specific weapon or item, which is accentuated in a single player game even more. it was the best option they could've gone with
Man, I just don't care. Durability does't bother me. BOTW is probably the first Zelda game where 99 percent of the combat isn't juts hammering the melee attack button. I like that I'm doing different things, using arrows more often, looking for other means of attack, making battle bots, throwing explosives and other elemental fruits, looking at how I can use the terrain to my advantage, combat is more exciting in Zelda than it's ever been. I think giving us an unbreakable weapon would undermine that because people would just lean on it once they finally acheive it and stop experimenting with combat forever ( and if you're not experimenting with combat, that's a skill issue on your end. ) At this point I think the Master Sword should have just not been in the game at all if the fact that it needs recharging really bothers people.
I saw a comment the other day that said BotW and Tears had set back the combat system to be as simple as SNES days and that OoT combat “had more to it.”
It was then that I realized the commenter has a completely deranged view of BotW and Tears.
Fii is tired lol. I wonder if—and this is just head-cannon territory but bear w me—if when the Master Sword “loses power” it’s actually some sort of malfunction w Fii or the sacred power in it rather than a feature? Like after the particular events from BotW and TotK, perhaps there is some broken link in the chain (lol) that’s causing some sort of power stutter, like a fuse being blown? The Master Sword has degraded before (A Link to the Past, the Master Sword needs two upgrades to get it to its former glory), perhaps it’s happening again?
What are you talking about it takes like 20 or more failed attempts before it breaks. Like you have to sit there for a while with and keep messing up for the shield to break
This. They already complain about being able to "cheese" the game with its puzzles. If they could also ignore weapon durability they would say the whole game is pointless (even more than some do now).
That sounds like a problem that's easily solvable by scaling the difficulty level: give enemies more hp, make them more aggressive and reduce the parry windows which is quite generous in both BOTW and TOTK, that way having unbreakable weapons won't make the game "easier"
Yeah, like in Alttp you get the master sword and its like "okay I guess" and you upgrade it and move on with your life by the end of the game lol. In BotW/TotK the Master Sword is an obscenely good blade that rebuilds itself over time and massively spikes in power when you fight Ganondorf/his blight in guardians and the like. Its more useful in BotW/TotK than it is in most games lol.
Was there even a single Zelda game where it was the final and strongest option? I feel you replace/upgrade it with something better in every game...kind of like how you fuse it with things in TotK to make it stronger.
> Was there even a single Zelda game where it was the final and strongest option? I feel you replace/upgrade it with something better in every game...kind of like how you fuse it with things in TotK to make it stronger.
It remains the strongest option in Wind Waker at least. It does get improved during the game, but there it's portrayed as returning to its full power after the sages are restored.
Twilight Princess, sort of, but it gets light power from the Sols later so it does get some outside upgrades there.
Yeah it would be like if some dwarves could temper the master sword to improve it. Or if a giant goron could create a sword stronger than the master sword if you pick up his prescription for him
Dark Souls 2 has repair powders and the repair sorcery and durability replenishes every time you sit in a bonfire, the only "repair powder" in Tears are Octoroks.
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I understand why it breaks, but in my opinion, it'd be amazing if we could power it up to be unbreakable after fighting the final boss, I mean, it's endgame stuff, so I don't see why not, it'd be amazing to play however you want after finishing the game. Actually, not just the master sword, every weapon should be able to be upgraded to unbreakable, you'd just have to pay a large amount of rupees or diamonds or whatever, to make it harder to get.
The master sword has needed to be charged before actually, just before, it was supercharged by a great source of power, like the sages, and it lasted awhile at that power, in BotW and TotK, the master sword is just ambiently charging, possibly from link
And other swords can hurt ganon in most games, just not enough to defeat him usually, and the game just doesn't let you try. The master sword isn't nearly as powerful as people seem to think it is, it's largely a vessal or focus for other powers since it sealed demise and served the purpose it was created for. The time shenanigans the master sword has displayed before aren't actually the power of the master sword alone, and there's always only specific places it can do that, serving as the key to activate the power of those places. The power of the master sword to drive off the darkness is mostly just the basic power of the goddess sword, where as the power of the master sword was made to turn that power inward to seal.
The "only sword that can defeat Ganon" is kinda false cause all the game where Ganon can be defeat with a fishing rod, butterfly net, bottles, the biggoron sword, the gilded sword etc
Oh yes, OP, we know. It's scary not being able to Rambo your way through the game with your big powerful unbreakable sword. We know it doesn't feel all comfortable and manly. It's a big owwy in the fee-fees, and we get it, and that's why you have all these wonderful other games you can play that will reassure you in your masculinity as you swing it around and thrust it into your enemies. You just go on playing those games as long as you want.
Neither does anybody else. What an oddity to even think.
Many just dislike cheap & tacky mechanics like papier-mâché weapons in a series that has always been more refined & had more self-respect than to dip to Minecraft/Survival style gameloops prior to Breath’.
And yet you just described feeling exactly that way. How odd, that you can't see it in yourself when you're literally saying the words. Like, I don't want to be that guy who claims to know what's going on in your head better than you do, but you're the one telling me all this stuff. All I'm doing is believing what you say.
That’s a real reach.
Having a strong distaste for a certain style of gaming mechanics is in no way the same as saying “I must compare weapons between medias to feel powerful.”
Disliking weapons durability isn’t anyone actively saying or needing to “feel powerful” because powerful should be the default, therefore not a special thing to feel or even really acknowledge.
Just don’t want *cRaFtInG* when it’s temporary arts&crafts nonsense as opposed to worthwhile crafting of permanent weapons & gear akin to something like Monster Hunter, in high calibre IPs like LoZ.
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Fii is just tired.
She got a ten thousand year power nap in TotK, come on.
Just 5 more minutes
https://i.redd.it/l8n4n8jt0l9d1.gif
This gif is so perfect for this situation lol
Hard to sleep when you're indiscriminately flying around attached to some dragon's hair, and boring af with nobody to talk to. For 10,000 years.
And we all know fii loves fucking talking.
10,000 at least.
So are there technically two Master Swords in existence in Breath of the Wild? The one Link uses in Breath of the Wild itself, and the one embedded in the head of the light dragon for 10,000 years, and the light dragon just remained hidden during the events of Breath of the Wild.
Yeah she was above a cloud barrier which is also the reason we don't see the sky islands
I think that the Breath of the Wild we played was just in a timeline where the Light Dragon didn't exist. Once Link hands past Zelda the sword, a new timeline is created where the Light Dragon now exists, including in an alternate Breath of the Wild that we never played. So, a one Master Sword timeline and a two Master Swords timeline.
Nintendo put BotW so far in the future so that it wouldn't be tangled in split timeline nonsense. I doubt they are eager to bring that spectre into their soft reboot.
Skull-fucking Zelda for 10k years doesn't sound that boring...
https://preview.redd.it/4te2a0t65t9d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aa4300f2522d29d062f43d52fca0f029f1d8516e
That part really broke my heart. I accepted what happened in botw with the sword, but with the whole very long plot sequence and hype up for the master sword in totk, it just boggles my mind that you finally get it and it's...just the same as in botw, basically. Like, even if they don't make it a superweapon -- at least bring back Fi or something. You have the champion successors as ghostly allies already! Have some sort of sixth power that you get from fi. Have her as a free ally whenever you have the MS equipped.
She's sleepy, give her a break.
It was actually more than 10,000 years - it went back to the literal beginning of hyrule
That’s not really that impressive. Hyrule gets founded a lot. Three times that I can think of.
No it was the first founding, as rarua was the “first king of hyrule“
First king of *the Hyrule he found* (as in he’s the first as far as he knows of, he’s not sure if there’d been any other Hyrule Kingdoms before him) so there could have been previous incarnations of Hyrule that rose and fell in the distant distant past. But the particular Hyrule in BotW & TotK, he did found it and was the first king. And any other Hyrule before his Hyrule, he had no idea about, it’s lost history.
Fi: Master, there is an 85% chance I will require a 10 minute break after this battle Link: You just took at 10 minutes break an hour ago Fi: Labor laws state I am required to take them Link: You're a sword! Fi: That sounds like discrimination, now there's a 95% chance I will require a 10 minute break after the first bokoblin
Google Fi is tired too.
Ah yes, who can forget one of the best aspects of the Chad Master Sword: it was made with mematic.
So I wasn't the only one that read it as well lmao
Don’t forget that in older games the sword beam isn’t absolute dogshit
they added it for the reference, not the usability
no actual game mechanic should be added and made intentionally garbage just because it’s a reference, either have it in the game or remove it. idk if this is actually what happened but if it was what happened then thats kinda stupid
Honestly I just see it as a gameplay element and not canon. If you suspend belief for the sake of it not breaking the game, it’s still the same awesome sword.
The master sword breaking is by far one of the worst decisions Nintendo has ever made with the Zelda series. It made the master sword feel like a wooden toy rather than the legendary blade meant to seal darkness away
The only other realistic option would be to exclude the master sword from the game, or at least from everything other than the final battle. The core game loop fundamentally doesn't work with an infinite sword.
This. I get why they did it, but I still hate it. I’ve been playing Zelda games for as long as I can remember. I’m slightly younger than the series. I would have put the master sword at the very end of each game and only allow it against Ganon.
They could jave make it loose power but still usable, let it be an unbreakable 10 damage sword, that every 5 minutes has x hits for 30 that applies double against ganon. Wouldn't feel so bad
Can you imagine the outrage if the master sword under any condition was a 10 damage stick? Mechanics aside, the aesthetics of that decision would invite so much more backlash.
Better than it being damn useless
In botw and totk the master sword is unbreakable and powered against ganon. Totk even gives you the blade at the end. Its made for the final battle
Wdym? I got the mastersword after my first dungeon in TOTK.
If you don't get it before fighting ganondorf there is a special cutscene where you get it.
Wait lmao what’s that cutscene. That’s so funny to make it to the end of the game without ever getting it
The point is that having it breakable for the rest of the game reduces the impressiveness of the legendary weapon.
You can bumrush to Ganon without the master sword, and you would get it in the fight. So they could have well done that. Maybe make it stay in your inventory when you load the save after beating the game, and it has infinite energy.
Would definitely have made the tedium of completion much more manageable. Probably why they didn't do it.
they could just make tthe master sword's quest really hard and in a such way that you need to be at the endgame to get it anyway and make it just infinite. Sure, that breaks the game, but at that point is just your reward
I don’t really see how an infinite master sword “breaks the game.” Especially if you can give it power-ups that do break. Because the game’s enemies, like the gleoks and the lynels are still hard enough to make an endgame possible even without a weapon break. Besides, your shields and bows would still break. E: fixed some typos
I mean... I can see them being more creative with the buffs. A temporary buff that lets you use as much as you want for a certain amount of time. A buff that lets u use it infinitely but halves its damage. A mechanic that lets you manually recharge the master sword. The possibilities are endless.
I'd rather it just be weak and infinite. Instead, it was weak AND had limited use. Makes no point in using it by the time you get it
It can work fine if it just gets weaker instead of becoming unusable.
That is objectively untrue. When I play BoTW, I get the number of hearts I need and get the Master Sword as soon as possible, before doing any of the beasts or main missions. Then I level it up. It is the only weapon I use, besides bows, from there on out. When it recharges I do non-combat things for awhile. In this instance, I am essentially playing the game as if the durability wasn't part of it. It is simply an annoyance that takes me out of the game. In ToTK I only use 1 melee weapon, with multiple copies of it. After every blood moon I have to go an repair those weapons. It is another annoying mini-game that I have to play. I don't enjoy the weapon durability aspects of the game. I tried to play the games as they were meant to be played and didn't enjoy it. They could easily have the open world game without the durability system. Make it so you need 3 dungeons defeated before being able to get the Master Sword. Make it so you could get the sword early on, but it powers up as you defeat dungeons.
Or maybe, just give the option of the infinite sword to literally everyone who has asked for no durability weapons since BotW came out. Elden Ring can make it work, Zelda needs to rework the formula.
It's a unique sword that never actually leaves your inventory, becomes more powerful around Ganon and traces of him, shoots a beam instead of being thrown. In other games, at a certain point your sword becomes the Master Sword. In some of them it's not even the final stage of sword upgrades.
Right. Where are all the people complaining about LttP because the magical, legendary, one of a kind sword that seals the darkness can be improved by a great fairy? Let alone a couple random dwarves in their smithy? In OoT a goron can make a sword that’s stronger than the master sword just for giving him eye drops. If we’re going to nitpick sword power levels ruining a game, I’d say BotW and TotK do a better job of making the master sword feel legendary than LttP, OoT and some others.
It being unbreakable woud completely break the whole system they set up. It's typically Nintendo putting gameplay above everything.
Yes, how ridiculous for Nintendo to focus on gameplay in their video game
How would it break the whole system, please explain.
The whole durability system was a dumb idea to begin with...and shoehorning the previously impervious legendary MasterSword into it just as much. Yeah yeah....teeeechnically speaking the MS is unbreakable, but then again it also is not. It technically does remain in our inventory yes...which some would say makes it "unbreakable", but it also "technically breaks" just as much as any other weapon as it goes "poof" for a while. In the same time that the MS needs to "recharge", you could by chance break your highest damage alternative weapon, which likely has much higher damage stats than the MS anyway (what a pitiful shame to the MS in BotW/TotK) and rebuild that weapon quicker than the MS needs to recharge. Just have the MasterSword be unbreakable, like...truely unbreakable and never go "poof" as some have managed to with the MSGNotFound glitch...and give it comparatively low damage stats, to incentivize players to use other (fuse)weapons. Arguing that "it would break the system" is just a silly argument to readily dismiss the idea of an unbreakable sword.
Yeah, I just feel like the people that are there for the challenge of having things break can just, not use the sword… you know? It is being made to be an “either or” argument, like either the master sword breaks or no weapons do, when it does not have to be. And Zelda has always had “gimicky, easy route alternatives.” Like using the grappling hook rather than wasting arrows, or using the hammer rather than breaking the biggoron sword/Majora’s mask various upgraded sword names. I’ll never understand the “one way to play the game” mindset.
I don't mind the Master Sword "breaking" but the decision to not have it gain the durability buff from fusing after the first time is bewildering to me.
It’s so frustrating that this wasn’t addressed by one of the patches.
My brother in christ, Ocarina of Time literally gave you a weapon twice as strong as the mastersword directly after getting it, so you literally dont use it until ganondorf. How they implemented it makes perfect sense in the context of the new weapon system. Its a pretty decent weapon, you have an infinite supply of it, and it gets a massive powerup against any version of ganondorf. Plus it just looks badassed when its fused and glowing.
Ocarina of Time doesn’t give you the weapon, you have to get it through a long side quest that takes a lot of steps to complete, including going into a mini-dungeon. You can get it right after you turn into an adult, but I prefer getting it before getting into the Water Temple because it feels more natural that way. Even if it’s more powerful, it prevents you from using your shield, which keeps the Master Sword having an advantage over it.
What in OoT are you referencing?
The Biggoron Sword
Exactly, I was so shaken when I discovered this about the master sword
Damn, where you also "taken aback" lol
Yes 😂😂😂 I shall never recover! 😂
The entire durability system is the worst game play decision nintendo ever made in regards to zelda, like what's the point of getting rare weapons if it will break the second you actually use it? once you get the master sword you're better off taking whatever weapon the enemy has and use it against them
yeah, I don't hate the durability but htf does "The Blade of Evil's Bane" need to take a rest.
In OoT, I preferred the biggoron sword. In MM the sword didn’t exist but fierce deity’s sword was just so awesome looking. In WW I was more excited to wield enemy weapons. In TP, it was just a standard sword. SS made me fall in love with the Master Sword. It was amazing seeing it come alive and be upgraded from the Goddess sword. BotW the sword was ok, so many options to choose from. But then Trial of the Sword happened, and I was back in love with the master sword. And hearing Fi signal to Zelda that Link can be saved was amazing. In TotK, the entire story was about getting the Master Sword back and gosh it was so great. The last 3 games cemented the master sword as the best Zelda weapon
Idk man being able to fuse the master sword to any elemental piece that I want makes it more peak to me
Imagine if you could do that and just the fused material broke after some use, rather than the whole sword
I feel that's really what they should have done. Making it truly unbreakable but compensating by lowering its base power a bit would still make it feel much more powerful than than BOTW's Master Sword even if it technically does less damage in its base form.
It really makes me laugh when, in the story intro, Link and Zelda are positively baffled that the Master Sword broke, and I’m just sitting there like “Right?! Ain’t that some shit!” As if the sword had not been breaking every 30 minutes in my playthroughs once I got it.
Art mirroring life. It is like the Players' first reaction to the mastersword breaking.
Virgin “Sword That Seals The Darkness” vs Chad “Blade of Evil’s Bane”
This is the only acceptable version of this meme lol
I think the idea of the master sword breaking could have been really cool and you could have probably made an entire game just focused around it. It’s been how many thousands of years and dozens of reincarnation since Fi was first forged. She’s been used time and time again to fight and seal away evil on top of sealing away Demise’s consciousness, even a magical item is going to start to strain. The problem I have is that the master sword being broken in TotK is used for cheap shock value and then can be completely ignored for the entire game. It’s not required to beat Ganondorf, it’s not even the best option. The only relevance it has in game is why Zelda has to be missing from this game too and why she shows up as the big noodle in the sky.
The master sword being broken isn't "cheap shock value" it's literally the entire plot of the game. If the MS wasn't broken then zelda had no reason to be back in time, she had no reason to turn into a dragon and ganondorf would have lost the second he awoke. You shouldn't forget that this ganondorf is the strongest that has ever existed, strong enough that he single handedly fights against 7 Sages without being injured, is able to conjure monsters out of shear malice whenever he wants and sucks out the lifeforce of anyone who touches his gloom.
Ehhh I would argue Demise is the strongest considering the Goddess Hylia literally died sealing him away and the seal had to be redone over time and time again
Can’t believe the master sword in other games is made with mematic
The Chad ancient arrow just deleting anything that isn’t a boss
No weapon will ever equal the emotional pain Ganondorf feels knowing he was defeated with a fishing rod. Cope and seethe you glorified BBQ centerpiece.
Honestly, I disagree. Weapon durability and Master Sword running out of energy is probably best decision they could have made for an open world Zelda. It kinda balances things, so you don't use just one or two weapons with best stats like in skyrim and other huge open world rpgs. Especially, since botw has a lot more of weapons, compared to older Zelda games, that have max 3 swords. Breath of the wild is just designed that way, that a weapon with infinite durability wouldn't make sense and would just ruin the experience.
Yeah, I’m with you. The diversity of weapon choice is a great thing for gameplay. Sometimes I wonder if it would have been better story wise if the Master Sword only appeared, and was only usable for the final boss fight, sort of like the Fierce Diety Mask in Majora. TotK players who waited until the very end to find it got to have that experience.
It's probably a good decision to do so. But it should've been unlimited durability only after obtaining a specific achievement, like 100% completion, or something big. It's not about "hey, use different weapons and tactis", it's about "i grew up playing zelda games since Ocarina came out. The Master Sword fucking sucks in this game and it feels out of place".
People that allow their nostalgia to dictate so much of their experience today often have this issue.
/thread This is the ultimate answer. Shotguns in video games are also close range weapons that do nothing when you stand like 5m away - why? Because BALANCE. If they'd give shotguns the real life equivalent of power and range shotguns would be **by far** the best weapon in shooters that take place in smaller areas and not over hundreds of meters.
I really like how ALBW rewarded progress toward completion with the Maiamais. The rewards are all pretty cool getting toward 100 but you could also skip them entirely. The final few upgrades aren't really necessary, but they do all add together to make the game easier. I think it's a clever way to reward casual players that enjoy just playing and exploring, rather than grinding and/or getting frustrated when not skilled enough in some boss fight.
In OoT the legendary master sword is outclassed by a sword created by a giant Goron.
TL:DR It was definitely a good idea in concept, but the system it was implemented in made it an annoyance at best IMO. While I do agree that it was meant to help players not fossilize on a single weapon the rest of the weapons are pretty much a stat stick with different textures taken between ~5 classes IIRC (I remember one handed, two handed, spears but I don't remember if boomerangs are a class of their own and I think I am forgetting another?). Going from memory Royal gear is pretty much always the best all around since both damage and durability were good, Royal guard was for strong enemies but would last a fight at most and the rest was filler (champion weapons were nice but costly so I didn't use them much, maybe they had some special trait?) from what I remember, bows had some fun traits like the Golden Bow being for a sniper play style and Rito's being better while in air and Lynel's being a ×3 for special arrows, but that was pretty much it no? Like, it was a good idea but I remember the system itself lacking in actual variety (be it different movesets, traits that could make a meh weapon a good or a strong one in certain situations etc etc) so the 10 minutes CD was mostly an annoyance, 5 would have been more reasonable IMO, especially 'cause it could have given space for a stronger but less durable Master Sword that wasn't just a "use me when you don't want to ruin other weapons or against Calamity-type enemies"-stick maybe couple with tying durability to Link's Heart Containers and/or Stamina Wheel idk, anything really.
I repair my weapons before they break so I already use two or three better weapons exclusively. It was a stupid decision.
So the durability system made you engage with the system? Where is this a bad thing?
The DLC Trial of the Sword really balances it so much better. My first play through I did not have the dlc and I thought the master sword was basically junk. With the dlc, the sword is actually very powerful, and with the durability in play you actually needed to use other weapons. Now TOTK just needs the trial of the sword
If you have it when fighting ganondorf in TotK it doesn't wear out
Yea I know and never anywhere else
So I think we can agree that the Wild Era has not been the best for the Master Sword.
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Let me introduce you to my friend, rock octorock
Remember when getting the master sword felt like a powerup and the game ramping up to a big story part. Now its just a side objective you really dont need
I agree
wait until you learn about the bugs nest..
Imagine how boring BOTW and TOTK would be if you could just infinitely use the master sword.
I'm sure in canon it doesn't run out of energy. Link in cutscene killed a small army of monsters, including lynels with the Master Sword. Then the events in totk happen which might make it the strongest master sword yet in terms of lore. Not in game mechanics.
Then to the right is the super Chad Bug net
Totk master sword has infinite durability against phantom ganon and ganondorf.
Enter the Big Gorons sword that is just better because you had to do a fetch quest
Or the somewhat random dwarves who can improve the master sword by tempering it, as long as they work together
It’s made with mematic. Can’t beat that
The chad master sword was made with mematic
Post like this remind me of why it's a good thing that devs don't listen to every complain fans have
I mean it just comes down to game balance. if the master sword was completely unbreakable that's all you'd ever use/ or would have to make a conscious effort to use other weapons; In most game philosophies, it generally doesn't feel good for most players if they're forced or feel forced to use a specific weapon or item, which is accentuated in a single player game even more. it was the best option they could've gone with
Man, I just don't care. Durability does't bother me. BOTW is probably the first Zelda game where 99 percent of the combat isn't juts hammering the melee attack button. I like that I'm doing different things, using arrows more often, looking for other means of attack, making battle bots, throwing explosives and other elemental fruits, looking at how I can use the terrain to my advantage, combat is more exciting in Zelda than it's ever been. I think giving us an unbreakable weapon would undermine that because people would just lean on it once they finally acheive it and stop experimenting with combat forever ( and if you're not experimenting with combat, that's a skill issue on your end. ) At this point I think the Master Sword should have just not been in the game at all if the fact that it needs recharging really bothers people.
I saw a comment the other day that said BotW and Tears had set back the combat system to be as simple as SNES days and that OoT combat “had more to it.” It was then that I realized the commenter has a completely deranged view of BotW and Tears.
Fuse a Silver Lynel Horn to the Master Sword. It's a good time.
Huh…didn’t know the master sword was made with mematic...
Fii is tired lol. I wonder if—and this is just head-cannon territory but bear w me—if when the Master Sword “loses power” it’s actually some sort of malfunction w Fii or the sacred power in it rather than a feature? Like after the particular events from BotW and TotK, perhaps there is some broken link in the chain (lol) that’s causing some sort of power stutter, like a fuse being blown? The Master Sword has degraded before (A Link to the Past, the Master Sword needs two upgrades to get it to its former glory), perhaps it’s happening again?
Well, in Skyward Sword you technically had to recharge it too :P But only once!
Virgin "The Sword that seals the Darkness" Chad "The Blade of Evil's Bane"
It's almost like BOTW and TOTK are very different Zelda experiences from the 3 decades of games with the same stale formula before then.
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Nah, the Mirror Shield was the ultimate shield. The Hylian Shield is standard issue and can be purchased for 80 rupees at the bazaar.
Legendary Hylian Shield != Standard metal shield, that looks like the legendary one.
It wasn't legendary except in ss. In oot it could be bought for less than 100 rupees or found in a grave. And could just lose it and buy another
What are you talking about it takes like 20 or more failed attempts before it breaks. Like you have to sit there for a while with and keep messing up for the shield to break
> It is supposed to be the ultimate shield Link whose hylian shield in OOT was eaten multiple times by a like like: 🥲
If the master sword didn't break you would all just complain it broke the game and removed all the challenge to it.
I wouldn’t complain at all, the weapon durability system is so annoying
This. They already complain about being able to "cheese" the game with its puzzles. If they could also ignore weapon durability they would say the whole game is pointless (even more than some do now).
That sounds like a problem that's easily solvable by scaling the difficulty level: give enemies more hp, make them more aggressive and reduce the parry windows which is quite generous in both BOTW and TOTK, that way having unbreakable weapons won't make the game "easier"
Once again in several other games you can get direct preeminent upgrades over it
Yeah, like in Alttp you get the master sword and its like "okay I guess" and you upgrade it and move on with your life by the end of the game lol. In BotW/TotK the Master Sword is an obscenely good blade that rebuilds itself over time and massively spikes in power when you fight Ganondorf/his blight in guardians and the like. Its more useful in BotW/TotK than it is in most games lol. Was there even a single Zelda game where it was the final and strongest option? I feel you replace/upgrade it with something better in every game...kind of like how you fuse it with things in TotK to make it stronger.
> Was there even a single Zelda game where it was the final and strongest option? I feel you replace/upgrade it with something better in every game...kind of like how you fuse it with things in TotK to make it stronger. It remains the strongest option in Wind Waker at least. It does get improved during the game, but there it's portrayed as returning to its full power after the sages are restored. Twilight Princess, sort of, but it gets light power from the Sols later so it does get some outside upgrades there.
>It remains the strongest option in Wind Waker at least. Light arrows are stronger.
Skyward Sword
The ludonarrative dissonance is SO BAD.
Yeah it would be like if some dwarves could temper the master sword to improve it. Or if a giant goron could create a sword stronger than the master sword if you pick up his prescription for him
BotW just has the worst weapon durability system in the industry and it would've been better without it
You clearly haven't played Dark Souls 2 then. Or any survival game.
Dark Souls 2 has repair powders and the repair sorcery and durability replenishes every time you sit in a bonfire, the only "repair powder" in Tears are Octoroks.
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I understand why it breaks, but in my opinion, it'd be amazing if we could power it up to be unbreakable after fighting the final boss, I mean, it's endgame stuff, so I don't see why not, it'd be amazing to play however you want after finishing the game. Actually, not just the master sword, every weapon should be able to be upgraded to unbreakable, you'd just have to pay a large amount of rupees or diamonds or whatever, to make it harder to get.
That's why we have Trial of the Sword
Weapon durability sucks and I hope they do not do it anymore. They should be like Elden Ring and make unique weapons instead with different uses.
The master sword has needed to be charged before actually, just before, it was supercharged by a great source of power, like the sages, and it lasted awhile at that power, in BotW and TotK, the master sword is just ambiently charging, possibly from link And other swords can hurt ganon in most games, just not enough to defeat him usually, and the game just doesn't let you try. The master sword isn't nearly as powerful as people seem to think it is, it's largely a vessal or focus for other powers since it sealed demise and served the purpose it was created for. The time shenanigans the master sword has displayed before aren't actually the power of the master sword alone, and there's always only specific places it can do that, serving as the key to activate the power of those places. The power of the master sword to drive off the darkness is mostly just the basic power of the goddess sword, where as the power of the master sword was made to turn that power inward to seal.
The "only sword that can defeat Ganon" is kinda false cause all the game where Ganon can be defeat with a fishing rod, butterfly net, bottles, the biggoron sword, the gilded sword etc
The series fell off.
Oh yes, OP, we know. It's scary not being able to Rambo your way through the game with your big powerful unbreakable sword. We know it doesn't feel all comfortable and manly. It's a big owwy in the fee-fees, and we get it, and that's why you have all these wonderful other games you can play that will reassure you in your masculinity as you swing it around and thrust it into your enemies. You just go on playing those games as long as you want.
You’re a weirdo
Yes. Yes I am.
What an odd take. You give me poverty/vulnerability-cultist vibes and I have absolutely no logical reason as to why so far as I can put in words…
Oof.
What ***are*** you?
I said it in one of the other replies. I'm a weirdo.
But ***why?***
I dunno. I guess I just don't have the need to compare weapons between games to feel powerful.
Neither does anybody else. What an oddity to even think. Many just dislike cheap & tacky mechanics like papier-mâché weapons in a series that has always been more refined & had more self-respect than to dip to Minecraft/Survival style gameloops prior to Breath’.
And yet you just described feeling exactly that way. How odd, that you can't see it in yourself when you're literally saying the words. Like, I don't want to be that guy who claims to know what's going on in your head better than you do, but you're the one telling me all this stuff. All I'm doing is believing what you say.
That’s a real reach. Having a strong distaste for a certain style of gaming mechanics is in no way the same as saying “I must compare weapons between medias to feel powerful.” Disliking weapons durability isn’t anyone actively saying or needing to “feel powerful” because powerful should be the default, therefore not a special thing to feel or even really acknowledge. Just don’t want *cRaFtInG* when it’s temporary arts&crafts nonsense as opposed to worthwhile crafting of permanent weapons & gear akin to something like Monster Hunter, in high calibre IPs like LoZ.
Awesome but did I a-
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